Guild Wars 2

Ive been playing necro for a while and to be onest i dont see it not even something close to being remotly balanced pvp , assasins that heal for almoust full health in stealth lose any conditions you use on them by simple rolling and the cream of the crop can take u down in 2 3 hits, guardians&elementists that heal for full health, mesmers with the most op skills in the game , overall the best bet out of all the builts ive tryed is glass cannon condition master that actualy did have some positive results and even then u have to stay waaay away far to be safe and not insta killed

the funny thing is we are not the black sheep of the flock were something like grey, in comparison warriors truly have it made being easely bested by almoust eny class

Unlike the league of legends matchmaking, GW2 profession balance is quite good, remember necros have the highest base efficiency from just weapon+utility skills (and some basic 10 point traits like transfusion, mark of evasion, shrouded removal, greater marks, terror and chilling darkness).
Warriors aint in such a bad spot, its mostly current meta + Boon strength that rips them a new one (both being adressed in the patch on the 30th) and sword/axe + Longbow, Mace/Shield + Hammer builds work for their niche roles (condition zone control and immortal cc monster for others to kill off people).

Think of it this way; League of Legends has an estimated 12 million people online every day. It has been out for over 3 years, has a very active international competitive scene with people that literally do nothing but play LoL as their job. And yet with so much money in their game, so much time, and so many people playing, nearly every week there are at least small tweaks to balance.

The reality is that perfect balance is impossible to achieve in this kind of a game. There is always going to be a build that is a bit too strong, some that are a bit too weak, and flavor of the month classes. ANet has been doing a lot of balancing, but it takes time. They are approaching it the right way though, and I think it will get better.

if thats true then whats the point of lvl up in pvp if it serves no other purpose than how your character looks wouldnt a matchmaking system be better?

Best example i can give lets say a team of lvl 5/10 people join a pvp match vs a lvl 60/70 consider this ,the more newbier team has a worser chance of winning than 60 /70 because the more experience players know how to deal with the other clases while the weaker team has no freaking idea ,and before i read comments that fighting a more experienced team increases your own skill consider the fact the not everybody like to beaten again and again and again just to learn one part of the game

Bhawb.7408:

The reality is that perfect balance is impossible to achieve in this kind of a game. There is always going to be a build that is a bit too strong, some that are a bit too weak, and flavor of the month classes. ANet has been doing a lot of balancing, but it takes time. They are approaching it the right way though, and I think it will get better.

what was the point of nerfing epidemic then restoring it to how it was ? isnt that a step back then 1 foward to where u started ?

There is an MMR (match making ranking) in place right now, which means you are facing teams of similar MMR. The problem right now is that MMR is very volatile, due to a combination of a new system and very small population, and also that with so few people around in general, MMR differences in each game might be fairly large.

Epidemic used to be infinite range, no LoS, no AoE limit, and couldn’t miss. That needed to change, so they have progressively been scaling it back. Them returning the unblockable is just restoring some of the function it had before the most recent fix, but not all of it.

From the state of the game, Guardians are the measuring stick the developers are hoping to tune professions up or down to. Necromancer is not that far off. It is one of the harder jobs to play but ther were hints toward making easy jobs a bit more technically challenging but not changing damage output much at all, with certain exceptions like grenadier.

alex.7364:

Bhawb.7408:

The reality is that perfect balance is impossible to achieve in this kind of a game. There is always going to be a build that is a bit too strong, some that are a bit too weak, and flavor of the month classes. ANet has been doing a lot of balancing, but it takes time. They are approaching it the right way though, and I think it will get better.

what was the point of nerfing epidemic then restoring it to how it was ? isnt that a step back then 1 foward to where u started ?

That’s pretty much what balance is, you adjust accordingly. While i think it’s something they should have tested a little more strenuously, they did the right thing by reverting some of the changes. Balance is a back and forth dance. Sometimes you gotta go back to move forward

Bhawb.7408:

Think of it this way; League of Legends has an estimated 12 million people online every day. It has been out for over 3 years, has a very active international competitive scene with people that literally do nothing but play LoL as their job. And yet with so much money in their game, so much time, and so many people playing, nearly every week there are at least small tweaks to balance.

