Guild Wars 2

This probably won’t happen but it’s what I wanted in a necromancer.
I don’t really wan’t minions but I think it would be cool if when you kill a mob (has to be a mob that rangers can have as pets) you can bring it back to life until it dies for a second time. It could be like if it dies for a second time it turns to ash because it was only brought back due to necromancy.
just a thought. I would like to hear feedback to see what others think.

+1000

This would make reanimator 1000x cooler

We do not actually raise undead creatures. What I mean by that is we don’t reincarnate anything, we do not make “zombies”, we are not Necros in the classic sense that we actually take individual creatures and raise them back from death. What we do instead is take components of dead creatures, and mold them together.

This is actually really important lore-wise. Necromancers are not only not allowed to fully reincarnate creatures (only able to use dead matter to make minions), but Zhaitan does that very thing; he creates true undead. It is what separates Necromancer’s darker themes from being entirely evil. We’re already generally shunned by the general populace, but imagine if we started using the same magic as Zhaitan.

What if reanimator created a synthesised undead minion with attacks similar to what was killed?

It probably wouldn’t work due to the work that would have to go into designing this for all enemies but just imagine…

Kill a fire elemental and reanimator uses a fire attack
Kill a graveling scavenger and reanimator uses a knockdown
Etc

I think it’d be cool in PvE, but a ton of work, so its unlikely.

Bhawb.7408:

We do not actually raise undead creatures. What I mean by that is we don’t reincarnate anything, we do not make “zombies”, we are not Necros in the classic sense that we actually take individual creatures and raise them back from death. What we do instead is take components of dead creatures, and mold them together.

This is actually really important lore-wise. Necromancers are not only not allowed to fully reincarnate creatures (only able to use dead matter to make minions), but Zhaitan does that very thing; he creates true undead. It is what separates Necromancer’s darker themes from being entirely evil. We’re already generally shunned by the general populace, but imagine if we started using the same magic as Zhaitan.

I’m with Bhawb on this one. As cool as it would be gameplay-wise, it would break lore. And would probably be really hard to code, at that.

Bhawb.7408:

We do not actually raise undead creatures. What I mean by that is we don’t reincarnate anything, we do not make “zombies”, we are not Necros in the classic sense that we actually take individual creatures and raise them back from death. What we do instead is take components of dead creatures, and mold them together.

This is actually really important lore-wise. Necromancers are not only not allowed to fully reincarnate creatures (only able to use dead matter to make minions), but Zhaitan does that very thing; he creates true undead. It is what separates Necromancer’s darker themes from being entirely evil. We’re already generally shunned by the general populace, but imagine if we started using the same magic as Zhaitan.

^ this

Sepreh.5924:

This would make reanimator 1000x cooler

Was gonna say this would be the perfect job for reanimator. Would make necro the single most kitten class in the game lol. I’m sure there wuld have to be restrictions of course, but just having it at all would be epic. I don’t think it would break lore really. Other classes have evolved and adapted over time (read: monk/ somewhat ritualists >>> guardians) so why can’t necros? Anyways, necros only use bodies and body parts, not living souls. Reanimating the empty husk of a fallen enemy is not the same thign zhaitan does. He captures the very souls from the mists as well as the bodies. Why do you think it is the risen can sustain some semblance of individual thinking rather than a mindless flesh-hive. Also, ever done the risen eye at the end of the personal story? If not go do it and you’ll see what I mean. A necro reanimating an enemy body is not the same thing at all compared to what zhaitan does to those long dead orrians. Don’t get me wrong though, i don’t think every minion should be done this way, but it certainly would make reanimator not only make more sense, but be more useful.

I like how minions function currently, and I agree with what Bhawb explained as well.

I do wish some of our minions would be re-designed. The blood fiend is just ugly to me, and not in the cool, intimidating, or horrific way… it just looks silly.

I am a big fan of raising zombies, skeletons, etc. But I don’t necessarily prefer raising corpses compared to what we currently do. Creating minions from dead matter is cool and different, even if they sometimes look ridiculous.

OH I almost forgot, I REALLY want a Fleshreaver summon, other than the crappy sigil. Those things are wicked!

