Guild Wars 2

It would relieve some of the pressure off the elite specialization traitline having to be very weak in order to compensate for Continuum Split.

Unlike the other elite specializations which have to remove something in order to gain their new mechanic, Chronomancers simply add a new mechanic ontop of everything they already have leaving their weakness to be placed on the traitline that provides it. I think it would be nice if some of that weakness was instead placed on the removal of Distortion. CS would be a good enough replacement for it in my opinion.

Most importantly it would solve the UI issue. :P

I would actually be okay with it if they lowered the cd on it. Not 100% yet, but i think so, anyway.

Yeah, balance is second to fundamentals. Numbers can always be changed.

Either that or just remove the F5 (i actually prefer this). It’s very hard to balance and very much op in its current form. Move speed and clone/phantasm respawn is (for me) already a very good reason to go Chrono. The added F5 makes it strictly better than base Mesmer.

Chronomancer got an offhand, so less new skills, that’s probably one of the reason we got a new skill elsewhere. Otherwise mesmers could argue 3 of the skills from guardian longbow should only replace an existing skills they have.

Um which other elites remove something for their elite?

As far as I know the others have their class mechanics change (guard virtues, necro DS) but the basic functionality stays the same. Additionally guards keep the passive bonuses and the activated effects can become much stronger or at least stay the same depending on situation.

Tempest also gets overcharge added. Sadly I wasn’t in the beta so never got to test it. I know it’s bad at the moment but it could end up really good eventually. All added nothing taken away there and it’s arguably the strongest class atm.

So…why are you advocating taking away?

Spleen.7836:

Chronomancer got an offhand, so less new skills, that’s probably one of the reason we got a new skill elsewhere. Otherwise mesmers could argue 3 of the skills from guardian longbow should only replace an existing skills they have.

Weeeeeell… discounting heal/utilities/elite since everyone gets 1/4/1.

Elementalist get 2×4 + 4 skills. Warhorn offers 2 offhand skills for each Element. Tempest inherently get their overload skills which is 4.

Guardian get 5 skills + 3 “half” skills. Longbow offers 5 skills, kitten . Each of the F skills get an update, which is both an addition yet not a net gain on skills (compared to overloading).

Reaper gets 5 skills + 5 “half” skills. Greatsword offers 5 skills. F skill gets full revamp, similar to Guardian.

Chronomancer gets 2 + 1 skills. Shield grants 2 offhand skills. CS is a full blown new skill, slightly moreso than overloading.

Druid gains 5 + X skills. Staff is a two handed weapon, thereby granting 5 weapon skills. We don’t know what else they gain.

Soooooo… Elementalist gets the most skills. Reaper has the second most updates, followed by Guardians. Chronomancer gets the least amount of skills in any comparison thus far (even if you count Chrono wearing a Shield compared to other professions not wearing their new weapon) bar the “half” skills not counting as net gain of skills.

apharma.3741:

Um which other elites remove something for their elite?

As far as I know the others have their class mechanics change (guard virtues, necro DS) but the basic functionality stays the same. Additionally guards keep the passive bonuses and the activated effects can become much stronger or at least stay the same depending on situation.

Tempest also gets overcharge added. Sadly I wasn’t in the beta so never got to test it. I know it’s bad at the moment but it could end up really good eventually. All added nothing taken away there and it’s arguably the strongest class atm.

So…why are you advocating taking away?

Exactly, reaper and guard give up their old mechanics for their specialization (in this case ranged shroud and instant virtues). DH virtue actives are stronger than the original ones but have way longer cds (except F1) and aren’t instant which hurts a lot.

I’m not an ele, so i can’t say much about them.

Using the number of new weapon skills as an argument makes actually no sense at all, since you are not losing your old weapons which are perfectly fine. In case of reaper, the GS is even entirely useless and might as well not exist.

Iavra.8510:

Using the number of new weapon skills as an argument makes actually no sense at all, since you are not losing your old weapons which are perfectly fine. In case of reaper, the GS is even entirely useless and might as well not exist.

