Guild Wars 2

Hey, so I wanted to post some possible suggestions for updates which could help some area’s of Necro’s (Definiftely not an end all be all fix to their problems). I’ve got UPDATES which are current skills/talents in the system which could use some slight revamping. Then I’ve got Additions which are things that are not available to Necro’s which I thought I’d take a stab at to suggest the implimentation of…

Updates:

Combine Ritual Mastery & Focused Rituals. Move (new) Ritual Mastery to Mastery Rank in Spite Tree. Move Training of the Master to Blood Magic tree in place of Ritual Mastery.
‘New’ Ritual Mastery: Wells use ground targeting (900), Reduces recharge of Wells (20%), Wells improve critical damage for you and nearby allies. (150 Ferocity 900 Radius)

Warhorn:
Wail of Doom: Grant Vigor to yourself and Allies (10 sec 100% vigor).
Locust Swarm: (Blast Finisher) Applies 5 Stacks of Might for 15 sec to yourself and nearby allies.

Close to Death: All critical hits apply Might to you and allies (7.5 sec 600 radius).

Additions:

Greatsword (Cleave)
1) CHAIN
A.) Tormented Swing - 250 damage 130 radius Torment (1 Stack) 10 sec – Swing at your foe.
B.) Tormenting Slash - 250 damage 130 radius Torment (1 Stack) 10 sec – Slash your foe.
C.) Grenths Power - 250 damage 130 radius apply Might (1 Stack) 5 sec – Slam your foe with the power of Grenth.

2) Hellfire Sweep - 2 × 1250 damage 130 radius Fury 10 sec 650 Burning 2 sec – Swing sword in a large arc twice slashing foes in your path and setting them on fire.

3 Soul Conflagrate - 310 damage 600 range 400 Burning 2 sec (Target) 200 Burning 2 sec (Surrounding) – Explode the soul of the targeted foe setting them on fire and foes surrounding them.

4 Necrotic Teleport: 150 damage 1200 range Blind 10 sec & 600 damage Poison 10 sec – Teleport to target location from the darkness of shadows applying blindness and poison.

5 Reign of Fire: (Blast Finisher) 1200 damage 180 radius 350 Burning 1 sec – Burn foes at your location gaining swiftness and leaving behind a line of fire that burns.

Sword (Cleave)
1 CHAIN
A.) Slash - 202 damage 130 range Vulnerability 8 sec – Slash at your foe.
B.) Stab - 202 damage 130 range Vulnerability 8 sec – Stab your foe.
C.) Rip - 250 damage 130 range Weakness 2 sec – Rip your sword from your foe and leave the foe weak.

2 Soiled Earth: 3 × 260 damage – 130 range 180 radius
A.) Pull all conditions from allies.
B.) Strike foe & transfer all conditions. Condition damage is increased by 1000 for 1 sec. All transferred conditions last 1 second.

3 Blighted Strike: 504 damage 130 range 2 sec Immobilize 180 radius – Drive sword into ground immobilizing foes in area.

The two additions of GS & Sword are for cleaving options.

Greatsword being a pure power based weapon giving a good option for power builds and allowing for some viability in dungeons/fractals while still having it’s role in PVP/WVW.

Sword was my hope for a real hybrid weapon, one that can be either or both depending on the build.

You’re basically asking for everything the devs said they are not going to give necros: More group buffs and vigor. While these additions would make necro downright op, it’s things they will never give us. And an aoe immobilize? That would make sword one of the best weapons in the game lol. Rangers have to use an elite to do that.

Don’t get me wrong these are amazing ideas and would make necro very powerful, but it would be too powerful and they don’t want necro getting any stronger. The one thing I think you should definitely and very strongly push for though, is a blast finisher on warhorn. Pretty sure we’re the only class that uses warhorn without a blast finisher. I would think wail of doom would be better suited for a blast though

Ragnar.1546:

Combine Ritual Mastery & Focused Rituals. Move (new) Ritual Mastery to Mastery Rank in Spite Tree. Move Training of the Master to Blood Magic tree in place of Ritual Mastery.
‘New’ Ritual Mastery: Wells use ground targeting (900), Reduces recharge of Wells (20%), Wells improve critical damage for you and nearby allies. (150 Ferocity 900 Radius)

The new Ritual Mastery is an interesting idea, imo. It does potentially nerf some builds that want Chill of Death + wells, or didn’t want to go into spite, but overall an interesting idea (not sure if it is actually good or not). However, moving Training of the Master is an awful idea that ends up nerfing MM builds. Get rid of Spiteful Marks (or make it baseline), instead.

