Guild Wars 2

So I just got my Mesmer up to level 80, and the only place I have found this class to be remotely enjoyable is WvW zergs. What type of setup should I use to be effective in a zerg? I feel like shatter would be useless due to clones/illusions dying way too fast, and lockdown seems pointless in a zerg fight. So what would you guys suggest for equipment, traits, and skills?

Also, I plan on using traveler’s runes, since mesmer movement SUCKS.

There is no zerg build mesmers are the worst class for zergs because they require targeting and are primarily single target attacks. The most effective class’s for zergs can do mass aoe dmg without targeting like war guards necros eles.

You could try a confusion/blind build on your glamor skills but the cds are too long to feel useful enough, other than that all you can really do is bring utility such as a veil here and portal there.

Go shatter conditions to get a build remotely close to AoE damage for zerg fighting. Other than that, you’re basically a portal and veil bot in zergs and aren’t going to be doing frontlining or AoE. In zerg fights you can help out by putting pressure on the thieves that are trying to snipe the backline. If you are traited for phantasms they will track the thieves through stealth and effectively keep them from picking your teammates off to their heart’s content.

I think the glamour traits are helpful in a zerg. Null-field, feedback, veil, and timewarp all help out the zerg. I typically run GS and scepter/focus in a zerg.

I don’t think you need to get traveler’s runes if you are running with a zerg, there will be plenty of speed buffs going around.

Mesmers are tricky in zergs, for sure.

Shatter builds are ok, just “reduced”. You’re best at picking off stragglers/ranged and playing like a thief. Don’t expect to stop the melee train in its tracks, but you’re an absolute monster at destroying the back line and stripping boons.

I usually avoid interrupt builds… too much stability from my enemies and long cooldowns. Most people shrug off a 1.5s daze and use it as an opportunity to re-position. I don’t know. I just feel like slightly delaying a few casts for a few people every 10-20 seconds isn’t the best my class has to offer.

I like phantasm builds and glamour builds. 20/10/0/25/15 is one I keep going back to. Tons of phantasm damage, super low cooldowns, and a lot of options for more cooldowns, glamour support, and even mantra support. While your phantasms don’t survive for long, they usually get at least 1 attack off. ’Zerker becomes a 5k damage AoE/Cripple + 1k damage shatter with a 12s cooldown, which is a sweet, sweet little beast.

PU builds are great for roaming, but they rely a lot on staying stealthed. Since our illusions die quickly, they seem like builds that revolve around non-participation in battle.

I’d try a phantasm build, I’d try a mantra build, and I’d try doing a few rounds of sPvP with a shatter build then using it in WvW and seeing how it feels. Read the thief forums, see how they contribute to WvW and try to best their efforts rather than reading the elementalist “AoE aplenty” forums and feeling impotent.

I’m aware that Mesmer isn’t the best damage class in a zerg. I have plenty of other 80s I can use for damage. My problem is that my Mesmer is boring and doesn’t seem very effective in dungeons or PvE roaming. For these parts of the game I would much rather use my Ranger, Thief, Elementalist, Warrior, Guardian, or Engineer (and although I know I can also use them for WvW, its the only part of the game that I found entertaining as a Mesmer). I don’t intend to delete my Mesmer, therefore I’m looking for a build that will maximize my usefulness and enjoyment in zergs.

It really depends on what kind of zerg we are talking about.

If its a completely random zerg, commander is not on TS, you’re not on TS and pretty much every fight is a moshpit that your side has a 50/50 chance of winning (ie did you bring the most people? Good.) then I would highly recommend a full ranged hybrid build, either direct damage damage or condition. It doesnt really matter which. Skills doesnt really matter either, go with selfish ones to stay alive.

If its an organized guild zerg, then its direct damage and ~3K armor all the way. You need to stay alive and you need to push damage when the commander says so. Condition damage is not effective here and better left to other classes like necros. You can use a PU spec – most organized guilds have multiple Mesmers and veil before engaging. Shatter spec work perfectly fine as well. Focus feedback specs work too of course, but personally I find them a little boring.

If its a really organized guild raid then shatter dps build bring the most oomph. Few go that far though. Red Guard perhaps

The two zerg specs I have personally found the most fun:
0/25/20/25/0 greatsword/staff healing mantra/condition mantra/stability mantra/feedback/timewarp. This is my greatstaff phantasm mantra heal spec that can plow through pretty much anything. Its meant as a ranged frontliner.
0/20/30/20/0 sword/torch/staff healing mantra/blink/decoy/null field/mass invis. This is more of a PU skirmisher spec aimed at going stealthed into the backline and disrupt but I also use it in the melee train if I’m in a group that has enough stability.

Both run direct damage@3K armor. With the PU in solo mode I reach 60% crit chance and 80% crit damage. Had a fun fight with a warrior yesterday – he failed to bring me below 90% HP. It took like 3 minutes to kill him due to heavy tank spec, lol :p

Its a rather cheezy spec, but at least I dont have to change between roaming and zerging. PU is the only spec I have find to reliably be able to counter roaming theives.

