Guild Wars 2

Heya, I have never really played a necromancer so there are some things i’m unsure about before I make one.

• Are they wanted in dungeons and how good are they in them?
• Can they dash out a lot of DPS and can they tank well.
• Last thing. How are they in boss battles, like dragons and stuff.

Thanks

Necromancers are bad in most Dungeons, and not desired. They are only effective at mass-dots, which most builds on most classes can achieve more effectively.

Necromancers can tank rather well, but they cannot do nearly as much damage as other classes. You can spec to do decent damage with Deathshroud and Lich form, but you will never be as effective as another burster.

I’d say they’re average for those things. Personally I feel for boss battles (Not multi-target bosses though, Necro sucks at those), Necromancers are superior to many other classes simply because of Deathshroud. Take the King from Ascalonian Catacombs for instance, many players will often die the second they get pulled in, however a Necromancer when traited properly can constantly keep pressure on the King by flipping into Deathshroud to get the Enfeebling blood skill, and insta-fear him, then go back to stacking DoTs. They’re also good against condition based enemies in PvE, as Plague Signet can really shine there when used properly.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Necromancers are bad in most Dungeons, and not desired.

Bad at most dungeons? depends on the build.
Not desired? Well, no one will ever request a necromancer in map-chat for their group. But to be honest, when someone asks specifically for a certain class like warrior or guardian, I immediately assume that they can’t pull their own weight.

Tanking definitely depends on the build, but even with a rather glassy one there’s always death shroud… lets you survive bathing in a hostile zerg for two or three seconds :P
DPS… certainly not direct damage compared to other classes, but that’s not the point of the necromancer.

As to “dragons and stuff”, if by that you mean those huge group events with the daily reward and huge chest then (as with every other class) all you can do is get a few hits of and not die. That’s all that is ever needed with those dragons…

Acension.9270:

• Are they wanted in dungeons and how good are they in them?

I’ve never been turned down from a dungeon because of being a necro, and I’ve currently done most paths, excluding Arah and higher level fractals. I hear that in higher level fractals people mostly want Guardians/Mesmers/Warriors, but I’ve also heard of necros doing level 38+ fractals.

Acension.9270:

• Can they dash out a lot of DPS and can they tank well.

I’ve heard it’s not possible to do as much damage as several other classes if both spec purely into damage. That said, people mostly spec pure damage for CoF farming, so unless that’s your thing it usually isn’t a big deal. There are several higher damage builds on the forums. One issue is that a lot of our damage is single target damage – while we have a great AoE weapon (staff), it has less damage and more control/support (but also hits lots of enemies, which still makes it effective)

They can definitely tank well. We have naturally high health (although low toughness), and death shroud provides extra tanking health. We also have a good amount of healing if specced for that (although most people don’t). PVT or HPT gear both allow us to tank pretty well. However, we don’t have access to vigor, which means we have to absorb more of the boss’s damage.

Acension.9270:

• Last thing. How are they in boss battles, like dragons and stuff.

They’re great in dungeon boss battles. Signet of undeath allows you to res multiple people at once while moving. I run a healing/support build and can heal the team a lot during boss fights.
If you mean open-world boss battles, I don’t do those much, but my understanding is they’re now so pathetically easy that anyone can do them effectively.

• Are they wanted in dungeons and how good are they in them?

No more than rangers. We’re not a class that people seek out for specific encounters or other things.

• Can they dash out a lot of DPS and can they tank well.

Condition specs can AoE rather well, but it doesn’t even come close to the AoE abilities of classes that can cleave (IE: warrior). Our single target DPS leaves much to be desired.

• Last thing. How are they in boss battles, like dragons and stuff.

In typical boss battles, if things ever go bad, I’m almost always one of the last people standing. Doesn’t mean much though, because if everyone else wipes and I’m still alive, there isn’t really anything I can do other than let myself die or reset the fight so the others can revive.

I’d say if there is anything wrong with necromancers, is that this class has been cursed to be average at everything. There isn’t really any one thing we’re the best at. Also, the death shroud mechanic is pretty kittenty if you’re playing anything other than a power build. Even then its not all that great. Even if you trait specifically to use DS as much as possible, its still pretty meh.