It kind of does make sense, because you can only equip the weapon if you equip the elite spec.

Lavra, it does when the Devi said specifically that mesmers are getting something else equivalent to a 2H weapon. In other words continuum split was designed to make up for the lack of 3 main hand skill options.

I know they said it, but i don’t think it should be this way. F5 is something you get for free, no matter what build you are playing. They should instead make the new wells more powerful and give a reason to take them over Blink/Decoy.

It would give a lot less to the mesmer than to the others professions, it’s not really a good idea. Or the others shatter skills should also provide something more or different, like super speed, slow…

Iavra.8510:

I know they said it, but i don’t think it should be this way. F5 is something you get for free, no matter what build you are playing. They should instead make the new wells more powerful and give a reason to take them over Blink/Decoy.

You don’t get it for free, you have to pick the chronomancy line.

Just like Guards to use the longbow have to use dragonhunter and get 3 more weapon skills to boot as well as a rework of their existing virtues to offer more variety/use.

Just like reaper to use the GS has to use reaper spec and gets 3 more weapon skills to boot as well as a rework of their DS and their 5 DS skills for more variety.

Not looked into tempest, Anet has completely missed the mark on it to the point I’ve just read a bit about it.

I don’t know. I think in using up the same clones used for the other shatters, there’s plenty cost already. :S

Iavra.8510:

I know they said it, but i don’t think it should be this way. F5 is something you get for free, no matter what build you are playing. They should instead make the new wells more powerful and give a reason to take them over Blink/Decoy.

No matter what build you play… with a specific traitline.

Just like how Guardians get updated Virtues no matter what build they play… with a specific traitline.

Or Reapers and their Shroud, and Tempest with their Overloads.

Iavra.8510:

I know they said it, but i don’t think it should be this way. F5 is something you get for free, no matter what build you are playing. They should instead make the new wells more powerful and give a reason to take them over Blink/Decoy.

You do have to give up something: an entire trait line. Do you think all Mesmers get Chronomancer as a free fourth trait line or something? There is opportunity cost to it.

You know that stealthy interrupt shatter build everyone hates? You have to give up some of that to be a Chronomancer. You either can’t take Prismatic Understanding (Chaos), or Confounding Suggetsions + Power Block (Domination), or Deceptive Evasion (Dueling). All of those are big losses. It’s not without its opportunity cost.

Removing Continuum Split would remove the entire reason to play a Chronomancer. Replacing Distortion with it actually makes some sense, but outright removing it is an insulting suggestion.

Those virtues are actually not that good in a lot of situations, since they aren’t instant and you can’t savestomp/use them during Renewed Focus. Please don’t compare a trash specialization like DH with Chrono in its current state.

Also, like i already mentioned, Reaper and Guard give up their old class mechanics instead of getting additional ones. That’s how all specializations should behave.

And “having to use” the Chrono traitline is hardly an argument when you get to spam clones/phantasms like no tomorrow and get free 25% movementspeed on top.

Esplen.3940:

Iavra.8510:

Using the number of new weapon skills as an argument makes actually no sense at all, since you are not losing your old weapons which are perfectly fine. In case of reaper, the GS is even entirely useless and might as well not exist.

It kind of does make sense, because you can only equip the weapon if you equip the elite spec.

I was actually not aware of this and now that I know about it, I don’t think I agree with it. However, if these new weapons are suppose to be of the same power as other weapons for that class then it shouldn’t be relevant, i.e, Mesmers shield is equivalent in power to a pistol and Necros greatsword is equivalent in power to a staff. Having these new weapons doesn’t increase the power thus meaning that the new mechanics added must have a downside placed somewhere else. If it is true that the new weapons are part of that downside then this would mean that the new weapons each profession gets is indeed suppose to be stronger than the base weapons for that class. This would be horrible if true, so I’ll assume it’s not, which leads me to believe it’s not relevant and that the downsides of each professions elite specialization relies on a combination of the new traitline and the new mechanics themselves.

