Guild Wars 2

Ahoy,
I’m one of the (rare?) sw+sw/staff CI build users, and I have a “little” problem against the meta Cele Engis.. As I can’t really rupt any “important” skills (heal impossible, grenades.. I can’t see which one are they shooting right now, so its pretty random..), and as I have no condi removal, my chances are pretty slim.
Is there any tactic that can help me, or the “hard-counter, run away” is the only viable?
Bad ones can be outplayed somehow, but against competent ones, I just can’t see any chance.

Thanks

Isn’t too hard of a matchup imo, easier and more predictable then static discharge engis when playing CI. There’s a few plays to beat em.

• Keep distance – Nades are easy as hell to kite, particularly if you have trav runes. Keep moving and darting in and out, so long as them chill nades dont get ya you’re sweet.

• Interrupt – He’s most vulnerable vs you with his Rifle out. Use a cheap daze (s4) to rupt his painfully slow AA to lock him in place. Cele engis only have one option to cleanse the immob, and that’s to use there heal rotation. Jump shot (r5) is part of that, leaping through his water field and doing large dps. If his turret goes down watch for it to deny him his heal+large dps spike and reapply the immob staight back on.

• Avoid – Magnet pull. At all costs. if you see a green line following from the engi to you. Interrupt. If he stealths, swap to staff and phase retreat ready the second your pulled. If your stuck in s/s blink or distort. Most cele engis use this as there burst by stealthing > pull > nails+pry bar+toolbelt nades then into instant cast rifle cc’s. If they land there magnet pull its gg.

Spend most the fight in staff, unless you have him under enough control to swap, staff will let you keep your distance (all his danger skills need close range) and will wear him down hugely with his lack of condi cleanse.

But with staff, my dps is close to zero.. and you can’t dodge IP ~.~
Now I’m trying with air+fire on Staff, then at least I have some random dmg.. But still feels like I’m at a disadvantage ^^

Static Discharge is not really a problem, as it’s glassy (and rare) enough (and I have played a lot, ‘cos I love SD engis), but I can’t really do anything against Cele’s sustain.
And ofc I can kite him as long as I want, but if he’s on the node for 0:30-1:00 defending, it does not really worth imo ^^

Ohk just properly looked at your build, here’s a couple of tweaks. Use doom on staff, if cele sustain is too much why not cut it by 33% :P. Staff with 3 clones + DD triggers is more dps then you’d think. Cele engis cant really afford to cleanse on a few bleed stacks so it adds up. There will of course be times, when moving into S/S for more dps is right. Really depends on reading the situation. as for the Ip problem, well that’s just an inherant problem regardless. There really is no counterplay to IP.

Hmm, then I’ll try it with Doom, thanks

Well, my “optimal” start is casting s5 at 1.2k range, then swap to staff still OOC, so I can just swap back when the burst is rdy, and the sword phantasm still doing that lovely 3-4k hits ^^
But this way no doom sigil at the beginning, seems like I have to adjust the playstyle to it.

In a 1v1 situation, If you can pull out a couple of phantom out to keep him busy wile you direct damage from distance the healing turret. Do so. #Number 1..Kill the Healing turret… With it, he is next to impossible to put down. with out, his life points melts away.

Vieux P.1238:

In a 1v1 situation, If you can pull out a couple of phantom out to keep him busy wile you direct damage from distance the healing turret. Do so. #Number 1..Kill the Healing turret… With it, he is next to impossible to put down. with out, his life points melts away.

So i will just overcharge my turret before you kill it?

StickerHappy.8052:

Vieux P.1238:

In a 1v1 situation, If you can pull out a couple of phantom out to keep him busy wile you direct damage from distance the healing turret. Do so. #Number 1..Kill the Healing turret… With it, he is next to impossible to put down. with out, his life points melts away.

So i will just overcharge my turret before you kill it?

Yes you may but it still gonna die. Then you. Worst comes to worst i moa your head see how overcharge you can turret..

Vieux P.1238:

StickerHappy.8052:

Vieux P.1238:

In a 1v1 situation, If you can pull out a couple of phantom out to keep him busy wile you direct damage from distance the healing turret. Do so. #Number 1..Kill the Healing turret… With it, he is next to impossible to put down. with out, his life points melts away.

So i will just overcharge my turret before you kill it?

Yes you may but it still gonna die. Then you. Worst comes to worst i moa your head see how overcharge you can turret..

Ill overcharge my turret immediately after using it to burst heal so technically you cant kill what is already dead.

If you’re addressing me about moa, you can try.

If you can destroy an engi’s healing turret, he’s a bad one and can be easily outplayed.. Good ones pick the HT up in ~1 sec, noway to destroy it…

And using elite skill (60+ sec CD) in 1v1 is just sad, even thou situations sometimes need it (if that 1 node can win us the match which otherwise would be lost, I will use elite skill.. but as default I have Mass Invi, I have to use my own skills and not the elite.)

Bubi.5237:

If you can destroy an engi’s healing turret, he’s a bad one and can be easily outplayed.. Good ones pick the HT up in ~1 sec, noway to destroy it…

And using elite skill (60+ sec CD) in 1v1 is just sad, even thou situations sometimes need it (if that 1 node can win us the match which otherwise would be lost, I will use elite skill.. but as default I have Mass Invi, I have to use my own skills and not the elite.)

