Guild Wars 2

In our first day of trials :P, we had a great time, and made about 10 attempts. The first video was a bit long, and you only get the game from my view, but it was a fun time.

The Beginning

All-Terror Attempts

Phase 2: Death Becomes Us

Your NA BoC All-Necro Tournament Team is Myrmidian, Kravick, Bas, Bhawb, and Soulgant, Bull Zooker.

Check out the videos and let me know what we can do to improve!

I’m definitely on board for this. Rating be kittened, I want to see what an all necro team can really do in tPvP. I’ve been running a support build for the last 50 games that I like, but I’ll play any role.

Awesome that gives us 4 of 5 ;p

We just need one more who wants to do some fun testing.

I’d combine the Condition Bunker and Support into one, as Shaman gear traited to support will be as tanky as Conditions get, and put in either another Condition damage necro, or have the Powermancer go full burst and then have another power necro that is more towards Cleric gear with wells to keep up.

The real key would be trying it out in game and seeing which combination gave the best ratio of survivability to damage output.

So a sample setup:
1) Powermancer (either berzerker, or vitality “bunker”)
2) Shaman Support
3) Terrormancer
4) Either a Condition damage build (if vitality bunker) or Cleric power necro
5) Soldier MM

A vitality/DS bunker could potentially work in this situation by stacking protection from his own abilities and the wells of the support, and using the fury on DS to offset the generally lower damage. Again I think we won’t know for sure at all until we’ve tried a few different setups (although I think an MM for back point, one support, one bunker, one terror is going to be the best base setup to work with).

Bhawb.7408:

I’d combine the Condition Bunker and Support into one, as Shaman gear traited to support will be as tanky as Conditions get

This is what I have been doing actually, with Well of Blood, Well of Power, Signet of Undeath, and Spectral Wall and at least one other person to support while utilizing the Transfusion and Deathly Invigoration traits, nothing short of a concentrated tactical strike by 3 high burst classes on one target has moved me and the person I’m supporting off a point. It also makes a surprisingly good orb running build.

Spectral wall would be an amazing utility in this situation, with MM’s bringing 2x projectile finishers (3 if on near point, which is where wurm will need to be to properly defend), 2x blast finishers, and everyone else bringing staff with a blast finisher for the Chaos Armor.

Sounds awesome. Pity you people are NA though, I’d love to join. Oh well ( no pun intented, I’m a power&well build :P ), I’m off to slaughter some guardians. Make sure to record that thing!

This might not be my place to add to the discussion since I’m not NA and can’t participate, but I want to say a few things:
I don’t think the best group composition is necessarily one where everyone has a different build. Off the top of my head I’d give the team at least 2 if not 3 condition builds.
So far it seems to me that you do the build planing in anticipation of a 5v5 confrontation, then the builds make sense with support, spectral wall and finishers and so on… like a mini zerg. That might happen from time to time, but most of the fights will probably be 1-3vs1-3.

5 bunker MMs… not good on paper, good in a real situation, messes with people’s mind… like mesmer clones.

Nemesis.8593:

5 bunker MMs… not good on paper, good in a real situation, messes with people’s mind… like mesmer clones.

Did this earlier today. Just for fun we had every single person pop out pets, minions, elementals, ranger spirits, warband support, thieves guild, etc. Any kind of NPC possible that would follow you. Made us look way bigger than we actually were. Mostly just scared people away. No one wanted to stay and fight us

We did manage to crash into a smallish group of people taking one of the towers. They had more numbers than we did, but since we weren’t getting any fights we just said eph it and rushed em anyway. Went a lot better than I had expected. I wasn’t even traited to use minions and we managed to wipe them. They didn’t notice us coming up behind them though, so we had the surprise factor which probably helped a lot. Multiple golem charges through the middle of them was an amazing thing to see.

Apparently ranger spirits turn into dolphins when under water. I failed to get a screenshot of that it seems.

what’s a terrormancer?

Pure Terror builds suck balls, since they lack many important utility from traits.
But having 3+ Epidemic is epicly scary.
DIVA

Thizz.3970:

what’s a terrormancer?

It’s essentially similar to a condition mancer except they pickup Terror and the 50 percent longer time on fear along with Fear duration runes. It’s a fun and interesting way to play. A really good terror build can control a fight. Their problem is along the lines of they are really bad if you are focused on, but that’s true with a majority of our builds.

flow.6043:

This might not be my place to add to the discussion since I’m not NA and can’t participate, but I want to say a few things:
I don’t think the best group composition is necessarily one where everyone has a different build. Off the top of my head I’d give the team at least 2 if not 3 condition builds.
So far it seems to me that you do the build planing in anticipation of a 5v5 confrontation, then the builds make sense with support, spectral wall and finishers and so on… like a mini zerg. That might happen from time to time, but most of the fights will probably be 1-3vs1-3.