In the case of the Chronomancer, their mechanics are only boosted meaning that the entirety of the downside is placed on the traitline. I was suggesting that some of the downside be placed on the profession mechanic, i.e, replacing Distortion with Continuum Shift. For balance sake as well as it just making more sense for the class.

I will say that removing Distortion would be a nasty thing to do to a Mesmer in PvE and WvW and you’d do serious harm to Chronomancer’s usefulness in those game types. I don’t think it’s a good solution, but if I have to choose between that and outright losing Continuum Split (which seems to be what most of the PvP forum wants), I’ll take the bargain.

apharma.3741:

Um which other elites remove something for their elite?

As far as I know the others have their class mechanics change (guard virtues, necro DS) but the basic functionality stays the same. Additionally guards keep the passive bonuses and the activated effects can become much stronger or at least stay the same depending on situation.

Tempest also gets overcharge added. Sadly I wasn’t in the beta so never got to test it. I know it’s bad at the moment but it could end up really good eventually. All added nothing taken away there and it’s arguably the strongest class atm.

So…why are you advocating taking away?

Necromancer has had their original shroud removed in place of the Reaper Shroud. Guardians have had their original virtues “removed” (reworked) for the new virtues. Elementalist, although I haven’t played Tempest yet, has a “lockout” after they have overcharged. Chronomancer is the only elite specialization that has absolutely no downside to their profession mechanic, only gains. Unless you count Continuum Shift “stealing” clones from the other shatter skills which I wouldn’t.

I just wish they moved the clone/shatter bar a bit to the left and placed the CS shatter next to the other 4…

Agent Noun.7350:

Iavra.8510:

I know they said it, but i don’t think it should be this way. F5 is something you get for free, no matter what build you are playing. They should instead make the new wells more powerful and give a reason to take them over Blink/Decoy.

You do have to give up something: an entire trait line. Do you think all Mesmers get Chronomancer as a free fourth trait line or something? There is opportunity cost to it.

This is true of all elite specializations so Chronomancer would need to sacrifice more in order to equate themselves to Reapers or Dragonhunters.

Hammerguard.9834:

Necromancer has had their original shroud removed in place of the Reaper Shroud. Guardians have had their original virtues “removed” (reworked) for the new virtues. Elementalist, although I haven’t played Tempest yet, has a “lockout” after they have overcharged. Chronomancer is the only elite specialization that has absolutely no downside to their profession mechanic, only gains. Unless you count Continuum Shift “stealing” clones from the other shatter skills which I wouldn’t.

Incorrect, the sprite is laughably easy to kill from what I saw, there is the down side. That’s without mentioning it lasts 1.5s base which is barely enough time to do anything so requires 1-2 clones to be useful.

Mesmers are also not seeing any more variety in their F1-4 skills either so they kinda lose out in variety there. While guard and necro get more choice AND a lot of it is to cover weaknesses they had.

As well as getting the absolute lowest number of weapon skills from any elite spec, how do you intend to change that if you’re suggesting taking away distortion? Otherwise it would leave chronomancy hilariously bad.

Tempest I would expect to get a heavy rework, right now the nicest thing I can say is the dev that thought it up needs to sit down with Phantaram, Wakey and Denshee for a conversation.

While guard and necro get more choice…

…how do you intend to change that if you’re suggesting taking away distortion?

You are contradicting yourself. Guard/Necro get the choice to give up their old DS/Virtues for RS/new Virtues, while Chrono currently gets a new class mechanic for free without having to give up anything (taking a traitline is NOT an argument, since every class has to do this).

Also, number of new weaponskills is not an argument, either, since the new weapons aren’t stronger than older ones (actually, so far they seem to be worse and thus irrelevant) and elite specializations work perfectly fine with only using core weapons.

Iavra.8510:

While guard and necro get more choice…

…how do you intend to change that if you’re suggesting taking away distortion?

