Title says it all, they decay almost as soon as you pop it up, please remove the decay while in combat as scourge is way squishier than core necro or reaper. Also it’s be nice if applying a barrier counted as healing
I don’t agree. Considering how much access to barrier we have, and their cooldowns, its not in a terrible place.
I think we should see how it plays out over a few weeks before deciding its too fast.
we have a MAX CAP on barrier… there is 0 and i mean 0 reason to have that super fast decay…..
that decay alone nerfs our shield againts dmg a good 50%….
when you get attack half of your shield wont dissapear because dmg but because of the Decay… and no we dont have mutch acces to barrier… and even those that we have barrely ads any meaningfull number of barriers compared to the OLD shroud and the dmg other classes can put in our face…
WE dont have ANY other defense not even Shroud anymore…. those barriers should be Strong as hell……. yet its one of the weakest existing defense mechanic in the game…..
You have a huge two second window where no decay can even happen! The design is clearly intended for predicive, skillful usage of barrier.
It decays waaaaay faster than every two seconds. It’s like half a second. That doesn’t detract from the point though, you can still use a healing power build and send out a lot of Barrier to protect your allies from incoming attacks as they happen.
…but perhaps that’s due to me just having beaten Bloodborne’s DLC. Good old Orphan required so much faster reflexes than mitigating damage with barrier does!
I don’t agree. Considering how much access to barrier we have, and their cooldowns, its not in a terrible place.
I think we should see how it plays out over a few weeks before deciding its too fast.
Wrong. Its “access” is crap. 2k, 5k, 4.3k, 1.4k are the barrier numbers from the skills that grant barriers. Not only are none of those numbers high (being that back lines will rip you apart), they decay in ~6 seconds? If it was the full amount for 6 seconds, maybe. But it literally decays so its actually pretty bad. Likewise, its a pretty useless feature in pve.
Necromancer is the worst class hands down. Wake up Anet.
I don’t agree. Considering how much access to barrier we have, and their cooldowns, its not in a terrible place.
I think we should see how it plays out over a few weeks before deciding its too fast.
Wrong. Its “access” is crap. 2k, 5k, 4.3k, 1.4k are the barrier numbers from the skills that grant barriers.
*Baseline, without Healing Power
*Which still are respectable and useful numbers
Keep telling yourself that. Im sure your mediocre barrier healing power support burn torment corrupt boon scourge will have massive impact in WvW and PvP.
Necromancer is the worst class hands down. Wake up Anet.
I don’t agree. Considering how much access to barrier we have, and their cooldowns, its not in a terrible place.
I think we should see how it plays out over a few weeks before deciding its too fast.
Wrong. Its “access” is crap. 2k, 5k, 4.3k, 1.4k are the barrier numbers from the skills that grant barriers.
*Baseline, without Healing Power
*Which still are respectable and useful numbers
Keep telling yourself that. Im sure your mediocre barrier healing power support burn torment corrupt boon scourge will have massive impact in WvW and PvP.
Keep telling yourself that. I’m sure it is a good excuse.
I don’t agree. Considering how much access to barrier we have, and their cooldowns, its not in a terrible place.
I think we should see how it plays out over a few weeks before deciding its too fast.
Wrong. Its “access” is crap. 2k, 5k, 4.3k, 1.4k are the barrier numbers from the skills that grant barriers.
*Baseline, without Healing Power
*Which still are respectable and useful numbers
Keep telling yourself that. Im sure your mediocre barrier healing power support burn torment corrupt boon scourge will have massive impact in WvW and PvP.
Keep telling yourself that. I’m sure it is a good excuse.
Not an excuse. Just facts that its crap. Has 0 synergy with anything else necro has. But you can go run your barriers that last for 6 seconds. Like i said, im sure it will have massive impact when the condis are killing you after your barriers expire.
Necromancer is the worst class hands down. Wake up Anet.
The barrier is kitteningly weak.its so horrid i am free kill to anyone.Either Make the barrier not decay and give us at least 15k barrier, or give us a barrier of 30 k that degrades after 10 seconds maybe.
once again we necros are free kills guess i’m rerolling to thief cause i’m not gonna stand around and instantly die cause no ccs and no barrier and warriors blow you up instantly.
