Why the massive cooldown on veil?
IIRC there are no limits on field effects. You can have 50 people run through it, all of them would get stealth
i’m inclined to agree with Xel on this. Wut the heck? This is clearly a skill balanced specifically for zerg wvw play. Why not change it outside of wvw? Bring it more in line with the other glamours and make it a 40s CD and a 4s stealth.
mesmer of Blackgate
http://intothemists.com/
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Well… you already can get 6 seconds of stealth from it (PU). Usually, I run through it, summon a phantasm, unstealth then immediately run through again, summon the other phantasm, and voila! Stealthed + two phantasms.
This is clearly a [mesmer skill] that functions in a [bad, overly-weak, actually…it doesn’t function at all] way
I agree completely!
Even if it had a 15s cd (traited), it’d hardly be abusable/op in a zerg situation. Veil is used during the initiation of combat, sometimes with a followup if a rally is needed. The thing is, the enemy will have access to the same thing. More veils will mean more interesting combat, and mesmers more willing to both take it, and use it.
Portal needs a reduction for the same reasons.
It just grants a 2 sec invisibility, that you have to walk through to gain, and is a light combo field, imo one of the most worthless fields. everything about this says it should be no more than 15 second 20-25 tops.
Am I missing some major use for this that warrants a 90sec cooldown, equal to that of a portal and mass invisibility?
It’s the only skill in game that can apply stealth to unlimited players, so it’s best used in wvw group play: we don’t really lack ways to get stealth for ourselves with the prestige, decoy and mass invis.
Now, if mass invis player limit was removed (since it’s an elite skill), then I would totally agree with you.
Caos Danzante – [So] Shellfish WvW guild ( videos )
Make WvW Eventful! – WvW, 4 years in
Yes, I have 5 lv 80 mesmers – Funny Puns
Make WvW Eventful! – WvW, 4 years in
Yes, I have 5 lv 80 mesmers – Funny Puns
The long cooldown is a pain, but I like the skill (especially in a PU build)
Not only can you use it as described above, but with a traited duelist and a bit of work in positioning, you can remove quite a few conditions.
Just a little cooldown reduction would go a long way for me on this skill
They should rework this skill completely. I don’t want utilities with the main purpose of zerging… I want it to be good for me primarily and then we think about the others… Easy fix for this skills tho.
CD 40sec
Lasts 8 sec (light field)
Stealth for 2sec
If more than 5 allies go through the field CD is doubled.
Instantly fixed and useful for every mez, not only those who zerg or want maximum cheese in a phantasm 1v1 build.
Fact: every Thief tells you to “l2p” when the subject is to nerf stealth.
(edited by Nuka Cola.8520)
Even if it had a 15s cd (traited), it’d hardly be abusable/op in a zerg situation. Veil is used during the initiation of combat, sometimes with a followup if a rally is needed. The thing is, the enemy will have access to the same thing. More veils will mean more interesting combat, and mesmers more willing to both take it, and use it.
Portal needs a reduction for the same reasons.
Imagine a fight, 40 on 40. Each side has ~5 mesmers. One side is more organized and daisy chains the veils. That side now has permanent, repeatably applied stealth for 40 people.
Skills like Veil and Portal have these long cool downs because under certain circumstances they can (and did) get abused to devastating effect.
Think about portals on a 40s cool down. The whole army you are fighting has constant teleports!
Even if it had a 15s cd (traited), it’d hardly be abusable/op in a zerg situation. Veil is used during the initiation of combat, sometimes with a followup if a rally is needed. The thing is, the enemy will have access to the same thing. More veils will mean more interesting combat, and mesmers more willing to both take it, and use it.
Portal needs a reduction for the same reasons.
Imagine a fight, 40 on 40. Each side has ~5 mesmers. One side is more organized and daisy chains the veils. That side now has permanent, repeatably applied stealth for 40 people.
Skills like Veil and Portal have these long cool downs because under certain circumstances they can (and did) get abused to devastating effect.
Think about portals on a 40s cool down. The whole army you are fighting has constant teleports!
They should just limit them both to 5 maybe 10 allies and significantly decrease their wtf CD.
Fact: every Thief tells you to “l2p” when the subject is to nerf stealth.
