Guild Wars 2

So.. now that curse line…
Terror, Path of Corruption, Master of Corruption, 3 of the most important traits for condition Necro all stuck into one spot and can only be chosen one…

I understand why they add CD on Consume condition (because of that freaking corruption category that doesn’t -20% CD but rather -33%, so they afraid consume condition to be like 17 secs CD), but shafting all the important traits along with it is totally counter productive because there’s no-way you can pick Master of Corruption if you want your Condition Necro to be viable.

Ah, Anet, where’s your brain? What to do now?
I don’t main Necro (but I do have a lv80 necro, with some PVP and WvW experience too), but when I see Necro got this weird and useless trait lay-out, I really can’t help but shake my head too.

Master of Corruption isn’t important, but the fact it exists is disgusting. I’d rather the cooldown reduction was put onto Path of Corruption and the trait went to grandmaster. They kind of stabbed us in the back by moving Terror to master and not doing anything else we asked for alongside the terror change to make it work, so it made the entire curses line worse.

There’s another point of conflict for condi necro in Soul Reaping master. You have to choose between doing damage, better ds, and good spectral skills, all of which you probably need to keep up.

You take terror, lingering curse, and the plague signet trait if you have precision. Thats three good traits. Your problem isn’t good traits in curses, it’s bad traits elsewhere. (Look at the death magic masters)

If you truly needed the boon corruption, take the signet trait.

Eat the corruption change. (There is no such thing as a corruption build because there are no corruption stun breaks),

Condimancers are not messed up as much as they may initially look. Secondary trait lines in combination with curses relieves the need to take Consume Conditions as a healing skill. They also trivialize the trait conflict between Terror, Path of Corruption and Master of Corruption (with terror winning out if you depend on it).

The Spite/Curse combo has traits that can be taken to mimic CC functionality and Path of Corruption functionality.

For starters, Spiteful Renewal is a mini consume conditions when striking enemies below 25% health (ICD 5 seconds).

All of Signet of Suffering’s effects seem to effect traits that trigger signets based off what Robert Gee said about Plague sending and Blood Bond (the tooltips only said recharge times). So Plague Sending will not only transfer conditions to enemies after 3 are applied (with a to be announced ICD), but will benefit from a better recharge time, grant you 3 stacks of might and convert 2 boons on foes. That’s on top of Spinal Shivers. So no need for the Path of Corruption trait.

If Consume Condition vulnerability stacking is too much, you could easily replace it with SoV and Parasitic Contagion for a condi regen build. With good enough condi application you would have high health per second and would be free to use SoV when you feel like it, which also adds DPS/Might, converts boons and the active now works in Shroud. So instead of playing reactively with Consume Conditions after exiting Death Shroud, you would be proactively using SoV before entering DS, then hitting the enemy with Dhuumfire life blasts and/or Life Transfer to trigger life steals.

Condition builds in general have a plethora of problems compared to power builds:

- in addition to evades, blocks and other damage counters, they are also much countered by cond removal. Just so happens that cond removal is really strong on the strongest classes like warrior, guardian and ele.
- cannot punish people rezzing or fast kill people who are downed (since they lose stack when they are downed and you need to restack)
- there’s a lot of aoe cond removal in the game, condi is nearly useless against a zerg
- the damage is not frontloaded like with power builds and it doesn’t exceed power builds’ damage by enough to justify that. A typical 10 bleed stack deal 1.1k DPS, which is something power builds easily match.

Why go with the build that can be countered by cond removal and that has a ramp-up if in your best case scenario you aren’t seriously outdamaging builds without these drawbacks.

They are still playable. Condi engineer is still good. Also, ironically, power builds that inflict burning (which has a nice base damage without any investment) are getting really good value out of condis.