I don’t agree. Considering how much access to barrier we have, and their cooldowns, its not in a terrible place.
I think we should see how it plays out over a few weeks before deciding its too fast.
Wrong. Its “access” is crap. 2k, 5k, 4.3k, 1.4k are the barrier numbers from the skills that grant barriers.
*Baseline, without Healing Power
*Which still are respectable and useful numbers
Keep telling yourself that. Im sure your mediocre barrier healing power support burn torment corrupt boon scourge will have massive impact in WvW and PvP.
Keep telling yourself that. I’m sure it is a good excuse.
Not an excuse. Just facts that its crap. Has 0 synergy with anything else necro has. But you can go run your barriers that last for 6 seconds. Like i said, im sure it will have massive impact when the condis are killing you after your barriers expire.
What are you smoking anyways? If you have damaging conditions on you, you activate a barrier and it will need to eat through the barrier first? What is so hard to understand? In fact it works exactly like shroud.
The barrier is kitteningly weak.its so horrid i am free kill to anyone.Either Make the barrier not decay and give us at least 15k barrier, or give us a barrier of 30 k that degrades after 10 seconds maybe.
once again we necros are free kills guess i’m rerolling to thief cause i’m not gonna stand around and instantly die cause no ccs and no barrier and warriors blow you up instantly.
You people do want to be unkillable gods, don’t you.
Your “suggestion” is so ridiculously overpowered it’s not even funny…
The barrier is kitteningly weak.its so horrid i am free kill to anyone.Either Make the barrier not decay and give us at least 15k barrier, or give us a barrier of 30 k that degrades after 10 seconds maybe.
once again we necros are free kills guess i’m rerolling to thief cause i’m not gonna stand around and instantly die cause no ccs and no barrier and warriors blow you up instantly.
You people do want to be unkillable gods, don’t you.
Your “suggestion” is so ridiculously overpowered it’s not even funny…
How would it be op if thats what we had in barrier when we were with reaper? we had like 30k energy or something last 10 sec or almost so? especially if we are going to be using it.Yeah we have a low cooldown but the minute that shield is on a cooldown and your cced and can’t escape, your dead.So you choose:Either we are free kills who can’t survive by ourselves and barely with a group or we get a decent survival and some good ccs to escape.
We need to survive, we are a condi class which can be bursted down nearly instantly.That is unbalanced and broken.Besides:The barrier would be capped and right now its obsurd we have a barrier in 2-4k even if its on a 15 sec cd its not enough to save us most of the time.We are literally blown up instantly by melee classes.
Either our shield needs to go up or our ccs and mobility need to go up or we need to have the best dps in all of spvp so we are actually feared and not just seen as free kills.
If 15k is too much then leave it at 10k and have it not degrade.Besides its already capped at 10k.And if 30k degrading in 10 sec is too much have a possibility of 15k degrading in 10 sec.Is that balanced? i dont’ want to be god mode but i don’t want to be free kills either, as that isn’t fun.
If you trait in Curses (Parasitic contagion) + Blood magic (Vampiric traits + Unholy Martyr), you get an insane amount of healing coming from all the condi damage you’re spamming. Coupled with Barrier, it’s far tankier than base Shroud.
Scourge looks fine, just a bit of tuning needed here and there but it’s already fun and useful to play.
The barrier is kitteningly weak.its so horrid i am free kill to anyone.Either Make the barrier not decay and give us at least 15k barrier, or give us a barrier of 30 k that degrades after 10 seconds maybe.
once again we necros are free kills guess i’m rerolling to thief cause i’m not gonna stand around and instantly die cause no ccs and no barrier and warriors blow you up instantly.
You people do want to be unkillable gods, don’t you.
Your “suggestion” is so ridiculously overpowered it’s not even funny…
How would it be op if thats what we had in barrier when we were with reaper? we had like 30k energy or something last 10 sec or almost so? especially if we are going to be using it.Yeah we have a low cooldown but the minute that shield is on a cooldown and your cced and can’t escape, your dead.So you choose:Either we are free kills who can’t survive by ourselves and barely with a group or we get a decent survival and some good ccs to escape.
