Guild Wars 2

Priorities. Always priorities. There is no class favoritism, just priorities.

I am having a blast on my new mesmer.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Fixes do happen, the mesmer clone bug took anet about 8 hours to fix..

It was fixed 24 hours and 29 minutes after it was reported. I’m not quite sure how you make 8 hours out of that, but I know… for some people, even basic math is kinda hard. I feel sorry for those people.

And it was a bug that rendered Mesmers completely useless against anything that has access to stealth on a relatively low cooldown.

Saturn.6591:

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Fixes do happen, the mesmer clone bug took anet about 8 hours to fix..

It was fixed 24 hours and 29 minutes after it was reported. I’m not quite sure how you make 8 hours out of that, but I know… for some people, even basic math is kinda hard. I feel sorry for those people.

And it was a bug that rendered Mesmers completely useless against anything that has access to stealth on a realtively low cooldown.

so it was turned into a necromancer?

Lightsbane.9012:

So it was turned into a necromancer?

roflol

Lightsbane.9012:

Saturn.6591:

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Fixes do happen, the mesmer clone bug took anet about 8 hours to fix..

It was fixed 24 hours and 29 minutes after it was reported. I’m not quite sure how you make 8 hours out of that, but I know… for some people, even basic math is kinda hard. I feel sorry for those people.

And it was a bug that rendered Mesmers completely useless against anything that has access to stealth on a realtively low cooldown.

so it was turned into a necromancer?

Golden! Sad part its kinda true..

Saturn.6591:

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Fixes do happen, the mesmer clone bug took anet about 8 hours to fix..

It was fixed 24 hours and 29 minutes after it was reported. I’m not quite sure how you make 8 hours out of that, but I know… for some people, even basic math is kinda hard. I feel sorry for those people.

And it was a bug that rendered Mesmers completely useless against anything that has access to stealth on a realtively low cooldown.

oh sorry i got the odd couple of hours it took fixing wrong ^^
lol ..

oh and since we are on adhomonim insults..

you look like an asuran mated with a skritt.

Lightsbane.9012:

so it was turned into a necromancer?

No, not at all. Or is there any bug that Necros have that makes it impossible for them to fight 3 out of 8 character classes if they are using some of their most popular builds?

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

you look like an asuran mated with a skritt.

Cool; that means I’m hyper-intelligent and I become even more intelligent when I’m together with others. Also, I look kinda cool and I get to have a tail on top of that! =)

As this (failed) insult wasn’t called for, I’m tempted to say something about the results of loving Grawls and Dredges. But I won’t do that. After all, I’m way too cool and intelligent for such things.

;P

Touche..
Tou…che

“No, not at all. Or is there any bug that Necros have that makes it impossible for them to fight 3 out of 8 character classes if they are using some of their most popular builds?”

yes, our professions mechanic. DS + overflow+traitwork+no iterrupt.
there are so many things broken with it.

Saturn.6591:

Lightsbane.9012:

so it was turned into a necromancer?

No, not at all. Or is there any bug that Necros have that makes it impossible for them to fight 3 out of 8 character classes if they are using some of their most popular builds?

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

you look like an asuran mated with a skritt.

Cool; that means I’m hyper-intelligent and I become even more intelligent when I’m together with others. Also, I look kinda cool and I get to have a tail on top of that! =)

As this (failed) insult wasn’t called for, I’m tempted to say something about the results of loving Grawls and Dredges. But I won’t do that. After all, I’m way too cool and intelligent for such things.

;P

Yeah, the deathshroud lockout of all heals and utilities has been broken for over 6 months… this is our class mechanic and has resulted in so many deaths for me its not even funny anymore.

But you know, Necro is not a priority class in Arena-nets eyes… this is not the first time they’ve hot-fixed other class issues and left us to rot.

Remember downed state health, where we had 1/3 of the health of every other class in downed state – that went on for months also.

It’s not like we don’t want Mesmer issues to be fixed, heck, Mesmer is one of my main classes – i love playing the little dude… but people are so over this favouritism game that A-net plays… it’s really wearing thin.

Yay for us… hugs and kittens.

“Necromancer
• Summon Blood Shark—Minion: Summon a blood shark to attack foes with crippling crunches.
• Charge: Command your blood shark to charge a foe.
• Underwater replacement for Summon Flesh Golem.

