Guild Wars 2

Perma retaliation that heals. This skill needs to go.

It’s a real shame that it has the best active ability in this game to date attached to it. They finally introduce a supportive hex back into the game and its attached to one of the most overpowered passives to have ever existed. ANet, please go.

Its not perma though, unless you never activate it…

Swagg.9236:

Perma retaliation that heals. This skill needs to go.

It’s a real shame that it has the best active ability in this game to date attached to it. They finally introduce a supportive hex back into the game and its attached to one of the most overpowered passives to have ever existed. ANet, please go.

No i think the skill is fine if they tweak the numbers right. The damage of the passive immo should be much lower (after all its a healing slot not a utility slot…) and the heal could maybe have bettter scaling with healing power (If the numbers of the ingame code are the final one ofc), then i think the skill would be ok. And the active is most likely dodgeble/blockeble etc., so you have a counterplay for the damage and the heal (this part is not so good but maybe nessesary for balance).

No, it’s not fine, it is terribad.

A skill that doesn’t heal should be a utility not a heal. Then we can have a debate about whether its good or bad and at what numbers.

How about we plain swap it with signet of the locust and make locust a pbaoe like Plagues passive is so:

Heal – Movementspeed (which helps necro positioning thus no need for burst heals) passive and PBAOE heal active (heals in case of a 1vx) for a medium amount which does weapon (attack) damage to everyone – lets face it, Signet of the Locust already heals like a racial/mesmer/thief heal if you hit 5 targets, why plain not make it one, but less kitten y to use

Signet1 – Condi pull passive which also gives you 1 second retal every second if you got more than 3 condis on you, active cleanse+ stun break

Signet2 – Life force passive generation + active lifesteal

Signet3 – On hit lifesteal + Revive active

Signet4 – Spite… it needs no changes and is the only non ultra situational/one part being plain stronger than other.

Not gonna happen but it would make more sense.

nekretaal.6485:

No, it’s not fine, it is terribad.

A skill that doesn’t heal should be a utility not a heal. Then we can have a debate about whether its good or bad and at what numbers.

MMhh but it heals and assuming there is no icd (and those numbers are the final ones ) the active life leach can, with ease, get you over 5k healing assuming of course your opponant doesnt dodge/block etc (but i hope it works similar to dagger 2, meaning you get the heal even if the opponet blcoks/avoids the damage). And that is, i think, comparible to cc and other heals. So it heals and is ok as a healing slot. Well the only problem, i guess, it is not a reliable heal as it also depends on your opponent, but i think thats a fair trade off.

Muchacho.2390:

nekretaal.6485:

No, it’s not fine, it is terribad.

A skill that doesn’t heal should be a utility not a heal. Then we can have a debate about whether its good or bad and at what numbers.

MMhh but it heals and assuming there is no icd (and those numbers are the final ones ) the active life leach can, with ease, get you over 5k healing assuming of course your opponant doesnt dodge/block etc (but i hope it works similar to dagger 2, meaning you get the heal even if the opponet blcoks/avoids the damage). And that is, i think, comparible to cc and other heals. So it heals and is ok as a healing slot. Well the only problem, i guess, it is not a reliable heal as it also depends on your opponent, but i think thats a fair trade off.

Signet active+Life Siphon with 15 into blood can equate to about 7.5k damage and 6k healing in Soldiers amulet over 3 seconds, leaving 2 more seconds of dagger swings. IDK, doesn’t sound that bad tbh.

The skill cant be tweaked right.

1. The heal values will be balanced by theory crafted numbers like what the above poster is doing and thus will always be terribad/underwhelming in a live setting.

2. The life steal traits exist.

That they exist means that the signet will be balanced based on them existing, meaning that you will be trading offence or defense + 30 trait points, + 5 traits just to get a usable heal.

3. Low damage weapon users (like axe necros). will constantly cry for nerfs of the skill regardless of whether the skill is any good. Meanwhile, the whole game is based on big hits from big weapons.

If it has no icd on procs on the active then I will be proving its good.

IF the active doesnt have a ICD then i can see it being VERY strong. Though that would require the “Mark” landing on the target and them not instantly going stealth, going Invul, CCing or dodging…

Thats ALOT of wasys it can easily be countered…

Spoj The Second.7680:

If it has no icd on procs on the active then I will be proving its good.

Surely there will be. I would bet at least 1 second ICD for active and passive.

Imagine hitting a commander with that. Each incidental hit that goes on them will sack an extra 600 HP from him? From any player source?

It is just ripe for abuse in certain situations, that will make it get reduced to the point where it will be craptastic in all the other normal situations.

I think the best is to wait and then see if it is good or not, be testing it. But regardless i like the idea of that healing skills, so i hope its good…

Rennoko.5731:

Spoj The Second.7680:

If it has no icd on procs on the active then I will be proving its good.

Surely there will be. I would bet at least 1 second ICD for active and passive.

Imagine hitting a commander with that. Each incidental hit that goes on them will sack an extra 600 HP from him? From any player source?