Ragnar.1546:

Warhorn:
Wail of Doom: Grant Vigor to yourself and Allies (10 sec 100% vigor).
Locust Swarm: (Blast Finisher) Applies 5 Stacks of Might for 15 sec to yourself and nearby allies.

Vigor won’t happen, and I’d put the blast on Wail instead. Also I’m not sure Swarm needs that big of a buff, its already a decent skill that puts in a lot of work (damage, tons of cripple, swiftness, life force).

Ragnar.1546:

Close to Death: All critical hits apply Might to you and allies (7.5 sec 600 radius).

Close to Death is strong as is, this would fit much better as a Curses trait.

Ragnar.1546:

Greatsword/Sword

You say GS is a power weapon, but then put torment on auto and give it a bunch of burning, and then say Sword is hybrid but give it vuln and no directly damaging condis, both of which make little sense.

Besides that, giving Necros a lot of burning probably isn’t a good idea (despite the lore issues with giving us burning), especially when the set also applies torment, poison, and indirectly can apply bleeds.

Also, Soiled Earth just sounds insane. Remove all conditions from everyone and give your enemy one big tick of conditions?

Thanks for the suggestions, but I just don’t think many of them are realistic or good to implement.

Existing trait/skill rework:

Siphoned Power
You and nearby allies gain Might (2x – 4 sec) and Vigor (4 sec) when you apply Weakness to your target.
(passive cooldown: 10 sec)
You and nearby allies gain Protection (1 sec) when you apply Vulnerability to your target.
Radius: 600
Targets: 5

Bloodthirst
You and nearby allies gain Regeneration (2 sec) have a chance to siphon health when striking targets afflicted with Bleed. (passive cooldown 5 sec)
Radius: 600
Life Siphon damage: 300
Life Siphon healing: 250
Chance to activate: 50%
Increases critical damage of nearby allies attacking targets afflicted with Bleed(+120 ferocity)
Radius: 600
Targets: 5
Duration: 5 sec
Interval: 3 sec

Signet of Vampirism
Passive Steal health from a foe when you take damage.
Active Heal yourself and mark a foe. Allied players will siphon health from that enemy (unrestrained).
Active life siphon damage: 200
Active life siphon healing: 392
Initial self heal: 3,960
Passive life siphon damage: 165
Passive life siphon healing: 325
Vampiric Mark: (unrestrained) 5 sec
Passive cooldown: cannot occur more than 3 times every 3 seconds.
Range: 900
CD: 45 sec

Signet of Undeath would possibly require a transition to Elite status
Passive: Damage received is split between your health and life force pools. Generate life force upon striking your enemy.
Life force generated: 1%
Damage redirected: 33%
Passive cooldown: 1 second
Active: Revive a defeated ally for 8 seconds and inflict weakness upon them. Revived duration increases with each enemy killed. At 5 kills, the target is rallied.
Activate time: 3.5 seconds
Range: 600
Weakness duration: 8 sec
Duration increase per kill: 3 seconds
Signet Recharge: 180 seconds

New Skill:
Well of the Profane
Target area pulses, stripping boons off foes and preventing application of new boons*
Boons removed per pulse: 2
Profane duration per pulse: 3 seconds
Pulses: 5
Duration: 5 seconds
CD: 40

*note about the profane duration: it’s 3 seconds per pulse, non-stacking. So if a target gets hit by 1 pulse, they lose 2 boons and cannot gain any new boons/stacks on existing for 3 seconds.

New weapon:
Hammer
Damage: 1,034-1,166

1- AA (cleave)
> Spectral Gaze : Pummel your foes with ghostly forces and gain spectral energy
Damage 296 (0.8)
Strikes: 4
LF Gain – 4%
Channel time: 2s
Targets: 3
Range 1200

2-Jaundiced Slam: Bash your target with a blast of necrotic energy. Inflicts Poison and Weakness on targets already suffering from a condition. Affects nearby targets.
Damage 518 (1.25)
Poison Damage 420 (5 sec)
Weakness Duration 5 sec
Targets: 5
Radius: 100
Range 1200
CD: 12
Combo Finisher: Blast

3- Mark of Fury Slam you hammer into the ground and inscribe a mark at your location that Immobilizes foes when they trigger it and grants Fury and Quickness to allies.
Damage 235 (.8)
Fury 4 seconds
Quickness 4 2 seconds
Immobilization: 1 sec
Targets: 5
CD: 20

4- Mark of Pain Slam you hammer into the ground and inscribe a mark at your location that Torments and Bleeds foes when they trigger it. Leaves an ice field.
Damage: 380 (1.0)
Torment: 1,600 (5x) (10 seconds)
Bleed: 1,020 (3x) (8 seconds)
Targets: 5
Combo field: ice
Field duration: 2 seconds
CD: 30