• Empowered Suffering—Corruption: Torment yourself for every boon on your foe. Bleed and torment your foe for every boon they have.”

/walks away silently/

Well, I know that Necros have many bugs. Mesmers have many bugs as well. But despite those bugs, Necros can still win against any build of any class as long as they play better than their opponent. With the “illusions die on stealth”-bug, Mesmers could NEVER win against those three classes, even if the Mesmer was a much better player than his opponent. The only way to win would have been if the opponent was a really, really, REALLY terrible player.

Saturn.6591:

With the “illusions die on stealth”-bug, Mesmers could NEVER win against those three classes, even if the Mesmer was a much better player than his opponent.

Just like your previous point, this is arbitrary. Not fact.

Sandra Martino.3870:

Saturn.6591:

With the “illusions die on stealth”-bug, Mesmers could NEVER win against those three classes, even if the Mesmer was a much better player than his opponent.

Just like your previous point, this is arbitrary. Not fact.

Which previous point?

Also, may I ask you how a Mesmer is supposed to win against any halfway decent opponent without being able to use illusions? Arbitrary… yeah, right. There’s a reason for why this caused such an outcry in the Mesmer-community.

Let me quote someone else:

selan.8354:

phantasms are inbound in our weapons, clones are part of our weapons and skills
for shatterer u have ip yes, but u still need the clones to do decent shatterdmg
we only have 1 weapon that doesnt require a target so killing a thief is only possible with illusions
thief,ranger,engi and mes can all stealth
every stealth removed all clones
we had no dmg left vs stealthy characters as phantasms died right away and cooldown is long
so without that ai we got no dmg
this was a gamebreaking bug
we couldnt dodge it, nor avoid it

Saturn.6591:

Necros can still win against any build of any class as long as they play better than their opponent.

Got any videos where you beat a Very Good Perma-stun Warrior or a Very Good & Mobile & Stealthy Mesmer or Thief?

And, talk about a mesmer bug that will never get fixed (because it benefits them too much), what about the Mesmer remaining Invisible while Weapon-Based/Created Illusions continue to attack! Players should not be able to make Weapon-Based Attacks AND Remain Invisible!

Yeah some bugs have been around since pre-launch…
Transforming into Lich or Plague form destroys your minions.

That’s actually a bug.
They added the description as a “temporary fix” and never actually made them work properly. :P

Me going into Plague/Lich-form & destroying minions bother me far less than when a Mesmer Moa-morphs me & destroys my minions. Same BUG just far more annoying.

^You can dodge Moa easily. You can not dodge your opponent’s stealth. You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster (in this case you’d probably often use Golem anyway?). You can not chose that your opponent doesn’t use stealth.

And about that very good perma-stun warrior… if he’s very good and you’re very good as well or maybe even extremely good, you can still win. If you are a very good Mesmer and your opponent a decent Thief, he will maybe not win but he also won’t lose, because you can’t do much against him with this bug. Thus it’s good that they hotfixed it.

And I’m all for Necros getting their bugs fixed, just like I’m all for Mesmers getting their countless remaining bugs fixed. However, this one bug WAS indeed very gamebreaking and couldn’t be avoided or worked around at all.

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily.

Not if you are out of dodges, immobilized, or fighting several opponents at once (so you miss the animation). So it remains TOTALLY UNFAIR that Moa morph destroys ALL Minions.

Saturn.6591:

You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster

Obviously, but sadly, once you enable Plague underwater you cannot disable plague (even if you are MM) – so you have to have it. You can try not to use it, but you will inevitably hit it accidentally. Thus the Elite is a total waste for Minion Masters.

Saturn.6591:

And about that very good perma-stun warrior… if he’s very good and you’re very good as well or maybe even extremely good, you can still win.

LOL @ “can” – I know. If you can keep your distance, but they are faster & can close gaps instantly, so I was still asking how to beat them. This was just a pep talk.

Saturn.6591:

If you are a very good Mesmer and your opponent a decent Thief, he will maybe not win but he also won’t lose, because you can’t do much against him with this bug. Thus it’s good that they hotfixed it.

No idea what this is about (what bug?) – this being the Necro forum, I was asking about a Necro beating a very good Mesmer or Thief. Thieves & Mesmers are the most OP professions in the game – because both have tons of invisibility – so I would expect it to be a draw if they were of equal ability.

