Necros need leaps

Necros need leaps

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Posted by: Zirith.6429

Zirith.6429

Only class that dosent have access to any kind of leap. Easiest fix would be for death shroud 2 to be ground targeted and for it to travel faster than it is already(it moves at 150% move speed ish, really slow)

Dagger 3 is also a horrible skill and could be turned into a 2 part skill, one for a leap component and the other for immob or high damage.

Necros just need some way to run away because atm there is plague form.

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Posted by: Muchacho.2390

Muchacho.2390

DS 2 used to be ground target in the beta but the changed it so it is unlikely that Anet will chang it back.
Having a leap on dagger 3 would be really nice, but i am sure this will never happen.

You know they dont want necros to run away. But if you use fleshworm and sw smartly, running away as necro is still possible.

(edited by Muchacho.2390)

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Posted by: ronpierce.2760

ronpierce.2760

The issue is, they want Necro to be the 1 class that can’t run, but is supposed to stop people from fleeing. That doesn’t work… With a teleport, a cleanse and a leap, a necromancer can’t keep ANY class (other than necro) from escaping if they really want to and don’t try too late by overextending… Engineer has no issue running from a necro, Warrior same, Ele same, Mesmer same. Ranger same, Thief definitely, the only one that might not have the best way to escape is a guardian that doesn’t have any ground barriers nor GS. Our niche doesn’t work well enough. We need more target teleports so that we can literally keep up on people whether they’re running or not, but we can’t use them to escape.

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Posted by: Andele.1306

Andele.1306

When we get our main/offhand swords im sure we will get one.

When life gives you lemon, ask if its from a anime or manga.

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Posted by: Dalanor.5387

Dalanor.5387

The issue is, they want Necro to be the 1 class that can’t run, but is supposed to stop people from fleeing.

If i have to tip on this issue, necro supposed to achieve this with cripple, chill and immob, but when condi cleanse and passive skills flying everywhere as several classes literally doing this, it fails hard.
Leaps would be good for gap closing, but wouldnt solve anything sadly.

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Posted by: Zirith.6429

Zirith.6429

The main problem with chasing is how slow the ds 2 is, you only move ~300 range closer if you are running with swiftness after them. My main annoyance is necro mobility, roaming with a necro slows the entire group down.

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Posted by: MethaneGas.8357

MethaneGas.8357

The main problem with chasing is how slow the ds 2 is, you only move ~300 range closer if you are running with swiftness after them. My main annoyance is necro mobility, roaming with a necro slows the entire group down.

Try using your other slows first, like staff #3 or scepter #2 on the target, then move in with Dark Path. You should be able to catch up to most opponents. When you dark path to them, dodge through them and fear them in the opposite direction (fear them back to your group). If you think they have leaps ready, use Doom as your Dark Path travels to disable them from using them. The chill from Dark path will make their leaps pretty much useless.

If you don’t have swiftness yourself, or any kind of speed buff (like locust signet, runes of traveler or some traits), your team should provide you with swiftness. Running away can be harder, but as mentioned earlier, using spectral walk or wurm can easily save the day.
Spectral wall is also really good. Casting slows on your enemies WHILE you are running is also crucial.
Last thing, Dark Path to NPCs while running away, it can be a life saver. Not only that, but it tags the NPC, so if you end up downing, you can try to kill the NPC to rally.
I’m talking from a WvW perspective only though..

Here’s a video of some tricks you can do with Spectral Walk and Wurm. You don’t even need to follow the build if you don’t want to, the main point is the options that the two utilities provide. Some people find Wurm alone to be enough, some prefer SW, while others like both
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhcaEyWW-sc

Necro, Ele, Mesmer, Guardian and Warrior, DR[OHai]
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(edited by MethaneGas.8357)

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

torment was supposed to help this concept. But the only form of torment we got is on DS (for those playing spvp), on a 40 second cd.

We should have more torment as well as immobilizes.

The tragedy is that guardians do a better job of this 1000 fold. They have teleports to enemies. They have pulls (to multiple foes). They have walls.

We have 1 tp to an enemy, 1 pull (on 1 enemy), and 1 wall.

When you compare a necro to a guardian you’ll have a hard time seeing why in gods name we are the way we are. Guardians can siphon harder than us in many respects, heal (not only themselves) way better, sustain more, flee from fights (if they spec for that), and keep ppl from fleeing a bit better than we can.