5- Mark of Oppression Slam you hammer into the ground and inscribe a mark at your location that Confuses foes when they trigger it. Leaves a Well of Darkness.
Damage: 554 (.65)
Confusion: 650 on skill use (5x) (5 seconds)
Targets: 5
Well Duration: 3 sec
Blind: 1s
Pulses: 3
Combo Field: Dark
CD: 45

The goal of the skill design was to try to keep with the “soul” of hammer skills (based on Warrior & Guardian skills) and draw inspiration from the mesmer’s GS melee weapon-caster focus motif while staying true to the spirit of necromancers. Many skills are based loosely off necro gw1 skills. The hammer should be our ranged power weapon and the skills listed, in my opinion, grant us the much-needed cleave and additional AoE skills that many have been asking for, while providing additional “attrition” (read: maintaining our lack of mobility, but being able to deal more damage the closer a target gets to us, since 3 of our skills are point-blank/melee range).

Note:

Since this is an open suggestion forum, my suggestions are to be taken in separate context, independent from one another. Also, damage, scaling coefficients and durations are all open to suggestion

The only thing I didn’t list on my suggestion for hammer skills was activation time. Use your imagination for what it should be to keep everything balanced :P

so pretty much a necro with death perception and baseline 50 crit is now able to stack 25 might no problem. add runes of strength and its pretty much permanent.

good ideas mate, but its never gonna happen.

Sors Immani.8429:

Existing trait/skill rework:

Siphoned Power
You and nearby allies gain Might (2x – 4 sec) and Vigor (4 sec) when you apply Weakness to your target.
(passive cooldown: 10 sec)
You and nearby allies gain Protection (1 sec) when you apply Vulnerability to your target.
Radius: 600
Targets: 5

So with a single minor trait, you get AoE vigor, might, and protection, on a pretty high uptime (I’m assuming the protection is supposed to have the same passive CD… right?)? That’s just… way too good. A single minor trait that grants up to 80% uptime on two stacks of might + vigor + 20% protection.

Sors Immani.8429:

Bloodthirst
You and nearby allies gain Regeneration (2 sec) have a chance to siphon health when striking targets afflicted with Bleed. (passive cooldown 5 sec)
Radius: 600
Life Siphon damage: 300
Life Siphon healing: 250
Chance to activate: 50%
Increases critical damage of nearby allies attacking targets afflicted with Bleed(+120 ferocity)
Radius: 600
Targets: 5
Duration: 5 sec
Interval: 3 sec

I’d get rid of the extra crap, just make it an AoE siphon. Traits need to accomplish one thing, not a bunch of completely different things at once.

Sors Immani.8429:

Signet of Undeath
Passive: Damage received is split between your health and life force pools. Generate life force upon striking your enemy.
Life force generated: 1%
Damage redirected: 33%
Passive cooldown: 1 second
Active: Revive a defeated ally for 8 seconds and inflict weakness upon them. Revived duration increases with each enemy killed. At 5 kills, the target is rallied.
Activate time: 3.5 seconds
Range: 600
Weakness duration: 8 sec
Duration increase per kill: 3 seconds
Signet Recharge: 180 seconds

So… a massive nerf to Signet of Undeath? Its literally just a worse Illusion of Life.

Sors Immani.8429:

New Skill:
Well of the Profane
Target area pulses, stripping boons off foes and preventing application of new boons*
Boons removed per pulse: 2
Profane duration per pulse: 3 seconds
Pulses: 5
Duration: 5 seconds
CD: 40

*note about the profane duration: it’s 3 seconds per pulse, non-stacking. So if a target gets hit by 1 pulse, they lose 2 boons and cannot gain any new boons/stacks on existing for 3 seconds.

Is this an elite? Because otherwise its a stronger Well of Corruption.

Sors Immani.8429:

New weapon:
Hammer
Damage: 1,034-1,166

1- AA (cleave)
> Spectral Gaze : Pummel your foes with ghostly forces and gain spectral energy
Damage 296 (0.8)
Strikes: 4
LF Gain – 4%
Channel time: 2s
Targets: 3
Range 1200

2-Jaundiced Slam: Bash your target with a blast of necrotic energy. Inflicts Poison and Weakness on targets already suffering from a condition. Affects nearby targets.
Damage 518 (1.25)
Poison Damage 420 (5 sec)
Weakness Duration 5 sec
Targets: 5
Radius: 100
Range 1200
CD: 12
Combo Finisher: Blast