Saturn.6591:

And I’m all for Necros getting their bugs fixed, just like I’m all for Mesmers getting their countless remaining bugs fixed. However, this one bug WAS indeed very gamebreaking and couldn’t be avoided or worked around at all.

Yeah, and that bug means Anet should have rethought/reworked mesmers rather than let them get away with such a major bug. And it could have been avoided because mesmers do not really need invisibility (since you have clones) – in fact no profession needs invisibility, except Thieves, jet far too many have access to it.

If you want to talk about a MAJOR BUG – Necros are the ONLY profession with a weapon that is all but USELESS against Downed Players – the Staff!! 4/5 of its attacks do NOT work against Downed Players. It has been like that since the dawn of time & Anet seems perfectly content in crippling necros, so I expect it will never be fixed.

Noble.3647:

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily.

Not if you are out of dodges, immobilized, or fighting several opponents at once (so you miss the animation). So it remains TOTALLY UNFAIR that Moa morph destroys ALL Minions.

Isn’t the Necro also the profession with the least Evade/Vigor/Aegis?

Phadde.7362:

Noble.3647:

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily.

Not if you are out of dodges, immobilized, or fighting several opponents at once (so you miss the animation). So it remains TOTALLY UNFAIR that Moa morph destroys ALL Minions.

Isn’t the Necro also the profession with the least Evade/Vigor/Aegis?

If 0 means the least, then yes.

Noble.3647:

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily.

Not if you are out of dodges, immobilized, or fighting several opponents at once (so you miss the animation). So it remains TOTALLY UNFAIR that Moa morph destroys ALL Minions.

I’ve never seen someone dodge (using the dodge-button) while he’s out of endurance. Stop claiming that’s like, necro-only. About immobilized; Necros have some of the best condi-removal out there. Also, immobilize has the same effect on everyone. And if you fight several opponents at once, well yeah… that happens. To everyone else as well. There were people complaining that they got hit by a killshot they couldn’t see due to having several opponents. So it’s again not something that has anything to do with this. Last but not least, Moa morph has a long cooldown. Thieves can enter stealth every 4 seconds. Oh and mind you, I’m not saying that they shouldn’t fix the bug that all minions die if you get moa-d. I’m just saying that it’s not nearly as bad as all illusions dying on stealth. Almost no Mesmer even uses Moa, because it’s quite bad. And it has a long cooldown. But most Thieves will use Stealth, and that multiple times in a fight. Also, that stealth can NOT be dodged unless they CnD on you… which isn’t the only way to gain stealth for them. Moa CAN be dodged (provided you see the animation), as it needs to be casted on you. A Mesmer can not cast Moa on someone else to Moa you, and he can also not Moa you without a target.

Noble.3647:

Saturn.6591:

You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster

Obviously, but sadly, once you enable Plague underwater you cannot disable plague (even if you are MM) – so you have to have it. You can try not to use it, but you will inevitably hit it accidentally. Thus the Elite is a total waste for Minion Masters.

And how is that relevant? Yes, it’s bad that you can’t use your elite underwater as a Minion Master. But you can chose to not use it. You have no control over your opponent going into stealth. And if you use your elite “on accident”, it’s cerainly your own fault. Also, it has a long cooldown, so you won’t accidentally destroy your minions very frequently. Stealth can be accessed every 4 seconds.

Noble.3647:

Saturn.6591:

And about that very good perma-stun warrior… if he’s very good and you’re very good as well or maybe even extremely good, you can still win.

LOL @ “can” – I know. If you can keep your distance, but they are faster & can close gaps instantly, so I was still asking how to beat them. This was just a pep talk.

Yes, you can. If you are better than them. The “how” is something you should ask the experienced Necro roamers here. It’s not easy, but it’s not impossible. However, it is impossible to beat someone you can not damage, which was the case with that bug.

Noble.3647:

Saturn.6591:

If you are a very good Mesmer and your opponent a decent Thief, he will maybe not win but he also won’t lose, because you can’t do much against him with this bug. Thus it’s good that they hotfixed it.

No idea what this is about (what bug?) – this being the Necro forum, I was asking about a Necro beating a very good Mesmer or Thief. Thieves & Mesmers are the most OP professions in the game – because both have tons of invisibility – so I would expect it to be a draw if they were of equal ability.

