Guild Wars 2

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/meet-the-daredevil-thiefs-elite-specialization/

Looking at the notes for Daredevil, i can’t help but notice a pattern, it’s traits and utilities completely negate just about everything the reaper does. A utility which interrupts at range and increases the interrupted skill’s cooldown, perfect for insta-halting many necro and reaper attacks, heals and utilities. frequent dodges which include, essentially, immunity to chill. High damage AOE Leaps on weapons, perfect for swatting necros and reapers between slow attacks, especially with chill removal to get away afterwards, with the bonus of annihilating any minions in the process.

There are also descriptions of additional stuns mixed in with the lot, so they’ll be able to make sure that once they hit us (not hard with necro/reapers total lack of active defence), we absoutely cannot finish our slow attacks or chase after them.

Oh and the GM dodges have finishers built in. Because, why not salt the wound right?

Any thoughts? Does it look the all-in-one reaper shut-down machine to anyone other than me?

We have so much AoE even as base necro, and thieves are still squishy as heck, with the increased damage we’re getting, plus whatever other changes we are going to get between now and then, we should be fine.

Plus I know engi has a Similar trait and it has an ICD attached to it, so if this gets like a 5 second IcD I’m not really worried.

The back wards roll is only 400 so reaper can keep up nicely with a dash ,pull from greatsword or even some shouts. We do have some stability now so that will be fix the dagger stuff. The only thing worrying in my opinion is the anti chill that is thrown accross the board: berserker + cleansing ire, tempest with traited overloads, traited reapers and now anti chill on dodge for daredevils.

It will be quite good against reapers, yes, but reapers are supposed to be really good in team fights due to all our cleaves, while this seems like a really powerful skirmisher/1v1 spec. I am alright with having counters, it is not like necro is not a hard counter to many a condi build.

Also – I doubt GS will be a popular weapon in PvP to begin with, and expect many reapers to stick to dagger/warhorn so that they can shroud more often, since it seems like this is the place where most of our power is loaded. So do not be too worried about being unable to ever hit them. If you are playing marauder you will probably have a bad day, but with a soldier/cele amulet you should be alright.

Yeah, forget about reaper bunkers becoming a thing.

That’s some tinfoil hat logic there. I very much down they specifically designed the Daredevil to counter the Reaper, as you are implying.

Does the Daredevil look like it’ll be tricky for the Reaper to deal with? Sure, a little. I think you’re underestimating just how squishy thieves are, though. The Daredevil looks to be pretty light on stealth, which means once you manage to catch one, they’re gonna go down pretty quickly.

This will probably be easier to deal with than someone who blinks in from nowhere, spikes through your entire Death Shroud, then blinks out and does it again 10 seconds later (except then you just die because you’re out of Life Force).

Blaine Tog.8304:

The Daredevil looks to be pretty light on stealth.

black powder+ leap on dodge?

Tim.6450:

Blaine Tog.8304:

The Daredevil looks to be pretty light on stealth.

black powder+ leap on dodge?

Well, if thieves go for SA to get the truly annoying stealth traits along with DD, they will have to give up on CS or Trickery, both of which are excellent offensive lines. So I am not that worried about it.

I don’t think our AOE will matter when Reaper has such slow and highly telegraphed attacks that the thief will just dodge everything we do…

TheLastNobody.8319:

We have so much AoE even as base necro, and thieves are still squishy as heck, with the increased damage we’re getting, plus whatever other changes we are going to get between now and then, we should be fine.

Plus I know engi has a Similar trait and it has an ICD attached to it, so if this gets like a 5 second IcD I’m not really worried.

No ICD on the dodge-modifying traits for Daredevil.

Plus “remove a condition when you evade” (with a datamined 1 second ICD) on a spec that has, by design, a ton of evades. Necro’s won’t stand a chance.

wolfyrik.2017:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/meet-the-daredevil-thiefs-elite-specialization/

Looking at the notes for Daredevil, i can’t help but notice a pattern, it’s traits and utilities completely negate just about everything the reaper does. A utility which interrupts at range and increases the interrupted skill’s cooldown, perfect for insta-halting many necro and reaper attacks, heals and utilities. frequent dodges which include, essentially, immunity to chill. High damage AOE Leaps on weapons, perfect for swatting necros and reapers between slow attacks, especially with chill removal to get away afterwards, with the bonus of annihilating any minions in the process.