You are contradicting yourself. Guard/Necro get the choice to give up their old DS/Virtues for RS/new Virtues, while Chrono currently gets a new class mechanic for free without having to give up anything (taking a traitline is NOT an argument, since every class has to do this).

Also, number of new weaponskills is not an argument, either, since the new weapons aren’t stronger than older ones (actually, so far they seem to be worse and thus irrelevant) and elite specializations work perfectly fine with only using core weapons.

That’s just the point. The shield weapon skills aren’t very good, and they won’t be better just by changing numbers (which are the only changes I think will happen at this stage).

I think you’re missing the elite part of elite specialization. Your suggestions (remove Continuum Split) would turn Chronomancer into just another specialization line—don’t pretend wells and shield are all that relevant to this discussion. Mesmer would, as a result, functionally be the only profession not to have an elite spec. Sure, they’d have something called an elite spec, but it wouldn’t really be that.

Part of the problem with most of the suggestions I’ve seen so far is that they utterly cripple the Chronomancer. I’m willing to bet that most PvP Mesmers would be unwilling to give up Distortion for Continuum Split—the extra survivability is just too vital. The same is true in PvE and definitely true in WvW. Similarly, just getting rid of Continuum Split turns the Chronomancer into just another trait line—a decent one, but nothing too special, mostly good for phantasm builds in PvE who’d like to be able to shatter a bit more without nuking their own DPS.

(Hint: Chronophantasma doesn’t let you do very much shatter-wise that you couldn’t already do by just taking Deceptive Evasion and slotting Mirror Images. It’s a little faster, but you can still rapid-fire shatter without it.)

The number of weaponskills is still an argument, Devs said that themselves. The fact that they are stronger or equivalent to other weapons is irrelevant. The fact that you are not satisfied with the new specializations from other professions should not be a reason to cripple a profession you don’t like. You should ask for a change to DH and Reaper instead. I’d be glad to see improvement to them.

@apharma,

Replacing Distortion with CS could warrant buffs to CS and also allow CS to play a more vital role in Chronomancers gameplay. It would give Chronomancers a more unique feel from Mesmers. At least more so than now.

I think you’re missing the elite part of elite specialization. Your suggestions (remove Continuum Split) would turn Chronomancer into just another specialization line

So, you are implying that elite specializations should be strictly better than core classes, giving player who own HoT a clear advantage over players who don’t?

I love my mesmer and i’d like for it to be balanced, but if Chronomancer stays the way it is, i will either not pick it and continue playing core mesmer or switch to a different class.

Hammerguard.9834:

@apharma,

Replacing Distortion with CS could warrant buffs to CS and also allow CS to play a more vital role in Chronomancers gameplay. It would give Chronomancers a more unique feel from Mesmers. At least more so than now.

You’d need to give Continuum Split some more defensive capabilities, then, which it actually doesn’t have much of now.

As it stands, you have to be very careful when using Continuum Split. Don’t use it on low health or you’re probably going to be in trouble when you snap back; don’t count on it to save you from a dangerous situation, because you can still be killed while it’s active and it won’t pull you back from downed state; don’t count on it lasting anywhere close to its full duration in a team fight because the AoE and cleave will almost certainly break it early.

If you asked me to give up Distortion for Continuum Split in its current state, I don’t think I’d take you up on that offer. And any buffs I can think of right now (like making the Continuum Rift indestructible, so you can always count on having the full duration) would make it an actually overpowered ability.

Iavra.8510:

I think you’re missing the elite part of elite specialization. Your suggestions (remove Continuum Split) would turn Chronomancer into just another specialization line

So, you are implying that elite specializations should be strictly better than core classes, giving player who own HoT a clear advantage over players who don’t?

No. I’m implying that they should give you something special, something new, and something big.

I want to clarify that when I reply to you I’m doing so assuming you’re still in favor of outright removing Continuum Split. If you do that, you are absolutely dropping Chronomancer to a level lower than any other currently-revealed elite spec, in that it would no longer interact with the Mesmer’s core mechanic in any way and, for the vast majority of players, wouldn’t offer anything new at all.