I’m not really complaining tbh. If our “niche” is being performed better by another class than you just have to realize that’s not our niche lol. I say work around it, make some perspective changes and make the class ur own.

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Posted by: Dalanor.5387

Dalanor.5387

I’m not really complaining tbh. If our “niche” is being performed better by another class than you just have to realize that’s not our niche lol. I say work around it, make some perspective changes and make the class ur own.

QFT

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Posted by: Dalanor.5387

Dalanor.5387

Mr Warrior sir, go back under your bridge. Please.
Taking two utility skills and doing some clutch play for escaping, when others cough warriors cough just press one button and disappear in the distance feels a bit unfair.
Which shouldn’t be a problem, necro is a low mobility class with the design to kill or be killed, but as Device wrote it, our tools lack in lock down and gap closing too, so it’s frustrating to see every other class with good or outright awesome disengage abilities.

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Posted by: GrandmaFunk.3052

GrandmaFunk.3052

I don’t think we need any leaps, but in total agreement with DS2 being ineffectual.

GamersWithJobs [GWJ]
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Posted by: Tim.6450

Tim.6450

Maybe instead of leaps we should receive reverse-teleports ( teleport an enemy to the necromancer)? We would still be a low mobility class but we can keep our enemies in combat.

EverythingOP

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Posted by: Dalanor.5387

Dalanor.5387

Well disengage is not an option for us.
Gap closing is … questionable.
Lock down would be neccesary. I tried to make a discussion about it a while ago, check it out. Anything non-condi based ability would be wellcomed.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/lockdown-and-chasing

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Posted by: spoj.9672

spoj.9672

We dont need leaps. But they would be nice. I could go exploring in arah on my necro if we had some leaps. :>

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Posted by: striker.3704

striker.3704

we don’t need more leaps, just more skills that prevent the enemy from getting away. At the very least Anet could put cripple/chill lower on the condition removal priority so it’s harder to remove them.

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Posted by: ronpierce.2760

ronpierce.2760

Funny thing about flesh wurm is it has a 1.5 sec cast. You can literally travel about 50% of the distance it can be put at max in the time it takes to cast it. If the other person uses any mobility to flee or any control effects on you, you can forget it. Wurm is kind of a bad example for mobility/flee catching… Spectral walk.. I mean… it’s swiftness. Who doesn’t have EASIER to obtain friggen perma swiftness? >_>:

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Posted by: Sandra Martino.3870

Sandra Martino.3870

Funny thing about flesh wurm is it has a 1.5 sec cast. You can literally travel about 50% of the distance it can be put at max in the time it takes to cast it. If the other person uses any mobility to flee or any control effects on you, you can forget it. Wurm is kind of a bad example for mobility/flee catching… Spectral walk.. I mean… it’s swiftness. Who doesn’t have EASIER to obtain friggen perma swiftness? >_>:

Exactly, we have no real catch mechanics, arguably we have acces to chills and slows but they last so short or are susceptible to removal that they are not viable to keep them near.

The necromancer should be easy to get away from and have limited tools to catch up fleeing opponents. This is all true right now, to offset this necromancers should be very dangerous when actually engaged in combat (which they are not).

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Posted by: MethaneGas.8357

MethaneGas.8357

Two things.

1) @Andele
The teleport-back acts as a pseudo-stun break. When you get locked down, and you disappear, you take no damage. In a way, it’s almost better than breaking a stun because you vanish from the scene. That’s why thief sword was so strong some time ago – it could teleport away even when stunned (it was nerfed… wonder why). Also, Lightning Flash (from elementalists) isn’t a stun break, but it teleports you, much like Spectral Walk return.
—The 2 skills (Wurm and Spectral walk) can work wonderfully in a combat situations. Calling people who know how to use the 2 skills ignorant is ignorant.

2) @ronpierce
Good use of wurm isn’t casting it mid-fight. Good use is preparing it BEFORE the fight so you can instantly teleport away when you get locked down. Sure, it’s not AS useful when you try to catch up to someone (although it can be, when your movement is decreased in-combat, or you are crippled, etc. Then you couple it with Dark Path and voila). BUT, Necros have lots of ways to catch up to their enemies simple my rooting them/slowing them/fearing them in opposite direction. Sure, sometimes a teleport is more useful than slowing down an opponent, but other times a slow is more useful because it allows your allies to catch up to the enemy as well.

