Guild Wars 2

Hail, all great necromancers of Tyria!

I wanted to take this time, as a thief player, to say I am really sorry for your loss regarding the healing skill. The datamined version looked so good and when I saw it yesterday on livestream, the only thing I thought was: “kitten , Thieves didn’t get the shortest stick!”
I thought we would get the crappiest heal from all 8, but your version with an ICD….just wow :P
Apart from siphoning being already pretty lackluster. I tried to get my guild wars 1 vampiric necromancer back, but it just won’t work.

So once more, my condolences!

I guess ANet got siphon spooked after the siphon food incidence…

Never mind they seems to have the mindset that Death Shroud makes us uber-tanks (when played correctly…).

At this stage, I think its safe to say that Necro’s are never going to be buffed to any real degree: Anet only buff classes that wear Heavy Armor

Clear that Anet has NO clue what they are doing. Even before it was nerfed into a joke that anyone in their right mind wouldnt bother getting it was average with a rubbish Active but some how they manged to make it even worse.

You see other classes new heals and they are insane to the point they are overpowered and the WORST heal out of the lot….yeah thats the one that gets nerfed. Anet, clueless as always.

When poor squishy thieves have pitty for you, its time to take a step back and reassess. T-T Thanks, Mr. Squishy-thief, our losses are deep. My apologies back that your heal has a silly long cooldown and doesn’t help most (if any) popular thief builds in PvP.

I think I cried a lil inside when I saw how good the other heals were when compared to our own…especially that mesmer signet. guess it might make PU mesmers even more of a pain than they are now.

I’ll take a healing signet like mesmers that gives me 350 healing every 3 seconds per minion out. That’d be neat.

ronpierce.2760:

When poor squishy thieves have pitty for you, its time to take a step back and reassess. T-T Thanks, Mr. Squishy-thief, our losses are deep. My apologies back that your heal has a silly long cooldown and doesn’t help most (if any) popular thief builds in PvP.

I thank thee for that. I am honestly pretty sad about our new healing skill, especially since the balancing is revolved around a 30 point grandmaster trait. Kinda forces you to take it so you can use it as developers intended but yeah, the necro heal is just….lol….I’ll unlock it on my necro just to try it out but I can’t see anyone in their right mind using either the Thief or Necro heal competitively xD

ronpierce.2760:

I’ll take a healing signet like mesmers that gives me 350 healing every 3 seconds per minion out. That’d be neat.

No thanks. Seeing as alot of people dont run Minion builds where as ALL Mesmers have to have Illusions.

I dont understand why the Signet had to be when you take damage. It should have been when you DEAL damage.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

I dont understand why the Signet had to be when you take damage. It should have been when you DEAL damage.

Would’ve been a cool design that encourages active use. Get passive healing by beeing hit and the ability to activate it and burst+burstheal someone by using your cd-limited multihit skills(dagger2, axe2) and give up the passive healing. If it gave flat healing per hit it would be way harder to find an interesting active effect that would be used and not simply let the signet work its passive magic.
Edit: Look at healing sig as an example of a passive effect that is too good to ever use the active.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

ronpierce.2760:

I’ll take a healing signet like mesmers that gives me 350 healing every 3 seconds per minion out. That’d be neat.

No thanks. Seeing as alot of people dont run Minion builds where as ALL Mesmers have to have Illusions.

I dont understand why the Signet had to be when you take damage. It should have been when you DEAL damage.

It was a joke :P

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

No thanks. Seeing as alot of people dont run Minion builds where as ALL Mesmers have to have Illusions.

At least a minion heal would have been useful to someone.

And my condolences to you too Mr. Squishy Thief. I still appreciate your venom-sharing in PvP that makes me look good when I destroy someone 1v1 because all my minions and I have venoms.