I wouldn’t say i favor it, but it’s the easier solution seeing how hard this skill is to balance. So far i see 3 options:

- Drop F5, might need to change the traitline to compensate (though iReversion and Chronophantasma combined with Alacrity are already extremely strong).

- Let F5 replace F4. This makes Chrono more glassy, but allows for higher burst by resetting shatters etc and possible jukes.

- Keep F4 and F5. Now this is tricky, because it would still mean giving chrono a free skill, so the traitline would need to have a negative impact to offset this, like reducing the max illusion limit.

That last option would be completely crippling and nobody would ever use Chronomancer.

Hammerguard does have a point: if Distortion gets replaced by Continuum Split, Continuum Split needs a buff to make it a worthwhile trade-off. No Mesmer in their right mind would make that trade with both abilities in their current state—Distortion is simply too vital for survivability in all game modes, while Continuum Split offers very little survivability at all.

Here’s the thing with Continuum Split:

1. Someone breaks the rift? It ends early, and may end at a really inopportune time for you. If you use it in the middle of a team fight, this will almost certainly happen.

2. Get focused on while in Continuum Split and go down? It won’t save you.

3. Happen to use Continuum Split while on low health or while your healing skill is on cooldown? Have fun when you snap back, buddy.

What I’m trying to say is: Continuum Split is not free damage (in fact, using it for damage in a lot of cases wastes its potential for team support). It is not easy to use. Its duration, even with three illusions, is not long. (I bring up the short duration because it really limits its ability to be used as a juke—if you, say, use F5 in an out-of-the-way spot to keep the Rift safe and give yourself a safe place to return to, you have very little time to actually accomplish anything after moving from that spot.)

I really think people are overstating how powerful Continuum Split is. Don’t misunderstand me: it is very good and very worth using. But I think once more than a weekend passes and people get a better handle on both how to use it and the very real limitations it has, it’ll even itself out.

You have to consider the specialization as a whole: As I already said, guardians didn’t get a new f skill, but they got a new 2 handed weapons with 5 new skills in a domain they were weak: Ranged. mesmer on the other hand got a off hand with 2 skills, and they already got enough off hands compared to main hands. They don’t get as much as guardians get with the new weapon from the new specialization. So, in compensation mesmer get a new f5 skills.

If you want to remove (god no) or replace the skill, you have to give something more to the mesmer.

Iavra.8510:

While guard and necro get more choice…

…how do you intend to change that if you’re suggesting taking away distortion?

You are contradicting yourself. Guard/Necro get the choice to give up their old DS/Virtues for RS/new Virtues, while Chrono currently gets a new class mechanic for free without having to give up anything (taking a traitline is NOT an argument, since every class has to do this).

Also, number of new weaponskills is not an argument, either, since the new weapons aren’t stronger than older ones (actually, so far they seem to be worse and thus irrelevant) and elite specializations work perfectly fine with only using core weapons.

You’re missing the entire point of F5.

When shield was announced for mesmer there was a lot of uproar, this is because mesmer doesn’t need another off hand weapon.

The devs responded by saying that mesmers will get something “just as good” and revealed the F5.

Mesmer gets F5 which is added on to make up for having only an off hand weapon added.

However guards get to change their F1-3 abilities. Necros get a whole new set of skills 1-5 on their DS. This offers both classes the opportunity to change their class mechanic if they want as well as synergising with the spirit of the elite spec (hunter in guards case, big monster movie slasher in necro).

The elite specs offer choices for all professions.

Additionally please do not retype what I put in a quote changing it completely. It’s one thing to disagree with someone, it’s another to completely change what they say under the pretence of quoting them.

apharma.3741:

Mesmers are also not seeing any more variety in their F1-4 skills either so they kinda lose out in variety there. While guard and necro get more choice AND a lot of it is to cover weaknesses they had.