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(edited by MethaneGas.8357)

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Posted by: Lord Kuru.3685

Lord Kuru.3685

Considering you only get 3 utilities, I find (IMO) slotting flesh wurm just so you have an escape to be pretty wasteful.

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Posted by: striker.3704

striker.3704

Considering you only get 3 utilities, I find (IMO) slotting flesh wurm just so you have an escape to be pretty wasteful.

It’s basically an escape/defensive skill for minion masters. When compared to a number of other purely defensive stun break skills, it has some pretty good benefits.

D/S/R necromancer F/A/T elementalist
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Posted by: Cyricus.2981

Cyricus.2981

This is the one thing I really hate about playing my necro. Honestly, all they have to do is lower the cast on flesh wurm so it’s an instant port. Would at least make it more bearable.

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Posted by: Towelie.4637

Towelie.4637

I got i what i can call a perm chill mod and i dont have any special issue with mobility. Signet of the locust is great too with the 25%.
My only problem is those stability guys, since it the last boon to go away….

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Posted by: Luke.4562

Luke.4562

Loving dudes playing by just some months going raiding on the other professions’ forums just to start flamewars.
Leaps would be needed only on dagger.

ALPHA, BETA, several months, … 1 Year later…“When it’s ready”[cit.]

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Posted by: ronpierce.2760

ronpierce.2760

Loving dudes playing by just some months going raiding on the other professions’ forums just to start flamewars.
Leaps would be needed only on dagger.

sure, make dark pact 1200 range, only immob for 2 seconds but cripple for 3 seconds and teleport to them. :P Do this :P

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Posted by: Luke.4562

Luke.4562

Why not? Substitute that creeping Dagger#2 with something like…
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Vampiric_Bite

“Leap at your target and steal some life”.

ALPHA, BETA, several months, … 1 Year later…“When it’s ready”[cit.]

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Posted by: Towelie.4637

Towelie.4637

Why not dagger #3 for leap + chill or cripple ?
I really love dagger #2 in 1v1 situation, or to win 2-3sec for my DS while getting gang banged.

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Posted by: Andele.1306

Andele.1306

Guys… just wait for sword/greatsword/rifle/land spears n tridents.

When life gives you lemon, ask if its from a anime or manga.

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Posted by: azuzephyr.7280

azuzephyr.7280

I just laugh whenever the ‘necro is the one class you can’t run away from’ quote comes back. Necro is hands down the easiest class to run away from, even worse as power. All slows you have access to have a huge cooldown, single target casts, unecessarily long cast times that require you to be facing your target. Compare that to sceptre 2 which can actually be reliably used to snare and it’s bull.

The classes that you can’t run away from are the ones who have the best ability to run away themselves. Once there’s a thief/warrior on you they are impossible to shake, doubly so as power

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Posted by: spoj.9672

spoj.9672

The best way to make necro a class that you cant run away from is to give it more teleports that require a target. That way it cant be reliably used for escape but it can be used to stop people from escaping you. But they need to be instant teleports. Dark path doesnt cut it.

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Posted by: Dalanor.5387

Dalanor.5387

Or implement a dark themed “guardian hammer” for us. Boom, attrition and only stability counters it, not 834626232626 another things like with fear.

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Posted by: Muchacho.2390

Muchacho.2390

I think necro only need a more reliable spectral grasp and ds2.
We dont need more movement skills we need more relaible “bring the enemy back” skills.
So maybe changing dark pact into something like this:
“teleports your enemy in front of you and immobilizes him for 3 seconds”

Woud be a better change

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Posted by: Bellamy.9860

Bellamy.9860

I am in favour of adding leaps or additional pulls.
Necro has decent access to cripple and chill but in this game the movement impairing effects of these conditions feel extreeeeeemely limited in usefulness.
Most bosses get significantly reduced durations and in pvp the effects get somewhat circumvented by dodge rolling granting maximum out of combat movement speed in addition to multiple gap closers and or teleport abilities on most classes.
Also spectral grasp might need some direct damage added. Spectral wall has some offensive potential in condi builds but spectral grasp seems like such a waste of a slot on a class that needs utility skills to get a decent burst going.