Discussions are not locked into NA or EU :P. I would love to get an EU version of this going, but I would need someone else to spearhead it and get it moving forward. I would be glad to show the recordings and keep it on here, but I can’t set it up.

I think a full MM would be a fun thing to do, but you would really run into issues with Engineer, Trap Ranger groups that specialize in high damage aoe. As for stacking similar types you will be doing that. Condition and Terror builds are very similar along with our support as all three will probably be carrying one or two traits that are the same.

If you run a Terror, Support, Condition, Power, Minions you would have 3 out of 5 carry epidemic or corrupt boon, and all 5 would be carrying signet of undeath :P.

flow.6043:

This might not be my place to add to the discussion since I’m not NA and can’t participate, but I want to say a few things:
I don’t think the best group composition is necessarily one where everyone has a different build. Off the top of my head I’d give the team at least 2 if not 3 condition builds.
So far it seems to me that you do the build planing in anticipation of a 5v5 confrontation, then the builds make sense with support, spectral wall and finishers and so on… like a mini zerg. That might happen from time to time, but most of the fights will probably be 1-3vs1-3.

In general tPvP that happens often, yes, but every pairing of the different builds should work out with each other, and the Soldier MM is generally going to be the one missing out on team fights from guarding back point.

And with what Bas said, I actually think Terror builds will find safety in an all Necro setup because of the presence of very high control, and even more threats (if you fight an entire team of people that can wipe you, who do you focus?).

Also, and I was surprised this wasn’t said, but I’d be interested to see how it would work out when it is possible to have up to 4 people on one team with Signet of Undeath, that effectively means one signet could be popped every 45 seconds.

Re full MMs, that really depends on who gets the engagement first, it is also why I suggest Soldier MMs, since it is significantly harder to bring one down. All you would need to do is realize that there exists that AoE threat, and make them one of the main targets, this team setup would have more than enough CC to shut down at least one player. The need for a full MM is defending home point, since Flesh Wurm is already easily accessed, and the easiest way to get back to home point, and full MMs are arguably one of the best 1v1-2 builds in the game, so at the very least they keep home point from being neutralized while the much slower rest of the team comes to help.

I’d be down to jump in on this (NA).

I’ve run just about all of the different Necro builds except MM (I hate AI stuff).

There are some really interesting dynamics in play when stacking necros. I haven’t tested a lot of them, and this exercise could be good for that.

Things I’d like to see (that maybe someone already has tested):
1) Would stacking Fear to max duration on a target, then having a Terror Necro Epidemic be as ridiculous as it sounds?

2) Well Spike, Lich Spike would be really irritating to fight against in theory

3) Even though I hate AI passives in tPvP a huge number of minions roaming around along with summons on runes would probably be really tough to counter for some professons that just lack AoE ability.

4) The current state of tPvP seems to have a lot of conditions. This comp has a ridiculous amount of condition control, and would not only cleanse, but transfer back to opponents frequently feeding more effect to epidemic. Could be interesting to see how fast condi necro’s would melt a team with a lot of burning application.

5) Since Necro is the most versatile class this might be the best 1 profession comp that the game has to offer. It may actually be viable on maps other than Spirit Watch(just not good enough at the orb).

Terror is a must if you are going condition in tpvp. When you play it well you can win 1v2’s no problem. I often feel like a semi bunker with the terror build because I dont waste utility slots with things like epidemic. I use skills which can be defensive and offensive. WoD, WoP and corrupt boon. Possibly WoC instead of WoP depending on opponents. To really get your conditons doing damage you need to cc your opponents and you need to be removing their defensive boons aswell. So It doesnt make sense to take a standard condition build without terror.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

5) Since Necro is the most versatile class this might be the best 1 profession comp that the game has to offer. It may actually be viable on maps other than Spirit Watch(just not good enough at the orb).

Ive never failed in capping the orb so far with the terror build. Even when being focused by multiple theives.

spoj.9672:

To really get your conditons doing damage you need to cc your opponents and you need to be removing their defensive boons aswell. So It doesnt make sense to take a standard condition build without terror.

I know terror is totally baws, the cc of fear still works without it though. It’s a nice damage boost but I wouldn’t say it doesn’t make sense not to have it.

spoj.9672:

Terror is a must if you are going condition in tpvp. When you play it well you can win 1v2’s no problem. I often feel like a semi bunker with the terror build because I dont waste utility slots with things like epidemic.

How does having terror make epidemic a waste?