As well as getting the absolute lowest number of weapon skills from any elite spec, how do you intend to change that if you’re suggesting taking away distortion? Otherwise it would leave chronomancy hilariously bad.

What you’re suggesting is distortion to continuum shift which if we’re following how it goes for other elite specs you’d have to change mind wrack, cry of frustration and diversion to different functionality too.

This would then put it on par with other elites…except 3 weapon skills down and it’s the 3 weapon skills mesmers need more of.

How about this trade.
Give mesmers main hand pistol and the off hand shield.
Then you can remove the F5

Solori.6025:

How about this trade.
Give mesmers main hand pistol and the off hand shield.
Then you can remove the F5

You would have to replace one F ability with continuum + replace other F abilities with something else to get on part with other professions then

I wouldn’t say Chrono is useless without a new shatter and only an offhand weapon (which i still don’t think should be an argument). The traits it offers are huge, basically supplying you with an unending stream of illusions and Alacrity giving you more frequent access to shatters the make use of them. Add Slow, which in itself is very powerful and the option to use other runes than Traveler and you have plenty of reasons to go Chrono even without a new weapon or F5.

This weekend i personally played Chrono and Reaper and fought against both Revenant and Tempest (i watched someone play Dragonhunter) and i think Reaper is so far the most balanced of them and other professions should be balanced according to it. I actually played against a very good ranger using a cleric build with shouts and taunt that i almost can never beat 1v1 with shatter and i won by pretty much spamming everything as a condi chrono.

You still want to remove the core mechanism of the specialization, the only new thing we get from it, like every other profession does.
beside, you can’t specialize to have good alacrity uptime, lots of illusions and slow. You have to make a choice. And you have to abandon something useful to be a chronomancer already.

Spleen.7836:

Solori.6025:

How about this trade.
Give mesmers main hand pistol and the off hand shield.
Then you can remove the F5

You would have to replace one F ability with continuum + replace other F abilities with something else to get on part with other professions then

Oh yeah true very true.

F1 inflicts double damage but increases the CD by 33%
F2 inflicts slow
F3 also immobilizes
F4 grants distortion and a displacement effect at you and clones shatter locations (240r)
:P

I don’t understand why some people think mesmers should have to negotiate with them at all. These suggestions are not only terrible, but they are extremely unfair.

How about this? Warriors lose rampage and in exchange get…a cookie.

So you feel yourself tempted to use the Elite Well when going Chrono?

DaShi.1368:

I don’t understand why some people think mesmers should have to negotiate with them at all. These suggestions are not only terrible, but they are extremely unfair.

That’s basically the PvP community. Nerf everything I can’t deal with. Even when in the most recent WTS mesmers didn’t make the impact an ele, guardian, or necro made.
Nah this is the same crap that rangers went through when they got buffs.
Prepare for the crusade

Honestly, Chrono could give no new weapons, heal, utilities, elite and F5 and i would still pick it over everything else because of 25% Movespeed, iReversion and Chronophantasma.

Solori.6025:

DaShi.1368:

I don’t understand why some people think mesmers should have to negotiate with them at all. These suggestions are not only terrible, but they are extremely unfair.

That’s basically the PvP community. Nerf everything I can’t deal with. Even when in the most recent WTS mesmers didn’t make the impact an ele, guardian, or necro made.
Nah this is the same crap that rangers went through when they got buffs.
Prepare for the crusade

That’s just the thing. For most people who demand Mesmer nerfs, they’re talking specifically about hot-join PvP. And it’s true: in a game mode with a large number of unskilled players and a lack of coordinated teams, Mesmers are in the perfect spot to dominate. (Please note that I am not calling posters like Hammerguard and lavra unskilled players, not by a long-shot; I’m only saying that, by and large, they’re probably playing with an unskilled team more often than not, no matter how skilled they are individually.)