They spent over 5 mins for each class on talking about the new skills,they got to Necros and were done in 1 min.The live stream was so funny,even in the stream you could see that the skill sucked,he was at 1hp used the skill and his HP went up to 2k lol

I couldn’t wait for the dec 10th patch till I saw the live stream,now im starting to look in to other MMO’s to play like WildStar.This Dev team has failed the game.

digiowl.9620:

I guess ANet got siphon spooked after the siphon food incidence…

Never mind they seems to have the mindset that Death Shroud makes us uber-tanks (when played correctly…).

a tank with the anchoring of the titanic.

Banjal.7328:

I couldn’t wait for the dec 10th patch till I saw the live stream,now im starting to look in to other MMO’s to play like WildStar.This Dev team has failed the game.

Except I know Wildstar isn’t going to be worth my time, because they are dead-set on re-skinning WoW, which I absolutely hated.

it’s alright i guess. i started playing this profession as it was advertised to be able to rival the lich king in power, instead i’m struggling to keep up with count chocula.

Bhawb.7408:

Banjal.7328:

I couldn’t wait for the dec 10th patch till I saw the live stream,now im starting to look in to other MMO’s to play like WildStar.This Dev team has failed the game.

Except I know Wildstar isn’t going to be worth my time, because they are dead-set on re-skinning WoW, which I absolutely hated.

From what i have seen it looks pretty awful. I wouldnt actually mind a reskinned WoW but WoW back when it was actually GOOD. Wildstar looks a mess though, the combat looks terrible.

Bhawb.7408:

Banjal.7328:

I couldn’t wait for the dec 10th patch till I saw the live stream,now im starting to look in to other MMO’s to play like WildStar.This Dev team has failed the game.

Except I know Wildstar isn’t going to be worth my time, because they are dead-set on re-skinning WoW, which I absolutely hated.

I was being sarcastic,I played Wildstar and it isn’t that good.With each update GW2 is going the same path.

I was all for the Dec 10th patch,now it just looking like a big let down like the WvW chest.

Bhawb.7408:

Banjal.7328:

I couldn’t wait for the dec 10th patch till I saw the live stream,now im starting to look in to other MMO’s to play like WildStar.This Dev team has failed the game.

Except I know Wildstar isn’t going to be worth my time, because they are dead-set on re-skinning WoW, which I absolutely hated.

I hated WoW as well – thought i was the only one lol.

I’ll be looking at Everquest Next though – i loved EQ2.

Lightsbane.9012:

it’s alright i guess. i started playing this profession as it was advertised to be able to rival the lich king in power, instead i’m struggling to keep up with count chocula.

This made me ROFLMAO!!! XD for a couple minutes. So funny, so sad, and so true.

Top row = what necros could be/should be.

Bottom row = where the devs are taking us.

Vun…vun nervf…HA…HA…HA…HA !!!

Two…two nervfs…HA…HA…HA…HA !!!

Tree…tree glorious nervfs…HA…HA…HA…HA !!!

Kraag Deadsoul.2789:

Lightsbane.9012:

it’s alright i guess. i started playing this profession as it was advertised to be able to rival the lich king in power, instead i’m struggling to keep up with count chocula.

This made me ROFLMAO!!! XD for a couple minutes. So funny, so sad, and so true.

Top row = what necros could be/should be.

Bottom row = where the devs are taking us.

Vun…vun nervf…HA…HA…HA…HA !!!

Two…two nervfs…HA…HA…HA…HA !!!

Tree…tree glorious nervfs…HA…HA…HA…HA !!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vC0uvUuXVh8

If only we could actually look like that 2nd picture, i wouldnt mind so much with us being crap at everything bar conditions.

[ramble]
Anet is trying to slowly throw conditionmancers out of the meta, not by fixing their easy access to condition damage on some crazy builds, but by giving other classes more access to their removals and protections against them! So, we’re still going to blow up everything that doesn’t fully spec in condi-removal but we won’t be able to do that, because everybody’s forced to go crazy on condi-hate builds (for example, I can’t help but to keep wondering, how can I stop unstacking my conditions on an engi when they pop their AED when I already have like 7 or something bleeds on them?).
But my real concern is that in Anet’s view, poor phantasm mesmers were apparently too bad and probably rangers needed another spirit because there weren’t enough already. And the next thing they give the warriors is another anti-damage stance. Build diversity… you got it! What’s gonna be next? A trait for necros that synergizes well with terror and dhuumfire (because those things apparently aren’t in good synergy already)!

