Guild Wars 2

Shoot a spectral beam at your foe and burn them.
Damage: (3x): 201
Burning: 1 s (328 damage)
Range: 1,200
(Channel, this ability can hit up to three targets caught in the beam.)

Spectral Attunement – Spectral skills have longer durations and grant life force on use.
(This makes the burning last 0.5s longer, and each hit grants 1% lifeforce.)

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

Only 1200 range weapon a Necro has.

Staff #1 doesn’t do too bad damage as power necro.

AoE hits.

Utility attacks (Regen access, Chill, Blast Finisher, Condition Transfer, Fear)

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

Few necro run a dagger/axe build.

Most necro have to use staff because they would then be stuck with out range and without AoE.

Staff also offer chill, poison, conditions transfer and fear, things that a power necro also need. Also number 4 hit really hard on a power necro build.

I did run 1 or 2 weeks without it, but it was a pain to have no range.

Taril.8619:

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

Only 1200 range weapon a Necro has.

Staff #1 doesn’t do too bad damage as power necro.

AoE hits.

Utility attacks (Regen access, Chill, Blast Finisher, Condition Transfer, Fear)

Trident is 1200 range.

Wells are AOE.

Staff #1 does horrible damage, because it never hits unless your enemy is standing still. (which is never.)

Utility attacks, those are conditions! :< And Axe/X has that, much better for Power.

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

because it’s our all around best weapon.

Dredlord.8076:

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

because it’s our all around best weapon.

Not really, I could argue that axe is the best weapon.

Daecollo.9578:

Taril.8619:

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

Only 1200 range weapon a Necro has.

Staff #1 doesn’t do too bad damage as power necro.

AoE hits.

Utility attacks (Regen access, Chill, Blast Finisher, Condition Transfer, Fear)

Wells are AOE.
Staff #1 does horrible damage, because it never hits unless your enemy is standing still. (which is never.)
Utility attacks, those are conditions! :< And Axe/X has that, much better for Power.

Well are on a long cooldown, and if not traited, you can’t cast them at range.

I don’t think anyone said it was good (projectil speed is too slow), but at least when it land, it can hit for 1-2k and can hit multiple enemy.

I still think Axe is lack luster in WvW/PvP, because number 1 is weak, and #2 never seems to hit for a full duration. That my personal opinion. And 600 range isn’t 1200.

Kardiamond.6952:

Daecollo.9578:

Taril.8619:

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

Only 1200 range weapon a Necro has.

Staff #1 doesn’t do too bad damage as power necro.

AoE hits.

Utility attacks (Regen access, Chill, Blast Finisher, Condition Transfer, Fear)

Wells are AOE.
Staff #1 does horrible damage, because it never hits unless your enemy is standing still. (which is never.)
Utility attacks, those are conditions! :< And Axe/X has that, much better for Power.

Well are on a long cooldown, and if not traited, you can’t cast them at range.

I don’t think anyone said it was good (projectil speed is too slow), but at least when it land, it can hit for 1-2k and can hit multiple enemy.

I still think Axe is lack luster in WvW/PvP, because number 1 is weak, and #2 never seems to hit for a full duration. That my personal opinion. And 600 range isn’t 1200.

Axe #1 is weak? Maybe in 1v1, in TPVP its Amazing.

Axe/Focus are GREATLY underestimated in TPVP. (Constant Vulnerability/Buff Removal.)

Also the ability to spread all that vulnerability and chill via epidemic.

Daecollo.9578:

Dredlord.8076:

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

because it’s our all around best weapon.

Not really, I could argue that axe is the best weapon.

you can argue whatever the kitten you want but kittening about the necro staff just makes you look like you picked up the necro yesterday after watching a “bursting video”.

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

Daecollo.9578:

Taril.8619:

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

Only 1200 range weapon a Necro has.

Staff #1 doesn’t do too bad damage as power necro.

AoE hits.

Utility attacks (Regen access, Chill, Blast Finisher, Condition Transfer, Fear)

Wells are AOE.
Staff #1 does horrible damage, because it never hits unless your enemy is standing still. (which is never.)
Utility attacks, those are conditions! :< And Axe/X has that, much better for Power.

Well are on a long cooldown, and if not traited, you can’t cast them at range.

