Guild Wars 2

Specter and Torch are almost always present in all confusion builds. So wouldnt it make perfect sense that they have have projectile finisher or Whirl finisher esp on confusing images and phantasmal mage.
Other then bleeds, i think confusion is one of the best condtion damage(ethereal combo fields, traits and of course weapons) which mesmers can stack and the primary weapons for doing so which is Specter and Torch have no link with the offensive combos. Best yet specter doesnt have any form or combo at all.
The only weapon that delivers both projectile finisher or Whirl finisher would be gs. But with one weapon set doing damage(specter & torch) it would be so much better to hold something like a staff for the utility and defensive abilities but again no projectile finisher or Whirl finisher.
Of course u can go with off hands like pistol or focus in which case you end up with just one projectile finisher or Whirl finisher. I guess you can try a second specter here for extra confusing images but is it really worth it?(not a rhetorical question cos I never tried it and I don think i will, if any one has tested it pls comment)
So pls to make this a good build it would be nice to see Specter and Torch having some projectile finisher or Whirl finisher.

I wish GS had a whirl finisher. And the blast finisher on The Prestige is probably the best finisher mesmer have (but unfortunately, the torch fails as an off-hand, different story).

Now we only have so little weapon skills, and ppl still have no clue… ^^

If mind wrack was a blast finisher…

Nikked.7365:

I’m not sure that all your facts here are correct. The torch has a combo finisher (The Prestige is a blast finisher). Blasts are one of the most effective finishers. Setting up the combo field then requires Null Field, Feedback, Veil, or Timewarp. (All confusion based, except for Veil.) If the staff is your secondary weapon, you can also use Chaos Storm. We don’t have any whirl finishers, which you said the GS has.

Further, Scepter + Torch isn’t a pure damage weapon combo; they are condition based (confusion primarily). Sword + Pistol or GS are both damage setups. Confusion is a weak condition in PvE. In sPvP or WvW, players do suffer from it, but they can also remedy it with condition removal. So, it’s a gamble.

Personally, I’ve never found a use for the scepter, so I can’t imagine carrying around two of them for the extra Confusing Images. This is the only weapon available to use that I actively avoid.

First off.. Blast finisher in Ethreal field gives aoe chaos armor, not spread confusion. Secondly GS does have a whirl finisher its the Berserker. Third the scepter can actually be decent for a power/crit build. The autos crit around 1k and the block is incredibly useful and also hits fairly hard. (thats actually with a low crit damage % around 30ish, I never used it with any higher).

dank.3680:

Nikked.7365:

I’m not sure that all your facts here are correct. The torch has a combo finisher (The Prestige is a blast finisher). Blasts are one of the most effective finishers. Setting up the combo field then requires Null Field, Feedback, Veil, or Timewarp. (All confusion based, except for Veil.) If the staff is your secondary weapon, you can also use Chaos Storm. We don’t have any whirl finishers, which you said the GS has.

Further, Scepter + Torch isn’t a pure damage weapon combo; they are condition based (confusion primarily). Sword + Pistol or GS are both damage setups. Confusion is a weak condition in PvE. In sPvP or WvW, players do suffer from it, but they can also remedy it with condition removal. So, it’s a gamble.

Personally, I’ve never found a use for the scepter, so I can’t imagine carrying around two of them for the extra Confusing Images. This is the only weapon available to use that I actively avoid.

First off.. Blast finisher in Ethreal field gives aoe chaos armor, not spread confusion. Secondly GS does have a whirl finisher its the Berserker. Third the scepter can actually be decent for a power/crit build. The autos crit around 1k and the block is incredibly useful and also hits fairly hard. (thats actually with a low crit damage % around 30ish, I never used it with any higher).

In fact it is correct that iZerker acts like a whirl finisher. It just normally only gets 1 whirl projectile out of the combo field which is fairly neglectable.

Nikked.7365:

I’m not sure that all your facts here are correct. The torch has a combo finisher (The Prestige is a blast finisher). Blasts are one of the most effective finishers. Setting up the combo field then requires Null Field, Feedback, Veil, or Timewarp. (All confusion based, except for Veil.) If the staff is your secondary weapon, you can also use Chaos Storm. We don’t have any whirl finishers, which you said the GS has.

Further, Scepter + Torch isn’t a pure damage weapon combo; they are condition based (confusion primarily). Sword + Pistol or GS are both damage setups. Confusion is a weak condition in PvE. In sPvP or WvW, players do suffer from it, but they can also remedy it with condition removal. So, it’s a gamble.

