I expect every single one of you to attend the thread following the patch notes of the revised Shattered Strength. You won’t, which is why it will be hilarious when you’re all crying about it.
@Blundby, I think mesmers are so unused to get buffs they just cant handle it. Like ppl win the lottery and cry tears while they have hard handle the situation.
/Osicat
I concur – I was pondering about this earlier and realised it opens whole new playstyles. My Guardian doesn’t need to wear glass cannon gear because I get so many boons to help with damage.
Now mesmer have good access to boons, I can mix more condition damage into my shatter build since it gets buffed by might, that in turn led me to realise that if I went all-out boon duration buffs on my runes and took some ranks in chaos I can become a buff-bot for my team, and still do decent damage all round with shatters, staff and sword.
Such a small change opened up so many possibilities, there’s now multiple ways to spec shatter
BINGO.
combine with signet of inspiration, shatter up as high a stack of might as you can, use signet, pop time warp, MELT WORLD BOSS
But this is a huge problem; such easy access to might stacking makes investing anything more than a basic amount in domination totally obsolete. A simple 10 stack of might is 350 power, more than you can get by maxing out Domination, and easy to maintain with fast rotation of shatters. Changes like this remove any glass attribute from glass cannons; leaving you with people who do stupid damage with ridiculous survivability. They’re moving mesmers in the same direction eles are at right now, which is not good for the game. Any good ele will tell you that the class is OP right now because of this situation; we do good damage with hella survivability to back it up, making a glass cannon completely useless in a basic comparison, especially since Fire Magic is a useless traitline and Air Magic is only good when it’s complementing the healing rotation granted by Water/Arcana. The worst part is that before this, Domination and Dueling were not bad traitlines to begin with; most of the problems mesmers faced had to do with phantasm AI and other bugs, along with some problems with trait synergy. Activating a single skill you were going to use anyway to instantly gain 9 stacks of might is unhealthy for balanced game progression imo.
the clones are on long cooldowns and come in “bursts” of damage, its not consistent. the damage increases if there are 3 of more clones, which is hard to pull off because they are squishy.
this is a onesided statement from the OP
i believe he has no experienced mesmer to the fullest to understand how vulnerable they are.
Long cooldowns on clones? Between dodge, weapon skills and utility you find the clones have long cooldowns? Not even mentioning you can shatter phantasm too.
@Blundby, I think mesmers are so unused to get buffs they just cant handle it. Like ppl win the lottery and cry tears while they have hard handle the situation.
/Osicat
I concur – I was pondering about this earlier and realised it opens whole new playstyles. My Guardian doesn’t need to wear glass cannon gear because I get so many boons to help with damage.
Now mesmer have good access to boons, I can mix more condition damage into my shatter build since it gets buffed by might, that in turn led me to realise that if I went all-out boon duration buffs on my runes and took some ranks in chaos I can become a buff-bot for my team, and still do decent damage all round with shatters, staff and sword.
Such a small change opened up so many possibilities, there’s now multiple ways to spec shatter
BINGO.
combine with signet of inspiration, shatter up as high a stack of might as you can, use signet, pop time warp, MELT WORLD BOSS
But this is a huge problem; such easy access to might stacking makes investing anything more than a basic amount in domination totally obsolete. A simple 10 stack of might is 350 power, more than you can get by maxing out Domination, and easy to maintain with fast rotation of shatters. Changes like this remove any glass attribute from glass cannons; leaving you with people who do stupid damage with ridiculous survivability. They’re moving mesmers in the same direction eles are at right now, which is not good for the game. Any good ele will tell you that the class is OP right now because of this situation; we do good damage with hella survivability to back it up, making a glass cannon completely useless in a basic comparison, especially since Fire Magic is a useless traitline and Air Magic is only good when it’s complementing the healing rotation granted by Water/Arcana. The worst part is that before this, Domination and Dueling were not bad traitlines to begin with; most of the problems mesmers faced had to do with phantasm AI and other bugs, along with some problems with trait synergy. Activating a single skill you were going to use anyway to instantly gain 9 stacks of might is unhealthy for balanced game progression imo.
Then why are people only complaining about this once Mesmer can do it and not when any of the other classes can?
@Blundby, I think mesmers are so unused to get buffs they just cant handle it. Like ppl win the lottery and cry tears while they have hard handle the situation.
/Osicat
I concur – I was pondering about this earlier and realised it opens whole new playstyles. My Guardian doesn’t need to wear glass cannon gear because I get so many boons to help with damage.
Now mesmer have good access to boons, I can mix more condition damage into my shatter build since it gets buffed by might, that in turn led me to realise that if I went all-out boon duration buffs on my runes and took some ranks in chaos I can become a buff-bot for my team, and still do decent damage all round with shatters, staff and sword.
