Guild Wars 2

Played against a Cond Mesmer and the speed he could apply conditions was amazing, Conditions then invis/blink-rinse and repeat until I was dead :-( hehe
Anyone else come up against this type of Mesmer?
I hear Rangers are also awesome at applying conditions fast …

No class out conditions a Necro with sheer condition application.

But pretty much every class has a condition build of some sort, with varying viability.

The only advantage necro has is the amount of conditions we can apply. Other classes burst condi a lot better in many situations. Necro can burst but its limited by cooldowns and its difficult to get close to max stacks of bleed.

probably 20/20/30 requires you to kill clones to really load you up on conditions. Its decent if people think you can run away from necromancers easy you can definitely run away from a mesmer 20/20/30 build.

with the new runes of perplexity mesmer condi build is stronger now I wouldn’t say its better than a necro condi build pre-runes of perplexity it was a full attrition style and people could ignore you. With runes of perplexity and a little tweaking to the build you can kill people pretty fast.

The big advantage necros have is that our condi builds have 2 or so condition transfers, so at bare minimum we can match whatever the opponent throws at us while neutralizing their damage at the same time. I play a hybrid engineer quite often, and I have to be careful when fighting an opposing condi necro, because I have had long duration burning and all my bleeds thrown back in my face more than enough times to learn my lesson.

That said, I do like how a condi mesmers plays. They have little burst, but the main advantage is that they apply conditions so rapidly that they just power right through cleanse.

Lol what a silly question.

Mesmers are pretty much middle of the line in condis, not as fast as thief/warrior, better spread of them but less reliable then a ele and just as slow application of their condis as necro, they do have the double shatter condi burst (12~17 stacks of confusion for like 10 seconds with possible other crit effects) and attacking them hurts enough (carmor, block, retal), problem is unlike other mesmer specs it has no real way of specialization and thus quite being weaker than other mesmer specs.

Have you guys not seen how fast mesmers can rack up bleeds with phantasms? Much faster bleed stacking than necro’s when done properly.

spoj.9672:

Have you guys not seen how fast mesmers can rack up bleeds with phantasms? Much faster bleed stacking than necro’s when done properly.

Bleed mesmer doesnt have as much strong confusion. If they go for all out phantasam bleeds they are just a kittentier version of a thief (that evade 23/7 with their calt/blossom build), now if you are talking underwater yep i agree 100% (bu those are clones).

You only need 15 in dueling and a pistol or focus for bleeds. And im just guessing but most condi mesmers go 25 in dueling for confusing combatants? I only said phantasms because those are the fast multi hitting clones mesmers have.

If condi mesmers dont take dueling can you direct me to a build they do use. Because the trait options for condi’s seem pretty limited to me.

spoj.9672:

You only need 15 in dueling and a pistol or focus for bleeds. And im just guessing but most condi mesmers go 25 in dueling for confusing combatants? I only said phantasms because those are the fast multi hitting clones mesmers have.

If condi mesmers dont take dueling can you direct me to a build they do use. Because the trait options for condi’s seem pretty limited to me.

just look on the mesmer forums for the blackwater build is popular build. 20/20/30 cripple on clone death, random condition on clone death prismatic undertanding staff recharge etc.

I don’t know what people run with perplexity me and a friend came up with something different to run with those runes. we go 0/30/30/0/10 with perpexity runes and run pistol instead of torch.

I know that if they combine stakitten and the pistol phantasm and get really lucky that they can very quickly put on a lot of conditions, especially if you are standing in staff 5s field, too. Assuming it works out for them, they can apply more damaging conditions than we can in just a few seconds.

But the issue is it requires a bit of luck, a bit of skill, and some longer cooldowns while we can continue more of an onslaught and do it consistently.

Yeah so I was right then. They do all take atleast 15 in dueling. Andele was just disagreeing with me for the sake of disagreeing as usual.

spoj.9672:

Yeah so I was right then. They do all take atleast 15 in dueling. Andele was just disagreeing with me for the sake of disagreeing as usual.

I feel 15 in dueling is a must if you want to at least try to kill someone. I tried no 15 in dueling but its not enough pressure.

oZii.2864:

spoj.9672:

Yeah so I was right then. They do all take atleast 15 in dueling. Andele was just disagreeing with me for the sake of disagreeing as usual.

I feel 15 in dueling is a must if you want to at least try to kill someone. I tried no 15 in dueling but its not enough pressure.

