all is vain
Necro OP?
The community tends to think Necros are on the low side of balance, meaning they feel they are underpowered.
I should point out though, that community beliefs aren’t necessarily correct. I have no experience as a Necro, so I’m not in the right position to analyze it. I’ve seen good Necros though.
Virydia – Hearld
Tirydia – Scrapper
Tirydia – Scrapper
(edited by Ayestes.1273)
no. your friend just failed as a mesmer. necros, rangers, warriors, engies are just right imo. shatter mes is probably the most OP build in the game, with d/d ele, BS thief and bunker guard following close behind.
If he lost to you with either shatter mesmer or phantasm mesmer hes terrible and you’re better player. That’s just cold fact. He should nevernevernevernever loose
Chieftain Ninjas – Purie – EU
If he lost to you with either shatter mesmer or phantasm mesmer hes terrible and you’re better player. That’s just cold fact. He should nevernevernevernever loose
I would say necros have fair chance to win mesmers we can try it out if you don’t believe me.
Skinny Kids Are Easy To Kidnap [Van]
Pink Deamon
Pink Deamon
If he lost to you with either shatter mesmer or phantasm mesmer hes terrible and you’re better player. That’s just cold fact. He should nevernevernevernever loose
I would say necros have fair chance to win mesmers we can try it out if you don’t believe me.
Focus pull(U can’t react to it. u can random evade but not react to it) full shatter necro low health. duel lost.
Chieftain Ninjas – Purie – EU
If he lost to you with either shatter mesmer or phantasm mesmer hes terrible and you’re better player. That’s just cold fact. He should nevernevernevernever loose
I would say necros have fair chance to win mesmers we can try it out if you don’t believe me.
Focus pull(U can’t react to it. u can random evade but not react to it) full shatter necro low health. duel lost.
Depends on life force, but i still think necro has a fair chance winning it. You can try to time the fear on mesmer when he leaps.
Skinny Kids Are Easy To Kidnap [Van]
Pink Deamon
Pink Deamon
Not-a-chance for a standard necro to win against an even skilled standard mesmer.
It of course can happen if the mesmer makes a mistake and necro’s a bit lucky, but in general I would say this cannot take place.
In their condi builds, necros have no defensive abilities and their offense is rather teamfight oriented. This makes a shatter or phantasm mesmers, who has good offense/defense coming from weapon sets and even a Time Warp to make the encounter even more biased, rather a hard encounter for the necro.
Leman
(edited by leman.7682)
nope necro is fine they are pretty balanced in my opinion they are strong in some situations and weak in others and this is while keeping player skill in mind.
balance to me is having your cake and not being able to eat it unlike
ele’s having there cake and eating all they want since there capable of too much in just about any situation
And before says my build doesn’t work, when Ele’s get nerfed it will be -Schwahrheit
Necromancer is kind of a funny one, I’m usually pretty good PVPing with one but the Build I’m using ATM is pretty balanced (Power/Con. Damage hybrid based off the Well bomber build), and I usually only have trouble with the occasional Thief and Ranger.
Mesmers don’t have a lot of condition removal (on most “damaging” builds I think anyway) They usually don’t have Arcane thievery, Shattered removal?, Null Field or P. disenchanter. so condition become their main weakness (not saying this is true 100% of the time trust me) and Necros are pretty good with condition especially if you’re specked for them.
“Destroying my minions?, I’ll make more.”
For me necro is ok , its the most balanced class in game with few bugs , other think is that other class are broken.
Which one of necro and mesmer is the best for 1v1:ing people with?
Well still without a doubt mesmer. Most builds that people play with necro are teamfight oriented and are pretty trashy 1v1 against any class or build that is played in tPvP. Im not saying necro cant win 1v1. But specs that I see in tPvP these days necro prolly cant take any of those 1v1 fights.
Ele vs necro hahah cool fight bro.
For me necro is ok , its the most balanced class in game with few bugs , other think is that other class are broken.
As I said well necroes or epidemic necroes are teamfight oriented and shine in teamfights and suck compared to other classes in 1v1.
Name an easy 1v1 expect warrior or engi which nobody plays.