We need to survive, we are a condi class which can be bursted down nearly instantly.That is unbalanced and broken.Besides:The barrier would be capped and right now its obsurd we have a barrier in 2-4k even if its on a 15 sec cd its not enough to save us most of the time.We are literally blown up instantly by melee classes.
Either our shield needs to go up or our ccs and mobility need to go up or we need to have the best dps in all of spvp so we are actually feared and not just seen as free kills.
If 15k is too much then leave it at 10k and have it not degrade.Besides its already capped at 10k.And if 30k degrading in 10 sec is too much have a possibility of 15k degrading in 10 sec.Is that balanced? i dont’ want to be god mode but i don’t want to be free kills either, as that isn’t fun.
Lol. We have 4 instant cast skills that are way better than anything reaper had for survivability.
Tell that to me when you get blown up instantly and die the second a melee ccs you and does instantly 15-20k burst.You will be dead before you can bleed or do anything.
If you trait in Curses (Parasitic contagion) + Blood magic (Vampiric traits + Unholy Martyr), you get an insane amount of healing coming from all the condi damage you’re spamming. Coupled with Barrier, it’s far tankier than base Shroud.
That sounds good but the problem is that I want to play my Power Reaper, not condi Necro/Scourge. My Shroud got nerfed so Reaper is not fun atm. I understand that Scourge needs new traits but why nerf my Reaper? It would be better to have options for more builds so people could choose what they prefer but Anet forces these new specs on us by ruining old stuff. I find it unfair.
I just got instantly blown up by melee cause of burst.Even with a barrier i’m gonna die in 2 seconds top.It would be like saying OMG a nuclear warhead is going to hit my country i will hide under a table.Well that won’t help you much because the fallout and the blast will break the house apart and kill you.
Its just like world or warcraft all over cept necros are the casters getting kittened and warriors and other melee are the ones instantly bursting down those said necros.
Its simply not good design.Mesmers have great dps great ccs great survivabilities.
If you trait in Curses (Parasitic contagion) + Blood magic (Vampiric traits + Unholy Martyr), you get an insane amount of healing coming from all the condi damage you’re spamming. Coupled with Barrier, it’s far tankier than base Shroud.
That sounds good but the problem is that I want to play my Power Reaper, not condi Necro/Scourge. My Shroud got nerfed so Reaper is not fun atm. I understand that Scourge needs new traits but why nerf my Reaper? It would be better to have options for more builds so people could choose what they prefer but Anet forces these new specs on us by ruining old stuff. I find it unfair.
I agree Reaper needs some work after the latest patch.
But it baffles me how people start complaining after trying a new elite spec for 30 minutes, and always ask for buffs. And then, months later, the same people start complaining about powercreep.
Scourge does the job of providing necros with new options to play and be a bit group-oriented. And more importantly for me, it’s actually fun to play.
Tell that to me when you get blown up instantly and die the second a melee ccs you and does instantly 15-20k burst.You will be dead before you can bleed or do anything.
Have 30k hp, I don’t die instantly, and I have the dodge button. Been tearing melee players apart all day
Also enemies can hit for up to 10-15k easily with burst.Even rangers with their arrow shot on longbow can easily do that much or a necro with axe.
I mean yes you could use speed of shadows but like 3 seconds of buff and barrier and its gone and then what? your cced and blown up instantly cause your going nowhere fast.
I’m not saying its impossible to reach R1, but you are going to be needing a babysitter at all times to break your ccs for you and give stealth heals and invulns becaus you will get destroyed.Its just unfun to solo queue into spvp
Yep I agree, barriers are too little to be decaying that fast
I’d like to not see them decay at all and we’re gonna need them to be a bit bigger
Unless they tone down the damage from the new specs, those 5k-8k barriers even if they start sticking to us aren’t going to do crap because a lot of my builds can already muscle 7k crit damage with that not being part of the burst
Scourge is great, but if its gonna compete with the other classes it needs better barriers
Also why not make it Sand Wraiths or something?