I don’t think anyone said it was good (projectil speed is too slow), but at least when it land, it can hit for 1-2k and can hit multiple enemy.

I still think Axe is lack luster in WvW/PvP, because number 1 is weak, and #2 never seems to hit for a full duration. That my personal opinion. And 600 range isn’t 1200.

Axe #1 is weak? Maybe in 1v1, in TPVP its Amazing.

Axe/Focus are GREATLY underestimated in TPVP.

What is so great about Axe #1 that make it amazing in TPVP?

You can auto attack for 10 second? doing 1k dps and maybe stacking 20 vulnerability?

I can do the same with my engineer grenade auto attack, hit for 2-3k dps, and stack 25 vulnerability from 1500 range. All this AoE.

WHERE IS YOUR GOD NOW!!! :P

Trident is underwater (try chasing someone on land especially someone with good mobility) with an Axe, it’s not going to happen, (Though I tend to use Focus/Spiteful talisman) 1200 Chill hell yes.

Wells are good AoE damage yes (2 of them anyway), but like someone said unless you trait them (and not all power Necros use Wells) they won’t do the trick and I believe they become 600-900 range.

Think of Staff like Thief Short bow rather then being an extra set of “weapons skills” it’s more like a second utility bar.

Daecollo.9578:

Trident is 1200 range.

Underwater weapons tend to not be usable on land.

Wells are AOE.

Wells are also utility skills not weapon sets (For example WoS + WoC + Staff #2, #3 #4 #2 = Nice AoE damage with utility and 2 blast finisher combos), Wells have long cooldown, Wells can only be used at range with a trait (Only up to 900 range still)

Staff #1 does horrible damage, because it never hits unless your enemy is standing still. (which is never.)

Can still do damage vs zergs in WvW (Usually one of the main times a 1200 range weapon becomes necessary) and PvE things tend to not move a great deal…

Utility attacks, those are conditions! :< And Axe/X has that, much better for Power.

Chill and Fear may be conditions, but since they don’t rely on Condition Damage (Rather they use Condition Duration which most power builds get 30% of due to Spite trait line) AoE Regen is nice for anyone, regardless of spec and Condition Transfer is very good for survival (Dead power necro = Useless power necro) not to mention it’s a hard hitting direct AoE attack.

Axe is pretty bad for a lot of things, it’s #1 lacks damage (Though is easier to pull off than Dagger #1 in a few scenarios) and it’s #3 deals barely more damage than a single #1 hit so most of it’s actual damage comes from the Retaliation (Which can’t be relied on in a lot of AoE situations since you’ll die quickly) and doesn’t provide anywhere near the utility that Staff brings.

Taril.8619:

Daecollo.9578:

Trident is 1200 range.

Underwater weapons tend to not be usable on land.

Wells are AOE.

Wells are also utility skills not weapon sets (For example WoS + WoC + Staff #2, #3 #4 #2 = Nice AoE damage with utility and 2 blast finisher combos), Wells have long cooldown, Wells can only be used at range with a trait (Only up to 900 range still)

Staff #1 does horrible damage, because it never hits unless your enemy is standing still. (which is never.)

Can still do damage vs zergs in WvW (Usually one of the main times a 1200 range weapon becomes necessary) and PvE things tend to not move a great deal…

Utility attacks, those are conditions! :< And Axe/X has that, much better for Power.

Chill and Fear may be conditions, but since they don’t rely on Condition Damage (Rather they use Condition Duration which most power builds get 30% of due to Spite trait line) AoE Regen is nice for anyone, regardless of spec and Condition Transfer is very good for survival (Dead power necro = Useless power necro) not to mention it’s a hard hitting direct AoE attack.

Axe is pretty bad for a lot of things, it’s #1 lacks damage (Though is easier to pull off than Dagger #1 in a few scenarios) and it’s #3 deals barely more damage than a single #1 hit so most of it’s actual damage comes from the Retaliation (Which can’t be relied on in a lot of AoE situations since you’ll die quickly) and doesn’t provide anywhere near the utility that Staff brings.

Why are we arguing this? Since its a beam channel, it would do the same if not a little more damage then what staff currently is, just be good for condition users as well.