Chieftain Ninjas – Purie – EU
(edited by Purie.9046)
This is hard to say without knowing both your builds, and your experience with playing the game. Whenever I play against a Necromancer as a Mesmer, they seem to go into Death Shroud pretty often, and I play a condition build. When I think about it, I don’t know that I’ve ever been defeated by a Necromancer in 1v1. They are a lot of fun to play against, though, as you get some very dynamic fights.
Also, when I tried playing a Necromancer in sPvP a few weeks ago, I had a very hard time making a build, as their damage always seemed really low. I never really felt like I could defeat anyone on my own. So no, I don’t think Necromancers are overpowered, at all.
80 Ranger | 80 Mesmer | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 40 Engineer
“The learned is happy, nature to explore. The fool is happy, that he knows no more.”
-Alexander Pope
“The learned is happy, nature to explore. The fool is happy, that he knows no more.”
-Alexander Pope
Necros are great at mesmer’s number one weakness… Conditions… That is the biggest thing to keep in mind when you fight against us. Not this mesmer may just have been really bad but necro’s are not OP.
At best, the necro might be able to wear down the mesmer. Necro’s do excel at soaking damage whilst dealing consistent damage.
A few decent dodges from the necro to avoid the mes burst and it could all be the way of the Necro.
All I can say here is, go play a necro. They are the most under appreciated profession in my opinion, even though you see them among many top teams. Necro has incredible 1v1, 2v1 potential. That is not to say that mesmer does not also have strong 1v1 potential, but a good necro knows how to avoid shatter and eat the damage with DS for those he gets pulled into. Even a full zerker well necro played correctly has more survivability than any other glassy prof who don’t have our aoe potential.
A necro played right, whether team fight or solo, is a force to be reckoned with. Not that we don’t have plenty of issues (bugs, traits, ai, build diversity) but we are not as down trodden as this thread paints us to be. If more people took the time to learn and understand them they have the potential to do what ranger and ele did when people learned to play and build them. Terror builds have excellent survivability and a lot of 1v1 potential. I haven’t had a chance to test it against many very skilled ele’s, but still think that terror is one of the more effective counters to a dd bunker.
Visit the necro forums, check out the builds and learn from players who have worked with them. I am no pro but anyone interested in learning necro or setting up a build can PM me or message me in game. I am more than willing to share what I have learned.
Black Avarice
(edited by reedju.5786)
Which one of necro and mesmer is the best for 1v1:ing people with?
Well still without a doubt mesmer. Most builds that people play with necro are teamfight oriented and are pretty trashy 1v1 against any class or build that is played in tPvP. Im not saying necro cant win 1v1. But specs that I see in tPvP these days necro prolly cant take any of those 1v1 fights.
Ele vs necro hahah cool fight bro.
For me necro is ok , its the most balanced class in game with few bugs , other think is that other class are broken.
As I said well necroes or epidemic necroes are teamfight oriented and shine in teamfights and suck compared to other classes in 1v1.
Name an easy 1v1 expect warrior or engi which nobody plays.
Easy 1v1? That all depends on the skill of the player. Most rangers, guardians and thieves can be countered easily by a necro. Ele’s and mesmers are the hardest 1v1 we have, but most other classes are not that intimidating without solid skill behind them.
Black Avarice
I play necro and warrior. Necro seems fine and warrior seems weak to me.
Most 1 v 1 as a necro are hard (engie prob easiest for us). 100b warrior is hard sometimes believe it or not. They can get to you and kill you fairly easily. 1 Whirling blade and 1 eviserate = death more or less.
All other classes have a big 1 v 1 advantage vs most necro builds. The main reason for this is that the necro build is often purely based around team fighting on a point. I am sure there are possible good dualling necro builds (minions when they fix ai) but at present those arent really the most powerful. I mean the signet of undeath isnt going to help you 1 on 1 and niether are wells vs a ranger or something.
This is just a 1 on 1 in open ground. We gain more of an advantage if we are fighting over a point due to our aoe with marks and s/d.
I would say the hardest 1 on 1 is by far a bas venom berserker thief. You should never win that in open ground running a glass cannon power well suffering/well corruption/sig undeath build. Unless you have plaugue available.
Character: Henry rank million/Duke Henry
Necromancer/Casual Warrior
[Team] Best WvW guild of all time. EASILY.