Nay of the Ether.8913:

Was gonna say this would be the perfect job for reanimator. Would make necro the single most kitten class in the game lol. I’m sure there wuld have to be restrictions of course, but just having it at all would be epic. I don’t think it would break lore really. Other classes have evolved and adapted over time (read: monk/ somewhat ritualists >>> guardians) so why can’t necros? Anyways, necros only use bodies and body parts, not living souls. Reanimating the empty husk of a fallen enemy is not the same thign zhaitan does. He captures the very souls from the mists as well as the bodies. Why do you think it is the risen can sustain some semblance of individual thinking rather than a mindless flesh-hive. Also, ever done the risen eye at the end of the personal story? If not go do it and you’ll see what I mean. A necro reanimating an enemy body is not the same thing at all compared to what zhaitan does to those long dead orrians. Don’t get me wrong though, i don’t think every minion should be done this way, but it certainly would make reanimator not only make more sense, but be more useful.

I agree that Zhaitan takes it further, but the core idea remains; Necros do not reanimate entire bodies, we form together minions from body parts. That is an integral rule of Necromancy that Grenth opened to us when he usurped Dhuum, and one that is not nearly as flexible as others. Not only is it an integral rule coming from the current god of death (whose opinion is obviously relevant), but it is integral to Necromancy being an accepted path of magic to the public.

Think of it this way, even if the Necromancer was “discerning” (and didn’t raise children or allies), how do you think people would stomach the bodies of fallen combatants being used in combat? It is a bit different to take their bones and flesh and reform it into something entirely different, compared to just giving life back to the person whose head you just bashed in. There is no way I see that being an acceptable form of magic (not even including it being outlawed by Grenth to my knowledge) when our current, much more abstract ways aren’t even fully acceptable.

Necromancers in GW2 lore are fleshshapers saddly no TRUE reanimation. We just TECHNICALLY make abominations.

Well , I agree with Bhawb with every word
I played both gw1 and gw2 , in gw1 > I was a Vampiric MM , rising horde of minions ( more enemy you kill = more minions to rise ) , while in gw2 > you don’t need enemies to get your minions ( reanimator is an exception ). I really like MM in gw2 more than the previous one.

What if reanimator created a synthesised undead minion with attacks similar to what was killed?

It probably wouldn’t work due to the work that would have to go into designing this for all enemies but just imagine…

Kill a fire elemental and reanimator uses a fire attack
Kill a graveling scavenger and reanimator uses a knockdown
Etc

You idea is wonderful , but I don’t think that it will need much work as they can create 7 types > the 6 conditions + knockdown. They can search their database so they can dvide foes into 7 groups ( each group has one special attack > burning , poison , fear ……etc ..)

Stx.4857:

I like how minions function currently, and I agree with what Bhawb explained as well.

I do wish some of our minions would be re-designed. The blood fiend is just ugly to me, and not in the cool, intimidating, or horrific way… it just looks silly.

I am a big fan of raising zombies, skeletons, etc. But I don’t necessarily prefer raising corpses compared to what we currently do. Creating minions from dead matter is cool and different, even if they sometimes look ridiculous.

OH I almost forgot, I REALLY want a Fleshreaver summon, other than the crappy sigil. Those things are wicked!

I agree with you , Flesh weaver will be awesome

Rising undead is actually not that hard in the lore. The reason why none of the “good” necromancers do it is because its illegal. For undead to work, the necromancer must force the spirit of the dead back into a body, usually against that spirit’s free will.

For example, let’s say you want to bring an ancient mage back from the dead. Well you can reanimate that body, but it is useless unless that body knows the spells it used to know. For that to happen, you must bring the spirit of that mage back into his body. His knowledge and experience is required for that undead mage to be just as effective as when he was alive.

But why would that mage want to help you fight? He has been happy in the underworld for ages.

Ritualists in GW1 did bypass this by asking help from their ancestors. Their ancestors were “glad” to help them, for a short amount of time.

Minions are soulless. They are just golems, made of fresh of the dead. They are not undead in any way.

Plus it fits Oolas ideas of combining golamancy and necromancy. If you are an asura that is.

I’d be my fav game of ALL time if we could collect ‘bits’ from mobs we killed, and built minions in say a ‘spawn’ game editor.

For the non-risen… err… pretty sure bone fiend looks like a dead mob I seen in world/ranger pet/guy from personal story’s pet… [Shrugs]

Anyway, at least SKINS!
Such a pretty game, such badly designed minion looks. Well, shad I like. Very GW vibe to the werid smoke. Bone’s ok’ish… but Golem… What is it suppose to be, low res/texture/bump mapped whale’s boy bits thrown on a overgrown undead chicken?