Axe is good for its debuffs, if you can’t see its strength then don’t argue against it, giving 2% extra damage for your entire team every autoattack is REALLY nice.

So you could have the worse weapon in the game, but as long as it give 2 vuln stack it would be good? I don’t see your logic there.

Like I said, I can do better with one attack from grenade kit, at range, and AoE, with more damage.

About staff #1, you remove some damage from the direct damage, when the staff itself is still a better weapon for a condimancer then a powermancer. Other then number #1, most other staff skills are better for condition then powr (#4 been good for both).

Hell, if you trait for faster staff cooldown, the #2 from stats is nearly an auto attack, which produce AoE bleed.

Also, I still don’t think Anet intent to give necromancer burn.

Daecollo.9578:

Why are we arguing this?

Because you were completely disregarding any benefits that a staff brings a Power necro (A valid playstyle that should be taken into account when changing weapon abilities) for silly reasons.

Axe is good for its debuffs, if you can’t see its strength then don’t argue against it, giving 2% extra damage for your entire team every autoattack is REALLY nice.

I know how good 2% extra damage for an entire team is.

I also did the math about the discrepancy between damage dealt by Axe and other weapons (Staff, Dagger, Sceptre and even Death Shroud)

I then calculated the amount of damage a team would have to do to make up for the discrepancy that I found, and decided it wasn’t worth it for the most common sized groups (Dungeon sized, didn’t account for zerg size (Though with that many people focusing on one target I don’t think it’d make too much difference)).

I’m not saying Axe is a bad weapon, it’s just seems very niche (Axe #2 is amazing, if combined with Focus #4 it’s possible to gain a huge amount of LF very quickly. Axe #1 is also better than Dagger #1 if you can’t stay in melee range to use Dagger #1.)

Kardiamond.6952:

So you could have the worse weapon in the game, but as long as it give 2 vuln stack it would be good? I don’t see your logic there.

Like I said, I can do better with one attack from grenade kit, at range, and AoE, with more damage.

---

About staff #1, you remove some damage from the direct damage, when the staff itself is still a better weapon for a condimancer then a powermancer. Other then number #1, most other staff skills are better for condition then powr (#4 been good for both).

Hell, if you trait for faster staff cooldown, the #2 from stats is nearly an auto attack, which produce AoE bleed.

Also, I still don’t think Anet intent to give necromancer burn.

If you want to have a grenade kit, don’t be a necromancer.

Spectral Beam would be both a good power attack and a condition attack.

I used to like axe too till I learned how to survive using Dagger. Dagger dps is sooo much better, and it builds Lifeforce just as well if not better then Axe. You just have to be very bursty, and know when to back off and start life blasting.

Technically speaking most classes have a “utility weapon”

Thieves I mentioned have shortbow
Warriors have Greatsword (this is mostly because GS is their best weapon)
Most Elementalists have either D/D (yes I know it’s one of the best sets) or Offhand dagger at least.
Most Mesmers carry Staff
the only ones I can’t think of is Ranger and Guardian.

But at the same time there is usually a weapons Classes don’t tend to use often

Warriors – Offhand Axe/Longbow
Rangers – Offhand Axe/Longbow
Necromancers – Axe (not totally but it is usually dropped for Dagger in power classes for the Root/Heath sap/attack speed)/Warhorn
Mesmers – Offhand sword (I might be wrong about that one.)

EDIT – Also forgot to mention, Staff is meant to be a Utility weapon just by looking at it, it fits lots of play styles, Condition weapon you have Scepter, Power you have Dagger and Axe, off hand are like utilities too, Dagger (condi removal and condi support), Focus (Boon hate for power, movement restriction and power support), Warhorn (Movement increase with life force support + CC)

Permanent burning on a necro, from an auto attack…

No.

Staff is already in nearly every Necro build regardless of power/condition due to its superior utility. Buffing it in this way would make it wildly OP.

Axe is a big, squishy brown kitten in PvP. Auto attack damage is too low and/or too slow and the channel on 2 is too long. A really well coordinated team can make it “useful” but even then it is suboptimal. D/F coordinated with any other profession provided Vuln stacks for a burst is far superior to anything you can do with an axe.