Necromancer/Casual Warrior
[Team] Best WvW guild of all time. EASILY.
I would say that my experience has been that shatter mesmers can have a hard time with tanky condition heavy necro builds on point. I’ve found the carrion amulet well build necros easier to deal with than the rabid amulet necros just because the carrion amulet builds are typically a lot easier to burst down but both can present some serious challenges on points.
Even with null field slotted, burst shatter mesmer just doesn’t have much in the way of condition removal.
Open field is a different matter but conditions are always going to be problematic for mesmers just because of the way the class is designed.
Even a full zerker well necro played correctly has more survivability than any other glassy prof who don’t have our aoe potential.
Sorry but necro has not more survivability than other glassy profs.
Survivability in gw2 is not about who has the highest life pool, but more about hard damage mitigation and escape.
Necro has the highest hp pool of all class but lacks in the mitigation and escape department. All in all, necros’ survivability is not high at all.
Even a full zerker well necro played correctly has more survivability than any other glassy prof who don’t have our aoe potential.
Sorry but necro has not more survivability than other glassy profs.
Survivability in gw2 is not about who has the highest life pool, but more about hard damage mitigation and escape.
Necro has the highest hp pool of all class but lacks in the mitigation and escape department. All in all, necros’ survivability is not high at all.
You have either never faced a good necro or simply have never played a necro. A good necro is a pain to kill and a pain to avoid. We have a pretty easy time regardless of build against, rangers (condition rangers can be trouble if you are dumb enough to stand still), warriors, thieves, and especially guardians (I am the bunker killer, thereisn’t a guardian build out there that can beat a good necro). Engineers, Mesmers, and Ele’s can be the biggest problems.
A good engineer is next to impossible to find, but they are brutal bunkers, and their grenade build is amazing. Mesmers will wipe you out if they get the first hit. If you can catch them, and dodge the shatters, than you win. A mistake though and good bye necro. Ele’s are tough a long fight, but they excel in high mobility hit and run or getting away, Necros excel at the opposite style of play so it makes sense we can fight each other well.
Even a full zerker well necro played correctly has more survivability than any other glassy prof who don’t have our aoe potential.
Sorry but necro has not more survivability than other glassy profs.
Survivability in gw2 is not about who has the highest life pool, but more about hard damage mitigation and escape.
Necro has the highest hp pool of all class but lacks in the mitigation and escape department. All in all, necros’ survivability is not high at all.
They have pretty kitten good mitigation actually. You know it as ‘Death Shroud’.
Pikachoops – Engineer, Fort Aspenwood
They have pretty kitten good mitigation actually. You know it as ‘Death Shroud’.
You mean the thing that starts every game at 0%?
It’s not damage mitigation in the same way as blocks, invulnerability or evasive abilities like blurred frenzy, it’s just (potential) extra health.
You have either never faced a good necro or simply have never played a necro. A good necro is a pain to kill and a pain to avoid. We have a pretty easy time regardless of build against, rangers (condition rangers can be trouble if you are dumb enough to stand still), warriors, thieves, and especially guardians (I am the bunker killer, thereisn’t a guardian build out there that can beat a good necro). Engineers, Mesmers, and Ele’s can be the biggest problems.
A good engineer is next to impossible to find, but they are brutal bunkers, and their grenade build is amazing. Mesmers will wipe you out if they get the first hit. If you can catch them, and dodge the shatters, than you win. A mistake though and good bye necro. Ele’s are tough a long fight, but they excel in high mobility hit and run or getting away, Necros excel at the opposite style of play so it makes sense we can fight each other well.
Actually i play Necro for a team in EU.
Necro is not a pain to avoid, most classes have enough escape capability to just leave and reset the fight.
A high health pool (high natural heath + DS) is useful to survive pressure, not spikes and bursts from the opposite team. In case of a focus, the only thing you can really do is plague or try to run away. Death Shroud will only soak a small part of the heavy damage you take and necro has no hard escape or “ho kitten” button. There is a reason why necros are often primaried, that’s because they don’t have much to survive a focus.
Don’t get me wrong necro is not underpowered, i’m saying it could need one small (yes small) improvement on the mobility departement.