There are also descriptions of additional stuns mixed in with the lot, so they’ll be able to make sure that once they hit us (not hard with necro/reapers total lack of active defence), we absoutely cannot finish our slow attacks or chase after them.

Oh and the GM dodges have finishers built in. Because, why not salt the wound right?

Any thoughts? Does it look the all-in-one reaper shut-down machine to anyone other than me?

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

TheLastNobody.8319:

We have so much AoE even as base necro, and thieves are still squishy as heck, with the increased damage we’re getting, plus whatever other changes we are going to get between now and then, we should be fine.

Plus I know engi has a Similar trait and it has an ICD attached to it, so if this gets like a 5 second IcD I’m not really worried.

No ICD on the dodge-modifying traits for Daredevil.

Plus “remove a condition when you evade” (with a datamined 1 second ICD) on a spec that has, by design, a ton of evades. Necro’s won’t stand a chance.

The interrupt thing may actually see some use but Shadow Step, maybe Shadow Refuge, a Signet or the new 10s physical stun break are more likely… don’t forget about the trait that makes us deal 1.200 damage (no crit) after 2s when we interrupt someone though

Because of that, the condition removal on successful dodge may not be taken too often, also not the cripple/chill clear+20% range increase on dodge (as that competes with damage on dodge + leap finisher) so don’t worry too much about that…

Also, the staff seems more like a PvE/Zerg/Small Group fighting weapon, as things are looking now you shouldn’t see it too much on solo roamers (in the first few weeks maybe because everybody is gonna try it out)

Andlat Helsonr.1284:

Tim.6450:

Blaine Tog.8304:

The Daredevil looks to be pretty light on stealth.

black powder+ leap on dodge?

Well, if thieves go for SA to get the truly annoying stealth traits along with DD, they will have to give up on CS or Trickery, both of which are excellent offensive lines. So I am not that worried about it.

Backstab+evasive empowerement might hurt a bit though.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

TheLastNobody.8319:

We have so much AoE even as base necro, and thieves are still squishy as heck, with the increased damage we’re getting, plus whatever other changes we are going to get between now and then, we should be fine.

Plus I know engi has a Similar trait and it has an ICD attached to it, so if this gets like a 5 second IcD I’m not really worried.

No ICD on the dodge-modifying traits for Daredevil.

Plus “remove a condition when you evade” (with a datamined 1 second ICD) on a spec that has, by design, a ton of evades. Necro’s won’t stand a chance.

^ This. And I am quite sick of being hard countered by everything. Mesmers got a new slow condition, thief got a free dodge and we got torment, oh wait, so did everything else!

Being the slow as kitten movie monster means nothing if we can be hard countered whenever we show our faces. Chill is all well and good, but it seems it has been neutered to the point of uselessness at this point. Bah, well at least we will still be good at tagging mobs in PvE, never mind, we always were.

Tim.6450:

Andlat Helsonr.1284:

Tim.6450:

Blaine Tog.8304:

The Daredevil looks to be pretty light on stealth.

black powder+ leap on dodge?

Well, if thieves go for SA to get the truly annoying stealth traits along with DD, they will have to give up on CS or Trickery, both of which are excellent offensive lines. So I am not that worried about it.

Backstab+evasive empowerement might hurt a bit though.

Yes, it will hurt quite a lot. This will be one of the specs that will be the hardest for us to deal with because of how evasive and mobile they are, and how absolutely impossible they are to pin down by a necro.

But as I said – I am quite alright with having hard counters. S/D thief has always been a nightmare to deal with as a berserker(Marauder) power necro spec. Tankier builds should do fairly well against it since if we get in a situation where a big fight is going down, Reapers will have a big advantage.

Let’s wait to see how good we fare in the next BWE. Balancing all the new specializations is tricky.

I have to agree its a pure hard counter because with all that evade they are getting crap tons of cc.

I fail to see the point in saying that Reaper is all about chill then all the other professions get e-z traits that will remove chilled by doing something as simple as a dodge or a roll. :/ For crying out loud the stealth attack with staff is a 2 second knockdown most of there utility has some sort of cc attached to it + all the evades.

A Daredevil vs Reaper fight from the upcoming BWE

Well, no wonder.

Apart from 2013 Dhuumfire and Power Necro when procs align, good Thief has always been countering Necromancer pretty nicely 1v1.

I’m still more concerned about Chronomancer.