I just cant see the value in such a short lived stealth even to a group of people. You cant get very far and plenty of skills still hit you be they aoe or channelings.
Requiem is the only one to give an example of this ability being used to some effect. Maybe not 90sec worth of effect but still pretty good.
Maybe if what Nuka Cola said with a group of organized people to weave in and out of it to abuse the quick restealthing it MIGHT warrant the cooldown. Things on paper dont always go as planned once ingame.
Anyone willing to make a video where a group of people use Veil with devastating results?
Even if it had a 15s cd (traited), it’d hardly be abusable/op in a zerg situation. Veil is used during the initiation of combat, sometimes with a followup if a rally is needed. The thing is, the enemy will have access to the same thing. More veils will mean more interesting combat, and mesmers more willing to both take it, and use it.
Portal needs a reduction for the same reasons.
Imagine a fight, 40 on 40. Each side has ~5 mesmers. One side is more organized and daisy chains the veils. That side now has permanent, repeatably applied stealth for 40 people.
Skills like Veil and Portal have these long cool downs because under certain circumstances they can (and did) get abused to devastating effect.
Think about portals on a 40s cool down. The whole army you are fighting has constant teleports!
Do you know how hard it is to get a single mesmer in a zerg these days? Least of all one willing to play the veil meta? That said, if it happened you’d see a dramatic increase in stealth trap use.
All that aside, so what? That’s a huge level of coordination to pull off, and it’s only manuvers.
What’d it’d really mean is that you could run more mesmers with fewer veils. Hell, you’d be free to run 2 with veil, and 2 with portal, the last with null field, and each mesmer could take some personal (keep me the kitten alive) utilities instead.
I just cant see the value in such a short lived stealth even to a group of people. You cant get very far and plenty of skills still hit you be they aoe or channelings.
Requiem is the only one to give an example of this ability being used to some effect. Maybe not 90sec worth of effect but still pretty good.
Maybe if what Nuka Cola said with a group of organized people to weave in and out of it to abuse the quick restealthing it MIGHT warrant the cooldown. Things on paper dont always go as planned once ingame.Anyone willing to make a video where a group of people use Veil with devastating results?
Generally speaking it allows two important things. First it drops target. Second, a zerg can fake and alter direction. Misdirection can waste an enemyzergs cc’s and bomb.
I think the non-target-limited nature is the problem here.
One way to fix that would be to change the base nature of the spell, I was always in favour of a “wall” which simply makes people on opposite sides unable to see each other. Basically a graphics engine trick, but it also disables targeting (you can still target AEs into the area behind the wall).
Another would be to make the wall have X charges, indicated by pieces of the wall breaking off. In turn, reduce CD to ~30seconds.
The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.
I just cant see the value in such a short lived stealth even to a group of people. You cant get very far and plenty of skills still hit you be they aoe or channelings.
Requiem is the only one to give an example of this ability being used to some effect. Maybe not 90sec worth of effect but still pretty good.
Maybe if what Nuka Cola said with a group of organized people to weave in and out of it to abuse the quick restealthing it MIGHT warrant the cooldown. Things on paper dont always go as planned once ingame.Anyone willing to make a video where a group of people use Veil with devastating results?
Just check any GvG video
Caos Danzante – [So] Shellfish WvW guild ( videos )
Make WvW Eventful! – WvW, 4 years in
Yes, I have 5 lv 80 mesmers – Funny Puns
Make WvW Eventful! – WvW, 4 years in
Yes, I have 5 lv 80 mesmers – Funny Puns
I think the cooldown is reminisent of the old veil skill and when they nerfed it they never bothered to update the cooldown.
It’s better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.
Noobs: JEZUZZZ MAN NERF THAT VEIL IT’S SO OP IT STACKS STEALTH!!!
Anet: ok ok…
(Veil Stealth got shrunk to 2 seconds)
Anet: Fine now?
Noobs: YEAH FINE NOW!!
Mesmer Players: wtf? where’s the trade-off? where’s the balance?
Welcome to the mesmer club!
I think the cooldown is reminisent of the old veil skill and when they nerfed it they never bothered to update the cooldown.
how was it before?
Fact: every Thief tells you to “l2p” when the subject is to nerf stealth.