Personally, I’ve never found a use for the scepter, so I can’t imagine carrying around two of them for the extra Confusing Images. This is the only weapon available to use that I actively avoid.

If your using a confusion build then projectile finisher or Whirl finisher would surely be better as it gives confusion stacks. One can easily go up to like 11- 15 stacks of confusion with projectile finisher or Whirl finisher(even more if done right). Just imagine the stacks of confusion one can put out if specter and torch has projectile and/or Whirl finisher. As blast finishers only give chaos armor, i guess its decent for a confusion build as it may cause confusion stacks when someone hits you, but i don see how its better then then projectile and whirl.

You do make a point about it being a condition and that it can be removed in pvp or WvW but so far I find it alot better then other condition build and power builds. I cant say i find it better then mantra build cos i havent really tried it.

I don really use confusion build in pve as specter/torch, astleast for me is more for single target. Of course there’s shatters that give confusion but i think a regular shatter build will do much better in dungeons with alot of mobs.
However I don understand why you would say it is a weak condtion in pve.
If anything confusion is stronger in pve then in pvp and the link below will prove it.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Confusion
And compared to confusion, bleeds are weaker. The calculation for bleeds are in the link below
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bleeding
So basically if it was a single target fight, like boss fights. I think Confusion build will put out alot more damage then a regular condition build based on bleeds.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

I wish GS had a whirl finisher. And the blast finisher on The Prestige is probably the best finisher mesmer have (but unfortunately, the torch fails as an off-hand, different story).

Now we only have so little weapon skills, and ppl still have no clue… ^^

Number 1 – Gs 4 skill Phantasmal Berserker is a whirl finisher and incase you dim enough to say its not. Read the link below.( I think your the one with no freaking clue with whats happening when you make statments like “I wish GS had a whirl finisher”)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Berserker

Number 2 – Why is a blast finsher the best for a confusion build when whirl and projectile gives stacks of confusion and blast only gives chaos armor.

Number 3 – Torch does not fail as an off hand esp on pvp/wvw. The aoe blind and the invisi it offers is very useful and a Phantasm thats gives 3 stacks of confusion on the first shot(which by the way bounces twice) is quite decent for a confusion build.

He said that confusion is weaker in PvE cos normally mobs dont spam skills like ppl do. So even when confusion hits quite a lot its not unusual that mobs only take dmg once or that confusion goes away before they attack not taking dmg at all from it. If mobs attacked a lil faster confusion would destroy them a lot faster for sure.

Dess.4391:

He said that confusion is weaker in PvE cos normally mobs dont spam skills like ppl do. So even when confusion hits quite a lot its not unusual that mobs only take dmg once or that confusion goes away before they attack not taking dmg at all from it. If mobs attacked a lil faster confusion would destroy them a lot faster for sure.

Ok to this, I have no argument. It is dependent on the attack speed of the mobs. But for most mobs, I don’t think is so slow that it becomes weaker then bleeds right. When I get the time, I’ll do more test’s on a couple of mobs in dungeons and post the results.

However you do have to remember that a mob can only have a max of 25 stacks of bleed. On certain fights i have noticed that the mob, usually vets and bosses,almost have 25 stacks of bleed on them already. Hence there is a question of how much of those 25 stacks of bleed comes from you. Technically you can be doing not much dps. Thats the problem with bleed, its the number 1 condition damage being used across the board.

joeytan.3865:

Dess.4391:

He said that confusion is weaker in PvE cos normally mobs dont spam skills like ppl do. So even when confusion hits quite a lot its not unusual that mobs only take dmg once or that confusion goes away before they attack not taking dmg at all from it. If mobs attacked a lil faster confusion would destroy them a lot faster for sure.

Ok to this, I have no argument. It is dependent on the attack speed of the mobs. But for most mobs, I don’t think is so slow that it becomes weaker then bleeds right. When I get the time, I’ll do more test’s on a couple of mobs in dungeons and post the results.

However you do have to remember that a mob can only have a max of 25 stacks of bleed. On certain fights i have noticed that the mob, usually vets and bosses,almost have 25 stacks of bleed on them already. Hence there is a question of how much of those 25 stacks of bleed comes from you. Technically you can be doing not much dps. Thats the problem with bleed, its the number 1 condition damage being used across the board.

True also. In big event fights agaist 1 big boss your bleeds will be wasted and its most likely your confusion wont. Thats the only reason i would take out shaper images for pve in my mesmer if i could… If you are heavy built into cond dmg your bleeds are wasted, if you are not you waste some1 else bleeds…

One day Mind Stab will be a blast finisher but in how many years