The “333” S/P and the “222” S/D may come back, but they will at least lack either Deadly Arts or Acrobatics for rolling the elite spec.

As for the Spec itself, it looks like hell lot of fun. Kinda like a Windwalker Monk, but more evasive and stealthy. Will surely check it out.

Captain Unusual.9163:

A Daredevil vs Reaper fight from the upcoming BWE

Assuming the Reaper was ever not blinded/dodged/stunned, yes. This is what would happen.

But given the spec gives Thieves even more ways to do those things…

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Captain Unusual.9163:

A Daredevil vs Reaper fight from the upcoming BWE

Assuming the Reaper was ever not blinded/dodged/stunned, yes. This is what would happen.

But given the spec gives Thieves even more ways to do those things…

Right, that’s what I meant. Thief will dance around a necro and shut him down, but if the thief makes a single mistake, he’s kittened. Honestly, I feel like catching and crushing a thief is one of the most satisfying things in the game.

Can you necroforum warriors please stop the martyr complex already? So many people here complain about the necro/reaper to be weak as hell but they hardly ever play. I have high MMR and regularly face off against ESL players when I queue, and i do mostly fine against them, so I don’t see why everyone is crying about necro/reaper being underpowered in pvp just because of new toys that every other class is getting, while forgetting that our new toys are just as good, if not better.

nearlight.3064:

Can you necroforum warriors please stop the martyr complex already? So many people here complain about the necro/reaper to be weak as hell but they hardly ever play. I have high MMR and regularly face off against ESL players when I queue, and i do mostly fine against them.

To be fair, Reaper was weak the only chance we’ve had to play it. Even with the upcoming buffs, it’s looking like every elite spec is getting better and better ways to protect themselves against the Reaper’s greatest strengths, from on-demand Chill removal, to faster attacks/interrupts, to more prevalent Super Speed, which negates the snaring effect of Chill, or AoE stunbreaking to negate the Reaper elite skill.

Am I concerned? For Tempest, Herald, and Dragonhunter, not a bit. The only one of those that really counters Reaper well is Tempest, but compared to base ele, the spec is underwhelming, so it won’t see much use.

For Daredevil, Berserker, and Chronomancer? They will make a Reaper impotent by heavily exploiting the weakness (slow attacks and movement) and being extremely resilient to its strengths (Chronomancer through Alacrity and chill reduction, plus being interrupt-happy, Berserker through shedding conditions faster than a husky in the summer sheds fur, and Daredevil by laughing as the Reaper attempts to hit him, shrugging off any control effects that might land with ease).

Got to remember that if they want to run daredevil they have to drop a trait line from current thief. If they want to keep all the magic that steal does they must take trickery. If they want survival they have to take shadow arts and so on. So things will be different than current play style.
So if they take say, acro, devil and sa then they lose some crucial traits for steal as well as that whole using your bundle twice as they wouldn’t be taking deadly arts either (in which they would lose one of the best traits, improvisation.) Don’t know exactly what their new f skill function would be, got to wait and see.
To be honest, Shadow arts is the one thing keeping them alive at the moment. If they drop that, they will have an extremely difficult time with any class.

I guess we’ll have to wait and see. I just don’t like the negativity of thinking that every new elite spec is going to hard counter us. I think the argument is a bit skewed because much of the reapers kit is team fight oriented, while most people are comparing reaper to other classes purely through 1v1s. And that’s a fair assessment since most base necro builds are fundamentally stronger 1v1 than in team fights.

Anyway I just think we should keep that distinction in mind while discussing this.

nearlight.3064:

I guess we’ll have to wait and see. I just don’t like the negativity of thinking that every new elite spec is going to hard counter us. I think the argument is a bit skewed because much of the reapers kit is team fight oriented, while most people are comparing reaper to other classes purely through 1v1s. And that’s a fair assessment since most base necro builds are fundamentally stronger 1v1 than in team fights.

Anyway I just think we should keep that distinction in mind while discussing this.

In the case of Daredevil, the concept itself is quite strong against what Reaper’s concept is: mobile and evasive versus slow and powerful hits. I don’t expect Reaper to do well against it if both are tuned properly.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

nearlight.3064:

Can you necroforum warriors please stop the martyr complex already? So many people here complain about the necro/reaper to be weak as hell but they hardly ever play. I have high MMR and regularly face off against ESL players when I queue, and i do mostly fine against them.