I ment it as a joke because in the 3 (well 4) years League existed, the way the matchmaking sets up teams is so broken that Vanilla WoW could have been considered balanced in comparison because setting up a low diamond player with 2 silver, a copper and you in gold is just as broken as ret bomb, rogue tea instagibbing mages just to get instaggibed by every melee in a 600+ range or shadow troll priest battry being able to supply mana to 30+ people while shielding them better than dis priest specs.

Such things are trully broken, as you said a few builds being stronger than others is something that in general happens, lets just hope that a-net only leaves the stronger builds in that are easy to counter not if class does rotation x (*cough ele 34q52tqt6q345insertheretotherrandomkittenq34tg245terg245t245), you cannot even kill them with a freaking siege shot.

i stand by my original post i just played 5 tourneys and to be honest it was completly one sided so yes the ballence is horrible off
if a assasin can take 3 at once and kille em all in 1 minute (necro me warr and a ranger)yea the ballance is seriosly off

There are what, a whole couple hundred people online doing tournaments at any given time? Not exactly a lot to work with from an MMR point of view.

And LoL current matching system is pretty consistent. At most, you will be facing people one “rank” away. So diamond will at worst be placed into high platinum, bronze will never face higher than silver, etc. They have even split team queueing, solo/duo, and ranked/normals with different MMRs.

Nay of the Ether.8913:

That’s pretty much what balance is, you adjust accordingly. While i think it’s something they should have tested a little more strenuously, they did the right thing by reverting some of the changes. Balance is a back and forth dance. Sometimes you gotta go back to move forward[/quote]

it wasnt adjusted ,it was butchered..

The thing with LoL is there are what, 40+ classes to balance? So it’s a good and bad thing that the meta can shift a lot, people can find a lot of OP combos but same as in GW1 at least people have more options to find a new counter meta. Here we’re kind of locked in without a lot of permutations.

I agree that Necro is a little above warrior and they’re both the bottom end classes right now, either the simultaneous survival + damage gods need to be nerfed down to the median or the low liers need to be boosted up to actually achieve balance.

I think if every class were like Necro or Guardian (in terms of relative survivability _ damage level) the game would be a lot more balanced.

That said I don’t really care too much about a balanced game but the idea of an attrition class just doesn’t work unless you’re one of the ‘burst classes’ like thief, mes, ele, right now…which is just…yeah…

Bhawb.7408:

And LoL current matching system is pretty consistent. At most, you will be facing people one “rank” away. So diamond will at worst be placed into high platinum, bronze will never face higher than silver, etc. They have even split team queueing, solo/duo, and ranked/normals with different MMRs.

The example was from my last nights rank up game in gold, so unless it was a duo que that didnt wanna say anything, yeah no the matchmaking is still broken as all hell (but thats most elo based matchmaking setups that take into account win streaks and wanna get people into games as fast as possible cough dota 2). It did go from 3/5 games not being even to 1/5, but my point still stands, as long as GW2 profession balance isnt as broken as that, you can play it no matter your profession if the build you are using makes sense.

Otaking.4675:

The thing with LoL is there are what, 40+ classes to balance? So it’s a good and bad thing that the meta can shift a lot, people can find a lot of OP combos but same as in GW1 at least people have more options to find a new counter meta. Here we’re kind of locked in without a lot of permutations.

There are 112 champions and around 150 items, all with individual balancing.

Realistically speaking though, GW2 has similar diversity. In the highest level of play for both, there is very little deviation. Team comps are very similar, strategies are pretty common, there isn’t tons of variety. And in lower play, things are much more wide open, just like in GW2 you can do pretty much whatever you want in lower tournies and win with good team play.

@Anchoku, one example is statistically insignificant, LoL’s system is pretty smooth. Spectating is a pretty easy way to see it, deviation is very small.

alex.7364:

i stand by my original post i just played 5 tourneys and to be honest it was completly one sided so yes the ballence is horrible off
if a assasin can take 3 at once and kille em all in 1 minute (necro me warr and a ranger)yea the ballance is seriosly off

I’ve beaten two thieves at once on my necro before. If a thief can burst you out on a necro in a few seconds you seriously need to revise your build. We don’t have as many stun breakers as other classes, death shroud is like our invulnerability skill. You have to wisely use death shroud to soak up damage that you can’t tank and that takes experience. Necros are imo the hardest class to learn for pvp. We don’t have insane burst like other classes, but our overall dps is higher over the course of a long fight. Add in the fact that we are extremely tanky if built correctly, and you can win almost any fight as long as you survive their initial burst.