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Posted by: ronpierce.2760

ronpierce.2760

Try playing power (Without abusing Lichform, obviously) starting with 0 life force and fighting a stun d/p+SB thief. It kittening infuriates me. x.X

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Posted by: ellesee.8297

ellesee.8297

i wish necros had that risen necromancer ability plague charge. like a 600 range leap that transfers conditions on hit and it looks cool as hell. if only

or turn spectral grasp into spectral charge. 600 range charge that grants life force and chills on hit. mmmm

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(edited by ellesee.8297)

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Posted by: Towelie.4637

Towelie.4637

“teleport your target in front of you and imobilate for 3seconde”
Really… You want it to be instant cast and unblockable too?
Anyway if we get such a good spell, it would be like 1+ minute CD, because we are necromancer….

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Posted by: Setun.4368

Setun.4368

Maybe instead of leaps we should receive reverse-teleports ( teleport an enemy to the necromancer)? We would still be a low mobility class but we can keep our enemies in combat.

This 100%. I love spectral grasp so much on my necro. It would be awesome if there were more effects like this. First thought is if someone hits a spectral wall could there be a 2nd move with it that pulls any that hit the wall to the necro.

I will say that with 86% condition duration and access to 4 chill skills, I can keep someone perma-chilled with 20+ sec of chill for the duration of a fight most of the time (condition cleanses obviously chance that up, but still, that’s a ton of chill duration.)

Also if any of y’all are playing Norn Necro’s snow leopard form is a godsend for escaping while roaming / small man havocs.

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Posted by: azuzephyr.7280

azuzephyr.7280

Maybe instead of leaps we should receive reverse-teleports ( teleport an enemy to the necromancer)? We would still be a low mobility class but we can keep our enemies in combat.

This 100%. I love spectral grasp so much on my necro. It would be awesome if there were more effects like this. First thought is if someone hits a spectral wall could there be a 2nd move with it that pulls any that hit the wall to the necro.

I will say that with 86% condition duration and access to 4 chill skills, I can keep someone perma-chilled with 20+ sec of chill for the duration of a fight most of the time (condition cleanses obviously chance that up, but still, that’s a ton of chill duration.)

Also if any of y’all are playing Norn Necro’s snow leopard form is a godsend for escaping while roaming / small man havocs.

To start spectral grasp would need fixing, I can’t count how many times it just flies in the wrong direction, produces ‘obstructed’ on targets less than 600 range away or just doesn’t pull the target any closer to you when it does hit.

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Posted by: Muchacho.2390

Muchacho.2390

“teleport your target in front of you and imobilate for 3seconde”
Really… You want it to be instant cast and unblockable too?
Anyway if we get such a good spell, it would be like 1+ minute CD, because we are necromancer….

No, cd and casttime should be the same…

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Posted by: Druss.6917

Druss.6917

Stop asking for things we already have:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Foul_Current

/end sarcasm

If they would just take every underwater skill we have, put it on land weapons…we would be in perfect shape.

“Come to me and die you stinking whoresons. For I am Druss, and This is Death!”

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Posted by: Setun.4368

Setun.4368

Maybe instead of leaps we should receive reverse-teleports ( teleport an enemy to the necromancer)? We would still be a low mobility class but we can keep our enemies in combat.

This 100%. I love spectral grasp so much on my necro. It would be awesome if there were more effects like this. First thought is if someone hits a spectral wall could there be a 2nd move with it that pulls any that hit the wall to the necro.

I will say that with 86% condition duration and access to 4 chill skills, I can keep someone perma-chilled with 20+ sec of chill for the duration of a fight most of the time (condition cleanses obviously chance that up, but still, that’s a ton of chill duration.)

Also if any of y’all are playing Norn Necro’s snow leopard form is a godsend for escaping while roaming / small man havocs.

To start spectral grasp would need fixing, I can’t count how many times it just flies in the wrong direction, produces ‘obstructed’ on targets less than 600 range away or just doesn’t pull the target any closer to you when it does hit.

I haven’t encountered that problem as much with spectral grasp…only time it obstructs or otherwise gets buggy / weird is when I see the projectile clip a tree or trying to go through a hill to grab an enemy. I will say pve mobs / other players who get pulled by it instead of the target I wanted is annoying as all hell though.