Hold on; so you are saying that you’re posting in a topic without even knowing what it is about? The bug was, that all illusions would die when their target is stealthed when they are supposed to attack. Which means that Mesmers weren’t really able to do damage to Thieves anymore. If you want tips on how to beat a Mesmer with a Necro, ask the experts here. It’s certainly possible, since Necros (at least condition-necros) are the closest thing to a hardcounter for Mesmers.

Noble.3647:

Saturn.6591:

And I’m all for Necros getting their bugs fixed, just like I’m all for Mesmers getting their countless remaining bugs fixed. However, this one bug WAS indeed very gamebreaking and couldn’t be avoided or worked around at all.

Yeah, and that bug means Anet should have rethought/reworked mesmers rather than let them get away with such a major bug. And it could have been avoided because mesmers do not really need invisibility (since you have clones) – in fact no profession needs invisibility, except Thieves, jet far too many have access to it.

What the heck are you talking about? This part makes no sense to me, sorry. I think you’ve missunderstood something, or I dunno.

Noble.3647:

If you want to talk about a MAJOR BUG – Necros are the ONLY profession with a weapon that is all but USELESS against Downed Players – the Staff!! 4/5 of its attacks do NOT work against Downed Players. It has been like that since the dawn of time & Anet seems perfectly content in crippling necros, so I expect it will never be fixed.

Wow, not this silly argument again. That’s not a bug. It’s the way the weapon is designed. You can still auto-attack a downed body, and you can still stomp. Also, you can still switch your weaponset to another one. That’s what those options are for, you know. Nobody said that you can do everything equally good with every weapon.

Phadde.7362:

Isn’t the Necro also the profession with the least Evade/Vigor/Aegis?

Yes; but even Necros can dodge.

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily. You can not dodge your opponent’s stealth. You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster (in this case you’d probably often use Golem anyway?). You can not chose that your opponent doesn’t use stealth.

Most moa morphing mesmers do so from stealth, so wildy dodging when your opponent enters stealth is in no way a counter to moa morph.

Monoman.2068:

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily. You can not dodge your opponent’s stealth. You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster (in this case you’d probably often use Golem anyway?). You can not chose that your opponent doesn’t use stealth.

Most moa morphing mesmers do so from stealth, so wildy dodging when your opponent enters stealth is in no way a counter to moa morph.

And yet that’s how people are expected to dodge backstabs from thieves.
Dodging randomly and hoping to get lucky has /always/ been how you deal with getting hit from stealth in gw2

EnRohbi.2187:

Monoman.2068:

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily. You can not dodge your opponent’s stealth. You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster (in this case you’d probably often use Golem anyway?). You can not chose that your opponent doesn’t use stealth.

Most moa morphing mesmers do so from stealth, so wildy dodging when your opponent enters stealth is in no way a counter to moa morph.

And yet that’s how people are expected to dodge backstabs from thieves.
Dodging randomly and hoping to get lucky has /always/ been how you deal with getting hit from stealth in gw2

Difference being that you can bet on the fact that the thief will most likely be coming in close to deal damage and can put up the minimal resistance necessary so he doesn’t leave the exchange unscathed. This is in no way defending stealth, but at least there is some risk associated with the most dangerous things a thief will do in stealth.

Now putting your opponent out of commission for 10 seconds from range while stealthed when there are a myriad of different things mesmers can do from range or while stealthed is complete and utter bs.

Monoman.2068:

EnRohbi.2187:

Monoman.2068:

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily. You can not dodge your opponent’s stealth. You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster (in this case you’d probably often use Golem anyway?). You can not chose that your opponent doesn’t use stealth.

Most moa morphing mesmers do so from stealth, so wildy dodging when your opponent enters stealth is in no way a counter to moa morph.

And yet that’s how people are expected to dodge backstabs from thieves.
Dodging randomly and hoping to get lucky has /always/ been how you deal with getting hit from stealth in gw2

Difference being that you can bet on the fact that the thief will most likely be coming in close to deal damage and can put up the minimal resistance necessary so he doesn’t leave the exchange unscathed. This is in no way defending stealth, but at least there is some risk associated with the most dangerous things a thief will do in stealth.