Well it looks like we have 5 willing players, anyone else interested? I have jury duty so partaking in extended conversations may take a long time haha. Even so, if you are an EU player and want to take part let me know!

For those who are up for the attempts is everyone free today around 7pm PST? After the podcast recording Bhawb and I usually do a BoC presents, but this would be fun!

spoj.9672:

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

5) Since Necro is the most versatile class this might be the best 1 profession comp that the game has to offer. It may actually be viable on maps other than Spirit Watch(just not good enough at the orb).

Ive never failed in capping the orb so far with the terror build. Even when being focused by multiple theives.

If you succeed in the commune, then a lot of necro builds have enough sustain to brute force their way to the point with it, but against a good team having the Necro do anything with the orb on purpose is not really great.

First of all, you have no reflect, no block and no means of getting it from teammates, so the only way that you should be able to get it is if A) your team burns a bunch of CD’s just so you can finish the commune or you have already wiped all of the opponents at the altar.

Supposing that you have picked the orb up, your mobility is terrible, you probably have only 1 stun break (and maybe none), you have 0 access to vigor, you do not have an invulnerability (unless you rune for it).

It is not to say that you can’t run the orb as a necro (I have successfully done this many times myself), but rather that other professions have so many advantages in that specific role that it makes a full Necro team not viable for that particular map where it might potentially be viable on others.

It really is a credit to the balance of Necro that this could even be considered. What other profession could you possibly field a diverse and functional team with 5 of them? Most teams with 5 of the same profession would be forced to run gimmicky, but with Necro we have the luxury of being able to create character builds 5 different ways without being completely redundant. We would really lack the ability to apply boons to eachother in a meaningful way, but aside from that there isn’t much that an all necro team cannot do.

Bas.7406:

Well it looks like we have 5 willing players, anyone else interested? I have jury duty so partaking in extended conversations may take a long time haha. Even so, if you are an EU player and want to take part let me know!

For those who are up for the attempts is everyone free today around 7pm PST? After the podcast recording Bhawb and I usually do a BoC presents, but this would be fun!

BoC presents all Necro tPvP

As for Spirit watch, I think it would come down to not worrying nearly as much about carrying the orb as the standard group might. Not to say that we can’t try to carry it, but that it will probably come secondary to capping and holding points (maybe have the MM run points while the team keeps them all locked up mid). Basically we would play the anti-meta, instead of controlling and running the orb, we’d just stop the team from being able to effectively run the orb, and then maybe pick it up and run with it when we get larger scale wipes on the enemies.

@Bas I am fine with 7 PM PST today. I am not sure about the others though.

Even if we can only get a few people (at least 3 just from what we are looking at now), that would let us try out a small version of it.

I think everyone will be online. I think only Myrmidian is the only one I am not sure will be on. Kravick is almost always on when I am online. We will try and get multiple recordings of the same fights. I will then piece them all together and link it here for some feedback.

I would absolutely love to be a part of this if you guys need an extra condition bunker. This is an awesome idea. Good luck guys!

Bas.7406:

For those who are up for the attempts is everyone free today around 7pm PST? After the podcast recording Bhawb and I usually do a BoC presents, but this would be fun!

I’ll be on.

7 PST is kinda late for me during the week (I am in EST and work early in the am). As it happens I will be on tonight. You probably already have a server in mind for voice, but if not we can use the Xen of Onslaught TS3 server.

flow.6043:

How does having terror make epidemic a waste?

Terror doesnt make epidemic a waste. Epidemic is a waste of a utility slot in spvp.

spoj.9672:

flow.6043:

How does having terror make epidemic a waste?

Terror doesnt make epidemic a waste. Epidemic is a waste of a utility slot in spvp

You don’t always fight 1v1 in spvp.

Kravick.4906:

Bas.7406:

For those who are up for the attempts is everyone free today around 7pm PST? After the podcast recording Bhawb and I usually do a BoC presents, but this would be fun!

I’ll be on.

Did you guys find enough necros yesterday? How was it?

Don’t want to steal any thunder from BoC by getting into too much detail, but we did get 5 Necros on together and made a few runs at it.

It was fun, and opponents had a good laugh seeing 5 Necros coming at them. Even the ones we beat thought is was funny.

flow.6043:

Did you guys find enough necros yesterday? How was it?

We did. It really was a lot of fun. I really want to do it again. Theres always next week. Looking forward to it.

How long does it usually take Bas to edit and put up videos?

We had a great time, and made about 10 attempts. The first video was a bit long, and you only get the game from my view, but it was a fun time.

The Beginning

and

Full Terror Team

Spirit Watch is the tournament map on rotation and so presented a litany of Necro issues, so it took us a bit of time to get down not just an attack, but a playstyle that worked at least a bit.