Id rather be able to choose a spot to raise it and then choose to have 1 or more stay with me or attack my targets
I just don’t like having to micro manage sand shades, theres too much going on in spvp for that
Also enemies can hit for up to 10-15k easily with burst.Even rangers with their arrow shot on longbow can easily do that much or a necro with axe.
You go into pvp. Make a demo character. Equip the carrion amulet. Kthxbye. You’re assuming just because you have trouble playing everyone else has. That is not true.
This isn’t even scourge related anymore at this point. The carrion amulet has been around for 5 years now.
Would it be worth getting something with shield for higher shield? i mean if barrier is based around healing power then more healing power means more group support?
Would it be worth getting something with shield for higher shield? i mean if barrier is based around healing power then more healing power means more group support?
It is based around healing power and vitality.
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there are a lot of ways Anet could make barriers more useful. any of the following would do the trick
Remove decay make quantity slightly larger
Cant take damage from condis while up (condis can still be stacked)
Cant be critically hit while barrier is up
Barriers decay into health a 75% efficiency
Barriers destroy projectiles
Traits added along the lines of “enemies damaging your barriers take a torment condition” or “allies protected from damage by your barrier gain random boons” or “barriers that decay without taking damage heal in an area around them”
Gets huge damage negation that doesn’t depend on LF/establishing a resource foothold which is why necros get focused and get shut down so easily by being focused.
“14k baseline damage negation with big healing power scaling/BM synergy on high hp pool isn’t good enough.”
C’mon guys, if you play well it negates a huge chunk of potential incoming damage. Even if it needs some minor tweaks regarding baseline degen speed, the amount of sustain it provides is solid given just how ridiculous its condition bomb/boon application is. Barrier is active defense. If it buys you a few seconds per fight, you’ve basically got traited DH virtues which is great.
Sounds to me like people were getting too used to auto-30+ bleed stacks dire/tb reaper with huge shroud pools.
Maybe the Scourge (condition + healing support) just isn’t your style, either.
Yes, but it doesn’t put all if your eggs in one basket and get shut down as easily while it simultaneously allows more seamless negation rather than needing to depend entirely on that existing pool and further depending on that pool for outgoing damage as well.
Spectral Armor for example gets you over the hurdles and gives a lot of gains while allowing for further negation with barriers. The cooldowns are a lot lower which lets you negate more hits more frequently. At the higher end you can counter more things without shroud lockout, especially now with the removal of the shroud CDR from SoS.
I’m not saying the Scourge’s barrier implementation is fine, but that people proposing things like permanent barriers and major buffs don’t understand the concept of active defenses and have gotten to comfy with the safe play techniques in respects to negating damage which necro provides.
Gets huge damage negation that doesn’t depend on LF/establishing a resource foothold which is why necros get focused and get shut down so easily by being focused.
“14k baseline damage negation with big healing power scaling/BM synergy on high hp pool isn’t good enough.”
C’mon guys, if you play well it negates a huge chunk of potential incoming damage. Even if it needs some minor tweaks regarding baseline degen speed, the amount of sustain it provides is solid given just how ridiculous its condition bomb/boon application is. Barrier is active defense. If it buys you a few seconds per fight, you’ve basically got traited DH virtues which is great.
Sounds to me like people were getting too used to auto-30+ bleed stacks dire/tb reaper with huge shroud pools.
Maybe the Scourge (condition + healing support) just isn’t your style, either.
This. It’s fun and active.
Reminds me of two things; the second thing is the protection monk.
But, first it reminded me of… Lucio-ohhhs
“Revenant is actual proof that devs read the necromancer forum” – Pelopidas.2140
Gets huge damage negation that doesn’t depend on LF/establishing a resource foothold which is why necros get focused and get shut down so easily by being focused.
“14k baseline damage negation with big healing power scaling/BM synergy on high hp pool isn’t good enough.”