Sad? Cuz using an elite in a 1v1 situation. pfff!
First off, it’s not sad to use an elite in a 1v1 situation especially if that situation drags on or the build of the enemy is overwhelming as he stated. If you knew how to read you would of understood what i said. *sigh!

Second of all, you can average Moamorph during spvp at least 3-4 times a games. So whats sad & a waist of a great equalizer is not using it when needed to win a cap. Especially if the enemy is of a cheese build. Witch seems to be in most cases.

Third, if you can destroy a healing turret, that does not mean the Eng is an idiot. That just means that his traits are placed in other priorities suited to that player play-style.

Fourth, Mass inv is a great elite & i use it especially when i play a PU build. But it’s not becuz you say so & that you make it sound that any players using Moamorph or any other elite other then MI is an idiot. I often use Moamorph as an elite when i’m running my favorite build. The double phantom.

Fifth & final, Hey if you can use your own skill to bring down an Eng or any other cheese build with out using an elite. good for you. I say to each are own play style. but i don’t need to be insulted do!

I asked about the meta cele engineer build.
The one where every better-than-bad engi takes HT up in ~1sec, ‘cos needed for healing rotation. (Take up or blast, same as it’s gone in ~1 sec.)

Using a long-CD in 1v1 to win means that if you can’t win without it, next time you’ll face him you’ll prolly lose that, as it’s on CD (Lich/Supply Crate/Moa, all the same). Yes, it is fun to destroy an enemy with them. Yes, it’s effective. But you should not depend on your elite to fight, it’s something for situations where you start from a disadvantage (as a lot of times you’ll have cooldowns when the enemy start the fight, nothing we can do about it, sPvP is not 1v1 tournament).

If you took it personal, then sorry, but your input was not really for the situation I asked about

Overall, it’s an incredibly difficult matchup.

Vieux P.1238:

Third, if you can destroy a healing turret, that does not mean the Eng is an idiot. That just means that his traits are placed in other priorities suited to that player play-style.

No, if you can destroy the healing turret it means you’re either fighting a turret-bunker engie — which is not a celengineer — or they’re absolutely awful.

Neptune.2570:

• Keep distance – Nades are easy as hell to kite, particularly if you have trav runes. Keep moving and darting in and out, so long as them chill nades dont get ya you’re sweet.

See, this advice works really well if you don’t want to accomplish anything. If you’re forced to stay away from the engie so that you can dodge the nades, the engie can happily camp wherever they want to camp and you can’t do anything about it. Sure, you can play at 1200 range and the engie won’t hurt much…but you’ll also be totally useless.

Neptune.2570:

• Interrupt – He’s most vulnerable vs you with his Rifle out. Use a cheap daze (s4) to rupt his painfully slow AA to lock him in place. Cele engis only have one option to cleanse the immob, and that’s to use there heal rotation. Jump shot (r5) is part of that, leaping through his water field and doing large dps. If his turret goes down watch for it to deny him his heal+large dps spike and reapply the immob staight back on.

Really, he shouldn’t be spamming rifle autos. If he is, then by all means interrupt and capitalize on it…but a good engineer won’t. You’re right that the full heal rotation involves jump shot, but that’s rarely done. The normal heal rotation is simply turret→overcharge→ explode, and that’s more than enough sustain while being completely un-interruptable.

Neptune.2570:

• Avoid – Magnet pull. At all costs.

This is accurate, if you get hit by magnet pull then you’re pretty much dead. Dodging magnet is sorta a basic requirement of being able to fight any engie build at all.

Neptune.2570:

Spend most the fight in staff, unless you have him under enough control to swap, staff will let you keep your distance (all his danger skills need close range) and will wear him down hugely with his lack of condi cleanse.

Unfortunately, this really isn’t accurate at all. In a CI build, your conditions will do very little damage. The healing turret quick combo is by far strong enough to outheal any sort of sustained pressure you can apply with staff. The issue is that staying at range in staff applies close to zero pressure.

Ultimately, builds like celengineer are why I generally stay away from playing interrupt builds in a competitive environment. Interrupt builds fall under the category of ‘things that work really well until they don’t.’ Against a build that has very few interruptable skills and strong sustain, it simply doesn’t work at all. You’re basically going to either need to call in friends or hope that the engineer makes some large blunders.

@Fay:
I have similar feelings about staying at range with staff. Even the “quick-healing” drop-overcharge-pickup can outheal almost all of my pressure (with Backpack Regen, which is I believe meta), and they can repeat it every 15 sec..
Playing with staff and contesting can work in big circles like Foefire middle (you can try to stay at ~600-900 range, which is near to nullify all grenades), but the smaller ones are just impossible for me against a Celengineer. (And there even the bomber-ones are difficult to handle, but they at least have not so easy access to poison/chill which are my greatest problems.)

I’ll check if playing with Doom or Fire can improve my gameplay as I have the feeling that Energy on staff is not so important (#2 is a semi-dodge for me), but I just feel like the Celengineers are hard-countering this build.
[Where countering for me means making it close to useless in Conquest-style gamemode.]
I can accept it, just wanna know if it counters the build or me