3- Mark of Fury Slam you hammer into the ground and inscribe a mark at your location that Immobilizes foes when they trigger it and grants Fury and Quickness to allies.
Damage 235 (.8)
Fury 4 seconds
Quickness 4 seconds
Immobilization: 1 sec
Targets: 5
CD: 20

4- Mark of Pain Slam you hammer into the ground and inscribe a mark at your location that Torments and Bleeds foes when they trigger it. Leaves an ice field.
Damage: 380 (1.0)
Torment: 1,600 (5x) (10 seconds)
Bleed: 1,020 (3x) (8 seconds)
Targets: 5
Combo field: ice
Field duration: 2 seconds
CD: 30

5- Mark of Oppression Slam you hammer into the ground and inscribe a mark at your location that Confuses foes when they trigger it. Leaves a Well of Darkness.
Damage: 554 (.65)
Confusion: 650 on skill use (5x) (5 seconds)
Targets: 5
Well Duration: 3 sec
Blind: 1s
Pulses: 3
Combo Field: Dark
CD: 45

The goal of the skill design was to try to keep with the “soul” of hammer skills (based on Warrior & Guardian skills) and draw inspiration from the mesmer’s GS melee weapon-caster focus motif while staying true to the spirit of necromancers. Many skills are based loosely off necro gw1 skills. The hammer should be our ranged power weapon and the skills listed, in my opinion, grant us the much-needed cleave and additional AoE skills that many have been asking for, while providing additional “attrition” (read: maintaining our lack of mobility, but being able to deal more damage the closer a target gets to us, since 3 of our skills are point-blank/melee range).

The hammer is very interesting, although I don’t think it fits a hammer so much as it fits a GS weapon. Getting quickness is a bit too strong as well, but otherwise it looks like a fun weapon set.

I’ve suggested a minor/major trait which would increase our evade-ability when slotted, while sticking to the theme and not adding vigor.

Something like:

Price of Failure (some icd)
When you evade foe’s attack or foe misses due to Blind applied by you, steal 25% (50% PvE) of his Endurance. If victim doesn’t have required amount, apply Weakness (x sec) and corrupt any hostile Vigor boon in range of 300.

@Bhawb As always, your input is appreciated.

Siphoned Power rework— change tier as needed. My logic was that Weakness isn’t exactly easy to apply as a necromancer, so ideally (read: as intended) you would get 2x might around 40% uptime and about 20% uptime on vigor if you were able to maintain weakness on your target.. As for the vuln, the protection was meant to be on a 2-3s ICD.
I could see changing tiers if it’s still too strong.

Bloodthirst— AoE siphon + 10% additional crit damage is what I was going for, on the condition it only works against targets afflicted with bleed.

Sig of Undeath— I think you read it wrong. Revives dead or defeated players, not downed.

Well of the Profane— spur of the moment inspiration after glancing over my GW1 builds. Could be changed to elite status as needed, as well as having its variables tweaked.

Hammer weapon set— the idea, as stated, was to make the necro stronger as the fight wore on and as the target got closer. Took inspiration from mesmer GS, guard/warrior hammer skills, GW1 necromancer skills, and necro axe skills. Hammer, to me, is more of a brutal weapon than GS and thus fits the necro better.

That, and I just don’t like greatswords in this game :P

[Edit]
The quickness on Mark of Fury was a direct homage to its GW1 counterpart with quickness instead of granting adrenaline, and removing the “cracked armor” (vulnerability) condition. I would settle for a quickness duration of 2s in lieu of 4 to try to reign in its power.

Rym.1469:

I’ve suggested a minor/major trait which would increase our evade-ability when slotted, while sticking to the theme and not adding vigor.

Something like:

Price of Failure (some icd)
When you evade foe’s attack or foe misses due to Blind applied by you, steal 25% (50% PvE) of his Endurance. If victim doesn’t have required amount, apply Weakness (x sec) and corrupt any hostile Vigor boon in range of 300.

Reword-
Siphon health and endurance when you evade an attack.
Life siphon damage: 89
Life siphon healing: 125
Endurance siphoned: 25%
ICD: 10 sec

Sors Immani.8429:

@Bhawb As always, your input is appreciated.

Siphoned Power rework— change tier as needed. My logic was that Weakness isn’t exactly easy to apply as a necromancer, so ideally (read: as intended) you would get 2x might around 40% uptime and about 20% uptime on vigor if you were able to maintain weakness on your target.. As for the vuln, the protection was meant to be on a 2-3s ICD.
I could see changing tiers if it’s still too strong.