To be fair, Reaper was weak the only chance we’ve had to play it. Even with the upcoming buffs, it’s looking like every elite spec is getting better and better ways to protect themselves against the Reaper’s greatest strengths, from on-demand Chill removal, to faster attacks/interrupts, to more prevalent Super Speed, which negates the snaring effect of Chill, or AoE stunbreaking to negate the Reaper elite skill.

Am I concerned? For Tempest, Herald, and Dragonhunter, not a bit. The only one of those that really counters Reaper well is Tempest, but compared to base ele, the spec is underwhelming, so it won’t see much use).

The Dragon hunter has a ranged attack that hits almost as hard as kill shot on low cool down (the reaper has no ranged defense)

The Dragon hunter automatically gets a knock back every 7 seconds (that functions as a interrupt of slow attacks, and the reaper is slow to run back into melee range)

The Dragon Hunter’s mechanics for blocking are OP against slow attacking enemies.

Last BWE, playing on dragon hunter I was hard countering reapers.

I think you should add dragon hunter to the classes that hard counter reaper. It will be worse than longbow ranger vs reaper (another hard counter to add to the list).

Mhh that makes greatsword kinda useless against them…

Guess in spvp we will only see dagger/warhorn reapers.

nekretaal.6485:

The Dragon hunter has a ranged attack that hits almost as hard as kill shot on low cool down (the reaper has no ranged defense)

The Dragon hunter automatically gets a knock back every 7 seconds (that functions as a interrupt of slow attacks, and the reaper is slow to run back into melee range)

The Dragon Hunter’s mechanics for blocking are OP against slow attacking enemies.

Last BWE, playing on dragon hunter I was hard countering reapers.

I think you should add dragon hunter to the classes that hard counter reaper. It will be worse than longbow ranger vs reaper (another hard counter to add to the list).

Death’s Charge will block projectiles, remember? The longbow knockback is getting reduced to once every 10 seconds as well. Plus, Dragonhunter’s blocking is no different than base Guardian’s and..oh wait, Reapers get a skill that makes all of their attacks unblockable for 4 seconds minimum, making blocking abilities a moot point.

If a Dragonhunter is hard-countering a Reaper, the Reaper is playing poorly. Only thing to really be concerned with is the elite trap, and even then, only if Infusing Terror isn’t available.

Muchacho.2390:

Mhh that makes greatsword kinda useless against them…

Guess in spvp we will only see dagger/warhorn reapers.

GS feels like a teamfight weapon you want to use to disrupt enemy positioning, AoE blind, and occasionally hit a big-money digger when people are not paying attention. If you want to play 1 v 1, dagger/warhorn is vastly superior. And staff is way too valuable for reaper, so I would never drop it for a d/wh+GS setup.

Remove 1 condition on evasion and every dodge remove cripple and chill.
So another specialization that will make any condition build nearly to useless or even useless.
And on top of all that, will make Reaper play fool, because if the target is not chilled, what is the point?

Tim.6450:

Blaine Tog.8304:

The Daredevil looks to be pretty light on stealth.

black powder+ leap on dodge?

Oh they’ll still totally have access to Stealth, but they don’t have any on Quarterstaff, in the Daredevil trait line, or in their physical skills. They’ll still have stealth, but they’ll have to give up some to really spec into Daredevil.

My thought is that, Thieves can already counter Reapers. Nothing new there.

Like the other elites, that said professional will have to give up a trait line in order to use the elite spec, thus throwing their “Meta” builds out the window. Right now it looks like daredevil is ment for thieves to be reliant on evades and interrupts and not stealth. Still, all you need to do is pressure one to waste their utilities or dodges since they already melt to conditions and burst damage.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

TheLastNobody.8319:

We have so much AoE even as base necro, and thieves are still squishy as heck, with the increased damage we’re getting, plus whatever other changes we are going to get between now and then, we should be fine.

Plus I know engi has a Similar trait and it has an ICD attached to it, so if this gets like a 5 second IcD I’m not really worried.

No ICD on the dodge-modifying traits for Daredevil.

Plus “remove a condition when you evade” (with a datamined 1 second ICD) on a spec that has, by design, a ton of evades. Necro’s won’t stand a chance.

I know it doesn’t right now, but going off the engi one I think it will, just have to see after the next BWE.

Daredevil looks fun just like reaper is fun. I am starting to have a problem though with almost every class now getting immunity or extra cleansing etc for chill which is kinda supposed to be the reapers thing. Not like any of the new elite specs got remove burning (looking at you warrior) on dodge.