And guess what? Anet did realize that life siphon necro builds are lackluster, so they decided to give us a signet that is sub-par to every other healing skill the necro has access to right now.

Don’t worry guys, anet has fallen in a sine curve with their balance it seems. Pretty soon, necros are gonna become underpowered and then a patch afterward will make us super OP again. And then the story goes on…
[/ramble]

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

I dont understand why the Signet had to be when you take damage. It should have been when you DEAL damage.

Probably because necros have access to a million different skills that AoE. A properly traited well with a sig that healed on hit would make you practically unkillable.

Its clear at this point that ANET devs (doing balance) mostly main Warriors, elementalists and some guardians. Thieves and Necromancers have been getting the short end of the stick since launch for all the balance patches.

We’ve already answered that, Nagato. All you have to do is put a heal cap/second (Modified by healing power) or a cap on how many people the trait can steal from at a time. There are ways to adjust that, while having the ability in a good place. Their alternative is just terrible.

ronpierce.2760:

We’ve already answered that, Nagato. All you have to do is put a heal cap/second (Modified by healing power) or a cap on how many people the trait can steal from at a time. There are ways to adjust that, while having the ability in a good place. Their alternative is just terrible.

The passive as it was in the datamined version was fine, just needed number tuning.

The active should be gated by both debuff stacks and 5s. Unlike Vampiric which is kept low because of “infinite” scaling, this thing can only do as much as it has stacks. So make stacks apply based on some base number + X for each ally up to a max, and remove the ICD.

For example, if you are alone, 10 stacks, no ICD on attacking. With 1 ally, 15 stacks. 3+ allies 25 stacks (max). No ICDs, it is gated by the number of debuff stacks (non-infinite scaling), and by only having 5s to deal that to a target that is actively defending themselves.

Also; if damage is screwing over the healing portion, they should really re-add the damage portion of the passive, cut the damage in half on the on-use, but double the healing portion of the siphons. I mean this IS a healing skill, there’s no rule saying all leeches have to deal as much as they heal. If the damage is the reason this ability blows, don’t remove the damage, or make the healing suck. Just make the damage lower and make it a useful healing skill. x.X And remove the kitten ICD.

So now it will heal you when you take damage? That makes it completely useless.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

So now it will heal you when you take damage? That makes it completely useless.

It worked that way even in the datamined version, but that at least dealt damage to the opponent too.

And didn’t have an ICD. Now it only heals you for 300 every 1 second if hit. Talk about a load of garb garb.

Yup! Let’s do a comparison to the warrior’s healing signet.

Necros get 300 health back, only if they get hit.

Warriors get 392 health constantly.

Hmmmmmmmm.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

So now it will heal you when you take damage? That makes it completely useless.

A flat 300 damage reduction on every hit (which is what it was pre-ICD) is far from useless. Especially on the old version, where it also returned that damage. The datamined version was, frankly, OP as a passive effect, and it was on-hit. It was OP because with retal up (easily done) you would have returned over 550 damage every time you are hit, and been healed for 350.

The problem with the new version is that it directly competes with Blood Fiend for passive healing (and loses), loses out in group healing to WoB (by a massive amount), and loses in self-healing to CC.

The whole point of this skill was having a retal-like passive that also had some slight damage reduction via healing, and then a very high risk/reward active that was again, very damage based. The real soul of this skill was allowing the most aggressive class in the game to give up reliable burst healing for sustained damage/healing. It was by far the most attrition based heal we had ever been (almost) given access to.