Such a small change opened up so many possibilities, there’s now multiple ways to spec shatter
BINGO.
combine with signet of inspiration, shatter up as high a stack of might as you can, use signet, pop time warp, MELT WORLD BOSS
But this is a huge problem; such easy access to might stacking makes investing anything more than a basic amount in domination totally obsolete. A simple 10 stack of might is 350 power, more than you can get by maxing out Domination, and easy to maintain with fast rotation of shatters. Changes like this remove any glass attribute from glass cannons; leaving you with people who do stupid damage with ridiculous survivability. They’re moving mesmers in the same direction eles are at right now, which is not good for the game. Any good ele will tell you that the class is OP right now because of this situation; we do good damage with hella survivability to back it up, making a glass cannon completely useless in a basic comparison, especially since Fire Magic is a useless traitline and Air Magic is only good when it’s complementing the healing rotation granted by Water/Arcana. The worst part is that before this, Domination and Dueling were not bad traitlines to begin with; most of the problems mesmers faced had to do with phantasm AI and other bugs, along with some problems with trait synergy. Activating a single skill you were going to use anyway to instantly gain 9 stacks of might is unhealthy for balanced game progression imo.
Then why are people only complaining about this once Mesmer can do it and not when any of the other classes can?
Did you not see me just say that it’s not ok for eles to do it either? Why on earth does our Water Magic 25 minor give +% damage for each boon when water is not supposed to be related to damage in the first place? It’s counter-intuitive to the function of traitlines to begin with. It’s one thing to stack might, and eles do it very well, albeit with a rather long combination of skills; it’s another thing to stack 9 might instantly; eles cannot do that and the immediate benefit is that it completely makes up for any sacrifice of Domination Magic that you may have made. It’s a bad situation when some professions gain access to large amounts of damage in the same lines that give them amazing survivability, while others do not. This does not exclude eles or any other profession in the slightest, so please do not misunderstand me; I am aware that there are professions besides mesmer that have a huge advantage in PvP. However, I don’t think buffing traits like this to oblivion is the solution. I’m not extremely active on the forums, but many of the skilled players I know in-game (some of which also play elementalist) also understand the current state of the game, and that this is not the way to fix the situation.
It’s one thing to stack might, and eles do it very well, albeit with a rather long combination of skills; it’s another thing to stack 9 might instantly; eles cannot do that.
And yet warriors have been able to have more than 9 since launch, engineers almost as long, and the semi recent change to necro blood is power for instant 10 stacks. Do people really need to bring these up over and over again?
as a mesmer i think anyone can see how this MINOR trait is insane OP right now, this even it was a elite trait would be OP but a minor trait? please just nerf this or otherwise soon everyone will play mesmer.
make it only 3 stack might full shatter, 9 stack might is just insane for a MINOR trait….
This is a GRANDMASTER trait… not a MINOR — you need 25pts in illusions to get it.
Part of me thinks that someone in ANet was thinking “hey, wanna see something funny? Watch this…”
Why are people saying Mesmer’s can stack this might instantly? How are they coming in to talk about a class when they have no idea how it works?
You have to throw up 3 illusions which takes time to do, the illusions then have to charge at the enemy where they can be dodged, blocked or kited and at any point during this the preparation or actual shatter attempt they can be killed. Which part of this is throwing up huge stacks of might instantly? Not to mention you are probably using your big damaging cooldowns to get the stack in the first place.
The way people are talking we are running around with 25 stacks instantly doing 3 illusions + IP shatters in peoples faces.
When I take my Mesmer into PvE I rarely get the chance to do 3 illusion shatters because PvE mobs actually kill our illusions, it is saying a lot when the PvE AI is smarter then the average PvP player.
It’s one thing to stack might, and eles do it very well, albeit with a rather long combination of skills; it’s another thing to stack 9 might instantly; eles cannot do that.
And yet warriors have been able to have more than 9 since launch, engineers almost as long, and the semi recent change to necro blood is power for instant 10 stacks. Do people really need to bring these up over and over again?
Are any of those professions as strong as a mesmer?
This is a GRANDMASTER trait… not a MINOR — you need 25pts in illusions to get it.
What shatter mesmer does not have a decent investment in Illusions already? It makes investing in Domination almost obsolete save for vulnerability on daze.
Why are people saying Mesmer’s can stack this might instantly? How are they coming in to talk about a class when they have no idea how it works?
You have to throw up 3 illusions which takes time to do, the illusions then have to charge at the enemy where they can be dodged, blocked or kited and at any point during this the preparation or actual shatter attempt they can be killed. Which part of this is throwing up huge stacks of might instantly? Not to mention you are probably using your big damaging cooldowns to get the stack in the first place.
