Guild Wars 2

There has been several 3D on thieves already so I apologize for opening another one. But aint gonna be complaining or asking for tips and tricks. Just asking for opinion on a build.

But first I just wanted to point out that I am still in love with lockdown, which is by far my preferred playstyle. I like shatter too, and that is still my second choice when changing build after having played lockdown for quite a while. Lately I have been running Shatterlock with a good degree of success.

But. It is always hambows and thieves (perma evasion/perma stealth) which, at some point, will stress my skills and builds to my very limits. I do win against them, don’t get me wrong but while lock down has improved my skills and awareness vs many professions and sometimes faceroll some classes, I still find these two professions in spvp brackets hard to deal with. I especially feel it is unfair for warriors to manage to cap a point while firing their bow at you while you are trying to deal damage with GS (literally letting them to take the point). Than you realize they regen health faster than you do damage. How can it be possible?!? So, lets close the gap and try to melee them down (right :| ). A quick switch of hammer and all is sorted…

Thieves cannot capture a points like warriors/guardians/necros/engis can do but they are slippery and vicious. Lock down helped me but not as much as I wished to. It is really difficult to pin them down when in perma evasion. Shatter… well, they just eat you alive.

I have already taken into account a l2p issue and I frankly do not have problem admitting one is better than me (i.e. last fight in the new Alissa movie vs thief I would have surely died there, but Alissa is better than me as much as that thief would outplay me any day).

However, I wanted to give bread for bread (or eye for and eye, not sure how to say it in English) to those cheese builds out there. Didn’t want to fall in the PU pattern nevertheless I tried this and I could immediately feel a difference when dealing with those professions on capture points:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vgAQNAW7alknpUtNqxMNcrRiYmRwhcoPYdkKUalUYbXIA-TsAAzCpI+R9j7HzPyfs/MAZByuCA

Going back to a condition based build feels a bit odd but it makes me slippery almost as a thief, able to handle 2-3 opponents and if people don’t run they will eventually die.

Question. How would you improve it (if any improvement is really needed)? What do you think its weaknesses are? I don’t do much organized tpvp but it seems working fine in hotjoint tpvp. Where can this build lead me?

Looks pretty solid, and having phase retreat on a 6 sec CD is probably very helpful. Definitely change the runes tho, you could try undead or perplexity once they come to spvp. Could also try 10/20/20/0/20 to get either illusionary bounce which with the patch will also apply to clones making staff extremely deadly, or phantasm all haste, which will stack up a lot more bleeds for your duelist

This is pretty much the same spec that I run, except that I run 25 dueling instead of chaos for confusion on clone death and master of misdirection in illusions. Have you done the math that the extra cond dmg (from chaotic transference) actually helps more/does more dmg overall?

I am reluctant in giving up chaotic transference because I’m thinking of switching runes to undead, like Carpboy says. Alternatively I would take longer confusions if I decide to go for perplexity. The 10/20/20/0/20 is the other build I thought of and will surely try once the update in live (still don’t know what is better between IE and PH in the illusion tree)
But my question still stands. Have you guys managed to climb the ladder with similar builds/play style?

Some food for thought …

For one of the condition builds I play in sPvP, I struggled with whether to take chaotic transference when I had another major trait available. In your build you don’t have this issue unless you give up a major trait in another line.

Ultimately I decided that as strong as the trait is, I would have given up going 30 into dueling for it, which just didn’t seem worth it for the minor condition damage boost. The only thing that might sway me is if you could get condition damage really high, meaning undead runes, which might make it worth taking (in my build at least). Again though, undead runes and chaotic transference do nothing to uniquely define your build – they just boost stats.

I generally prefer to choose runes/traits that strengthen the build/focus I’m going for, IF I have to choose in a situation like this.

For warriors…try not to worry about 1v1s with them. Sure you can win in the end, but usually it’s a colossal waste of time.

My advice would be to drop decoy and pick up portal. Lay a portal on the warrior’s point, then go contribute to a different fight. The hambow is now out of the game for 60 seconds. If he rotates off, portal back for an easy decap.

At first it’s hard to give up decoy, but in the end you’ll be a lot more effective.

If you like lockdown why completely give it up? I have not played in a few months due to different priorities, but the last time I was playing I was using an interrupt/condi burst hybrid. I had great fun with it and found it to be effective enough for my needs.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vgAQNAW7alknpUt1oxMNcrNiY6RwhcCHKFXX2VSBudhA-TsAAzCpIKSVkrITRyisFNqY9xuCA

Here is what I recommend: 10/30/30 – with Lyssa and Rampager’s

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vgAQNAsaWlknpRtlpxWNcrNiY6RwhcAHpClWpH4WudhA-TsAg1CqIKSVkrITRyisFNWY5x0DA

Why Rampager’s? Because BLEEDS.