Try a 30/30/10/0/0 with knights gear, knights/soldier/zerker trinkets, and melandru/hoelbrak and lemongrass, GS, Sword/Torch with sigils of fire and stamina. Take the two mantra grandmaster traits plus illusion damage, GS cooldowns, deceptive evasion, phantasmal fury, and debilitating dissiption. Use mantras of recovery, concentration, resolve, and either a glamour or blink.

Playstyle is to move just behind the front line, unload with GS skills, shatter, swap to sword/torch and push through the melee using sword, prestige, and dodging. With sigil of stamina and clone-death traits, you’re tagging everyone and spreading some condos with nonstop clone spamming. You can either stay on the heels of the melee classes or stay with ranged and jump into melee, burst DPS, and then blink back to safety.

Anyway, this is just one DPS option for zerg play.

http://nl.twitch.tv/doiidrg/profile/pastBroadcasts

Shatter useless in raids? Since when?

BlackDevil.9268:

http://nl.twitch.tv/doiidrg/profile/pastBroadcasts

Shatter useless in raids? Since when?

Love your vids, BlackDevil!

Shatter is definitely a workable build. In my experience, it’s great for roaming and great when supported by allies (condition cleansing and stability especially). It requires a bit more attention than some other builds. Making sure your clones reach their target, knowing when to duck out of combat, knowing the rapid-fire burst combos you’ll need.

I’d say the entry-level skill requirement can be high though, and that’s intimidating for new-to-the-class players. Definitely worthwhile to do some PvP and practice.

Do you ever run with a different off-hand? Warden always feels so weak to me in large battles.

Pyro had a zerg build at https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guide-Build-The-Zergmower.

I have no way to compare to other people and other classes, but using clones that explode for conditions, the +33% confusion duration trait, the minor that clones cause confusion on kill, and traited staff, Illusionists celerity, and deceptive evasion .. (in a full condition build and equip) .. I spam chaos storm, and then spam as many clones as I possibly can into the opposing zerg .. it seems to get a lot of bags.

Not the strongest in a zerg for sure.

Btw I run a strange 0/25/30/0/15 condition build much of the time.

Contrition.8945:

Pyro had a zerg build at https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guide-Build-The-Zergmower.

I have no way to compare to other people and other classes, but using clones that explode for conditions, the +33% confusion duration trait, the minor that clones cause confusion on kill, and traited staff, Illusionists celerity, and deceptive evasion .. (in a full condition build and equip) .. I spam chaos storm, and then spam as many clones as I possibly can into the opposing zerg .. it seems to get a lot of bags.

Not the strongest in a zerg for sure.

Btw I run a strange 0/25/30/0/15 condition build much of the time.

I like the clone-death zerg build as well. Just an fyi though: +condi duration is wasted in zergs (for the most part) because of all the aoe cleansing. Short, hard-hitting conditions are thus best, like burning and torment. Geomancy is good as well.

Bunda.2691:

Contrition.8945:

Pyro had a zerg build at https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guide-Build-The-Zergmower.

I have no way to compare to other people and other classes, but using clones that explode for conditions, the +33% confusion duration trait, the minor that clones cause confusion on kill, and traited staff, Illusionists celerity, and deceptive evasion .. (in a full condition build and equip) .. I spam chaos storm, and then spam as many clones as I possibly can into the opposing zerg .. it seems to get a lot of bags.

Not the strongest in a zerg for sure.

Btw I run a strange 0/25/30/0/15 condition build much of the time.

I like the clone-death zerg build as well. Just an fyi though: +condi duration is wasted in zergs (for the most part) because of all the aoe cleansing. Short, hard-hitting conditions are thus best, like burning and torment. Geomancy is good as well.

I use +condition duration in my build to ensure that the burns from the guardian runes will tick even on someone stacking -duration.

Pyroatheist.9031:

Bunda.2691:

Contrition.8945:

Pyro had a zerg build at https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guide-Build-The-Zergmower.

I have no way to compare to other people and other classes, but using clones that explode for conditions, the +33% confusion duration trait, the minor that clones cause confusion on kill, and traited staff, Illusionists celerity, and deceptive evasion .. (in a full condition build and equip) .. I spam chaos storm, and then spam as many clones as I possibly can into the opposing zerg .. it seems to get a lot of bags.

Not the strongest in a zerg for sure.

Btw I run a strange 0/25/30/0/15 condition build much of the time.

I like the clone-death zerg build as well. Just an fyi though: +condi duration is wasted in zergs (for the most part) because of all the aoe cleansing. Short, hard-hitting conditions are thus best, like burning and torment. Geomancy is good as well.

I use +condition duration in my build to ensure that the burns from the guardian runes will tick even on someone stacking -duration.

Fair enough, esp if using guardian runes and extra burning. I just usually use orrian truffle and meat stew for the additional dodges and might.

Also, been using runes of tormenting to good effect. Works really well at tagging along with sigil of tormenting. Wish the stack was a little bigger though.

