I kind of think corruption skills are lackluster, they need to be better than they are currently. Due to that, I’m gonna suggest a few changes and a new trait.
Corrupt boon: Corrupts all boons, 3/4 second cast, so it has counterplay. Nothing else changes
Blood is Power: 4 stacks of self bleeds for 5 seconds, 6 stacks of enemy bleeds for 10 seconds, 8 stacks of might for nearby allies for 12 seconds. Makes the transfer more predictable, gives aoe might which is better than self might.
Epidemic: Fine as it is
Corrosive Poison Cloud: Weaken yourself for 7 seconds, blocks projectiles, and applies Corrosion to enemies in the well, reducing their armor by X amount pulses every 3 seconds (not sure what that amount would be, 300-400 maybe).
Trait: Master of Corruption (GM tier) reduces CD by 20% (remove the other one), and corruption skills have additional effects.
Corrupt Boon: Corrupted Boons have double duration
Blood is Power: adds 4 stacks of might giving it 12 stacks
Epidemic: Applies 10 stacks of vulnerability to enemies
Corrosive Poison Cloud: Also applies poison and weakness as it functions currently.
I think this would help these skills in all game modes, but especially pve where we need the most help.
I think instead they should just remove the self- applied conditions
or
see revenant
There is literally no reason for the self applied conditions to exist.
Seriously, it adds literally nothing to gameplay, and just makes the skill overall worse.
Corrupt boon got nerfed hard and fast. The reduction to only 5 boons and DOUBLING the cast time were seriously not needed either.
Also yeah, it’s pretty sad to see anet is essentially making rev the condi controller necro should have been.
(edited by War Mourner.5168)
There is literally no reason for the self applied conditions to exist.
Seriously, it adds literally nothing to gameplay, and just makes the skill overall worse.
Corrupt boon got nerfed hard and fast. The reduction to only 5 boons and DOUBLING the cast time were seriously not needed either.
Also yeah, it’s pretty sad to see anet is essentially making rev the condi controller necro should have been.
I disagree I use the conditions as either extra health for consume conditions or extra damage with a transfer skill.
self applied conditions are there to redirect them with necro skills(dagger 4, plague signet, etc) or to heal more with consume conditions
Yes which relies upon using important, high CD skills.
All of which (other then consume conditions) have a limit on how many conditions they deal with.
So unless you have a perfectly timed situation where you use a corruption followed by a condition removal/transfer, then you are wasting potential.
Either using one of your few, or only condit removals on self applied gimps, or not wasting the CD, and having to live with a self applied kitten .
It is completely unreasonable to call it useful when it relies on wasting other skills.
If it was like revenant, where they get buffs for having conditions on them, then yes, it could be seen as a benefit.
But Necro is not Rev.
(edited by War Mourner.5168)
I actually love the self applied conditions. It means they either hurt you or they can be used to help you or they can be used to hurt your opponent. It really is a matter of preference though. I think it justifies the strength of some of these skills though as well.
I really like the self applied conditions and hope they stay aswell. Just gives some risk to using the skills.
If the skills are deemed to weak for the self hurt, then the positive effects should be buffed, not the self applied conditions removed.
The suggestions are good, but:
Blood is power: i think the might can be increased
CPC: just turn it to vulnerability. anet is not going to implement something like -X Armor when Vulnerability already exists. I’d also change the self inflicted condition to bleed or torment, since a skill that makes enemies vulnerable to physical attacks and gimps your own physical attacks at the same time is a bit contradicting.
Yes which relies upon using important, high CD skills.
All of which (other then consume conditions) have a limit on how many conditions they deal with.
So unless you have a perfectly timed situation where you use a corruption followed by a condition removal/transfer, then you are wasting potential.
Either using one of your few, or only condit removals on self applied gimps, or not wasting the CD, and having to live with a self applied kitten .It is completely unreasonable to call it useful when it relies on wasting other skills.