Now putting your opponent out of commission for 10 seconds from range while stealthed when there are a myriad of different things mesmers can do from range is complete and utter bs.

If Moa morph would even be half as awesome as you claim it to be, you would see many more people running around with it. I’m playing this game for over a year now, and I think I’ve been turned into a Moa by a player maybe uhm… 1-2 times in total. I was Moa’d more often by NPC’s than by players. Moa is almost completely useless against anyone who isn’t a MM-Necro. Also, Moa morph has a long cooldown, while backstabs are coming every 5 seconds or so; so comparing them with eachother is kinda silly.

the mesmers have ton of bugs that are in the game since launch too. and one of the bugs affects our dmg greatly, we cant even hit unbuilt oil and some bugs affect our defensive skills.
i really dont get why u guys are reacting this jealous over a bug fix that was simply gamebreaking.
look at it this way if there was a bug that makes necros loos all life force when immobilized or so, then this would be gamebreaking for the necro and would need bugfixing in a hotfix too.
i play necro and am aware of the very annoying bugs and yes i really want them to be fixed asap. but they arent gamebreaking and to be honest no where nnear as bad as most of the mesmer bugs we have.
we have a ton of los bugs that put our main dmg dealers phantasms into full cooldown, we cant hit unbuilt oil, blink doesnt work on bridges and fails often on uneven terrain, fails on stairs, fails downhills, ileap is broken since launch and fails 60% of the time, phase retreat makes u stuck or can portal u under the map or into terrain, shatters fail, traits are bugged, clones dont show buffsiwarden is so broken that it doesnt attack most of the time and therfor makes an entire weapon useless, etc. so we got bugs too.

and btw most of us mesmers hate moa and want it replaced.im one of them moa is a stupid elite on a massive cooldown that barely works as u gotta get close to the target and if target moves or dodges it in full cooldown.
btw u can choose to use ai, we are forced to use ai!id rather have the necro aoe skills so i can be more than a veilbot….also the reason why i made a necro because in tired of beinu useless in wvw.

A better comparison would be the deathshroud lockout bug, honestly. That bug is probably just as gamebreaking as illusion death on target stealth (though I’m sure Mesmers would disagree), and likewise has to deal with the class mechanic of the profession. Why a bigger effort has not been made to fix the lockout is truly baffling when the mesmers can get their seriously game-breaking bug fixed in a matter of hours and we’ve been waiting for several months.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

A better comparison would be the deathshroud lockout bug, honestly. That bug is probably just as gamebreaking as illusion death on target stealth (though I’m sure Mesmers would disagree), and likewise has to deal with the class mechanic of the profession. Why a bigger effort has not been made to fix the lockout is truly baffling when the mesmers can get their seriously game-breaking bug fixed in a matter of hours and we’ve been waiting for several months.

Well, I agree that it’s a bad bug and it should get fixed asap. But I don’t agree that it’s as bad as the illusions-die-on-stealth bug was. You can still fight and use your skills and damage your opponents. You maybe can’t for a second or two (I don’t really remember right now how long it is). With the bug that was hotfixed for Mesmers, they could not damage certain opponents at all. Maybe tickle them a bit, but not damage. Because without illusions, Mesmers aren’t really dangerous. Unless the opponent is a terrible player, of course.

This back and forth tit for tat is kinda sad.

Step back and see the real issue is anet needs to fix kitten on ALL classes.

Ya’ll must be bored as I am replying to this…

Bedlam.3562:

Step back and see the real issue is anet needs to fix kitten on ALL classes.

^
And the man said the word.

Maybe necro doesn’t get much love, but when greater marks + staff mastery got bugged with a patch, pretty much game breaking bug, they DID hot fix it within 24hrs or so.

Just saying

Saturn.6591:

Sandra Martino.3870:

Saturn.6591:

With the “illusions die on stealth”-bug, Mesmers could NEVER win against those three classes, even if the Mesmer was a much better player than his opponent.

Just like your previous point, this is arbitrary. Not fact.

Which previous point?

Also, may I ask you how a Mesmer is supposed to win against any halfway decent opponent without being able to use illusions? Arbitrary… yeah, right. There’s a reason for why this caused such an outcry in the Mesmer-community.