The thing with that trait is that you only cure one condition on a SUCCESSFUL EVADE, which means that you can put all the conditions you want on the thief, and then just watch them bleed out from that. They are still susceptible to condition burst from necromancers, its the sustained condition application that they will do better against.

Honestly daredevil looks amazing, but it looks like it’s built to draw you into a long fight. Minion reaper or a bunker will do just fine

I so find it funny that chill is supposed to be reapers thing and it seems like all the other classes are getting ways to ignore it.

The thief’s natural immunity to chill effects always makes it a tough fight for the reaper. Daredevil isn’t particularly more dangerous than base thief in this regard.

Warrior is Hard Counter to necro, even more so with Berserker. Thief I found sometimes very easy to kill on Necro and with more Melee I see no change.

TheLastNobody.8319:

We have so much AoE even as base necro, and thieves are still squishy as heck, with the increased damage we’re getting, plus whatever other changes we are going to get between now and then, we should be fine.

Plus I know engi has a Similar trait and it has an ICD attached to it, so if this gets like a 5 second IcD I’m not really worried.

if you get hit by autoattack and Gravedigger then you’re an idiot that doesn’t think. dude autoattack has 3s cast time and Gravedigger has 2. also Gravedigger has distinct animation: it hover in the air and does a swing that doesn’t do dmg, you can easily evade it even if you’re the worst pvp’er if you just look in your freaking monitor. in roaming i’ve never been hit by Gravedigger cause i can see it’s animation and i dodge like a boss. it takes 2 seconds for Gravedigger to do dmg. when you see him hover, you use dodge. simple. even my 5 year old nephew can dodge Gravedigger if i tell him “now”. so, i don’t really care if they increase it’s dmg by 1000%. if it doesn’t land who cares how much dmg it does. i was hoping for cast time decrease than more dmg, cause it’s functionality sucks. if you look behind the flashy animation you’ll realize how mediocre the skill actually is. not to mention it hits only 3 targets. autoattack the same. ALL dagger skills of Ele beside autoattack hit 5 targets, even the frontal ones, cause why not? Fire Grab has barely 40-50 degrees cone range and yet it hit 5 targets. but Gravedigger which is a horizontal cleave with at least 3 times higher cone range can’t hit 5 targets. if this is not bs then what it is? this selective crap has to stop some time, but i highly doubt it will

Samhayn.2385:

I so find it funny that chill is supposed to be reapers thing and it seems like all the other classes are getting ways to ignore it.

they don’t want Reaper to be OP, that’s why. aside that, did you see Revenant elite specialization video? it has a utility skill that pulses Chill 2 times and it stack in duration(3s) and it only has 15s cd. Necro/Reaper supposed to be master of Chill, and yet Revenant got Chill with pulse. how ridiculous is that?

Dakunaito.9602:

they don’t want Reaper to be OP, that’s why. aside that, did you see Revenant elite specialization video? it has a utility skill that pulses Chill 2 times and it stack in duration(3s) and it only has 15s cd. Necro/Reaper supposed to be master of Chill, and yet Revenant got Chill with pulse. how ridiculous is that?

Do you mean http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elemental_Blast? How about reading it correctly? It doesnt pulse chill… Only the second pulse is a 3 second chill but honestly a 3 second chill on a 15 second cooldown is nothing special if we have a 5 second chill on a 15 second cooldown.

Dakunaito.9602:

Samhayn.2385:

I so find it funny that chill is supposed to be reapers thing and it seems like all the other classes are getting ways to ignore it.

they don’t want Reaper to be OP, that’s why. aside that, did you see Revenant elite specialization video? it has a utility skill that pulses Chill 2 times and it stack in duration(3s) and it only has 15s cd. Necro/Reaper supposed to be master of Chill, and yet Revenant got Chill with pulse. how ridiculous is that?

This skill pulses over time, each pulse applying different condition. First applies Weakness, second Chill, third Burning. And it’s all stationary. And you have to stand in it for fair amount of time to get more than Weakness. Hardly ridiculous.

Dirame.8521:

My thought is that, Thieves can already counter Reapers. Nothing new there.

This. I don’t think that the DD will be more annoying to Reapers than to any other class or Necromancers in general. They do have more evades but as others mentioned, they have to give up other important traits for that. People also exaggerate their CC potential. They solely get CC through utilities which – let’s be honest – many Thieves won’t pick because they need those slots for survivability. OH Pistol + Steal provides as much CC as Thieves need anyway. No gain here.