If it was like revenant, where they get buffs for having conditions on them, then yes, it could be seen as a benefit.But Necro is not Rev.
Putrid mark 25 secs, Deathly Swarm 18 secs, Plague Signet 60 secs, Well of Power 50 secs, Consume conditions 25 secs. If you ask me that’s more than enough skills that benefit from conditions, despite 2 long cooldowns. If anything they should add the resistence boon to some necro traits/skills but the conditions should remain there.
well of power, deathly swarm and putrid mark are all limited in terms of how many conditions you transfer.
It is very likely that you’ll have more then 3 conditions on you during a fight, in which case, having the extra condition does not benefit in anyway, since you’re still tranferin the limit (or 1 per tick in the case of the well).
If you have less conditions on you then the limit, then it’s only useful if you planning on using it anyway.
Deathly Swarm transfers 9 conditions if there’s more than one enemy to bounce to.
100 blades does awe inspiring cleave damage – if you manage to hit with the full channel.
The point is, regardless of if we have other skills that can transfer/convert conditions, you cannot say self applied conditions are useful when 90% of the time in pvp you wish you had more condi cleanse, not less.
If we were literally up to our ears in condi cleanse to the point where we just never had conditions, then sure, it could be useful.
I really like the self applied conditions and hope they stay aswell. Just gives some risk to using the skills.
If the skills are deemed to weak for the self hurt, then the positive effects should be buffed, not the self applied conditions removed.The suggestions are good, but:
Blood is power: i think the might can be increased
CPC: just turn it to vulnerability. anet is not going to implement something like -X Armor when Vulnerability already exists. I’d also change the self inflicted condition to bleed or torment, since a skill that makes enemies vulnerable to physical attacks and gimps your own physical attacks at the same time is a bit contradicting.
Vuln doesn’t do the exact same thing. I actually think it should reduce armor by a percent now that I think about it, some pve bosses have a ton of toughness, and it should be stronger on higher toughness targets. The other point of that debuff would be for pve where it is really easy to get 25 stacks of vuln. Unique buffs and debuffs make a lot of classes in pve, and having one or two would be really good for dungeon necro viability.
if we bring well of power and plague signet we then only have one corruption
making the synergy very poor
imo blood is power should me a skill that grant hefty amount of resource like in gw1
make it fill 25-33% life force on use or something
imo blood is power should me a skill that grant hefty amount of resource like in gw1
make it fill 25-33% life force on use or something
It used to give you 20% life force on use but it was changed to 10 might long ago.
wow dat’s just…..
edit:
dissapointing
I agree that there is no valid reason for them to have self inflicting conditions. We require certain utilities or traits to counter the harm we cause to ourselves. If we had a condi transfer as base (in DS) then it would be fine. But we dont so we are forced to use transfers or cleanses when using corruption skills. Its restrictive.
Make a master trait to remove self condi effect on corruption skills? If you don’t have consume conditions or plague signet you would probably want it.
Vuln doesn’t do the exact same thing. I actually think it should reduce armor by a percent now that I think about it, some pve bosses have a ton of toughness, and it should be stronger on higher toughness targets.
They both lower armor. Anet is not going to have two condititons side by side that do that. and if you make it percentage based it IS exactly like vulnerability.
The other point of that debuff would be for pve where it is really easy to get 25 stacks of vuln. Unique buffs and debuffs make a lot of classes in pve, and having one or two would be really good for dungeon necro viability.
Thats more of a general problem of vulnerability: Most groups dont have to do anything for it, cause it’s included in so many weapon skill sets. No need to go out of oyur way to cause it; Vulnerability just happens. If anything, THAT should be changed.
People complaining about self applied condis apparenly don’t know how to play a necro, that’s all im going to say about that.
Now on to the proposed changes. Assuming that AE might includes me than i couldn’t care less.