So is this one trait? Because having separate ICDs on two separate things is kinda weird; this is that clarity of purpose they like to bring up. Also it does two very different things at once, it gives fury/might (damage) and protection (defense) in one. Another issue is if this goes up to GM Major, then it competes with CtD, which really hurts our builds (we need utility and damage, not one or the other). And finally, a 1s protection on a 3s CD basically allows axe to have near 100% protection uptime.

This would be too much for any trait, imo, I’d just use it on my MM, allowing me to give my minions a bunch of fury (10% DPS bonus) very easily (bone minions + dagger OH = easy 100% uptime on this trait), plus protection via axe AA. Even if this was like SoV and didn’t apply to minions, its still a huge amount of team utility to give on a single trait.

I’d probably just go for a weaker version of this trait (btw, weakness is very easy to apply on a 10s CD, with Weakening Shroud) that applied some fury (more synergy w/ weakening shroud + furious demise) or might on weakness application, with a CD as you said, and leave it as a minor trait.

Sors Immani.8429:

Bloodthirst— AoE siphon + 10% additional crit damage is what I was going for, on the condition it only works against targets afflicted with bleed.

The issue is those don’t really have any synergy. Siphons don’t crit, and in fact the only reason siphon really synergizes with crit is using it as a proc mechanic. Your “best” siphon builds are either power/healing power/toughness (maxes the siphon’s stats + toughness synergizing best with the healing) or power/prec/toughness for a similar reason. You’re basically wasting strength, assuming this is balanced which I’d argue it probably isn’t without an increase in tiers, on having a siphon with something that doesn’t synergize with it, and vice versa. I’d probably bump this up to GM Major, with Bloodthirst simply being an AoE siphon support mechanic, and have the ferocity as a totally separate trait.

Sors Immani.8429:

Sig of Undeath— I think you read it wrong. Revives dead or defeated players, not downed.

Fair enough, its an interesting difference, could maybe see niche use in WvW with some stealth+mass zerg revive play.

Sors Immani.8429:

Well of the Profane— spur of the moment inspiration after glancing over my GW1 builds. Could be changed to elite status as needed, as well as having its variables tweaked.

I think it fits very nicely as an elite, although I guess someone could argue its still conflicting with Well of Corruption. But regardless, an interesting idea (also fits with a current idea in the balance forums to tie all utilities and elites together).

Sors Immani.8429:

Hammer weapon set— the idea, as stated, was to make the necro stronger as the fight wore on and as the target got closer. Took inspiration from mesmer GS, guard/warrior hammer skills, GW1 necromancer skills, and necro axe skills. Hammer, to me, is more of a brutal weapon than GS and thus fits the necro better.

That, and I just don’t like greatswords in this game :P

[Edit]
The quickness on Mark of Fury was a direct homage to its GW1 counterpart with quickness instead of granting adrenaline, and removing the “cracked armor” (vulnerability) condition. I would settle for a quickness duration of 2s in lieu of 4 to try to reign in its power.

The issue with quickness, especially an AoE one, is that it has a lot of power. This is why currently quickness is tied to skills with long CDs, usually single target, and with drawbacks. For example Frenzy gives you 6s of quickness, but also 6s of increased damage received and is on a 60s CD. Quickness is just so much potential power that it’d have to water down the rest of the skill too much imo.

I suppose the main points behind updating the Necro is to be able to bring it to the “group table”. They don’t bring a great deal compared to other classes in group settings, they could use blast finishers, cleaving weapons, access to at least another weapon for power specs, change Well of Blood to a water field instead of a light field.

I agree post suggestion some of the ones I listed as being OP, it’s not intended. I find pure Condi Necro very good but thoroughly enjoy my Power Necro, I wished that I could bring more to my allies while specced as Power like a Warrior can but with a Necro twist.

Edit: One thing that bugs me about Warhorn 5 is that dumb DoT that comes out, if you try to use it OOC and it hits something you end up moving slow again. I know it wouldn’t happen for obvious reasons but I would rather Wail of Doom infects the target with those Locusts and could spread to X nearby foes on cast. Then the Locust Swarm changing completely to give Might and Swiftness plus be a blast finisher. But that wouldn’t happen because they would have to rename that skill and edit too much of Wail of Doom I wouldn’t see it happening.

Everyone with the kittens Greatsword and Sword. Honestly, those are the two most common used weapons among professions. You have ranger, warrior, mesmer, and guardian who can all use both these weapons and they are for the most part good options for all of them.

Why no love for Maces? Why can’t necromancers get a mace? Why does it always have to be swords?

Lily.1935:

Everyone with the kittens Greatsword and Sword. Honestly, those are the two most common used weapons among professions. You have ranger, warrior, mesmer, and guardian who can all use both these weapons and they are for the most part good options for all of them.