Choops : In my previous post, by “mitigition” i was talking about hard damage mitigation, as block, vigor, teleport, stealth, invul, or hard escape. A second health bar only helps you for few seconds but that’s all.
(edited by Amorlaliance.9156)
I apologize for inferring DS can be used to soak up damage. Running D/D Necro I found DS to be extremely useful for a 976 toughness build, as soaking up a huge chunk of burst without using my actual health was quite useful. Apparently referring to this as ‘damage mitigation’ is incorrect. My bad.
Pikachoops – Engineer, Fort Aspenwood
Necromancers cannot run, they cannot tank. Every other class has a good variety of instanteous mobility. Necro has none.
Necro damage relies on conditions, and other classes have too many condition removals.
50% of the thief’s moveset give free dodges, count the fact that thieves can spam. I’m sorry anet, why are thieves in this game again? They break the balance, and being fragile is pointless if they can’t be hit.
Good necros do not exist. What you see are good players. Good players that somehow manage with the necro’s low variety pool, poor trait line and bonuses, etc.
In my experience its just that mesmers tend to bring very little condition removal to the fight… Makes them easy pickings for a condition necro, and if that mesmer thinks his clones and illusions fool anyone in a 1v1 he is sorely mistaken, very easy to keep track of the real one when you’ve loaded him with conditions.
Other than that, no necros are hardly OP. We cant completely face kitten anyone in a few seconds even with all our cooldowns unless we totally well-bomb them, and few fall for that trick.
Necros are far better in sPvP and tPvP though, compared to WvW where necros tend to be very very subpar with their lack of defensive skills and mobility.
Kinda agree with LezardValeth.
Necro, ranger, thief, warrior, ele, engineer, mesmer, and guardian, are all OP. Or so the community says so. Honestly, I dont see necro as generall OP, just that they excel at surviving (lich form and conditions). Just like thief excel at burst/mobility, guardian excel’s at staying alive, staying alive, ah ah ahyeah.
Ele on the other hand excels at everything but this isn’t the place for that list.
“I’m waiting for the staff to get off their lunch
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
Necro, ranger, thief, warrior, ele, engineer, mesmer, and guardian, are all OP. Or so the community says so. Honestly, I dont see necro as generall OP, just that they excel at surviving (lich form and conditions). Just like thief excel at burst/mobility, guardian excel’s at staying alive, staying alive, ah ah ahyeah.
Ele on the other hand excels at everything but this isn’t the place for that list.
LOLOLOLOL every profession is OP according to people from another profession… HAHAHA
Ending of a 1v1 Fight
“YOU SUCK!”
“But dude I just beat you in a fight.”
“That’s because you play an OP class, play (insert qqers fav class) that takes skill and not a gimmicky face roll class like (Insert class that just won).”
I seriously see that so many times and not just in sPvP people go to other forums and kitten about the OP specs of a class because they just lost in a fight to the class of the forum. This thread (not the Opener) but the person that had the audacity to call a necro OP because he lost. Just proves that…
Its not suprising a necro beat a mesmer 1on1 frequently. Mesmers really struggle with dealing with condition damage.
In fact probably the worst thing you can fight as a memser is a trap ranger.
1on1 matchs are not always good matchups. But a mesmer is probably a little stronger overall than a necro in team games.
But a mesmer 1 vs 1 against a necro, would i think go the necros way more often than not. but if you beat him like 10x in a row, hes probably doing something wrong.
This might sound like heresy but mesmers are not a great 1on1 class.
WArrior vs mes =mes should probably win
thief vs mes= close to 50/50 probably tiny favor in mes.
necro vs mes=favors necro
ranger vs mes =favors ranger big time
ele vs mes=if its at a reasonability high level of play , ele should win the vast majority.
mes vs mes=washout.
guardian vs mes =who cares guardians are bunkers. mes, but over a decent time length.
Engy vs mes= Engy if hes speced right believe it or not. I dont play engy very often and i solo mesmers who are higher rank and good mesmers. (depends alot on engy spec).
I know these forums like to complain about mesmers alot, but the truth is outside of hotjoins and lower ranked players in frees they dont really dominate that much. Its timewarp, and not the mesmer that make trouble.