It does stack higher than 2% if they’re being hit constantly and don’t clear it, though I view the idea of it being useful as opposed to beginning to compensate for the weapon’s flaws with a pretty extreme degree of scepticism. I guess it depends firstly how well you can keep it applied, then if you + your team’s direct damage to that target is amplified enough to cover not having a more damaging weapon, and thirdly whether you wouldn’t be better off using just the focus & well vulnerability (or since he’s talking about tournaments, whether it should be you as a necro applying the vulnerability at all).

/shrug

Not a thing I care enough to find out, but I’m sure someone could experiment and compare.

As for the staff: I don’t really like the idea of a beam aesthetically for necro, much less a beam of fire, but I can’t say the current attack feels amazing or anything. I tend to think of it as a graphical effect that happens between casting marks.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Permanent burning on a necro, from an auto attack…

No.

Staff is already in nearly every Necro build regardless of power/condition due to its superior utility. Buffing it in this way would make it wildly OP.

Axe is a big, squishy brown kitten in PvP. Auto attack damage is too low and/or too slow and the channel on 2 is too long. A really well coordinated team can make it “useful” but even then it is suboptimal. D/F coordinated with any other profession provided Vuln stacks for a burst is far superior to anything you can do with an axe.

Why would a minion necromancer use staff over axe?

LameFox.6349:

It does stack higher than 2% if they’re being hit constantly and don’t clear it, though I view the idea of it being useful as opposed to beginning to compensate for the weapon’s flaws with a pretty extreme degree of scepticism. I guess it depends firstly how well you can keep it applied, then if you + your team’s direct damage to that target is amplified enough to cover not having a more damaging weapon, and thirdly whether you wouldn’t be better off using just the focus & well vulnerability (or since he’s talking about tournaments, whether it should be you as a necro applying the vulnerability at all).

/shrug

Not a thing I care enough to find out, but I’m sure someone could experiment and compare.

As for the staff: I don’t really like the idea of a beam aesthetically for necro, much less a beam of fire, but I can’t say the current attack feels amazing or anything. I tend to think of it as a graphical effect that happens between casting marks.

Ahaha I like the way you see staff #1.

Kardiamond.6952:

LameFox.6349:

It does stack higher than 2% if they’re being hit constantly and don’t clear it, though I view the idea of it being useful as opposed to beginning to compensate for the weapon’s flaws with a pretty extreme degree of scepticism. I guess it depends firstly how well you can keep it applied, then if you + your team’s direct damage to that target is amplified enough to cover not having a more damaging weapon, and thirdly whether you wouldn’t be better off using just the focus & well vulnerability (or since he’s talking about tournaments, whether it should be you as a necro applying the vulnerability at all).

/shrug

Not a thing I care enough to find out, but I’m sure someone could experiment and compare.

As for the staff: I don’t really like the idea of a beam aesthetically for necro, much less a beam of fire, but I can’t say the current attack feels amazing or anything. I tend to think of it as a graphical effect that happens between casting marks.

Ahaha I like the way you see staff #1.

I like how slow and imposing it is. OMFG I GOTTA AVOID THAT SCARY HAND that does little to no damage and can be avoided by stepping to the right.

Daecollo.9578:

Why would a minion necromancer use staff over axe?

I’m not a fan of minions, but I suspect the constant regen, plus area-weakness combos, and the transfer of conditions from minions to enemies in the process probably adds up a bit. And chill is always nice.

Daecollo.9578:

Why would a minion necromancer use staff over axe?

Minion Necro might use Axe with Staff, or Scepter with Staff depending on how it is built, but it probably shouldn’t go anywhere without staff regardless. I suppose the point is moot as far as I am concerned because Minions are sub optimal in sPvP imho (some might argue this, but I’d prefer not to derail the OP’s discussion on this issue).

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Daecollo.9578:

Why would a minion necromancer use staff over axe?

Minion Necro might use Axe with Staff, or Scepter with Staff depending on how it is built, but it probably shouldn’t go anywhere without staff regardless. I suppose the point is moot as far as I am concerned because Minions are sub optimal in sPvP imho (some might argue this, but I’d prefer not to derail the OP’s discussion on this issue).

My Minion Necro is usually top player in SPVP. However I have not tested it in TPVP. I don’t use a staff.