Reapers will have issues with Thieves in general. Especially since Chill doesn’t work against Initiative. Which is a weirdly balanced resource anyway. Mesmers will agree.

Evadeing a slow cast skill will happen alot but NOT ALWAYS no matter how skilled a Thief (or any other class btw) is they will not Evade or Block or simple avoid all big Slow hits.

They can be CC stun,daze,knockdowned and Immob… but to say that a person is Idiot for not Evadeing a slow cast skill is imho definition of not being clear on how combat works. Most slow cast skills like GS AA and even Executioner Scythe and Gravedigger will be Evaded by a good Thief but by no means ALL, and all a good Reaper needs is to hit with 1-2 of these hard hitters to completely swing they fight vs a Thief.

no player Evades all ever

nearlight.3064:

Can you necroforum warriors please stop the martyr complex already? So many people here complain about the necro/reaper to be weak as hell but they hardly ever play. I have high MMR and regularly face off against ESL players when I queue, and i do mostly fine against them, so I don’t see why everyone is crying about necro/reaper being underpowered in pvp just because of new toys that every other class is getting, while forgetting that our new toys are just as good, if not better.

also tested reaper and with a bit knowledge of how thiefs dodge working you can outplay thiefs, andnot every thief willtake Escapist’s Absolution or all other condicleans traits just to punish nekros ….
Always remember, they dont have stabi, so hard cc

Lynnie.7213:

Remove 1 condition on evasion and every dodge remove cripple and chill.
So another specialization that will make any condition build nearly to useless or even useless.
And on top of all that, will make Reaper play fool, because if the target is not chilled, what is the point?

If you look at what Thieves have to choose from in that trait tier, you likely won’t see the cripple and chill removal (Called Unhindered Combat) on dodge too often.

Condi thieves will take Impaling Lotus
Power Thieves (especially x/P users) will take Bounding Dodger

http://dulfy.net/2015/08/25/gw2-thief-elite-specialization-traits-from-game-files/

Heal on dodge, condi removal on dodge, weakness & blind uptime, knockdowns, stuns, upper cuts, landing damage on dodge, I honestly didn’t think they could make thieves more annoying but they’ve managed to give them everything possible to be the ultimate 1v1 annoying machine. Not looking forward to fighting them.

Reapers will do better against Daredevils, but any necros not taking Reaper will hurt big time. This makes Reapers pretty much a must have. And I’m not sure how it’ll play out yet, as Reaper/GS attacks are so slow.

Arkantos.7460:

nearlight.3064:

Can you necroforum warriors please stop the martyr complex already? So many people here complain about the necro/reaper to be weak as hell but they hardly ever play. I have high MMR and regularly face off against ESL players when I queue, and i do mostly fine against them, so I don’t see why everyone is crying about necro/reaper being underpowered in pvp just because of new toys that every other class is getting, while forgetting that our new toys are just as good, if not better.

also tested reaper and with a bit knowledge of how thiefs dodge working you can outplay thiefs, andnot every thief willtake Escapist’s Absolution or all other condicleans traits just to punish nekros ….
Always remember, they dont have stabi, so hard cc

Yeah after watching the livestream I honestly feel like it won’t such a huge problem. I mean the dash chill/cripple/immob cleanse should probably have a 9 second ICD to be consistent with other similar traits on other classes (like Stop, Drop and Roll).

Still I don’t think teh strongesr daredevil build will even take that trait. S/P with the leap finisher dodge trait will probably be used since it will let S/P builds have reliable stealth, which was always their biggest weakness. S/D could also make a come back using the dash-dodge trait, but I think S/P with the leap dodge will be stronger for better stealth access, better burst damage, and the fact that it hasn’t been nerfed a lot like S/D in the past.

Right now I’m more concerned about interrupt-based DD builds. S/P with the pulmonary impact proc and distracting daggers looks powerful with DD/Trickery/Deadly Arts (or maybe shadow arts but probably not). Basically it sounds like the “new” mantra mesmer. I think reaper stands a fair shot against that build due to having good stability uptime and melee pressure but it will be based on life force pool and skill differences between the two players.

Well just watched the video and its pretty official. 99% of all thieves now will be able to dash doge and remove chill. Well that sucks.