But when you’re talking about skilled players and coordinated teams, Mesmers fall back into line with most other professions. If anything, Continuum Shift trickery should help a lot in that part of the game (and in PvE), and its main impact actually won’t be burst damage. And when you have coordinated teams, it will be very easy to shove the big weakness of Continuum Shift right in a Mesmer’s face—break the rift and you’ve made them waste the skill for ~90 seconds (give or take some Alacrity).

It’s very dangerous to balance a game around unskilled and uncoordinated players.

What makes Continuum Shift so cool is that it’s very powerful but also has a very clear and decisive counter: break the Rift and the fun’s over. That’s really cool. There’s no trickery to it. And if the Chronomancer tries to hide the Rift out of the way, they have to give up a significant portion of the skill’s duration just to move back into the team fight.

@lavra:
Don’t forget what you are giving up for your cool Chrono toys.
Chronomancer has no good defensive traits.
Chronomancer has no reliable damage boosts (Danger Time being extremely niche, difficult to manage, displaces the toys you like the most, and apparently headed for a nerf anyway when they nerf permaslow).

Of the other trees the mesmer has, Dom/Illusions/Dueling all have significant, decently reliable dps boost traits for both yourself and your illusions.
Inspiration is the support tree, and has extreme durability.
Chaos mixes dps and durability traits, but is still closest to Chronomancer in terms of the kind of trait it hands down.

The fact is that taking the chronomancer line means taking a power cut.
You also lose a minor trait, which is one of the tradeoffs elite specs make to try to pay for their changes. If you take away the extra power an elite spec gives, you’re just adding a new trait line with one less trait than the others.

Mesmers are also in a different place than other classes traitwise, in that it’s actually pretty tough to limit yourself trait-wise for any given build. When I put my condi engi together, all my condition traits were in one line. Traits are pretty well segregated by type in most classes I’ve played, in fact.
But as a mesmer, Inspiration is the only line I feel I can say that about. No matter what build style I try to put together, I find the relevant traits scattered across the trait lines. No matter what Chronomancer build I put together, I found I had to give up a trait line that contained at least one key trait for my main mechanic.
That wouldn’t be true for my Engi, my Thief, or my Guardian. I don’t have a necro, and I suck so kitten my Elementalist that I probably shouldn’t say much about that, except that Eles are the other elite spec we’ve seen that had new skills added for every weaponset. Overload, like CS, doesn’t depend on you equipping the new skills, and it doesn’t change the base attunements. It’s a straight skill add. The lockout, like spending clones to activate CS or the enemy ability to break the CS, is meant to be a balancer. The fact that the Overloads aren’t worth the lockout is a matter of balance for the Tempest, not the Chronomancer.

It would be ok if they replaced distortion, but made CS 60 sec base cooldown, and removed the crystal from it- making it more reliable. Then i would be fine with this. Otherwise HELL NO.

AlphatheWhite.9351:

Mesmers are also in a different place than other classes traitwise, in that it’s actually pretty tough to limit yourself trait-wise for any given build. When I put my condi engi together, all my condition traits were in one line. Traits are pretty well segregated by type in most classes I’ve played, in fact.

On this topic, I actually think ArenaNet should work towards this kind of trait balance with the other professions. It’s really cool that Mesmers have enough good traits that it’s a legitimately difficult choice which ones to take. That should be true of every profession.

For builds, Chrono/Illusions/X is already a very good condi build with a flexible 3rd traitline.

With Power i’d either go Dom/Dueling/Chrono or Dom/Chaos/Chrono, depending on if i want more burst or sustain. Dueling/Chaos/Chrono is also a valid choice for shatter spam. As long as Mender’s Purity stays bugged i won’t touch Inspiration with a pole.

I hope you guys realize that by “replacing F4 with F5” you’re not actually going to replace F4 with F5. The way they’ve done the “overlapping of skills” is by slapping another effect onto the skill and retaining some/most of the base skill.

This means that now our CS will also give us (and maybe the Rift) invulnerability for each illusion shattered. Do you really want that?