Why no love for Maces? Why can’t necromancers get a mace? Why does it always have to be swords?

I think it’s more of a lore thing.

The only reason I don’t think of mace much is because even the two professions who get mace right now don’t use it that much. I can’t remember the last time I saw warrior use mace, and even on guardian its seemed to have fallen off a bit.

Because a mace will be slow and i doubt it will provide decent dps. Its not the cleave solution we need.

Warriors mainhand mace is only used for solos where you need extra blocks such as leurent. The offhand is used very often. But mace on guard is pretty much useless. I dont really want to see us get a new weapon which turns out to be even more useless than the axe.

spoj.9672:

Because a mace will be slow and i doubt it will provide decent dps. Its not the cleave solution we need.

Warriors mainhand mace is only used for solos where you need extra blocks such as leurent. The offhand is used very often. But mace on guard is pretty much useless. I dont really want to see us get a new weapon which turns out to be even more useless than the axe.

I could see a tendril /tentacle concept for a new weapon work. Imagine a power based long range weapon with a cc based skillset and a bouncing/creeping tendril AA. The necro wouldnt really hold the weapon, it would floot close to his hand with black tendrils emerging out of his palm and around the weapon. Could be applied to any new weapon, except maybe for hammer, because its too hard to imagine.

spoj.9672:

Because a mace will be slow and i doubt it will provide decent dps. Its not the cleave solution we need.

Warriors mainhand mace is only used for solos where you need extra blocks such as leurent. The offhand is used very often. But mace on guard is pretty much useless. I dont really want to see us get a new weapon which turns out to be even more useless than the axe.

Personally, I don’t think this is a good argument. Maces on other professions do provide a cleave and they are not used very much. The problem with having every profession using a greatsword and sword is it starts to lose its uniqueness. Which Swords and Greatswords actually have already lost that.

How the mace could be used with a necromancer might not be what you want, however Necromancers have very VERY good damage option at the moment and I personally feel that the area we are seriously lacking is in the defensive department. giving us a block would go a long way for survivability.

I know I’m in the minority in this, But I personally was never bothered by not having a cleaving weapon. And I think if we are going to start with a cleaving weapon we should start small and give us a proper defensive weapon.

Roe.3679:

Lily.1935:

Everyone with the kittens Greatsword and Sword. Honestly, those are the two most common used weapons among professions. You have ranger, warrior, mesmer, and guardian who can all use both these weapons and they are for the most part good options for all of them.

Why no love for Maces? Why can’t necromancers get a mace? Why does it always have to be swords?

I think it’s more of a lore thing.

Arena Net have shown that Lore is malleable and have already broken lore with Dhuumfire. Old wounds aside, I don’t see why a necromancer couldn’t use a mace. I don’t know of any specific characters who are necromancers who have used maces in the Lore, but that shouldn’t be a deterrent for providing a profession with new weapon options.

Lily.1935:

How the mace could be used with a necromancer might not be what you want, however Necromancers have very VERY good damage option at the moment and I personally feel that the area we are seriously lacking is in the defensive department. giving us a block would go a long way for survivability.

Necromancer DPS isn’t actually that good except in WvW because we have ranged AoE direct damage. But in PvP we’re only used because of burst/1v1 potential, and in PvE we’re just not used because we have middle-range DPS at best.

Mace could do well to give us some other options, but most people think of GS because its considered a DPS cleave option, which is what we need if we ever want to be used in dungeons.

Since we don’t really physically hit anything besides dagger auto it wouldn’t be inconceivable a mace could be a 600 range aoe bashing weapon

Bhawb.7408:

Lily.1935:

How the mace could be used with a necromancer might not be what you want, however Necromancers have very VERY good damage option at the moment and I personally feel that the area we are seriously lacking is in the defensive department. giving us a block would go a long way for survivability.

Necromancer DPS isn’t actually that good except in WvW because we have ranged AoE direct damage. But in PvP we’re only used because of burst/1v1 potential, and in PvE we’re just not used because we have middle-range DPS at best.

Mace could do well to give us some other options, but most people think of GS because its considered a DPS cleave option, which is what we need if we ever want to be used in dungeons.

Back and forth with this. Some people say its only slightly worse then the warriors, others say its not even close, I’ve seen the stats. Make up your mind people!

Can we just get like.

Landspear?

It’s a better weapon than any of our current land ones for PvE content. It has a cleave, whirl and PBAOE ticks, it has an aoe pull, it has a charge. It’s amaaaaazing.