We also made two attempts at running a full terror team. It failed miserably :P.

I would go into more detail, but I need to get to work, and I will simply comment after you guys watch it.

I will also put a copy of the videos at the top.

Kravick.4906:

flow.6043:

Did you guys find enough necros yesterday? How was it?

We did. It really was a lot of fun. I really want to do it again. Theres always next week. Looking forward to it.

How long does it usually take Bas to edit and put up videos?

I am on the west coast so I do have to sleep :P.

It takes me about an hour to edit and split and another 2 hours to upload depending on length of the video.

I would love to do something sooner than Next week, but as of last night. Thursday works, though depending on schedule we could do something earlier in the week if everyone is on board. We will get together and work something out.

I am trying to figure out if I should just post the videos as we do them or change the top post and add the videos there.

I’d keep changing the top post and just post a note that its been updated.

As for how it went, it went surprisingly well. I don’t know if we’ll be changing the meta to 5 necro teams anytime soon, but with better teamwork, and some more PvP practice for some of us (me), I think we could make some decent runs.

Bhawb.7408:

I’d keep changing the top post and just post a note that its been updated.

As for how it went, it went surprisingly well. I don’t know if we’ll be changing the meta to 5 necro teams anytime soon, but with better teamwork, and some more PvP practice for some of us (me), I think we could make some decent runs.

It takes some really exacting coordination, and I think Spirit Watches setup really helped us monitor and hold in the end. I am a bit eager to try the different maps.

This is pretty sweet. I’d be down to join you folks if you do it again.

I think the biggest problems that we were having were far more towards the side of communication than anything else. When we were coordinated with a solid strategy we completely turned the results on their head (from losing by 300 points to winning by that much). Plus, so many of you were running similar things (signet of undeath, boon corrupting, epidemic) that it makes communication really key (whereas in a standard group, only one or two people would have that, not practically the entire group).

Other than that, I think there will always be room for minor improvements (like I need to practice my wurm teleports, because that really makes travel back to point faster), but overall the setup

I would be interested. My in game name is torqky and im NA

Kudos for giving this a try.

Only watched a few minutes…but were you really using dagger/wh with spectral walk???

You already get plenty of swiftness with the warhorn…so spectral walk is largely wasted.

Because you are using a dagger…spectral grasp would have been a much better option in that utility spot.

Will try to watch rest later, but it would be fun watching all minion master team of necros…Coordinating golem charges and bone minion explosions could produce some good “lols”

We are going to run all MMs later, we just ran into time limits.

SPESHAL.9106:

Kudos for giving this a try.

Only watched a few minutes…but were you really using dagger/wh with spectral walk???

You already get plenty of swiftness with the warhorn…so spectral walk is largely wasted.

Because you are using a dagger…spectral grasp would have been a much better option in that utility spot.

Will try to watch rest later, but it would be fun watching all minion master team of necros…Coordinating golem charges and bone minion explosions could produce some good “lols”

I did absolutely start off with Spectral walk and then swapped it for grasp later on to much success, I wanted walk due to conversations with Khalifa about escaping a fight, but in the end I needed grasp to bring the combat to me.

If the rest of the team is available we can do a few more matches today around 5pm PST

I would be up for more and 5 pm PST is just as good as any other time.

My guild has WvW reset events starting around 4pm PST on fridays, but TBH, last night was so much fun that I think I can miss one reset event for this. I’ll make myself available.

Bas.7406:

Thizz.3970:

what’s a terrormancer?

It’s essentially similar to a condition mancer except they pickup Terror and the 50 percent longer time on fear along with Fear duration runes. It’s a fun and interesting way to play. A really good terror build can control a fight. Their problem is along the lines of they are really bad if you are focused on, but that’s true with a majority of our builds.

Edit: That’s true with a majority of builds. :P

I’ve always been interested in necros, I’ll go try this build out as soon as I can.

Wasn’t on last night, but whenever you guys see me online I’d be game to do this again. Only caveat is if I already have an organized team running in tourneys, then I can’t bail on them.

I think getting a full MM spec on video should be on the agenda for next run at it. Even though I hate running MM, I think it could make for interesting vids.

Ultimately I think that the balanced approach that we started with probably has the most upside, but I view this as more for fun than serious competition, and watching people poop when 18 minions run at them all at once will be funny.

*30-35 Minions (each person gets 6-7 depending on jagged horror or not).

Bhawb.7408:

*30-35 Minions (each person gets 6-7 depending on jagged horror or not).

I was assuming we would implement some strategy that has a chance to win rather than zerging 5 deep to 1 point

6 minion each x 3 team members = 18

We’re running 5 MMs, I think winning is kind of a secondary point :P