Constant Regen is only available if your near the mark when it is used, if you use the mark over 250 range, it does not give you regen.

We can meet in SPVP right now if you wish. However I don’t do duels, my builds are not made for 1v1 and are ineffective in 1v1. (It would try to be on the same team.)

Daecollo.9578:

My Minion Necro is usually top player in SPVP. However I have not tested it in TPVP. I don’t use a staff.

Constant Regen is only available if your near the mark when it is used, if you use the mark over 250 range, it does not give you regen.

Being top scorer in Hot Joins does not make your skill selection/build good. It means that you aren’t brain dead, and that you have some semblance of an idea about when/where it is a good idea to engage opponents. Kudos to you.

In tPvP scoring the most glory in a match isn’t even a good indicator of who was the most valuable player on the team for that match, but in Hot Joins the only purpose to play is to score that 300+ glory per match zerging about like a mad man. I suppose I should have been more clear in my original post.

At any rate, Have fun with it, and if it works for you, then great. I suppose I am a bit too much of a math nerd, and mathematically, there are better ways to operate the necro, but your tendencies and style may fit better with whatever you are using and thus make it more effective/fun for you. That said the OP idea of perma-burn on staff #1 is not practical.

@Daecollo

Not so sound elitist or anything, but you can prolly run the worse build in sPvP and still be a top player.

75% of player (made up statistic) in Hotjoin are only there to test build/kill people. They don’t care about score.

Staff is useful for MM because you can kite people with chill and cc, heal your minion and fear them.

With Axe/Focus, you have one single target chill, which any descend player can dodge. You have one aoe cripple which is pretty cool, but on cooldown you can’t kite anymore.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Daecollo.9578:

My Minion Necro is usually top player in SPVP. However I have not tested it in TPVP. I don’t use a staff.

Constant Regen is only available if your near the mark when it is used, if you use the mark over 250 range, it does not give you regen.

Being top scorer in Hot Joins does not make your skill selection/build good. It means that you aren’t brain dead, and that you have some semblance of an idea about when/where it is a good idea to engage opponents. Kudos to you.

In tPvP scoring the most glory in a match isn’t even a good indicator of who was the most valuable player on the team for that match, but in Hot Joins the only purpose to play is to score that 300+ glory per match zerging about like a mad man. I suppose I should have been more clear in my original post.

At any rate, Have fun with it, and if it works for you, then great. I suppose I am a bit too much of a math nerd, and mathematically, there are better ways to operate the necro, but your tendencies and style may fit better with whatever you are using and thus make it more effective/fun for you. That said the OP idea of perma-burn on staff #1 is not practical.

Score doesn’t really matter at all, your right. It leaves out way too much and the fact I use my team mates to do most of the work says how much of a player I am. My build was made just to help my teammates, it punishes glass cannons and people who tank too much. (thieves/eles.) However it has problems against mesmers.

Perma-burn on staff was a fun idea I had, it could be changed to bleeding or something along the lines of that, but I figured burning would be better since it just fits the theme of spectral burns you get when you visit scary houses. Most ideas I bring up are fun OP ideas I just throw around forums.

Burning doesn’t fit the necro theme at all. Poison on the other hand…

kidbs.8920:

Burning doesn’t fit the necro theme at all. Poison on the other hand…

The first MMO that had Necromancers had burning (everquest). So did diablo 2.
Corpse Fire and Spectral Burns have always been a major part of Necromancers in the past, just not undead summoning ones, mostly ones that dealt with spirits or getting rid of corpses.

If you recall, Necromancers even had an explosion of corpses in diablo 2, which was fire and poison.

http://www.diablowiki.com/Corpse_Explosion_
Damage Type: 50% Physical damage and 50% Fire damage

EQ Original Necromancer: Lifeburn, Special Burn.

Yep, I’ve acutely noticed our lack of fire condition damage. It rocks my dd elementalists world. This is why I simply wouldnt want to try a condition necro, pretty sure I’d feel wanting.

Well Necro do have terror fear to make up for it.

a CC that does really high damage.

I really like this idea, I wouldn’t mind staff having a Spacial Surge type attack.

T-down to anything that includes Necro + Burning/Rifle/Pistols/Bows/Mass boons.