The way people are talking we are running around with 25 stacks instantly doing 3 illusions + IP shatters in peoples faces.
When I take my Mesmer into PvE I rarely get the chance to do 3 illusion shatters because PvE mobs actually kill our illusions, it is saying a lot when the PvE AI is smarter then the average PvP player.
Many people are aware of the problems mesmers face in PvE with the rampant AoE effects and awkward targeting mechanisms of illusions, but this sort of easy might stacking is not healthy for pvp. Believe it or not I’ve played a mesmer to a degree; and I’ve never, ever felt weak enough to justify getting 9 might just for shattering three illusions, not to mention it’s a simple enough task to accomplish.
It’s one thing to stack might, and eles do it very well, albeit with a rather long combination of skills; it’s another thing to stack 9 might instantly; eles cannot do that.
And yet warriors have been able to have more than 9 since launch, engineers almost as long, and the semi recent change to necro blood is power for instant 10 stacks. Do people really need to bring these up over and over again?
Are any of those professions as strong as a mesmer?
This is a GRANDMASTER trait… not a MINOR — you need 25pts in illusions to get it.
What shatter mesmer does not have a decent investment in Illusions already? It makes investing in Domination almost obsolete save for vulnerability on daze.
Why are people saying Mesmer’s can stack this might instantly? How are they coming in to talk about a class when they have no idea how it works?
You have to throw up 3 illusions which takes time to do, the illusions then have to charge at the enemy where they can be dodged, blocked or kited and at any point during this the preparation or actual shatter attempt they can be killed. Which part of this is throwing up huge stacks of might instantly? Not to mention you are probably using your big damaging cooldowns to get the stack in the first place.
The way people are talking we are running around with 25 stacks instantly doing 3 illusions + IP shatters in peoples faces.
When I take my Mesmer into PvE I rarely get the chance to do 3 illusion shatters because PvE mobs actually kill our illusions, it is saying a lot when the PvE AI is smarter then the average PvP player.
Many people are aware of the problems mesmers face in PvE with the rampant AoE effects and awkward targeting mechanisms of illusions, but this sort of easy might stacking is not healthy for pvp. Believe it or not I’ve played a mesmer to a degree; and I’ve never, ever felt weak enough to justify getting 9 might just for shattering three illusions, not to mention it’s a simple enough task to accomplish.
Easy? Simple? I’m sorry but no you have not played a Mesmer. Please stop lying.
And that is all I am going to say in response to that because obviously you did not read my post either, only the last paragraph and you didn’t even get the point of that.
It’s not overpowered. We’re already weak as hell as it is. Shatter is strong, but it’s still nothing compared to thieves and warriors. Anet stated that Mesmers are supposed to be strong while illusions are out…and more or less helpless when they’re destroyed. Well, you know what?! I guess it’s time for people to also finally learn to kill/disable our illusions and Phantasms instead of looking for that bugged World Completion star and go straight after us!
Sorry to break it to you, but if you think mesmers are weak, you’re doing it wrong. Coming from somebody who plays d/d ele (which is quite strong when played correctly), I’ve never had an easier time killing people than on a mesmer.
This trait is horridly OP the way it is now. It would be one thing if mesmers had to setup their burst with something like a triple diversion shatter to gain might and then mind wrack to gain more/burst, but they don’t even have to try anymore. This does not bring interest to the class, and is not fun for anybody but the mesmer to try and counter. Boon removal is not a viable option; the stacks apply too quickly and the burst is over too soon to reliably have that sort of counter on-hand and ready to apply.
Leuca i’d love to play against your mesmer and see just how OP you’d be with that trait. The trait is not horridly OP and not even “slightly OP”
The trait isn’t OP at all. But really, if you’re serious about battling then let me know
Trolls like Leuca and the OP of this thread don’t even play Mesmer as their mains; they “play” one but they don’t really have a vested interest in the class other than fulfilling some gimmicky role in spvp. Most likely both play either Elementalist or Necro as their mains; players of both those classes feel the Mesmer should be the weakest caster and therefore they will do all they can to destroy it. TLDR: stop feeding these troll clowns and never respond to them directly. When you must respond to their ridiculous claims, you talk through/around them, that’s pretty much all they deserve. Later all, I have to go stack 212192371983719873 applications of might and beat GW2.
as a mesmer i think anyone can see how this MINOR trait is insane OP right now, this even it was a elite trait would be OP but a minor trait? please just nerf this or otherwise soon everyone will play mesmer.
make it only 3 stack might full shatter, 9 stack might is just insane for a MINOR trait….
