GW1 Necro vs GW2 Necro

GW1 Necro vs GW2 Necro

in Necromancer

Posted by: ryan.5106

ryan.5106

Ok, here’s my 2 cents for what it’s worth. The gists of this thread is that there are a number of people in the GW2 community that are unhappy with the Necromancer profession because it does not operate like the GW1 Necromancer class. I feel that it is important to note that the entire design philosophy of GW2 is a reaction to the classic “rotation” based combat system of most other MMO’s with the exception of a few like Terra, Defiance, FireFall, etc… Games like GW1 and WoW, and their predecessors (Everquest, Dark Age of Camelot) are all based on the idea that your character unlocks large numbers of skills while leveling and each one of those skills is added to the combat rotation in a manner that makes sense. That design philosophy eventually ends with players playing the most efficient rotation over and over and over and over again as a one size fits all solution to tackling each and every combat situation. It is, in my opinion, beyond redundant.

The opposite side of the spectrum is the “action” combat MMO. Third person shooter MMO’s, Hack’n’slash MMO’s, and FPS pseudo-MMO’s (I’m defining this as a broad category so I’ll use Borderlands as an example) rely on a smaller number of options to be used more frequently. Attack, dodge, jump, throw grenade, and usually a single class based special power are the crux of this type of game. Positioning and player based accuracy in a fast paced environment are key in this style of gameplay.

With all that out of the way, now to get to the point of why any of that really applies to this discussion. Arena Net, as far as I can tell, has adopted a hybrid philosophy about it’s combat for GW2. You have access to a medium sized set of skills during any combat engagement. About half of which have fairly short cooldowns and are meant to be used in almost every fight. The other half, give or take a few, have longer cooldowns and short durations. A larger set of skills than an action game, smaller than standard MMO’s. These are only meant to be used in some fights. If you do encounter a situation where you have to use one you have to weigh the benefit of its use now, versus the cost of not having access to it in the near future. So you have to make a tactical decision as opposed to simply including that ability in a “combat rotation”. This helps to vary the combat from fight to fight. Your dodge ability is also a strategic use defensive ability that all professions have access to. So now positioning plays a role in the combat, but not to the same extreme as a true Action game. You have a lock on mechanic like more traditional MMO’s and the more strategic elements of positioning of action games.

Because of all that ^, It would be very difficult to create a profession that follows the same mechanics as traditional MMO’s without unbalancing the current play style. Balancing any MMO is already a delicate process, but balancing an MMO that follows hybrid approach to gameplay is verging on the impossible. Things that worked great in GW1 simply will not work in GW2. While rotations still play a part in the moment to moment gameplay, it’s only a small part. And let’s face facts, even GW1 for all its unique approaches to its business model and character customization still relied on “refining the rotation”, just like WoW and all the others in the vein.

Now, as far as I can tell, the complaints specific to the Necromancer profession are derived from the personal perception of the individual making the complaint that this class “should play a specific way, and it doesn’t, so it’s obviously broken.” That’s a fallacy, and the worst kind of fallacy. This game holds a different design philosophy, this profession is not the same profession from GW1, and the player is not the game designer- the development team designed the professions and as the intellectual property owners they hold all proprietary rights to the game, which includes the design of each of the professions and how they interact with the in-game environment.

GW1 Necro vs GW2 Necro

in Necromancer

Posted by: ryan.5106

ryan.5106

My observations about the Necromancer:
1. Minions are not pets- They are expendable, they are disposable, and they die… permanently until re-summoned. They take up utility slots because you have to sacrifice some utility to bring them into the fight because the necromancer is not balanced to have a significant portion of its damage tied to a pet like the Ranger. In fact, you can play a Necromancer without ever summoning a minion after level 5. If your minions die during combat you can summon a new one during the fight. If a Ranger’s pet is taken out of the fight ( it never really dies, but it won’t heal and re-engage until combat is over or you have been downed and then rallied) you will have to go the rest of the fight without the damage and utility that pet would provide.

2. Necromancers are the masters of boon reversal and condition manipulation. I can’t think of any other profession with the ability to transform an enemies boons into conditions and then immediately spread all of those conditions to surrounding enemies with the stroke of 2 abilities. That’s pretty efficient. Necromancers are also the only profession that can turn conditions directly into their own health.

3. Necromancers have access to some pretty nice interrupt abilities. Their ability to cast fear more often than other professions is a great way to interrupt and forcibly re-position an enemy target. They also have access to a (by GW2 standards anyway) long lasting daze as well as several cripples and swiftness abilities for controlling the battlefield. The last part of this point is not unique to the Necromancer, but is nonetheless an important part of their skill set.

4. Stealing health. There is an entire trait line with vampiric traits that return health with each strike to an enemy. Combine these traits with an army of minions that return health to you, and traits that heal nearby allies and you have a pretty resilient creature crew that can tackle most challenges in an almost effortless fashion. Yes, minion A.I. can sometimes be buggy, it isn’t always.

5. Finally- I can not stress this final point enough. The Necromancer of Guild Wars 2 is the Necromancer of Guild Wars 2. It is not the Necromancer of Guild Wars 1. It is not the Warlock of World of Warcraft. It is not a Guardian, Elementalist, Mesmer, Warrior, Engineer, Ranger, or Thief. The Necromancer is it’s own class and if you expect it to be anything other than what it is then you spend all of your time playing it with nothing but disappointment. Relax and enjoy the profession as it has been presented. There will be changes, things will be balanced, and then balanced again and again and again… Patches will be implemented, other things will break, and more patches will be introduced and the cycle will continue because this is the nature of programming. Just roll with the punches and you will find yourself enjoying the game much more in the long run.

GW1 Necro vs GW2 Necro

in Necromancer

Posted by: Bhawb.7408

Bhawb.7408

Thank you for this post.

But of Corpse – Watch us on YouTube
My PvP Minion Build

GW1 Necro vs GW2 Necro

in Necromancer

Posted by: Xsorus.2507

Xsorus.2507

i don’t mind expendable pets like the Necro Minions

I mind expendable pets that stand there like they’re picking their nose looking at butterflies instead of attacking the target i’m on.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Xsorus/videos?view=0
Natures Ninja and Pain Inverter – Ranger PvP movies
http://www.twitch.tv/xsorovos

GW1 Necro vs GW2 Necro

in Necromancer

Posted by: ryan.5106

ryan.5106

i don’t mind expendable pets like the Necro Minions

I mind expendable pets that stand there like they’re picking their nose looking at butterflies instead of attacking the target i’m on.

Yeah, I hate when that happens. When I mentioned it in the “man, this kitten’s broke!” (a.k.a. the bug’s) forum I received a reply that boiled down to “take a number, we’re working on it!”

I’ve found that sometimes the Minions simply won’t engage until they receive damage. The equivalent of a knock on the head to wake them up.

There have been some complaints that minions were basically going rogue and attacking random mobs on their own. After playing around with it for a little bit I came to the conclusion that minion’s weren’t actually initiating combat with enemy mobs so much as they were just happening to enter that mob’s aggro range. Predictably the mob would attack first because, well, they’re programmed to do that Then the minion would actually perform as intended by retaliating to the incoming threat.

GW1 Necro vs GW2 Necro

in Necromancer

Posted by: Dustfinger.9510

Dustfinger.9510

They remind me of B.O.B. from Monsters vs Aliens:

Susan Murphy: [Fighting the robot] B.O.B.!
B.O.B.: What?
Susan Murphy: Help me!
B.O.B.: Sorry, I was just staring at this bird over there.