Sadly necro is much outdone in condi builds by other classes. A big necro problem is how horrible the weapon skills are. Scepter is horrible at gaining LF and skill 3 doesn’t fit in at all. It’s a power skills that crits for like 1700 in condi build on a target with 6 conditions. What is that skill doing on scepter I don’t know. Dagger offhand is also bad, the enfeebling blood is really bad for a slot 5 skill with medium cooldown. 2 stacks of bleeding? LOL. And no lifeforce gain here either. Another bad side of condi necro is that Shroud doesn’t do much for condis.

Balekai.6083:

Secondary trait lines in combination with curses relieves the need to take Consume Conditions as a healing skill.

Yep. Time to run Prayer to Dwayna/Antitoxin Spray. In sPvP, I guess we’ll just turn off our heal skill somehow.

Cecilia.5179:

Balekai.6083:

Secondary trait lines in combination with curses relieves the need to take Consume Conditions as a healing skill.

Yep. Time to run Prayer to Dwayna/Antitoxin Spray. In sPvP, I guess we’ll just turn off our heal skill somehow.

I think you will get more healing out of SoV using it as a might stacker, boon corruptor and potent siphon in DS skill when activating the active.

Combine with Parasitic Contagion and barring really good condi removal by enemy or enemies, you should start seeing 300-350ish regen per second or so from SoV when hit, and anywhere from 300-1000+ healing per second from conditions depending on the amount of enemies ticking with your stacks. 600-1300 healing per second just from SoV and Parasitic Contagion (not counting any regeneration, siphons or other skills/traits) should make up for the lost healing from CC if you choose not to use it.

Edit: Or you can use CC and use Parasitic Contagion as cover regen.

Balekai.6083:

Cecilia.5179:

Balekai.6083:

Secondary trait lines in combination with curses relieves the need to take Consume Conditions as a healing skill.

Yep. Time to run Prayer to Dwayna/Antitoxin Spray. In sPvP, I guess we’ll just turn off our heal skill somehow.

I think you will get more healing out of SoV using it as a might stacker, boon corruptor and potent siphon in DS skill when activating the active.

Combine with Parasitic Contagion and barring really good condi removal by enemy or enemies, you should start seeing 300-350ish regen per second or so from SoV when hit, and anywhere from 300-1000+ healing per second from conditions depending on the amount of enemies ticking with your stacks. 600-1300 healing per second just from SoV and Parasitic Contagion (not counting any regeneration, siphons or other skills/traits) should make up for the lost healing from CC if you choose not to use it.

Edit: Or you can use CC and use Parasitic Contagion as cover regen.

Just saying that if you somehow manage to get 10’000 dps just from conditions in PvP, you’ve already won the fight and you don’t need that healing.

Realistic scenario is about 200-300 hps max. Which wouldn’t be bad, but doesn’t heal in Shroud.

And just one bleeding stack nullifies passive healing of Vampiric Signet. Which heals you for your amount only when you’re being hit every second.

If you’re being hit every second by build that isn’t full cleric or rabid condi, you’re not likely to survive long enough to get better value out of Signet than from even post-nerf CC.

Rym.1469:

Balekai.6083:

Cecilia.5179:

Balekai.6083:

Secondary trait lines in combination with curses relieves the need to take Consume Conditions as a healing skill.

Yep. Time to run Prayer to Dwayna/Antitoxin Spray. In sPvP, I guess we’ll just turn off our heal skill somehow.

I think you will get more healing out of SoV using it as a might stacker, boon corruptor and potent siphon in DS skill when activating the active.

Combine with Parasitic Contagion and barring really good condi removal by enemy or enemies, you should start seeing 300-350ish regen per second or so from SoV when hit, and anywhere from 300-1000+ healing per second from conditions depending on the amount of enemies ticking with your stacks. 600-1300 healing per second just from SoV and Parasitic Contagion (not counting any regeneration, siphons or other skills/traits) should make up for the lost healing from CC if you choose not to use it.

Edit: Or you can use CC and use Parasitic Contagion as cover regen.

Just saying that if you somehow manage to get 10’000 dps just from conditions in PvP, you’ve already won the fight and you don’t need that healing.

Realistic scenario is about 200-300 hps max. Which wouldn’t be bad, but doesn’t heal in Shroud.