Still haven’t heard a single argument based on reality why the trait is OP.
If you claim that it is OP or horribly OP, give an example. Like some people who actually now the how the mesmer works have pointed out, it is not practical to use shatter for building might stacks, infact it gimps your damage. Yes, shattering gives you might stacks, but you only have 10 sec window to benefit from it and your first shatter, which you need 3 illusions for to have max stacks, is basically useless. In 10 sec you have to make 3 new illusions for your might burst. This whole rotation takes a lot of time if it even succeeds, and all this just that you can do a shatter burst with 9 stacks of might. Sorry, not OP at all.
Don’t know about the condition shatter build though.
Seems to me a lot of people here assume you get 3 stacks of might for each illusion you shatter… that’s not true. You get 3 stacks of might when you shatter, independent on the number of illusions you just shattered.
Seems to me a lot of people here assume you get 3 stacks of might for each illusion you shatter… that’s not true. You get 3 stacks of might when you shatter, independent on the number of illusions you just shattered.
Big difference…
Actually you do get three stacks per illusion shattered, not counting illusionary personae that doesn’t count for it though. That means a 3 illusions shatter gives you 9 stack of might.
Seems to me a lot of people here assume you get 3 stacks of might for each illusion you shatter… that’s not true. You get 3 stacks of might when you shatter, independent on the number of illusions you just shattered.
Big difference…
It’s really sweet of you to think every single mesmer in this thread was just goofing off and had no clue
But no, three might per asploded illusion. If they get killed before exploding then no Might.
A lot of words and arguements, this is simply a number and opinion topic.
I had 2200 condition damage last night for quite a few seconds. Is that ok? That’s not for me to decide.
A 10 second buff is easily brought to 15 with a few trait and/or rune investments. I think max we can achieve is 18 seconds? Either Is pretty long as far as boon duration goes.
It takes 3 dodges, 2 utilites, and 4 powers to produce a lot of might. It’s really not as much of a time investment as it might seem.
Its a good change in that it give spike to non-power traiting mesmers (see shorter condition durations)
It’s a bad change in that it helps retain a point distribution (20-20-0-0-30) that is often seen (and might be) as the best distribution. It also pushes mesmer more towards shatter-spamming instead of a direction that encourages timely shattering.
A lot of words and arguements, this is simply a number and opinion topic.
I had 2200 condition damage last night for quite a few seconds. Is that ok? That’s not for me to decide.
A 10 second buff is easily brought to 15 with a few trait and/or rune investments. I think max we can achieve is 18 seconds? Either Is pretty long as far as boon duration goes.
It takes 3 dodges, 2 utilites, and 4 powers to produce a lot of might. It’s really not as much of a time investment as it might seem.
Its a good change in that it give spike to non-power traiting mesmers (see shorter condition durations)
It’s a bad change in that it helps retain a point distribution (20-20-0-0-30) that is often seen (and might be) as the best distribution. It also pushes mesmer more towards shatter-spamming instead of a direction that encourages timely shattering.
if you simply shatter spam, it’s really not doing anything for you. you manage to get your might up to 20+ stacks for a couple seconds, but you spent 3 shatters, 2 utilities and all your weapon cooldowns to get it. what now? you have no significant skills to use to take advantage of your might buffs.
It is easy enough to get to 18 stacks of might, but then you’re left with nothing but your auto attack to use it on. If you set up a buff shatter (diversion or cry of frustration) before the intended use, you’ll have a reliable 9 stacks you can actually use. I don’t see how that’s over powered at all. Honestly, all professions should have a viable means to do something similar, rather than take it away from those who can (Warrior, Guardian, Engineer, Elementalist, Necromancer, and now Mesmer).
It is easy enough to get to 18 stacks of might, but then you’re left with nothing but your auto attack to use it on. If you set up a buff shatter (diversion or cry of frustration) before the intended use, you’ll have a reliable 9 stacks you can actually use. I don’t see how that’s over powered at all. Honestly, all professions should have a viable means to do something similar, rather than take it away from those who can (Warrior, Guardian, Engineer, Elementalist, Necromancer, and now Mesmer).
necro cant, not even with blood is power and DS life blast trait.
Also staff 1, sword 1, sword 2, and scep 3 are exactly what you want to use your might stacks with. None of those were needed to create clones either. Well…In addition to all those confusions you just created.
I have been playing with this for a bit and don’t think it is OP. People freak out over the might stacks (why?) but in practice all it does is level out our burst dps. Our weapon skills are weak by design and if you just shattered your dps goes down the toilet
This doesn’t help your normal shatter spec as much kittenter conditions build and opens up a boon sharing build. This actually opens up a lot of new build possibilities based around less GC more survival and lengthening the fight