I’ve never been turned down from a dungeon because of being a necro

Sadly, this has happened to me. The number of times has actually been relatively small, but it has happened. Once at the very beginning of the game when attempting to do CoF path 1 (this was before they nerfed everything, you really did need 4 warriors to do path 1 back then), a couple of times when attempting to do fractal levels higher than 22 (gets more frequent the higher in fractal level you go), and once when I joined a group to do a CoF speed run. I joined the group with the intention of switching to my warrior, but before I could the group kicked me saying necros don’t have enough DPS to do speed runs.

Kravick.4906:

I’ve never been turned down from a dungeon because of being a necro

Sadly, this has happened to me. The number of times has actually been relatively small, but it has happened. Once at the very beginning of the game when attempting to do CoF path 1 (this was before they nerfed everything, you really did need 4 warriors to do path 1 back then), a couple of times when attempting to do fractal levels higher than 22 (gets more frequent the higher in fractal level you go), and once when I joined a group to do a CoF speed run. I joined the group with the intention of switching to my warrior, but before I could the group kicked me saying necros don’t have enough DPS to do speed runs.

Yeah, the famous CoF speedruns. I get that, but it’s rather a pro warrior argument than a contra necro one.
The fractals though -.- …dude, just be glad you didn’t get in that group. The moment someone discriminates against other classes (not just necromancers) I know that the fractal will take twice as long, because they rely on the strenght of others. The only entry requirement above lvl20 should be enough agony resistance, and that’s it. I’ve done several lvl ~30 ish runs without guardians or mesmers or whatever the most popular are atm and it was just as quick.

Btw I disagree with the whole “average at everything”-stuff, but kravick knows that allready :P

I will give you my three step process to learning about the Necromancer

1) CHIPSSS Encyclopedia of Necro skills

2) Nemesis Tutorials

3) SOACGaming Podcast - sittingonacouch.com for audio only

Each of these are fantastic ways to get immersed into the spirit of the Necromancer and what they bring to the table.

Ignore the hate. The Necromancer does have a learning curve, but the more you play it the more you will enjoy it or find that maybe it’s not for you.

Good luck and if you have any specific questions as you level, don’t be afraid to come back here!

Also, Almighty Troll is exactly what he says he is. Ignore anything he posts and you will be better off.

Kravick is intelligent and has a lot of good stuff to say most of the time, but he has a serious bitterness to the Necro class at the moment, so you will have to look at what he says through glasses that are tinted to his dislike.

Currently, the Necro is in a good place, the helpful players now outnumber and in general overwhelm the angry players who remember the super powered Necro from Beta, and/or the completely screwed up buggy one that launched. So you have to weigh responses. Then there is me, and according to Dreadlord I run around shooting rainbows up players butts which is quite difficult as a Necro :P.

Kravick is intelligent and has a lot of good stuff to say most of the time, but he has a serious bitterness to the Necro class at the moment, so you will have to look at what he says through glasses that are tinted to his dislike.

Its not bitterness. I love this class. I’m just capable of seeing the forest for the trees (IE: big picture). I just feel the developers just haven’t taken the time and seriously looked at what they’ve created in the necromancer class. We had a lot of cool ideas in the beginning that were supposed to be necromancer only (where is our confusion we were promised?), but instead got gutted and given to other classes, and their versions function better than ours. The cast timers and cool down rates are also not in line with the other classes abilities as well.

Everyone here agrees that necromancer signets (save Undeath, and people feel tethered to Locust in WvW as its the only way were able to keep up with zergs) are absolute trash. No one in their right mind even uses them. Theres also the imaginary fear that the developers have regarding Death Shroud, and how they’re afraid of how “strong” it makes us (their words, not mine).

Death Shroud looks good on paper, but in reality, it pales in comparison to real mobility and escape mechanics. It doesn’t save us, and it doesn’t prolong a fight other than absorbing maybe 2 or 3 hits. Life Force generation is also a serious problem for non power builds, and has little to no synergy for anything but power builds. How can DS be an intricate part of this class that we’re “always supposed to utilize at all times” when all of its functions are clearly designed with only power builds in mind? Then theres the fact that dagger auto attack is the best LF generating weapon we have, but does more DPS than Life Blast. Why on earth would you want to use DS and purposefully nerf your damage like that? Its completely backwards!