Let me quote someone else:

selan.8354:

phantasms are inbound in our weapons, clones are part of our weapons and skills
for shatterer u have ip yes, but u still need the clones to do decent shatterdmg
we only have 1 weapon that doesnt require a target so killing a thief is only possible with illusions
thief,ranger,engi and mes can all stealth
every stealth removed all clones
we had no dmg left vs stealthy characters as phantasms died right away and cooldown is long
so without that ai we got no dmg
this was a gamebreaking bug
we couldnt dodge it, nor avoid it

So when mesmers outcry they get heard and their bugs are fixed in 24hours. While necro`s are outcrying for various different bugs allready and nothing happens exept any changes that turn out even more negative for them.

Yep, totally fair.

Sandra Martino.3870:

So when mesmers outcry they get heard and their bugs are fixed in 24hours. While necro`s are outcrying for various different bugs allready and nothing happens exept any changes that turn out even more negative for them.

Yep, totally fair.

Are you even reading what people write? Mesmer have bugs too. And just recently someone made a thread in the Mesmer-forums claiming that Mesmers have the worst bugs. Dunno if that’s true, though. But yeah, Mesmers have many bugs too. Not only Necros. Most classes have bugs I guess. From time to time, Anet breaks something that is REALLY bad… not just a “normal” bug. This was such a thing. And now stop q.q-ing; seriously.

Oh, and you might want to also read the post above yours. That wasn’t THAT bad of a bug either, since you —>could<-— chose to not use a staff (Mesmers rely on illusions no matter which weapons they use). But it was indeed hotfixed as well. So stop being overly jealous and whiny just because a really bad bug got hotfixed. Instead, you should be happy that Anet actually cares enough to hotfix really bad bugs. Next time it might be Necros again. Will I Q.Q then? Nope, I won’t. I’ll be glad. And for the less game-breaking (but still bad of course) bugs, they are fixing them whenever they can or feel like it. That’s the same for all classes. If you don’t believe me, someone recently made a topic listing all (or most) of the bugs that Mesmers have; some of them being there for ages already. And it doesn’t include those that were there for long, but got fixed eventually (like iZerker for example).

Saturn.6591:

Are you even reading what people write?

Yes i do and i read that most of your comments are biased towards mesmers and tend to make fun of necromancer problems. In the necromancer subforums. Also ad hominem.

On top of that you say mesmers rely on illusions and got hit hard by that bug, while that is true necromancers suffer not only from the marks on downed state (even if intended) but also other gamebreaking bugs like 1s lockout from DS shift and you say just switch to another weapon.

Sandra Martino.3870:

Saturn.6591:

Are you even reading what people write?

Yes i do and i read that most of your comments are biased towards mesmers and tend to make fun of necromancer problems. In the necromancer subforums. Also ad hominem.

On top of that you say mesmers rely on illusions and got hit hard by that bug, while that is true necromancers suffer not only from the marks on downed state (even if intended) but also other gamebreaking bugs like 1s lockout from DS shift and you say just switch to another weapon.

1. Show me where I’m making fun of Necromancer problems.
2. You on the other hand fail to understand that you CAN switch weapons, and that you CAN still use DS and your utilities and whatever (although with one second delay). A Mesmer can NOT decide to not use illusions. See the difference?
3. You still talk like Mesmers wouldn’t have a kittenload of other bugs as well; many of them at least as “gamebreaking” as the ones you keep listing for Necromancers, whith one of those not even being a bug but part of the weapon-design.

Got any videos where you beat a Very Good Perma-stun Warrior or a Very Good & Mobile & Stealthy Mesmer or Thief?

actually necro wins 1v1 against an equally skilled warrior aslong as you have plague off cooldown

Saturn.6591:

Sandra Martino.3870:

Saturn.6591:

Are you even reading what people write?

Yes i do and i read that most of your comments are biased towards mesmers and tend to make fun of necromancer problems. In the necromancer subforums. Also ad hominem.

On top of that you say mesmers rely on illusions and got hit hard by that bug, while that is true necromancers suffer not only from the marks on downed state (even if intended) but also other gamebreaking bugs like 1s lockout from DS shift and you say just switch to another weapon.

