Thats pretty much what i was using. And i was using it with my usual dungeon group. Banshees Wail isnt really necessary with kill times as they are. You want to swap quickening thirst for blood bond for fights though. You can trigger it with a dodge and a dark path. Or you can just pick up an icebow (ideal method of proc).
Also for some stuff you might consider swapping vital persistance for spectral mastery. So you can have longer lich form duration.
The only issue with it is that unyielding blast, reapers might and deathly perception are pretty much wasted. Which is why i am leaning towards dropping soul reaping when Reaper comes out. Even if camping RS becomes meta we can get the crit chance from the reaper line so we dont really need soul reaping either way.
Banshee’s wail locust is a pretty good dps skill, and happens to be about the same duration as most pub boss kills. It’s a tough call to make.
A decent group shouldn’t really need the vamp aura though. The aoe prot, siphon, and healing from your wells is more then enough support, and also provides way more then the crappy aura.
Also didn’t get soul reaping because going into shroud is a dps loss, and that traitline adds nothing to dagger auto. The only thing you miss is the lich form trait. Better to get curses and use the old “flash DS quickly to get fury and weaken”. Weakening bosses can be a pretty good support thing. They’re definitely competitive options though.
A good group will get more out of the vamp aura than you will get out of banshees wail. Its not about the sustain. Its the small dps increase. The sustain is just a nice bonus and makes scholar rune bonus that much easier to maintain.
It is difficult to choose though. VP is such a small bonus right now. Maximum damage ticks i was getting in arah was 42. Had a PS warrior for empower allies, banner of str and might. It does scale slightly. Without the might and banners i had 38/39 ticks.
To put this into perspective this coupled with 4 icebows and 2 lightning storms going off equates to over 7k armour ignoring damage (assuming all impacts hit). That might not seem like much. But it ends up being about an 8% damage boost during the burst phase.
I’m not sure if we should use curses or soul reaping. ~10 more crit chance and long weakness + self fury + transfer condis on foe when u get 3 (u will in ac at least)
If soul reaping, I would rather take Speed of Shadows to proc Rending Shroud more frequently but really the 5% modifier imo doesnt outdps the benefits of curses. idk the math though.
I’m using PvE Hybridmancer (using full Sinister, Dagger/WH & Scepter/Dagger), and I’ve been messing around with looking for an ideal build with my gear as well.
Soul Reaping doesn’t to the trick anymore for me and I went for Blood Magic instead, so I’m Spite/Curses/BM atm. Still, it’s a challenging opportunity and I’ll see how being a Hybrid goes off with all the new changes.
Should it all fail, I can still fall back on my Zerker or Rabid gear.
Only reason i didnt go for curses was because i didnt have a need for the crit chance. So i figured the 5% mod and spectral mastery would do a lot more for me. Id imagine in bad groups curses would probably be the right choice.
Well in ac you have base ~35% crit chance xD
I just think curses gives much more than 5% modifier. % modifier is just for you, while weakness is for everybody (you also make 2 bleeds on ds entry +bleed with crit which makes landing the minor vampirism signet much easier)
also some classes deal more dmg per condi on foe
and you still increase ur personal dmg output from target the weak
Maybe it’s a dumb question, but I’ll ask it anyway: why Signet of Spite instead of BiP?
Is the +180 power more significant than 8 stacks of might for the party? I won’t take it in open world, but maybe there is some merit in considering it as an option for dungeon?
Or PS Warriors and Eles already give high enough Might stacks that BiP would be useless?
English is not my main language, so please bear with me :)
Most groups will have the group might covered (even pugs all seem to have a PS warrior these days). BiP is only 8 second duration. Its basically the new staff guard might. Totally useless in most situations as you will overwrite your parties long duration might stacks with crappy 8 second might stacks.
Here’s what I currenly have. Note this is for working with pugs, which is why I picked vampiric presence rather than banshee’s wail
I can’t stand not having a passive movement buff.
So that being said
I’m running a signet build atm.
What I’m bothered about now is the fact that other classes, especially guardians are able to hit a lot harder than us, it’s not even close.
I
I have a burning spec guardian
2hsword
1hsword/torch
Just on burns alone he hits for 4k a tick plus his regular weapon damage which is between 1k to 3k hits…. in exo rampage armor.
My necro so far is averaging 900-1600-2300 dagger hits.
I’m OK with it so far, as my main reason for coming back after 2 years was to play the reaper.
So for me hopefully the introduction of 2hsword with traits chills that damage will be off the chart.