When you sit down and actually start comparing necromancers to another class, and the abilities that they have that mirror ours, you start to see how much better those classes function in those roles. In the case of warriors and thieves, I have first hand experience at the damage output they can bring over a necromancer. Its not that what necromancers do is bad. Its just average. No one ever wants to be average, and no matter how hard you try to push yourself, you just can’t get over that last hump as a necromancer because of imposed limitations. TBH, necromancer has been the fastest class I ever leveled to 80 simply because of Epidemic (which got nerfed pretty hard in PvP), but thats a case of quantity over quality in terms of getting heart quests done.

Then there is me, and according to Dreadlord I run around shooting rainbows up players butts which is quite difficult as a Necro

Yeah, you do this a lot.

They are scared of DS because of the absolute insanity it was during closed beta. Think of it this way, every build you’ve ever complained about (d/d eles, burst thieves, w/e) being able to 1v5 easily, and then give the build invincibility. It was ridiculous, and it lead to a lot of what we see now (death shroud being so weak and impossible to maintain).

I am signing on to Camp Kravick, and wish to know if there are pre-printed flyers I can hand out.

Necro right now is style >>>> substance. I like the style a lot though, and my ez-mode thief is still shelved in S in favor of bringing teh darknezz.

Kravick.4906:

Everyone here agrees that necromancer signets (save Undeath, and people feel tethered to Locust in WvW as its the only way were able to keep up with zergs) are absolute trash.

I don’t think they are “absolute trash”, but tbh I like locust the least of them all. It’s more like a travelling utility for bounty searches and such. In combat +25% movement is as good as just standing still. And the least of all you need it in a wvw zerg because there are always people giving all others swiftness anyway.

Kravick.4906:

Death Shroud looks good on paper, but in reality, it pales in comparison to real mobility and escape mechanics. It doesn’t save us, and it doesn’t prolong a fight other than absorbing maybe 2 or 3 hits. Life Force generation is also a serious problem for non power builds, and has little to no synergy for anything but power builds. How can DS be an intricate part of this class that we’re “always supposed to utilize at all times” when all of its functions are clearly designed with only power builds in mind? Then theres the fact that dagger auto attack is the best LF generating weapon we have, but does more DPS than Life Blast. Why on earth would you want to use DS and purposefully nerf your damage like that? Its completely backwards!

A good point on power builds, which is why I’m very hesitant on even trying one out.
But: non-power builds don’t (or shouldn’t) use ds as a damage sponge, freeze and fear then pop out again. That not only serves a defensive and offensive purpose at the same time, but you are then not as dependant on lf regeneration.
I know that makes ds look like you push it even further away from what it was originally intended to be and make it almost a mere extension of your other utilities, but it works.
And it shouldn’t be compared to escape mechanisms of other classes, because that simply isn’t what it’s for.

Its fine if you simply like concept and not interested in the flavor of the month class. If not then don’t bother. It’s as simple as that. There are a lot of things that are broken and creaky but well… its anet like bethesda but with mmos as end product.

Acension.9270:

Heya, I have never really played a necromancer so there are some things i’m unsure about before I make one.

• Are they wanted in dungeons and how good are they in them?
• Can they dash out a lot of DPS and can they tank well.
• Last thing. How are they in boss battles, like dragons and stuff.

Thanks

• Necro’s are great in dungeons. You might have an issue if you and another party member are condi builds. I myself play a meleemancer and I don’t have issues.

• There’s a couple of builds that you can tank with, they are buried in this forum. A couple of videos too. I’m a bit lazy right now, but if you search this forum for -tank- you should find the threads I speak of.

As for dishing out lots of DPS, it’s not so much. Sure a wellomancer can root a dude and plop wells down for a good amount of burst, but that’s an ideal situation that doesn’t always present itself. Does it have the insta gib potential of a thief? Definitely not. I like to think of the necro as an axe chopping down a tree. We chip away at them slowly while taking their abuse until they run out of tricks to use and then either run (which we have good chase) and die, or just die in defeat. We win fights with sustain, not front loading damage.

• Boss fights are pretty easy in my opinion. It doesn’t take much (for any class really) to do well. For dragons and other world bosses all you really need to do is auto attack with staff and you get credit. But in dungeons necro’s can provide some good utility for the rest of the group. Protection, condi stripping for both bosses and allies, some builds can heal well, etc. It really all depends on what you as a necro want to do. There are ways to do everything effectively.

All in all, the necro is a great class right now. The only thing that I think the necro cannot do well is reliable burst and minions have some issues with 30+ fractals but who does those anyways :P