C’mon guys, if you play well it negates a huge chunk of potential incoming damage. Even if it needs some minor tweaks regarding baseline degen speed, the amount of sustain it provides is solid given just how ridiculous its condition bomb/boon application is. Barrier is active defense. If it buys you a few seconds per fight, you’ve basically got traited DH virtues which is great.
Sounds to me like people were getting too used to auto-30+ bleed stacks dire/tb reaper with huge shroud pools.
Maybe the Scourge (condition + healing support) just isn’t your style, either.
Honestly, if DecieverX is saying positive stuff about it, it must be true. Jokes aside, I like barrier too
Guys, pleas, think about it for a minute no barrier decay in combat would be insane. Raid party’s would simply run around 10k extra health all the time because you CAN’T get out of combat in raids. the most i would give it is 1 max. 2sec. before it starts to decay or slow the decay speed by like 10%. Don’t think of barrier like a replacement for shroud, its more like a poor man’s dodge or distort and while it won’t block CCs you get much more frequent access to it. It just raises the skill level for necro above meshing you “oh crap” button when ever you take damage.
Gets huge damage negation that doesn’t depend on LF/establishing a resource foothold which is why necros get focused and get shut down so easily by being focused.
“14k baseline damage negation with big healing power scaling/BM synergy on high hp pool isn’t good enough.”
C’mon guys, if you play well it negates a huge chunk of potential incoming damage. Even if it needs some minor tweaks regarding baseline degen speed, the amount of sustain it provides is solid given just how ridiculous its condition bomb/boon application is. Barrier is active defense. If it buys you a few seconds per fight, you’ve basically got traited DH virtues which is great.
Sounds to me like people were getting too used to auto-30+ bleed stacks dire/tb reaper with huge shroud pools.
Maybe the Scourge (condition + healing support) just isn’t your style, either.
I don’t think you understood what people meant when they said that necro needs active defenses, what we wanted was to replace shroud and give us blocks and invulns, almost nobody even thought of barrier. Also if you think the barrier degen is fine then you likely dont play necro cause if you’re being focused (necros always get focused) you’ll die a lot faster than reaper and core necro because the barrier almost instantly disappears after 1 second. Yes barriers might be too strong if they dont degen in combat but at least increase the time it takes to degen to 5 and put the decay on shrouds level.
Also, scourge is by far my fav elite and it fits my style perfectly, maybe you just need to go back to the thief forums
Guys, pleas, think about it for a minute no barrier decay in combat would be insane. Raid party’s would simply run around 10k extra health all the time because you CAN’T get out of combat in raids. the most i would give it is 1 max. 2sec. before it starts to decay or slow the decay speed by like 10%. Don’t think of barrier like a replacement for shroud, its more like a poor man’s dodge or distort and while it won’t block CCs you get much more frequent access to it. It just raises the skill level for necro above meshing you “oh crap” button when ever you take damage.
A few things to say about this since i messed around:
1:We do have mobility.We got that mobility ability, and if we combine it with speed of shadows we can avoid ccs.If we spec for it, we can even eat those said ccs and escape.Also foot in the grave as well for stun resist.
2:Barriers are our only defense, and we need it because even if we got a little bit of mobility, we still don’t have a proper escape because the escape doesn’t work in pvp.(Yes i tried it, it was disabled)We need our barriers to last a little longer and personally, the barrier should stack with vitality and last 5 seconds.
Yes, but it doesn’t put all if your eggs in one basket and get shut down as easily while it simultaneously allows more seamless negation rather than needing to depend entirely on that existing pool and further depending on that pool for outgoing damage as well.
Spectral Armor for example gets you over the hurdles and gives a lot of gains while allowing for further negation with barriers. The cooldowns are a lot lower which lets you negate more hits more frequently. At the higher end you can counter more things without shroud lockout, especially now with the removal of the shroud CDR from SoS.
I’m not saying the Scourge’s barrier implementation is fine, but that people proposing things like permanent barriers and major buffs don’t understand the concept of active defenses and have gotten to comfy with the safe play techniques in respects to negating damage which necro provides.
Yeah i can agree with that but i think some changes to the decay (slower) or the timer (4 sec timer?) are needed.