Where are you doing your testing because my necro was hit ting for 4 to 7k with daggers
Actually I confirm those numbers. I’m just back from a quick run in fractal. Lev 29, with a random group (that might be the reason). The dagger damage was way far from 4k. On the other hand: 8,8k crit with Life Blast was pretty nice to see
Here’s what I currenly have. Note this is for working with pugs, which is why I picked vampiric presence rather than banshee’s wail
I can’t stand not having a passive movement buff.
So that being said
I’m running a signet build atm.
What I’m bothered about now is the fact that other classes, especially guardians are able to hit a lot harder than us, it’s not even close.
I
I have a burning spec guardian
2hsword
1hsword/torch
Just on burns alone he hits for 4k a tick plus his regular weapon damage which is between 1k to 3k hits…. in exo rampage armor.
My necro so far is averaging 900-1600-2300 dagger hits.
I’m OK with it so far, as my main reason for coming back after 2 years was to play the reaper.
So for me hopefully the introduction of 2hsword with traits chills that damage will be off the chart.
4k to 7k dagger hits… maybe its gear?
I have no ascended, and I am running full rampagers exotic atm (was trying to find someway to still take advantage of any cond improvements)
Im not sure that ascended makes 200%-400% dispartiy in damage though.
Im sitting at 2300 power 2100 crit atm as a reference point.
If i could figure out how to hit with MH dagger for 4 to 7k Im all in.
Well clearly you are going to hit less with rampagers instead of berserkers. You have less power and much less ferocity. You also lose a fair amount of stats and weapon power just by not having ascended.
Most groups will have the group might covered (even pugs all seem to have a PS warrior these days). BiP is only 8 second duration. Its basically the new staff guard might. Totally useless in most situations as you will overwrite your parties long duration might stacks with crappy 8 second might stacks.
Ah, okay, got it. Didn’t even think about overwriting better stacks. <.<
English is not my main language, so please bear with me :)
I’m absolutely loving the sustain from DS4 when traited for vampiric presence. Works brilliantly with WH5 too, as it procs on every damage hit and has no ICD.
The lower level dungeons are hitting a lot harder now, especially the condi mobs in AC, and I’ve found people are actually seeking BM necro in LFG to make the runs faster and easier.
Necro actually wanted in Dungeons, I want to hump Anet’s leg so hard right now
Resident smug Englishman on the NA servers, just because.
Warhorn is always good for an opener. But yeah for an in combat weapon you should prioritise focus. Ideally you should be using both with dagger mainhand. Staff isnt worth it unless you insist on a pure DS build.
Soul Reaping is good for a well build. Drop the wells and go into shroud immediately to gain +50% crit chance while the wells are ticking. That’s the only reason Soul Reaping has any offensive use in PvE.
Pretty much. The main reasons im using soul reaping is spectral mastery and strength of undeath. But those are rather weak reasons. The alternative is curses. But that has gotten a lot less favourable as power line. Although with precision being nerfed the extra crit from curses does help quite a bit which means its worthwhile for pugs at the very least.
Unless you’re in an AOE situation, it would be better to stay outside Death Shroud and auto-attack with dagger.
Soul Reaping is decent for Spectral Mastery for Lich Form and Strength of Undeath. Death Perception is okay for AOE. Everything else is kind of useless.
I think Death Perception is worth taking if you have Soul Reaping and you have wells because AoE situations are common. I guess Foot in the Grave is also worth taking.
Overall I think Soul Reaping is worth it but mostly for survival reasons.
Why are some people using warhorn over focus? Locust Swarm does about the same damage as Reaper’s Touch except it has double the cooldown and doesn’t apply vulnerability.
Then again, I’m also not really sure why some people are taking staff and the Death Shroud traits. Dagger is still better single-target DPS. Changing to staff for mediocre Life Blast damage isn’t worth it.
WH5 has a kittenload of damage ticks, so it’s great for easily negating blind and also procs vampiric presence on every single damage tick/hit (Which is a flat damage buff on top of any damage tick, as well as huge sustain).
Focus would probably be better in a single target situation, but the low cd daze and utility from WH5 VP makes WH outshine focus right now (at least for me).
DS as a whole has become more popular due to the BM line and it’s per-tick damage modifier, so skills with loads of ticks like DS4 and WH5 have actually received a significant damage increase from VP.
Probably is still better to remain out of DS using d/wh/f, but overall, given the downscaling nerfs and indirect massive buffs to condi using dungeon mobs, deathshroud is much more attractive right now than it was before the patch.
Resident smug Englishman on the NA servers, just because.