Corrosive poison cloud is already pretty kitten strong as is. Weakness isn’t given a whole lot of access to but with that you can keep perma weakness up on almost anything, not to mention the poison can be helpful.
If epidemic applying vunl is kinda weird… necros can already put up enough vunlerability with an axe and well of suffering, plus corruption skills are more condition centric (if you don’t understand that you’re missing the point).
For anyone who might be wondering, you take dagger OH and use skill 4 to transfer your condis onto your enemy after casting a full bout of corruption skills, OR you use plague signet if you decide to take that. OR you use consume conditions OR you take one of the many traits necros have to deal with conditions (minnions draw them in, you lose them on death, or on entering DS)
Conditions are good for a necro if you’re not a complete nub about it and recognize what you can do with them. Which is why, btw, a lot of necros feel like the revinant is being set up for “i can do anything you can do better”.
The whole time during that live stream they were explaining the revinant in concept i was just sitting there saying to myself “You mean, like a necro?”
>Lots of conditions on you are a good thing. Check
>Spreads conditions from self to foes. Check
>Can take condis from allies to self. Check
I suppose room has got to be made somewhere, but that was the one thing necros could do that nobody else could. Everybody else has fear, torment, and health siphoning… and really those are the only unique things necros were ever even close to given to begin with.
People complaining about self applied condis apparenly don’t know how to play a necro, that’s all im going to say about that.
Lol. This is an absurd statement to make. Somehow i dont think its a matter of not knowing. Its more of a “why should i slot/use this everytime i use a corruption skill”.
Like i said before its restrictive. Using a transfer with BiP is like the only worthwhile one to do. But its still restrictive. The bleed on self isnt too strong so you can leave it. However most of the time you never want to. So you are forced to use your heal or a transfer. The extra heal is negated if you leave the bleed on you too long which means you are forced to heal straight away. And the extra damage gained from a transfer is inconsequential.
And yes they all have synergy for larger heals with consume. But is that small amount of synergy worth the restrictive nature of the skill? I could understand them being so restrictive and forcing you take take condi cleanes if they were much much stronger. But they arent. They are weak.
Epidemic is reasonably strong but niche. And the self vuln can be completely ignored as it does not damage you and it does not butcher your damage. Epidemic is the only skill of the lot where the self condi is justified (still debatable).
The rest do more harm than good. Forcing you to only use the skills when you have a transfer or cleanse available. Forcing you to use a slot for a transfer/cleanse. Or forcing you to be punished for using a weak skill.
The corruptions were a badly thought out way to implement the self-harm of Necromancers from GW1. What ANet forgot to include was that in GW1 self-harm abilities were good because they were either extremely powerful, had HP instead of mana cost, and/or had much lower CDs than they otherwise would have. In addition the use of them limited your build a bit, you could only have so many of them before your build was ineffective because you would just kill yourself, so it often forced you to take heals and/or a dedicated healer. And sometimes they introduced a cyclic combo setup, like with Touch Necros, which would spam high energy low-cd abilities to gain HP/deal damage, then “spend” that HP to gain the energy back and repeat.
The mana is irrelevant now, so the only reason to have self-harm is for abilities that are essentially stronger than they would normally be, but with harm costs. So basically, what Revenant has is what we should have: skills that self-apply conditions but are much stronger than they “should” be, and also include ways to deal with those conditions.
Corrosive poison cloud is not good.
As a condition necro you lose valuable dodges and
As a power necro weakness also ruins your damage output
in pve bosses have defiance which reduces your weakness duration by 50%. with 100% condition duration and traited you will still not apply 100% weakness duration on the boss. Even worst many bosses remove conditions so your long weakness duration can become nulified.
in PVP and WVW people move out and since it only pulses once every 3 seconds you probably apply more weakness to yourself.
because of the self weakness make this one skill not worth using
the op suggestion to make it block projectile would make it worth using
but i alrdy said id rather have the self inflicted condition removed
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