1. Show me where I’m making fun of Necromancer problems.
2. You on the other hand fail to understand that you CAN switch weapons, and that you CAN still use DS and your utilities and whatever (although with one second delay). A Mesmer can NOT decide to not use illusions. See the difference?
3. You still talk like Mesmers wouldn’t have a kittenload of other bugs as well; many of them at least as “gamebreaking” as the ones you keep listing for Necromancers, whith one of those not even being a bug but part of the weapon-design.

In almost every post you disagree with the fact that necromancers are lacking in general, thats what i call making fun of.

A mesmer can walk, blink, stealth, dodge (heck why not fly as well?) away from a thief and attack him in order to summon clones again. Yes its annoying, but is it really unplayable?

No, those bugs are not making necromancers unplayable but so doesnt make the mesmer clone bug the class unplayable. They get unfair treatment for getting it fixed after 24h while we are still waiting.

If you cant see this is rational, i dont know what say… but we already know what your reaction will be right? Yes ad hominem, like you deserve.

Saturn.6591:

Monoman.2068:

EnRohbi.2187:

Monoman.2068:

Saturn.6591:

^You can dodge Moa easily. You can not dodge your opponent’s stealth. You can chose to not use Plague or Lich form if you play a Minionmaster (in this case you’d probably often use Golem anyway?). You can not chose that your opponent doesn’t use stealth.

Most moa morphing mesmers do so from stealth, so wildy dodging when your opponent enters stealth is in no way a counter to moa morph.

And yet that’s how people are expected to dodge backstabs from thieves.
Dodging randomly and hoping to get lucky has /always/ been how you deal with getting hit from stealth in gw2

Difference being that you can bet on the fact that the thief will most likely be coming in close to deal damage and can put up the minimal resistance necessary so he doesn’t leave the exchange unscathed. This is in no way defending stealth, but at least there is some risk associated with the most dangerous things a thief will do in stealth.

Now putting your opponent out of commission for 10 seconds from range while stealthed when there are a myriad of different things mesmers can do from range is complete and utter bs.

If Moa morph would even be half as awesome as you claim it to be, you would see many more people running around with it. I’m playing this game for over a year now, and I think I’ve been turned into a Moa by a player maybe uhm… 1-2 times in total. I was Moa’d more often by NPC’s than by players. Moa is almost completely useless against anyone who isn’t a MM-Necro. Also, Moa morph has a long cooldown, while backstabs are coming every 5 seconds or so; so comparing them with eachother is kinda silly.

You brought up backstabbing, I just mentioned stealth and moa morphing. Besides I’m in no way saying moa morph is OP in the grand scheme of things but for the small exchanges, it’s cheesy. I am not in the mindset that being able to make someone useless for 10 seconds is ok just because it’s single target, has a large CD, and a bait animation (which can be masked).

That’s a slippery slope where large amounts of cheese is ok as long as it can’t affect many people. Edit: But this isn’t the place so I’ll drop it.

Sandra Martino.3870:

Yes its annoying, but is it really unplayable?

Yes. Because Thieves can stealth more frequently and faster than Mesmers can summon phantasms. And on-clone-death builds also were screwed because they rely on the Thief killing the clones or them being overwritten while the Thief is near them. But if they die every few seconds no matter where the Thief is (and afaik also without triggering those traits), this way of damaging also doesn’t work anymore. Thus there was no way to deal any reasonable damage to opponents with frequent stealth anymore. Yes, I would call that unplayable.

And I would say that the amount of unfixed bugs is higher for Mesmers than it is for Necros.

And yes, Necros are lacking in some things. But so are Mesmers. Necros have strenghts. Mesmers too. And it just so happens that condition Necros are as close to a hardcounter as something can be to most Mesmer builds, as condition application is one of Necro’s strenghts and condition cleansing is one of Mesmer’s weaknesses.

And you can say “ad hominem” another thousand times, I don’t care. It seems to be your only argument anyway (aside from Mesmers being (almost) able to fly). Maybe you should try playing a Mesmer without using illusions. Then you’d probably notice how unplayable that is. Mesmers use illusions for (almost) everything, but especially for damage. If you remove all active illusions every 4 seconds… oh well. But of course; not being able to damage downed people with staff-marks is much worse!

Saturn, I don’t think you’re quite understanding. We aren’t upset at all that the bug got fixed. Far from it, we’re happy that it did! What we’re upset about is that we have also had a very crippling bug with our own class mechanic that has gone unaddressed for 8 months.