Depends, in pvp with a condi sustain build I usually work up to 10-15 stacks of AoE bleeds with no investment in curses. That alone is 80-100 tick healing with the new Parasitic Contagion against 1 toon. Now take a full condi DPS Necro, with the new scaling and conditions condi stacking. You should be able to easily reach 2K-3K condi damage per target. Hit 2-3 targets with your stacks and you’re golden… until the condi removal starts. Even terror fears will heal 100 health alone per tick. The healing will fluctuate for sure.

Still the pressure will be high and the added sustain from the trait allows condi necros some breathing room, so they don’t have to use heals like CC as emergency heals after exiting death shroud. We also gain breathing room to pick something like SoV for added utility by combining it with Signets of Suffering and the active to heal in shroud.

If we think sustain as condi necros is getting hit by the CC nerf, why not take a buffed Parasitic Contagion which adds another level of sustain? Especially with Lingering Curses duration buff only affecting Scepter conditions.

We can speculate, but because Shoutbow is very likely to remain, possibly be even stronger, we may as well start talking about power specs.

If you’re being hit every second by build that isn’t full cleric or rabid condi, you’re not likely to survive long enough to get better value out of Signet than from even post-nerf CC.

I would say this depends on how many more stat combos they put into pvp and how well siphons scale with healing power after the patch. Then again due to the blood magic minor giving healing power based on % threshhold you can hit some high values of it making the signet slightly stronger the lower you get.
Edit: Just tried clerics on my build in pvp…well i’ll be kitten ed. I was using valk but its not bad.

Master of corruption would be better if it had the corruption CD reduction + path of corruption effects. Would make thematic sense and would help ease the rediculously congested trait choices in curses.

As others have said, you will not miss Path of Corruption if you go into Spite for Signets of Suffering.

If you’re not planning on doing any support with Blood Magic, I’d go into Soul Reaping for your third spec. Pick Soul Marks, Fear of Death and Foot in the Grave. Not Dhummfire, while I don’t think it’s as bad as others think, the stunbreak from Foot in the Grave will be much more useful in a pvp setting, even if you aren’t flashing Shroud just for it (and you shouldn’t).

I’d also seriously consider picking up Parasitic Contagion over Lingering Curse. The extra condition damage from LC is nice, but the buff to Parasitic Contagion coupled with the fact that your conditions should be hitting even harder than before should give you a nice health tick while out shroud.

Rym.1469:

We can speculate, but because Shoutbow is very likely to remain, possibly be even stronger, we may as well start talking about power specs.

Power Spec is Gutted too. Aoe Moa from engi will destroy all lich 24/7. The CD is actually shorter.

All my condi builds were shafted one way or another, not really sure what I’m going to do with them now. Might just go to power and minion builds for the time being. I’ll also try getting on that signet train and see how that works out.

Toxsa.2701:

Power Spec is Gutted too. Aoe Moa from engi will destroy all lich 24/7. The CD is actually shorter.

But they have to give up the crate to get that, so it’s a pick-your-poison scenario.

Mind you, a lot of people will probably want to try out the mortar, so you won’t have to worry about lich moas until they get bored of it.

Cannot imagining that master of corruption will be picked up. Giving yourself two conditions every time you heal (they mentioned that there will be torment, bleed AND BLIND in the mix for condis that you get, so you might actually end up blinded whenever you heal)?This just to shave off a third of the cooldwon of consume conditions? Compare to engis, who can now take the medkit heal from 16 seconds cooldown to 8-10 seconds with a single trait without any drawbacks (they have a trait where they recharge the next toolbelt skill after evading).

Am I correct to think that parasitic contagion still does not work in death shroud? In that case it is far inferior to both other options in the tier.

Also, I find blood and death magis are still both really subpar. Teleporting downed allies to you using an easily interruptable skill? I am not sure you even WANT to be able do that: you are kind of drawing a huge arrow showing your opponents where they should now concentrate all their burst and cc (with you and the downed people now conveniently in one spot). Thieves OTH will now stealth themselves and their downed allie whenever reviving (something that I think makes much more sense) from A MINOR in shadow arts.