Bhawb.7408:

We do not actually raise undead creatures. What I mean by that is we don’t reincarnate anything, we do not make “zombies”, we are not Necros in the classic sense that we actually take individual creatures and raise them back from death. What we do instead is take components of dead creatures, and mold them together.
This is actually really important lore-wise. Necromancers are not only not allowed to fully reincarnate creatures (only able to use dead matter to make minions), but Zhaitan does that very thing; he creates true undead. It is what separates Necromancer’s darker themes from being entirely evil. We’re already generally shunned by the general populace, but imagine if we started using the same magic as Zhaitan.

Not really true…
a) We do reanimate the beings/create zombies, its just not as much sentient life, but more like plants or mushrooms (and asura using a very crippled version of necromancy based on manipulating the energy from crystals, that can be used to transfer life force as shown by kralky and the searing, to power golems into the Living and half sentient servants; well in 2 cases of the personal story actually sentient)
b) Verata and co (including Khilbron) who used the more nsfw magic still kept the souls of beings from the mists…. thats kinda what our shade is (but its probably some giant sperm or fuffle puff spirit so not something that could have really been called living) so again we and zhai aint so different in the way necromancy is used (but he brainwashes and hive minds his minions what makes quite a big difference… well we did that to eachothers minions in gw too…. ok no we are just the same thing but way tamer without the i wanna take over the world aspect being actually possible)
c) Necros were very much shunned till the magic was actually useful during the searing (what you got reminded of quite often)… thats kinda the very same reason why there were so many necromancer enemies in Prophecies, the removal of typically strict regulations put on the use of necromancy by the Order from Wizard’s Folly. So its more of a “shall we allow jack the ripper to live and do his thing because he is helping us to fight the kittens in a 10 times more efficient way than we can ever hope to do?” that just stuck to this day, also with grenth and dhuum out of the picture necros got way way weaker (since except blood offerings that seem to not exist anymore necros do get their magic hardcoded to the underworld).

Tutankhamun.3679:

Plus it fits Oolas ideas of combining golamancy and necromancy. If you are an asura that is.

Golemancy is necromancy (Oola was/is the only asura npc thats a necro and the only real golemancer we were able to meet, Snaff was probably a Necro/Ele too)… its just kinda crippled/regulated or in case of mass production, using elementalist arcane summoning techniques.

We do not reanimate the creatures themselves. They blurred the hell out of it in GW1 due to the corpse system, but we’ve always formed entirely new creatures, just using dead crap we find as the basis for it.

I would assume our shade is, more accurately, like the stuff we cloak ourselves in when we use Death Shroud. It was originally tied to it (it would even die if we left DS, if I remember correctly), so while this is a complete assumption I think it is of the same essence.

Also, Verata definitely stretched rules, but Khilbron outright broke them. I’m not trying to say Necromancers can’t do it, the issue is more is it acceptable enough to be considered an ability that every single necromancer has access to use? I don’t think so, it is highly controversial, and would be even less acceptable than our current practices are.

Bhawb.7408:

We do not reanimate the creatures themselves. They blurred the hell out of it in GW1 due to the corpse system, but we’ve always formed entirely new creatures, just using dead crap we find as the basis for it.

I would assume our shade is, more accurately, like the stuff we cloak ourselves in when we use Death Shroud. It was originally tied to it (it would even die if we left DS, if I remember correctly), so while this is a complete assumption I think it is of the same essence.

Also, Verata definitely stretched rules, but Khilbron outright broke them. I’m not trying to say Necromancers can’t do it, the issue is more is it acceptable enough to be considered an ability that every single necromancer has access to use? I don’t think so, it is highly controversial, and would be even less acceptable than our current practices are.

And frankenstein totally wasnt body parts of at least 2 once living beings but still counts as a zombie/undead, or the jiangshi, or vampires, or golems, or abominations (wow ones) if you wanna talk about different creatures being mixed.
Also Bone minions and jhorrors are the only summons that are some sort of ugly fusion since Blood fiend is a Wind Rider/a variant of the species, Bone Fiend being a Lashtail Devourer/variant of devourer Wurm being a Frost Wurm/non jungle wurm kin and Golem being a Minotaur.

Shades and Aatxes are spirits of the underworld/fusions of lost souls trough unnatural magic, in most cases gods or demon ones. Priory corrupt sword storyline in GW2 even explains it for those that didnt bother playing UW in GW.