It is just ripe for abuse in certain situations, that will make it get reduced to the point where it will be craptastic in all the other normal situations.

Then the Commander should start playing defensively when he sees this buff pop up on him.

Actually, that’s true for everyone. This debuff lands on you, you had better keep a strong mind to defense or you WILL be punished for it.

I actually think that’s pretty good design. I still don’t agree with the lack of a garunteed heal, but the numbers on this skill look pretty good to me, assuming the current tooltip is accurate.

I don’t think there will be an ICD on the signet at all. If there was, it would be by far the weakest heal in the game, only letting the necro heal about 2800 if they hit their target every second on the second.

So… is this new skill even confirmed. I have browsed through this whole post but i can find a link to anything concrete. Forgive me if i missed it as this forum IS 5 pages long and the links posted were all quite long as well.

If its confirmed im excited, I play MM and i can just imagine the combo possibilities. If you mark a target then have 5 pets just go to town… or golem charge… this will be nerffed to the point of pointless.

IF and its a big “IF” they ever fix/buff the blood tree the passive would add some nice sustain and an interesting play style.

Pretty much confirmed, since the tooltip codes are in the game.

Copy and paste the following into the game, if that isn’t “confirmed” enough for you, then I’m not sure what to say. :P

[&Bw1VAAA=] ( [&Bw9VAAA=] ) [&BzdVAAA=] [&BwJVAAA=] [&B/ZUAAA=] [&B6BUAAA=] [&B5tUAAA=] [&B5hUAAA=] [&BxJVAAA=]

If its 1 second icd then its completely pathetic and it would make no sense. You may aswell change the active to kittens grant life steal instead of 5 second duration.

Yeah outside of niche builds I don’t think this will see much use if it has a ICD; unless the devs reverse themselves and finally allow HP healing while in DS.

If that were to happen even the current level of life-leech before adding this new skill would become much more worthwhile, as well as allow allies to actually help us when getting focused by being able to heal us some.

Thanks for that, ill have to try it at home. BTW ICDs are stated in tool tips now so its likely that if it doesn’t say then there is no ICD. it WILL be nerffed but atm… who knows

well i think that i can be nice vs fast hitting builds, but will get destroyed from burst and condi

So, 1 sec icd on passive and active, around 300 health siphoned on passive aswell as active. Also the heal works with a stack like mechanic and applies 25 stacks on enemy and has 35 sec recharge. While it heals for around 4k initially this just seems like utter rubbish compared to every other new healing skill…
They just put icd on icd on icd. I had high hopes but man this was sooooo disappointing.

yeah i am disappointed… It is really trash, I guess i will stick to cc.

I think the safest assumption is the passive heal will activate per skill, not per hit.

Bellamy.9860:

So, 1 sec icd on passive and active, around 300 health siphoned on active. 25 stacks on enemy and 35 sec cd recharge. While it heals for around 4k initially this just seems like utter rubbish compared to every other new healing skill…

I just find it…. boring.

Here were the numbers (no idea the traits, but he was zerker)
Active siphon damage 286
Active siphon heal 422
Initial self heal 4035
Passive heal 340
Cooldown 1 second on passive

You really have no way to use more than 5 charges yourself on any target, so there goes any desire to use dagger or axe to try and get more healing/siphon off a target.

So what happens is this. You sit around with the signet on doing a marginal retal damage, with a somehwhat better than regen figure on you, until you need the heal, which can then AT BEST get you 4000 + 5*422 or about 6k healing.

Solo roaming I am not sold.

However…..

This is a much needed buff to group play. 5 man teams can mark the opponent necro (ironically) and just go to town on him. He will take upwards of 20*300 or 6000 bonus damage, in addition to giving your party a 2k heal.

Also range 1200, but the cast time is so long (at 1.25 seconds) so it will not be easy to land.

I was excited about this skill until I heard it was ‘when you get hit’ rather than ‘when you hit an enemy’, you siphon health. I think it needs changing.

Xernth.8561:

I think the safest assumption is the passive heal will activate per skill, not per hit.

No assuming, they just previewed it. It is on hit, with a 1 second internal cooldown.

Rennoko.5731:

Xernth.8561:

I think the safest assumption is the passive heal will activate per skill, not per hit.

No assuming, they just previewed it. It is on hit, with a 1 second internal cooldown.

Thanks.

It seems pretty fair overall; I think it will have use for very coordinated teams that put the offense on the active to good use and are good at water field healing while not being the goto heal for necros (which will still be CC).

Rennoko.5731:

Bellamy.9860:

So, 1 sec icd on passive and active, around 300 health siphoned on active. 25 stacks on enemy and 35 sec cd recharge. While it heals for around 4k initially this just seems like utter rubbish compared to every other new healing skill…

I just find it…. boring.

Here were the numbers (no idea the traits, but he was zerker)
Active siphon damage 286
Active siphon heal 422
Initial self heal 4035
Passive heal 340
Cooldown 1 second on passive

You really have no way to use more than 5 charges yourself on any target, so there goes any desire to use dagger or axe to try and get more healing/siphon off a target.