What we’re upset about is the fact ANet has not put forth the same effort in getting a vital bug fixed for our class as they have for Mesmers. I understand that, since our bug is not reliably repeatable, it would take more time, but 6 months since dev confirmation is way too long to be justifiable.

I understand that, since our bug is not reliably repeatable

it actually is, it always happens when you let deathshroud run out of lifeforce and dont deactivate it manually

Sandra Martino.3870:

Saturn.6591:

Are you even reading what people write?

Yes i do and i read that most of your comments are biased towards mesmers and tend to make fun of necromancer problems. In the necromancer subforums. Also ad hominem.

On top of that you say mesmers rely on illusions and got hit hard by that bug, while that is true necromancers suffer not only from the marks on downed state (even if intended) but also other gamebreaking bugs like 1s lockout from DS shift and you say just switch to another weapon.

erm i play a power necro and i am very well aware of the bugs.
the ds bug is very annoying and did get me killed many times.
but there is a way u can avoid being killed if u are careful when getting out of ds. we got a similar bug with blink that fails a lot of times and just moves u either into the middle of the zerg instead of past i or only one step to the side.

but the ds bug is not as terrible as the illusion bug was. mesmers have a phantasm in every weapon and lots of clones (clones and phantasms are illusions) and they are our main dmg dealers.
u need them for all shatter (4 abilities f1-f4)
u need them for condi
u need them for aoe dmg
u need them for defense
u need them for healing
u need them for condi cleanse
u need them for clone death
u need them for most of our traits

so here comes a thief, stealthes and poof all illusions gone…so we looose not just dmg, we lose almost everything. so this is gamebreaking.

the ds bug would be gamebreaking if for example u get hit by an immobilize and you get put out of ds.

im not saying the necro bugs are not bad. they are and they are annoying, but being mad that anet fixes a gamebreaking bug for the mesmers, is not ok.
i want them to fix them all for all classes, but i also want them to hot fix gamebreaking classbugs. even if the warrior gets affected by a nasty gamebreaking bug, i expect anet to fix it fast in a hot fix.

Sandra Martino.3870:

A mesmer can walk, blink, stealth, dodge (heck why not fly as well?) away from a thief and attack him in order to summon clones again. Yes its annoying, but is it really unplayable?

No, those bugs are not making necromancers unplayable but so doesnt make the mesmer clone bug the class unplayable. They get unfair treatment for getting it fixed after 24h while we are still waiting.

ok, i think u really dont understand much about mesmers. it’s ok u might havent played the class, so ill try to explain why this bug makes me unable to kill a thief without illusions and why losing all of your illusions =mesmer with 0 viability.
believe me i wish i could use a non ai build, but the only one we had was glamour which we all know was nerfed into the ground.

here is all weapon skills that are affected:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Berserker 20 second cooldown
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phase_Retreat its a clone(important for shattering)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ether_Clone clone
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Swordsman 20 second cooldown
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Warden (has been bugged for a very long time now and doesnt deal dmg 90% of the time)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Duelist phantasm again
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Mage

every single weapon is affected and this is the main dmg dealer of those weapons
utilities:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Decoy 40 second cooldown
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mirror_Images 45 second cooldown
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Defender 30 second cooldown
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Disenchanter 20 second cooldown

now not having illusions affects all shatter skills
so f1-f4 = useless unless traited with this:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Persona

if not a shatter build then u wont have this so all the traits that are about shattering are useless. so here are all traits that are about illusions and shatters:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Imbued_Diversion
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Invigoration
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Masterful_Reflection
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Confusing_Cry
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Precise_Wrack
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shattered_Strength
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Retribution
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vengeful_Images
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Healing
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vigorous_Revelation
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Persisting_Images
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Compounding_Celerity
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shattered_Conditions
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Restorative_Illusions
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rending_Shatter
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crippling_Dissipation
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shattered_Concentration
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharper_Images
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Confusing_Combatants
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Deceptive_Evasion
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Defense

so every single time someone stealthed non of these are giving u anything. sooo how is that not gamebreaking. all of the above traits require either a shatter or illusions and u u cant shatter without illusions unless the trait is activated i mentioned above.

look at the cooldowns of phantasms and certain utilities. a thief was simply unkillable due to this bug!