For condi necro, I think it will be curses, spite and soul reaping. The new weakening shroud is actually really strong (I think by far the best option in its tier), as are signets of suffering,

I think that if you already pick Curses and Soul Reaping as Condi, better option would be Death Magic for protection, increased survivability, condi removal and better synergy with Speed of Shadows and other Shroud traits. You could get Master of Corruption this way and not run signets.

Yamsandjams.3267:

All my condi builds were shafted one way or another, not really sure what I’m going to do with them now. Might just go to power and minion builds for the time being. I’ll also try getting on that signet train and see how that works out.

Toxsa.2701:

Power Spec is Gutted too. Aoe Moa from engi will destroy all lich 24/7. The CD is actually shorter.

But they have to give up the crate to get that, so it’s a pick-your-poison scenario.

Mind you, a lot of people will probably want to try out the mortar, so you won’t have to worry about lich moas until they get bored of it.

As an Engineer main… It’s a tough choice. Kinetic Charge Elixir X sounds downright broken, and Supply Crate will still be the tried and true option. Mortar though… A 100% AoE Projectile Finisher sounds incredible by it’s own (assuming it works just like piercing 100% projectile finishers do when they hit multiple targets) not to mention an Ice Field, as well as a Water Field that will last longer that half a second.

I think Mortars will become the new norm for Engineer elites, once people start to master the kit’s comboing potential. That’ll will probably be the Engi Elite you’ll have to deal with more than anything.

REMINDER:

“Plague: This skill is now considered a corruption skill and applies 1 stack of bleeding for 2 seconds to you every second it is active.”

Take plague off your bar, you’re gonna kill yourself.

Helicity.3416:

REMINDER:

“Plague: This skill is now considered a corruption skill and applies 1 stack of bleeding for 2 seconds to you every second it is active.”

Take plague off your bar, you’re gonna kill yourself.

The self destructive effects of Plague, while cause for concern, have been greatly exaggerated.

Plague increases your base Toughness by 4x and your base Vitality by 3×. In the coming patch, that will mean 3000 additional armor (increasing your armor to about 5k if running no toughness gear) and 20k extra health (Doubling your base health when running something with no Vit)when using Plague. The Health part is important: Right now when your total health drops when leaving Plague, you maintain the same total health % that you had when it ended. So while a Necro in Ascended Condi gear with food buffs and might stacks might do 10k actual damage to their self when using Plague, even with Carrion stats, will only be around 25% of their Plague health lost, which means their normal health will only be depleted by about 5k once Plague ends. Just a little tidbit to keep in mind.

Foefaller.1082:

Helicity.3416:

REMINDER:

“Plague: This skill is now considered a corruption skill and applies 1 stack of bleeding for 2 seconds to you every second it is active.”

Take plague off your bar, you’re gonna kill yourself.

The self destructive effects of Plague, while cause for concern, have been greatly exaggerated.

Plague increases your base Toughness by 4x and your base Vitality by 3×. In the coming patch, that will mean 3000 additional armor (increasing your armor to about 5k if running no toughness gear) and 20k extra health (Doubling your base health when running something with no Vit)when using Plague. The Health part is important: Right now when your total health drops when leaving Plague, you maintain the same total health % that you had when it ended. So while a Necro in Ascended Condi gear with food buffs and might stacks might do 10k actual damage to their self when using Plague, even with Carrion stats, will only be around 25% of their Plague health lost, which means their normal health will only be depleted by about 5k once Plague ends. Just a little tidbit to keep in mind.

You need to re-examine your math. And look at the people who have been testing.
You’re liable to drop yourself to less than a quarter of your health on a rabid/dire build, and that is if no one is beating on you.

In addition when you pop out of plague, your only /viable/ heal now slaps you with 10 vuln (and a blind if you run master of corruption, AND a chill if you have chill on blind).

Basically, necro is hosed.