I don’t think I’d be half as upset if I didn’t see the earlier version. And the devs can’t use the excuse “this is why we don’t like people to see what we do”. It’s not just a let down that we didn’t get the original version. It’s the fact that now I know you have some potential, then you go and absolutely trash it. Like you guys were at the very least ON to something…

Maybe if it was like: Heal for 600 damage when hit, 1 second ICD or like 250 healing when hit, no ICD, and reflect 50-100 damage for the passive, then for the use, heal for about 4.k and gain a say… 6 second SELF buff with 10 charges that says your next 10 attacks steal 350 HP from the target with a 25 second cooldown.

Why is this better and also not cheesy?

It withholds the idea that you FINALLY get punished for focusing down the necromancer (something to watch for) while it helps the necromancer survive multiple-target-burst since we have 0 evades/blocks outside of dodge rolls that happen less frequent than just about any other class (if not every?). THEN, the on use provides a small heal to keep us afloat and some high-risk healing because in order to get the rest of your healing you’d have to successfully hit and be aggressive. It’d eliminate the issue of the main portion missing, it’d retain the fact that leeching is about drain-tanking and being aggressive, not support. And it’d be short enough to CC us while most of our charges go away or you could evade many of them. Plus the damage would compensate for the lack of condition removal.

But instead we have… this. Heals for less hps than a warrior signet even if we’re getting blasted every second on the dot. The heal is terrible, and can be easily avoided. It marks 1 target so we have to focus that person to get any more healing… It has an ICD so we cap at a 35 second CD 5.2k heal… just… Who the hell thought this was okay?

It’s going to be good in PvE because it’s essentially a free 7,000 damage every 28 seconds, but it’s pretty terrible otherwise.

^ As long as it’s on a boss or something that won’t die before it ends, and as long as the necromancer doesn’t value/need much health. If a necromancer dies due to a terrible heal they’re slowing down the whole team’s dps.

I’m talking bosses, which are really the only challenge in PvE.

It should still come out as a 6,000 or so heal. That’s about where Consume Conditions usually comes at, barring a few bosses that apply conditions.

To be clear, I think it deserves a buff. I’m just saying it won’t be completely useless.

Lopez.7369:

It’s going to be good in PvE because it’s essentially a free 7,000 damage every 28 seconds, but it’s pretty terrible otherwise.

But with the cast time – you would have done that 7000 anyway.

^ Especially if you run with a Blood fiend.

Ghostextechnica.3270:

Yup! Let’s do a comparison to the warrior’s healing signet.

Necros get 300 health back, only if they get hit.

Warriors get 392 health constantly.

Hmmmmmmmm.

with a 0.5 HP modifier no less. a passive 1000 heal, anyone? Quite possible with 1500 HP…

Honestly tho, the real insult to injury was the devs going out of their way to demo a spec-ed up guardian to show the power of the new heal. Yet the necro demo virtually all about “see that red glowing icon? Nice and scary, right?”.

Still no response from A-net… nothing to appease any concerns.

It’s just depressing… when’s Everquest Next coming out?

Lopez.7369:

It’s going to be good in PvE because it’s essentially a free 7,000 damage every 28 seconds, but it’s pretty terrible otherwise.

It would be something if it did that, which, as others have said, is barely above your normal dps. Except, with 1 sec ICD and 5 seconds uptime, you’re looking at 3-4 procs per person max. Also, Karl pretty clearly stressed “Allied PLAYERS will siphon life from that enemy.” In other words, you’re looking at using up between 15 and 20 stacks of the 25 in a group of 5 (and need at least 7 players to use them all up), which is only 4.3-5.7k.

actualy that signet looks like a wonderfull minion master build signet as it effectively makes all your minion do about +250 damage for a time. Since most minion masters deals their damage from other source then the minions themselve its a good way to reorient the camera toward minion damage dealing and blood spec rather then the other spec such as death shroud. In some way its a spell that rewards quantity over quality and i can imaginate the heavy damage nuke multi striking unit will do while the target is under its effect

We’ve explained this Kyubi. It specifies “PLAYER allies”, it doesn’t benefit minions.