This build gives your iDuelist a 90% crit chance, which is insane for bleed damage.

Hotjoin heroes will enjoy stacking this with a Signet of Ether. I’ve spiked 17 stacks of bleeds on a thief within 4 seconds of opening (~1300 dps in bleed damage).

If I get the initiative, this is my opener:
Pistol 4 → Sword 3 + Swap → Sword 2 → Pistol 5 → Weapon Swap → Staff 5

This opens up with Duelist and a swap-Blurred Frenzy Combo. You follow up with Pistol 5, stunning them. Then swap to Staff, which will proc bleeds from Signet of Geomancy and drop a Chaos Storm on top of them. After a couple of seconds I Phase Retreat out to get Chaos Armor. This sets you up for the rest of the fight.

This opener will cause many opponents to blow their condition cleanse as well and/or their heal.

Thedenofsin.7340:

Here is what I recommend: 10/30/30 – with Lyssa and Rampager’s

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vgAQNAsaWlknpRtlpxWNcrNiY6RwhcAHpClWpH4WudhA-TsAg1CqIKSVkrITRyisFNWY5x0DA

Why Rampager’s? Because BLEEDS.

This build gives your iDuelist a 90% crit chance, which is insane for bleed damage.

Hotjoin heroes will enjoy stacking this with a Signet of Ether. I’ve spiked 17 stacks of bleeds on a thief within 4 seconds of opening (~1300 dps in bleed damage).

If I get the initiative, this is my opener:
Pistol 4 -> Sword 3 + Swap -> Sword 2 -> Pistol 5 -> Weapon Swap -> Staff 5

This opens up with Duelist and a swap-Blurred Frenzy Combo. You follow up with Pistol 5, stunning them. Then swap to Staff, which will proc bleeds from Signet of Geomancy and drop a Chaos Storm on top of them. After a couple of seconds I Phase Retreat out to get Chaos Armor. This sets you up for the rest of the fight.

This opener will cause many opponents to blow their condition cleanse as well and/or their heal.

Thedenofsin I like your build. It must be hilarious to see all those bleedings flying around. I might try it at some point. But it feels kind of squishy compared to what I am using now, which gives me stronger but less bleeds (+/- 120 x tick)

Allarious, I still like lockdown but I kind of moved away from it (for now). I learnt a lot while playing it but the way I see the game changes every time I start looking at what I want to accomplish. An that is now: less rage quitting vs hambows and thieves.

Much like skcamow says (thank for the food for thoughts). I checked your latest condition video with focus and decided to try it myself (not traited though). Good bleedings and nice control. I’d love to reflect projectiles with curtain…

Cyyrix, what you say is true and it’s a way I could handle wars. But I chose the hard way. And it looks like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vgAQRAra8dlknpNtNqxMNcrNiYmRw5boPYdleYbXYuB-TwAAzCpIaS1krJTTymsNNAZByehpFA

It’s amazing how well I can now handle warriors AND thieves. I am very satisfied with it.
The alternatives that I like to swap depending on sytuations are:

- change duelist discipline for phantasmal fury. Or have them both but dropping far-reaching manipualtion, which I got addicted to. However, this would also force me to drop AT because it’s kind of useless on a 900yrds range
- change bountiful interruption for shorter manipulation cd
- change blind on glamours for longer confusions depending on whether I use AT or NF

Dropping 10 points from dueling tree can open up various options:

- 10 points in domination for cripple on clones death (not recommending other traits here because of the low power based build)
- 10 points in inspiration for Mender’s Purity (allow you to drop a condi removal utility) or shorter glamours
- 5 points in Chaos for CI or PU and 5 in illusions for phanstasmal haste (good with pistol) or Elasticity if you want to swap sw/f for Staff or Gs

I think these are all good options which resolve around conditions type of game style. I do not know if you like it, but it’ll surely help vs fotm builds from other classes. The only hard counter I found so far was a terrormancer but judging from his lvl it would have been troublesome with any other build, at least with my skill level.

Lets see what the patch will bring but I think this build can still work well even after that.
wvw. I copied/pasted the build and gear to wvw. Not bad at all for roaming. During blob fights I mainly used pistol with increased range at the edge of the fight + scepter. Was able to down people and ecape easily. It’s not like “wearing” PU. Its aegis is just too good in those situations, still I think it does hurt (duelist do not run in to the aoe immediately) and survivability is great with manipulations + IC traits.

A phantasm based build should eat thieves alive. Let them stealth all they want. As soon as they show their face, it’s gg.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vgEQRAra7dlknpTtlqxYNcrNScSB0lOpHmu0nukCcnbA-w

This is what I was using in WvW and it was quite useful and annoying to Warriors and Thieves.