Ok guys then give me a link to a build that has reliable conditions and has same base defensive strengths of a terrormancer.
Yeah thats right you cannot, since mesmers do require a playstyle strength, it also cripples them in how much they can apply, a 15/25/0/0/30 condi mesmer for example will have both the bleed burst and good conditions, but gonna be killed by every random aoe burst.
The (quite popular) 20/20/30 torch using setup gave up most confusion power (till now with perplex runes being ok by old standards) and the bleed application speed for good survivability.
Glamour builds have the glaring flaw of massive cooldowns and massive requirements in situational awareness/positioning.

So no, while you were right on the trait side (what is pretty freaking obvius, its the only reliable source of bleeds after all), application speed is a totally different issue, and if you wanna go with pistol in offhand and staff as your second weapon, i welcome you to be in any fight where not all people are present or a necro/engie/ele is going for aoe.

Mesmer seems to have a tough way to go when it comes to conditions, simply because in order to make your condi’s effective you need to sacrifice a lot of survivability. Oddly, a Mesmer can condi-burst a single target more effectively than a necro can, but the AoE capability simply isn’t there.

I fooled around with a 0/20/0/25/25, Rabid, Sc/P, St build for a bit and it is a killing machine if left unchecked (Duelists Discipline + I-Duelist + combo fields = ridiculous single target condi application). In order to get the damage and keep yourself alive you have to DPS race every fight though. As soon as you get caught with anything significant on CD or miss 1 burst you will die to a competent player with an effective build. It can be really fun though.

Andele.1306:

oZii.2864:

spoj.9672:

Yeah so I was right then. They do all take atleast 15 in dueling. Andele was just disagreeing with me for the sake of disagreeing as usual.

I feel 15 in dueling is a must if you want to at least try to kill someone. I tried no 15 in dueling but its not enough pressure.

Ok guys then give me a link to a build that has reliable conditions and has same base defensive strengths of a terrormancer.
Yeah thats right you cannot, since mesmers do require a playstyle strength, it also cripples them in how much they can apply, a 15/25/0/0/30 condi mesmer for example will have both the bleed burst and good conditions, but gonna be killed by every random aoe burst.
The (quite popular) 20/20/30 torch using setup gave up most confusion power (till now with perplex runes being ok by old standards) and the bleed application speed for good survivability.
Glamour builds have the glaring flaw of massive cooldowns and massive requirements in situational awareness/positioning.

So no, while you were right on the trait side (what is pretty freaking obvius, its the only reliable source of bleeds after all), application speed is a totally different issue, and if you wanna go with pistol in offhand and staff as your second weapon, i welcome you to be in any fight where not all people are present or a necro/engie/ele is going for aoe.

Hmm you seem upset for some reason. Unless I am reading wrong all spoj is saying that you want to go 15 in dueling if you go condi. I agree why would you not go 15 in dueling thats a pretty big dps loss its like not taking barbed precision. That is pretty much all spoj is saying unless I am missing some other spat you two are having.

30 points in chaos will have more defense than a terrormancer do to the fact that you get protection like its going out of style, +50 toughness just because you have a staff, can get -3% damage for each of your illusions in full rabid would put you at around 2.8k armor with pretty much protection on demand. You don’t really need a build link to see that the base defense of a mesmer condi build will be higher than a terrormancer unless you go 30 in DM but most condi mesmers go 30 in chaos because Prismatic understanding is to good to not take in a condi build.

It doesn’t put out the offensive pressure of a necromancer the only way you can come close to necro condi burst pressure is 30 points dueling with pistol and staff confusion stacking 18 stacks in 2 seconds is easy and maintaining 12+ stacks of confusion is pretty easy while you still can have the 2.8k armor and 100% confusion duration along with bleeds. This can kill I would say as fast as a necro if the person presses a button.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Mesmer seems to have a tough way to go when it comes to conditions, simply because in order to make your condi’s effective you need to sacrifice a lot of survivability. Oddly, a Mesmer can condi-burst a single target more effectively than a necro can, but the AoE capability simply isn’t there.

I fooled around with a 0/20/0/25/25, Rabid, Sc/P, St build for a bit and it is a killing machine if left unchecked (Duelists Discipline + I-Duelist + combo fields = ridiculous single target condi application). In order to get the damage and keep yourself alive you have to DPS race every fight though. As soon as you get caught with anything significant on CD or miss 1 burst you will die to a competent player with an effective build. It can be really fun though.

This is pretty much spot on unless you run condi shatter but yea the really odd thing about mesmer condi builds is that you don’t go deep in the condi line if at all. I have been messing around with no staff and going sc/p +sw/torch and its alot more survivability in that set up but giving up staff is rough (I love mesmer staff)

Dont worry about Andele. He has a problem with everything I post.