And for Khilbron, the one time he maybe broke the rules was with Rurik (even if he didnt need to but i guess using a rez signet on him would have been too precious or maybe he did and the frostbite caused that face). Not to mention that pretty much every necro upon hitting level 30 offers his soul to the underworld in exchange for almost unlimited power and possible eternal life by turning into a lich…

So despite very little attention being put on it because of other stuff going on in GW2, it was kinda a “big” initial issue in GW to that everyone just said kitten it we got tattoos, fedoras, spikes, fishnets, top hats and fancy BDSM outfits; necros are still technically in the evil side of the moral spectrum, just moved from lawful to neutral/tame or chaotic, kinda same with mesmers and their always chaotic alignment. For the controversy id rather ask what the hell is in the engie elixirs and how exactly are we fine with letting rangers mind control the spirits of the environment now or even letting mesmers distort the particles of a person and turn them into a moa than oh someone gave a pile of decaying flesh basic motoric functions and a “mind” that is dumber than my pocket watch…

Bhawb.7408:

We do not actually raise undead creatures. What I mean by that is we don’t reincarnate anything, we do not make “zombies”, we are not Necros in the classic sense that we actually take individual creatures and raise them back from death. What we do instead is take components of dead creatures, and mold them together.

This is actually really important lore-wise. Necromancers are not only not allowed to fully reincarnate creatures (only able to use dead matter to make minions), but Zhaitan does that very thing; he creates true undead. It is what separates Necromancer’s darker themes from being entirely evil. We’re already generally shunned by the general populace, but imagine if we started using the same magic as Zhaitan.

Yeah and Norns should be a lot taller than what they are right now…

You seriously think they care about lore ? Heh, you’re a funny one, aren’t ya ? : )

Lore gets sacrificed a bit where gameplay is concerned. I’m not saying they care much (there were plenty of lore reasons that burning shouldn’t have been given to us), I’m saying I care.

Hey, I do too. In fact, if you look at my posts, I strongly believe that the Roleplaying elements of this game are out of the window, and Lore has a big place in it.

Still, if there’s enough voices crying for visual effects such as necromancy skills, well…

We all know how it’s going to turn out in the end.

(Or you can say “Charr” and I’ll give you that XD)

I honestly don’t know how people manage to RP in this game. It is one of the only games where the single player experience goes from essentially meaningless, menial tasks, and then basically turns you into a companion of the actual protagonist.

You basically play as Samwise Gamgee, with all the actually important characters everyone cares about being NPCs. It is ridiculous. Not only that though, there just doesn’t feel like anything special. I shouldn’t get the same reception from people as a Necro that I do as a Warrior; especially not when Zhaitan and I have such similar magic.

Honestly I just don’t get it. Besides the gameplay, I just really see no reason I’d want to RP as my characters.

Bhawb.7408:

I honestly don’t know how people manage to RP in this game. It is one of the only games where the single player experience goes from essentially meaningless, menial tasks, and then basically turns you into a companion of the actual protagonist.

You basically play as Samwise Gamgee, with all the actually important characters everyone cares about being NPCs. It is ridiculous. Not only that though, there just doesn’t feel like anything special. I shouldn’t get the same reception from people as a Necro that I do as a Warrior; especially not when Zhaitan and I have such similar magic.

Honestly I just don’t get it. Besides the gameplay, I just really see no reason I’d want to RP as my characters.

While its not really rp (i rarely do anything “in character”), but its fun to make a backstory for all your characters, like all my characters to be from the same guild (or warband in the old charriors mind) and went together trough the order quests, how the necro fought her mesmer cousin over who gets to join the OoW and tease tybalt with balls of yarn.

… ok its pretty much the last part of this http://i.imgur.com/mpCcE0M.jpg

Andele.1306:

Bhawb.7408:

We do not reanimate the creatures themselves. They blurred the hell out of it in GW1 due to the corpse system, but we’ve always formed entirely new creatures, just using dead crap we find as the basis for it.

I would assume our shade is, more accurately, like the stuff we cloak ourselves in when we use Death Shroud. It was originally tied to it (it would even die if we left DS, if I remember correctly), so while this is a complete assumption I think it is of the same essence.

Also, Verata definitely stretched rules, but Khilbron outright broke them. I’m not trying to say Necromancers can’t do it, the issue is more is it acceptable enough to be considered an ability that every single necromancer has access to use? I don’t think so, it is highly controversial, and would be even less acceptable than our current practices are.

And frankenstein totally wasnt body parts of at least 2 once living beings but still counts as a zombie/undead, or the jiangshi, or vampires, or golems, or abominations (wow ones) if you wanna talk about different creatures being mixed.
Also Bone minions and jhorrors are the only summons that are some sort of ugly fusion since Blood fiend is a Wind Rider/a variant of the species, Bone Fiend being a Lashtail Devourer/variant of devourer Wurm being a Frost Wurm/non jungle wurm kin and Golem being a Minotaur.