Also, instead of just complaining you might want to ask for advice and post your build that you were using. There are a lot of extremely experienced necros that enjoy helping other players on these forums. Unless you were just kittening for the sake of it, which is pointless.

Ever see a thread on the forums with someone asking how to deal with fighting Necros? Me neither. Some people think we get targeted in combat because we are a threat. The reality is we are easy to focus down. Our utilities are on huge cooldowns and staff marks are on long cooldowns (4&5). We don’t have a dangerous mechanic that must be avoided at all cost, unlike some classes which have devastating abilities that you do not want to get caught in. Except for maybe WoS, and Staff 4.

Actually yes, I believe it has been posted at least on the Mesmer forums.

Bhawb.7408:

Actually yes, I believe it has been posted at least on the Mesmer forums.

That thread was complaining about condition damage in general, which mesmers have a weakness against. Funny thing is, engineers do condition damage better, so when they mention necromancers specifically, I kinda laugh.

Kravick.4906:

Bhawb.7408:

Actually yes, I believe it has been posted at least on the Mesmer forums.

That thread was complaining about condition damage in general, which mesmers have a weakness against. Funny thing is, engineers do condition damage better, so when they mention necromancers specifically, I kinda laugh.

There is many differences between condi Engis and condi Necros and both have their advantages and disadvantages. If you’re talking about raw condi DPS on a single stationary target yes, condi Engis do more DPS. But Engis also have to fight at closer ranges and are not as strong in terms of AoE condi application so they should be stronger single target. Condi Engi’s also generally lack CC and have no boon removal. There are a ton of differences between the classes honestly, I could go on and on.

But at the end of the day a good condi Necro or Engi would both give a glass cannon shatter Mesmer a good fight. And this is coming from a person who mains Necro and Mes and played a bit of Engi as well.

To the OP: If you like Necro playstyle I suggest you stick with it. It is obvious you have just started to play the class. Research builds and spectate top players. Contrary to popular opinion Necros are not UP. Top teams do runs Necros.

Skyro.3108:

Kravick.4906:

Bhawb.7408:

Actually yes, I believe it has been posted at least on the Mesmer forums.

That thread was complaining about condition damage in general, which mesmers have a weakness against. Funny thing is, engineers do condition damage better, so when they mention necromancers specifically, I kinda laugh.

There is many differences between condi Engis and condi Necros and both have their advantages and disadvantages. If you’re talking about raw condi DPS on a single stationary target yes, condi Engis do more DPS. But Engis also have to fight at closer ranges and are not as strong in terms of AoE condi application so they should be stronger single target. Condi Engi’s also generally lack CC and have no boon removal. There are a ton of differences between the classes honestly, I could go on and on.

But at the end of the day a good condi Necro or Engi would both give a glass cannon shatter Mesmer a good fight. And this is coming from a person who mains Necro and Mes and played a bit of Engi as well.

To the OP: If you like Necro playstyle I suggest you stick with it. It is obvious you have just started to play the class. Research builds and spectate top players. Contrary to popular opinion Necros are not UP. Top teams do runs Necros.

Engis lack CC? What the hell are frost grenades and their net turrets from supply crate then? They have short cd aoe blinds and frost, aoe poison, and to say they have no aoe condition is disingenuous given that they apply aoe poison, aoe bleeding, and proc burning from their grenades.

The only time necro has higher aoe condi is with an epidemic, which is on cd and can be cleansed unlike the engineer who can maintain sustained aoe application.

And engi grenades even in condi spec far out damage mark damage in the direct damage portion. They also have elixir S and their shields for way better survival, and their healing skills are MUCH better than ours.

The only thing necromancers have that engis don’t is boon removal, at the cost of a utility slot on 30+ sec cd’s.