Also combine these traits

Ritual Mastery+Vampiric Rituals
Quickening Thirst+Dagger Mastery

Lily.1935:

Back and forth with this. Some people say its only slightly worse then the warriors, others say its not even close, I’ve seen the stats. Make up your mind people!

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/2bem98/pve_nonfgs_dps_for_each_profession/ is the most recent thing I’ve seen, which as us at a very mediocre amount of DPS, and actually puts us at an unnaturally high DPS figure because it assumes fury/might numbers we’d never hit on our own.

dagger#2 skill eliminated in favor of a leap skill(our life siphons are useless)
dagger#3 cool down reduced drastically to reflect skill usefulness, damage removed from skill because it compliments nothing
dagger#4 is actually fine, surprising right?
dagger#5 skill totally reworked into a direct damage skill, thus becoming useful

wells automatically having ground targeting
greater marks coming standard too
a melee cleaving weapon(DONT CARE WHAT IT DOES, WE NEED IT KTHX) does spear ring a bell?
a power ranged weapon (DONT CARE WHAT IT DOES, WE NEED IT KTHX)
more torment, because thieves having more access to a condition called TORMENT than a necromancer really infuriates me.
minions that have a purpose, by purpose i don’t mean suicide bombers.

Lily.1935:

spoj.9672:

Because a mace will be slow and i doubt it will provide decent dps. Its not the cleave solution we need.

Warriors mainhand mace is only used for solos where you need extra blocks such as leurent. The offhand is used very often. But mace on guard is pretty much useless. I dont really want to see us get a new weapon which turns out to be even more useless than the axe.

Personally, I don’t think this is a good argument. Maces on other professions do provide a cleave and they are not used very much. The problem with having every profession using a greatsword and sword is it starts to lose its uniqueness. Which Swords and Greatswords actually have already lost that.

How the mace could be used with a necromancer might not be what you want, however Necromancers have very VERY good damage option at the moment and I personally feel that the area we are seriously lacking is in the defensive department. giving us a block would go a long way for survivability.

I know I’m in the minority in this, But I personally was never bothered by not having a cleaving weapon. And I think if we are going to start with a cleaving weapon we should start small and give us a proper defensive weapon.

This is just a personal conflict of preference. I dont think the mace will feel fun or interesting. And you dont think sword or greatsword will.

Anet will most likely keep consistancy across weapons. So a mace would be a lower dps control weapon. Whereas sword and greatsword are likely to be more about high/moderate dps with aoe/cleave potential. You might not be bothered by not having a cleave weapon aesthetically. But its a huge design hole when you consider other classes. And i think its safe to assume that the majority would prefer greatsword for this reason and for aesthetic reasons despite how common they already are. Which is unfortunate for you assuming that anet go by the majority (the logical choice).

We already have 2 defensive weapons. The problem is they dont fit the standard idea of defensive weapons (blocks and evades). The necro has been designed to not have any extra conventional active defence so the type of defence we get are blinds, weakness, cc and other debuffs like cripple and chill. These are aggressive defence options. Offhand dagger and warhorn both cover these very well.

spoj.9672:

Lily.1935:

spoj.9672:

Because a mace will be slow and i doubt it will provide decent dps. Its not the cleave solution we need.

Warriors mainhand mace is only used for solos where you need extra blocks such as leurent. The offhand is used very often. But mace on guard is pretty much useless. I dont really want to see us get a new weapon which turns out to be even more useless than the axe.

Personally, I don’t think this is a good argument. Maces on other professions do provide a cleave and they are not used very much. The problem with having every profession using a greatsword and sword is it starts to lose its uniqueness. Which Swords and Greatswords actually have already lost that.

How the mace could be used with a necromancer might not be what you want, however Necromancers have very VERY good damage option at the moment and I personally feel that the area we are seriously lacking is in the defensive department. giving us a block would go a long way for survivability.

I know I’m in the minority in this, But I personally was never bothered by not having a cleaving weapon. And I think if we are going to start with a cleaving weapon we should start small and give us a proper defensive weapon.

This is just a personal conflict of preference. I dont think the mace will feel fun or interesting. And you dont think sword or greatsword will.

Anet will most likely keep consistancy across weapons. So a mace would be a lower dps control weapon. Whereas sword and greatsword are likely to be more about high/moderate dps with aoe/cleave potential. You might not be bothered by not having a cleave weapon aesthetically. But its a huge design hole when you consider other classes. And i think its safe to assume that the majority would prefer greatsword for this reason and for aesthetic reasons despite how common they already are. Which is unfortunate for you assuming that anet go by the majority (the logical choice).