Dunno, the tooltip specifically calls out players… (ninja’d)

Had a little brainstorm over at Suggestions. Wherein the passive would tag the attacker with a siphon debuff upon hitting the necromancer, and the active would consume said debuff to heal the necromancer. Slap a suitably long recharge on there, and the risk/reward revolves around how long the necro is willing to stay in the fight before healing.

Jan 10th 2014 Patch Notes:
- Necro will no longer receive healing from other players. This is to stop frustration of accidentally wasting healing on DeathShrouded Necro’s.
- All necro self healing will be converted to damage with a 0.004% co-efficient. This was a bug, but is now a working as intended feature.

Feb 10th 2014 Big Ballance Patch Notes:
-Tooltips updated to show no heals

Bweaty.9187:

Jan 10th 2014 Patch Notes:
- Necro will no longer receive healing from other players. This is to stop frustration of accidentally wasting healing on DeathShrouded Necro’s.
- All necro self healing will be converted to damage with a 0.004% co-efficient. This was a bug, but is now a working as intended feature.

Feb 10th 2014 Big Ballance Patch Notes:
-Tooltips updated to show no heals

March 11th
Updated the character creation screen to match up the existing professions, since the latest update the deletion of Necromancer doesn’t show up. Now working as intended.

Bhawb.7408:

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

So now it will heal you when you take damage? That makes it completely useless.

A flat 300 damage reduction on every hit (which is what it was pre-ICD) is far from useless. Especially on the old version, where it also returned that damage. The datamined version was, frankly, OP as a passive effect, and it was on-hit. It was OP because with retal up (easily done) you would have returned over 550 damage every time you are hit, and been healed for 350.

The problem with the new version is that it directly competes with Blood Fiend for passive healing (and loses), loses out in group healing to WoB (by a massive amount), and loses in self-healing to CC.

The whole point of this skill was having a retal-like passive that also had some slight damage reduction via healing, and then a very high risk/reward active that was again, very damage based. The real soul of this skill was allowing the most aggressive class in the game to give up reliable burst healing for sustained damage/healing. It was by far the most attrition based heal we had ever been (almost) given access to.

Didn’t the passive on the datamined version have an ICD?

April 10 2014 update:
We have reinstated the necromancer class due to concern from the remaining professions about losing easy kills. We have streamlined the trait lines to make them more in line with our vision for the necromancer.

The existing trait lines: Spite, Curses, Death Magic, Blood Magic, Soul Reaping have been deleted.

There are now two necromancer trait lines:
Dhuumfire
Reanimator

Up to 70 trait points can be put into each line. Adept and Master traits have been removed.

Grandmaster Traits:
Dhuumfire Grandmaster: Dhuumfire – burn everything within a 1200 radius of you. This includes environement, structures, NPCs, characters and your CPU

Reanimator Grandmaster: Raise the Dead – Summon a jagged horror whenever you kill a foe

Sepreh.5924:

April 10 2014 update:
We have reinstated the necromancer class due to concern from the remaining professions about losing easy kills. We have streamlined the trait lines to make them more in line with our vision for the necromancer.

The existing trait lines: Spite, Curses, Death Magic, Blood Magic, Soul Reaping have been deleted.

There are now two necromancer trait lines:
Dhuumfire
Reanimator

Up to 70 trait points can be put into each line. Adept and Master traits have been removed.

Grandmaster Traits:
Dhuumfire Grandmaster: Dhuumfire – burn everything within a 1200 radius of you. This includes environement, structures, NPCs, characters and your CPU

Reanimator Grandmaster: Raise the Dead – Summon a jagged horror whenever you kill a foe

Note: Dhuumfire duration has been reduced to 0.4second, so with 100% condition duration it won’t actually tick any damage, but will remove burning done by any allies.

Jagged horror dam reduced to 1, and movement speed reduced to 0. Any damage or conditions done to minion will be transferred to master.
Summon & Death voice in game, will be played 10 times per minion, or footstep taken in game world.

Id quite like to see this as a bugfix:

• When entering Deathshroud the game now correctly logs you out to character select.