I use 30/0/20or30/10/0

It’s a lock down build with glamour as utility to help zerg.

Confounding suggestions works excellent with Chaos Storm. torm. Land chaos storm on their back line because back lines are less likely to have Stability. It’s very fun because once back line has no Stability and Chaos Storm + confounding they are most likely steam rolled because of near perma stun (even with stun breakers unless they blink out)

Usually I use bountiful interruptiom if I’m looking to be a little boon reliant or chaotic interruption if I want more of a punishment spec. I almost always use 20% reduction on staff.

Going into inspiration, I grab the glamour trait (20 reduction recharge) and if I didn’t go for 30 in Chaos, I would use 20 here for the focus trait since Temporal Curtain becomes a (albeit low) wall of reflection and has reduced recharge for more pulls. Not to mention focus is also a ranged interrupt, which is still great even if you didn’t get the focus trait to proc Bountiful / Chaotic interruption.

Also with my build, I really don’t think gear spec matters, but I use power gear since I already went 30 into domination. Also I have Bolt and sword is not a good condition weapon. At times, I run into the zerg ball and blurred frenzy for more loot.

My utilities :
Feedback <> Null Field <> Blink <> Decoy <> Veil <> Portal <> Mantra of Distraction.

I always use MI since I’m lazy to switch it out for time warp and it’s a good elite anyway .

*please note: I realize me build maybe highly inefficient / ineffective compared to other builds but it works for me in zergs and I get decent tagging/loot

Thanks for the advice guys. I plan on running mostly with an organized guild zerg on TS. Usually we get 10-20+ people.

Listening to people say mesmers are useless in zergs gets old. People think mesmer is just there for veil but the fact of the matter is you have the best AoE boon removal power in game. Build around it and go wild.

Oh, and temporal curtain + chaotic interruption is one of the single best lockdown utillities in the game.

Kelthien.8593:

BlackDevil.9268:

http://nl.twitch.tv/doiidrg/profile/pastBroadcasts

Shatter useless in raids? Since when?

Love your vids, BlackDevil!

Shatter is definitely a workable build. In my experience, it’s great for roaming and great when supported by allies (condition cleansing and stability especially). It requires a bit more attention than some other builds. Making sure your clones reach their target, knowing when to duck out of combat, knowing the rapid-fire burst combos you’ll need.

I’d say the entry-level skill requirement can be high though, and that’s intimidating for new-to-the-class players. Definitely worthwhile to do some PvP and practice.

Do you ever run with a different off-hand? Warden always feels so weak to me in large battles.

I do agree on that yeah, but there’s no other way to learn it then just to try it out and practice with it.
Veil and quickness are your main utility’s as mesmer, the rest is up to you.
The build is mostly based around boon shatter and the immobilize, so you can even run full pvt at start if you’re not that experienced or your raid isnt that good with healing regroups and such just to practice.
You always gotta keep in mind: you’re not the dps, but the support. Doesn’t matter which build you wanna go, in fights of at least 20 vs X you’ll always be the support role (well… unless you wanna go kittened with these yologuilds that think getting 3-4 guys to pick off backline is really good I guess you can go some PU roaming build lol) , but that doesn’t mean you can’t deal damage.
Asuming blurred frenzy hitting aroudn 3.5k and shatter around 2.5k you can easily deal 20k damage, remove around 10 boons in total of nearby enemies and give immobilize around that target.

Not only that, but once you did this, you get out and drop your nullfield the very next moment you think it’s good (at regroups for example or when the guild clash together) and then you drop your chaos storm on them to daze/stun a few guys.

Too bad CS get’s fixed next patch though… Seems a bit unnecessary

Another note, about that off-hand: Sacrx wants us to use the focus for the pull. It’s very effective against spreading blobs to drag them together and kill them in 1 spot rather than killing them 1 by 1.
But yeah, I guess torch can be good too for some more survivability or some more damage if you time it well with the prestige.

BlackDevil.9268:

Another note, about that off-hand: Sacrx wants us to use the focus for the pull. It’s very effective against spreading blobs to drag them together and kill them in 1 spot rather than killing them 1 by 1.
But yeah, I guess torch can be good too for some more survivability or some more damage if you time it well with the prestige.

It worked great before the nerf, tbh now I think guardian greatsword does alot better job at pulling people together in open field. Especially if you want them on one spot, rather than flying all over the place like with the focus. For wall pulling the focus still have monopoly, I find it so incredibly boring to pack focus just because that one good use.

But hey if Sacrx say you have to use it, you have to use it. Personally I rather solo roam doing my own thing

Depends, I agree they can do it better, but that doesn’t mean focus pull is useless.
Nah I may run w/e I think is best for the raid, but I share the vision that teamplay is always better than soloing, as long as you do it right. Pull got nerfed hard, but if you know your raidleader so well that you know exactly where he will go to every time then you can precast your pull on that spot and just pull once your raidleader is almost on that spot.

For a pure zerg-support setup you want to invest heavily into shatters, but also 20 into Inspiration for reflecting Focus.

/Osicat