We already have 2 defensive weapons. The problem is they dont fit the standard idea of defensive weapons (blocks and evades). The necro has been designed to not have any extra conventional active defence so the type of defence we get are blinds, weakness, cc and other debuffs like cripple and chill. These are aggressive defence options. Offhand dagger and warhorn both cover these very well.

Actually I never said I thought the sword or greatsword wouldn’t be fun. They probably would be. My point was that there already is a major focus on them and that there are plenty of other weapons that almost never get used. I also didn’t say that the necromancer shouldn’t ever get them, just that I would rather get a proper defensive weapon first before we get another heavy offensive weapon.

Offhand dagger and warhorn are not actually defensive. You could say that control is a form of defense and I would be inclined to agree with you, however this isn’t the point I am making.I would put these more firmly in the control category then raw defense. Having a weapon that can block or evade can go a long way in terms of defenses. And its something we seriously lack and this weakness has been abused.

Especially talking about the dagger, although it can be used very defensively in PvP and WvW, in PvE it doesn’t work as well. Considering most(if not all) bosses in the game are unaffected by blind and don’t seem to care about weakness. This also applies to the warhorn which quite often can’t stun bosses either.

The closest weapon we have to a defensive weapon is the staff. And I’d call that more of a support weapon then defensive. The staff is probably the weapon that builds death shroud the fastest, excluding maybe MAYBE the dagger, it has 2 CCs, regenerate, and transfers conditions.

I understand your point so I hope you understand mine.

Thats simply how they have chosen to give us defence. I dont like it either. But i dont seem them doing much to change it. And i dont think a defensive weapon is that important on the priority list. Especially as the place where necro is in a terrible place is in PvE. Where extra defence isnt really needed at the moment. Only fight we lack the proper defence tools for is Mai Trin.

But yeah i understand what you mean. We will just have to agree we would rather see different weapons first. And that we have different priorities and values in game.

spoj.9672:

Thats simply how they have chosen to give us defence. I dont like it either. But i dont seem them doing much to change it. And i dont think a defensive weapon is that important on the priority list. Especially as the place where necro is in a terrible place is in PvE. Where extra defence isnt really needed at the moment. Only fight we lack the proper defence tools for is Mai Trin.

But yeah i understand what you mean. We will just have to agree we would rather see different weapons first. And that we have different priorities and values in game.

If they were to add a new weapon I’m in favor of scythes as our cleaving weapon. All the way. Don’t care if its pure power, hybrid, condi. I’ll use it.

Yes, Necro does not need a defensive weapon. Necro is inherently defensive, already. An offensive, chest-forward weapon with cleave is needed. I prefer something with bleed and torment, too.

Anchoku.8142:

Yes, Necro does not need a defensive weapon. Necro is inherently defensive, already. An offensive, chest-forward weapon with cleave is needed. I prefer something with bleed and torment, too.

I disagree with you. However I don’t see any reason why a cleaving, defensive weapon with damaging conditions couldn’t be added. Also, I find survival on a mesmer, guardian or engineer far far easier and more intuitive to grasp then defenses on a Necromancer. Also, necromancer’s defenses scale down while other professions defenses scale up.

Necros already have defensive weapons; staff and daggers.

If the problem is that leech is bad, then address leech.

Sarrs.4831:

Necros already have defensive weapons; staff and daggers.

Those are not defensive weapons, defensive weapons have mitigation as their primary focus. Staff does not have mitigation, it has condi-utility, dagger MH does not have mitigation, it has damage with the control and sustain needed to deal that damage, and dagger OH would be at best a highly aggressive defensive option, due to the fact that both of its skills have as much offensive pressure as they do defensive.

A purely defensive weapon for us would be something with a lot of chill/weakness/blind. Well of Darkness is a defensive CD, SA is a defensive CD, but on our weapons we get at best mixed, which means some of the potential defensive strength is missing because of the damage.

I think Necromancer’s defensive challenges come from its class mechanics. The dev’s could say l2p but lower mobility and slower dps generation are real handicaps.

Anchoku.8142:

I think Necromancer’s defensive challenges come from its class mechanics. The dev’s could say l2p but lower mobility and slower dps generation are real handicaps.

those are handicaps like being blind with a broken leg in a zombie apocalypse. aka, being blinded and crippled in wvw. good luck getting out of that scenario when there’s 10 people chasing you, on a necro anyway.

I think if myself as a sacrifice in wvw. When we see an extremely large group being try hards I typically shoot myself in the leg on purpose and hit plague to allow my guild to run away =(

Lol. I have done that, too. Plague is a good stop for a small zerg but it is also suicide. Behold, the selfless Necro!