So what happens is this. You sit around with the signet on doing a marginal retal damage, with a somehwhat better than regen figure on you, until you need the heal, which can then AT BEST get you 4000 + 5*422 or about 6k healing.

Solo roaming I am not sold.

However…..

This is a much needed buff to group play. 5 man teams can mark the opponent necro (ironically) and just go to town on him. He will take upwards of 20*300 or 6000 bonus damage, in addition to giving your party a 2k heal.

Also range 1200, but the cast time is so long (at 1.25 seconds) so it will not be easy to land.

Er, wait. So the in game ‘cut and paste’ tooltip isn’t accurate. This skill actually does now give a ‘normal’ big heal? That would make it much more interesting, except…

…did you say that the cooldown is now 35 seconds instead of 20? That is a dealbreaker for me.

Oh, it also now has a 1.25s cast time? kitten , did all other healing spells they previewed turn out to be garbage?

This heal is kittened.

No, Engineer, Guardian, Warrior, and even Thief heals are pretty darn good. Warrior skill even converts condition damage to healing.

And there is no ICD on the active. It is simply a 25 hit debuff, with each hit siphoning health. I’m sad that the passive no longer actually siphons health, but it’s still decent damage mitigation.

However, the long kitten cast time and long recharge say “no” to me outside of Stack & Smack. A shame.

Yeah.. This heal is garbage now. I’d rather continue using my Blood fiend than this as a fully specced Life steal MM build. :/ Pitty.

Are you sure about no ICD on active? When he hit the golems with dagger auto the 284 leech only popped up occasionally and not on every hit. Going to check that…

Bellamy.9860:

Are you sure about no ICD on active? When he hit the golems with dagger auto the 284 leech only popped up occasionally and not on every hit. Going to check that…

Pretty sure there’s no ICD on the active, each hit just consumes 1 stack.

Wow, gone from an average heal to a terrible heal.

He said there was a 1 sec cd on the active too, almost 100% certain he specifically said it. Am not happy at all. It sounded cool, and sounded like a good way to survive being focused… there went that. :/

Um yeah… I was excited about the potential for this skill but,

If it has a 35 second cooldown, 1.25 second cast time, and a 1 sec ICD… screw it, that wont be worth using in any PvP situation.

Could still be useful in PvE, which is what we really need help in, but with that long of a cooldown I don’t think it will be something groups really seek.

Well, at least I can looking forward to my Mesmer’s new OP heal.

sadly i cant see myself ever using this skill unless im doing something where i know i wont be getting hit just to utilize the procs for damage. even then itd only be team situations seeing as how i can easily crank out more than 250(guessing this is base since it was 286 with zerker necklace)x5, a total of 1250 dmg, in the 1.25sec cast time it has.

if u really want me to use it anet, remove the kitten icd on both passive and active, lower charges to 15 and do not let allies proc it(so yes no team support) and tweak the values abit(mostly the actives proc dmg id say)

also a thing to note, as someone said above your looking at around a 6k heal assuming u get all 5 of ur hits from the mark. CC has a 5250 base heal and a 724 base for each condition removed not to mention a 10sec lower cd. i know u will also get healed for the 300ish amount whenever you are hit but when ur hp gets low and you need to pop your heal by the time it finally comes off cd you probably going to need to use your heal again that and the whole time its on its long cd you do not benefit from the passive.

Oh god, thank you we will be in S tier! I almost felt usefull.

John was honest about it being bad, so i wont comment on that.

The catch is the “furtunate” bug for signets not working in DS, so they dont need to waste time balancing it.

Just make the passive on outgoing hit instead of incoming hit, then it’ll be good. Even with the ICD. But for sure I’ll never use this signet for the “on use” >_>:

alanis.6094:

Well, at least I can looking forward to my Mesmer’s new OP heal.

I wonder if Necro heal is the only one that getting nerfed. I can see several that needs to be adjusted.

Second part of the preview is up and it definately has a 1sec icd on the active part(at around 58:30 http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/485426386 ).
Ugh… atleast you could argue that our other heals are in no danger of beeing obsolete, since the new heal is like it is…

This is the first time I was PROUD that I use Blood fiend. And that’s sad! Incredibly incredibly disappointed. :/

If it is a spectral heal..

Reapers Medley
Gain x health and x% LF. Resets your DS recharge. Breaks stun,

If its a signet

Reapers Signet
Passive: Increase all LF gain by 100%
Active: Gain heath based on your current LF amount.

^ Lol we already know what the heal is, and prepare to be let down. :S

i still have hope. They can change it soon. They can still doit. Just turn back time. Reset

I thought the heal was okay (before they nerfed into into uselessness) Wasnt to keen on the active – Needed to be self only and buffed.

I desperately hope that they do things to move it back toward what it was before. As it is now, the skill is just flat-out terrible.