1on1 power matters alot also. As it allows one to create positional match up issues. this is why rangers and eles are so popular atm, they are very strong at 1on1. And also solid at teamfighting.
My examples are only to illustrate over a reasonable sample size, who would win more than 50%.
(edited by daydream.2938)
Yes necros are OPed. I play wvw a lot and I often kill 7 thieves at the same time all by myself. I chase down eles and kill them even when they are in home waypoint. I have a special ability to see which mesmer clones are fakes so I have no problem killing the real mesmer. I charge head first into a warrior and dagger them to death. I can debuff a zerg of 60 enemies at the same time all by myself. I can res all dead allies on the whole map every 2 minutes. My Flesh Golem is invincible, every time it losses its head it grows back 2 new heads. When I turn on Lich Form every enemy in the map runs away. Plague Form is Chuck Norris.
There are tons of videos on Youtube showing you how this is done. Necro should be nerfed they are ruining the game!
Chipsy Chips(Necromancer) & Char Ashnoble(Thief)
The Order of Dii[Dii]-SBI→Kaineng→TC→JQ
Necro Encyclopedia-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrAjJ1N6hxs
The Order of Dii[Dii]-SBI→Kaineng→TC→JQ
Necro Encyclopedia-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrAjJ1N6hxs
Yes necros are OPed. I play wvw a lot and I often kill 7 thieves at the same time all by myself. I chase down eles and kill them even when they are in home waypoint. I have a special ability to see which mesmer clones are fakes so I have no problem killing the real mesmer. I charge head first into a warrior and dagger them to death. I can debuff a zerg of 60 enemies at the same time all by myself. I can res all dead allies on the whole map every 2 minutes. My Flesh Golem is invincible, every time it losses its head it grows back 2 new heads. When I turn on Lich Form every enemy in the map runs away. Plague Form is Chuck Norris.
There are tons of videos on Youtube showing you how this is done. Necro should be nerfed they are ruining the game!
Great, now we know who to thank when the devs nerf us because you exposed our secrets. Thankfully, you left out the secrets and tactics to mastering deathshroud.
Vile Necromancer||Defender of the Beastgate||Slayer of Moa’s
Yes necros are OPed. I play wvw a lot and I often kill 7 thieves at the same time all by myself. I chase down eles and kill them even when they are in home waypoint. I have a special ability to see which mesmer clones are fakes so I have no problem killing the real mesmer. I charge head first into a warrior and dagger them to death. I can debuff a zerg of 60 enemies at the same time all by myself. I can res all dead allies on the whole map every 2 minutes. My Flesh Golem is invincible, every time it losses its head it grows back 2 new heads. When I turn on Lich Form every enemy in the map runs away. Plague Form is Chuck Norris.
There are tons of videos on Youtube showing you how this is done. Necro should be nerfed they are ruining the game!
Lol, fantastic.
Havok Legion [HL]
Fort Aspenwood
Fort Aspenwood
Mesmer is the class with the lowes conditon remove skills, so a conditon Necromancer is a perfec counter against shatter Mesmer.
It’s not about OP it’s about what counter the Build of the Enemy. A Conditon Necro have a lot of problems with Ranger and Warris but are fine vs Mesmer, Thiefs and Engineers.
So I was playing with my friend the other day. I play as a necro and he plays as a mesmer.
We tried to 1v1 a couple of times and I managed to win every single one.
He claimed this was because the necromancer is OP. I haven’t played as a mesmer, so I would like your opinion on this – is the necro OP? Which one of necro and mesmer is the best for 1v1:ing people with?
a properly played condition build will melt face in the current meta 1v1 because very few builds have enough reliable removal to handle them.
the moment it expands to group v group, though, this gets turned on its head, which is why most go power.
Mesmers in particular are very condition-vulnerable, as their “wholesale removal” in their healing tree requires shatters to connect, which they often do not.
Sure if you are a bunker you’ll probably feel that necros are op, that’s because necro is an anti-bunker class. From an external look btw necros are fine imo…they put high cond pressure and it’s how they’re supposed to work…nothing strange bout this.
Necros are one of the most balanced class’s in the game. The only thing that needs fixing is the no rally/no points thing on killing em.