Shades and Aatxes are spirits of the underworld/fusions of lost souls trough unnatural magic, in most cases gods or demon ones. Priory corrupt sword storyline in GW2 even explains it for those that didnt bother playing UW in GW.

And for Khilbron, the one time he maybe broke the rules was with Rurik (even if he didnt need to but i guess using a rez signet on him would have been too precious or maybe he did and the frostbite caused that face). Not to mention that pretty much every necro upon hitting level 30 offers his soul to the underworld in exchange for almost unlimited power and possible eternal life by turning into a lich…

So despite very little attention being put on it because of other stuff going on in GW2, it was kinda a “big” initial issue in GW to that everyone just said kitten it we got tattoos, fedoras, spikes, fishnets, top hats and fancy BDSM outfits; necros are still technically in the evil side of the moral spectrum, just moved from lawful to neutral/tame or chaotic, kinda same with mesmers and their always chaotic alignment. For the controversy id rather ask what the hell is in the engie elixirs and how exactly are we fine with letting rangers mind control the spirits of the environment now or even letting mesmers distort the particles of a person and turn them into a moa than oh someone gave a pile of decaying flesh basic motoric functions and a “mind” that is dumber than my pocket watch…

Necromancers are not actually evil. It is just that we understand the meaning of “sacrifice” a lot better than other people.

For example the GW1’s Blood is Power. The necro is killing 1/3 of himself to give his allies energy. Most people will see that as madness. Necro see that as a worthy sacrifice. We are willing to sacrifice everything for that extra inch of power.

It is the same thing when we look at the world and politics. If sacrificing 10 innocent people will save 10,000 people, a necro would do it in a heart beat. A warrior might refuse to sacrifice anyone, trying to save everyone, and ends up getting 10,000 people killed.

Necromancers also see death on a whole different level. That explains why they are so different from everyone else.

Bhawb.7408:

I honestly don’t know how people manage to RP in this game. It is one of the only games where the single player experience goes from essentially meaningless, menial tasks, and then basically turns you into a companion of the actual protagonist.

You basically play as Samwise Gamgee, with all the actually important characters everyone cares about being NPCs. It is ridiculous. Not only that though, there just doesn’t feel like anything special. I shouldn’t get the same reception from people as a Necro that I do as a Warrior; especially not when Zhaitan and I have such similar magic.

Honestly I just don’t get it. Besides the gameplay, I just really see no reason I’d want to RP as my characters.

Because it is fun to imagine where our characters came from.

For example if your character is a cheer go lucky girl, you have to figure out what made her so happy all the time.

Yeah, I don’t really give my characters personalities. I guess I can see a way that you could make it work though.

CHIPS.6018:

Necromancers are not actually evil. It is just that we understand the meaning of “sacrifice” a lot better than other people.

TL;DR Necros are the Sith (in ideology).

CHIPS.6018:

Necromancers are not actually evil. It is just that we understand the meaning of “sacrifice” a lot better than other people.
For example the GW1’s Blood is Power. The necro is killing 1/3 of himself to give his allies energy. Most people will see that as madness. Necro see that as a worthy sacrifice. We are willing to sacrifice everything for that extra inch of power.
It is the same thing when we look at the world and politics. If sacrificing 10 innocent people will save 10,000 people, a necro would do it in a heart beat. A warrior might refuse to sacrifice anyone, trying to save everyone, and ends up getting 10,000 people killed.
Necromancers also see death on a whole different level. That explains why they are so different from everyone else.

Well true, but its the same as saying the zerg in SC2, the tyranids in 40k or for the hell of it the changelings from MLP arent technically evil, its just a matter of blue and orange morality instead of black and white/good and evil. But stuff that we can do is like 3/4 is ususally on the side of evil (forced rez, stealing the souls of other people, turning their blood toxic, taking away their time on earth, enslaving shiz from the underworld to power our fleshy constructs and mind kitten via our fear effects) 1/8 neutral (blood offerings and spectrals/pushing half of our existence into the underworld) 1/8 good (healing others with our life force).

As Bhawb said, necros are Sith, but instead of just in ideology, its more the old Kotor sith like Revan, Darth Traya and comics Vader (no the pre trilogy doesnt exist so whine version doesnt count), less the Empire sith.