Why are some people using warhorn over focus? Locust Swarm does about the same damage as Reaper’s Touch except it has double the cooldown and doesn’t apply vulnerability.
Then again, I’m also not really sure why some people are taking staff and the Death Shroud traits. Dagger is still better single-target DPS. Changing to staff for mediocre Life Blast damage isn’t worth it.
WH5 has a kittenload of damage ticks, so it’s great for easily negating blind and also procs vampiric presence on every single damage tick/hit (Which is a flat damage buff on top of any damage tick, as well as huge sustain).
Focus would probably be better in a single target situation, but the low cd daze and utility from WH5 VP makes WH outshine focus right now (at least for me)
I think even for single target if you’re using siphons, swarm is better. Vampiric and Vampiric Presence both proc every hit. 10 hits per enemy means a little more than 800 damage per enemy from siphons alone, plus you heal around the same amount.
Why are some people using warhorn over focus? Locust Swarm does about the same damage as Reaper’s Touch except it has double the cooldown and doesn’t apply vulnerability.
Then again, I’m also not really sure why some people are taking staff and the Death Shroud traits. Dagger is still better single-target DPS. Changing to staff for mediocre Life Blast damage isn’t worth it.
WH5 has a kittenload of damage ticks, so it’s great for easily negating blind and also procs vampiric presence on every single damage tick/hit (Which is a flat damage buff on top of any damage tick, as well as huge sustain).
Focus would probably be better in a single target situation, but the low cd daze and utility from WH5 VP makes WH outshine focus right now (at least for me)
I think even for single target if you’re using siphons, swarm is better. Vampiric and Vampiric Presence both proc every hit. 10 hits per enemy means a little more than 800 damage per enemy from siphons alone, plus you heal around the same amount.
The only sad thing is that you cannot trait Banshee’s Whail cause it is in the same spot as Vampiric Presence e.e
“Revenant is actual proof that devs read the necromancer forum” – Pelopidas.2140
Pretty much. The main reasons im using soul reaping is spectral mastery and strength of undeath. But those are rather weak reasons. The alternative is curses. But that has gotten a lot less favourable as power line. Although with precision being nerfed the extra crit from curses does help quite a bit which means its worthwhile for pugs at the very least.
we’re not even sure if golem + dagger > lich :d that puts soul reaping even more in question, especially with minions also lifestealing AND getting VP when low-manning something
Just thought id bump this because ive worked some stuff out. Lich form uses 952.5 for its weapon power. Which means it has a coefficient of 1.9.
On a spite, soul reaping build in a fully buffed group this gives lich auto a total of 12,511.777 dps. When using dagger you have less crit chance so curses helps a lot. However even with 100% crit chance and berserker gear (not sure its even possible without sacrificing seaweed salad which would be a damage loss) dagger gives a total of 10,154.341 dps. Flesh golem gives about 882 dps. So Lich is always stronger than dagger. Which means its always worth taking Soul Reaping just for spectral mastery and the 5% modifier.
Just thought id bump this because ive worked some stuff out. Lich form uses 952.5 for its weapon power. Which means it has a coefficient of 1.9.
On a spite, soul reaping build in a fully buffed group this gives lich auto a total of 12,511.777 dps. When using dagger you have less crit chance so curses helps a lot. However even with 100% crit chance and berserker gear (not sure its even possible without sacrificing seaweed salad which would be a damage loss) dagger gives a total of 10,154.341 dps. Flesh golem gives about 882 dps. So Lich is always stronger than dagger. Which means its always worth taking Soul Reaping just for spectral mastery and the 5% modifier.
Too necro is still bad we still are bottom barrel of PvE. Rip the dream, amirite?
Khloe Deschanel – Human Necromancer/ Ami Ginju – Human Ranger [DOLO] -SBI
I stream sometimes: http://www.twitch.tv/kidtofu/
“Revenant is actual proof that devs read the necromancer forum”
Im gonna say stick to assassin for now unless you expect lich form to be enough for every fight. Or just wait for HoT when berserker will be best regardless.
Question: I’m using this build for dungeons/fractals at the moment: Build
The reason I have Melandru Runes is that I play often in WvW as it was/is my main gamemode, but I’m thinking of changing them. What would be better for pug groups that are more experienced (zerker only, exp, etc…): strength runes or scholar runes? I’m more inclined to scholar runes (mainly because they are a LOT cheaper), but what would be optimal?
Scholar would definitely be optimal. Most pug groups have a phalanx warrior these days so might is completely covered. And even with scholar the might generation on the dagger build is fairly decent. Strength runes are wasted on anything other than the DS build when you are soloing or your group isnt providing any might.
