Guild Wars 2

Dodging Mark of Blood only to get hit by Chillbains right after is getting really old. Dodging the right marks can mean the difference between life and death when fighting a necromancer and having absolutely no way to tell what mark the necro is using is unacceptable. This needs to be a priority in the next balance patch.

100% agree.

Every mark cast has different animation already, so your asking for longer cast time on marks so you can better notice that animations are different or what?
Mark of blood – default
Chillblains – hand glows green
Putrid – hand glows black
Reapers – whole animation different and looks like poke with staff

Leeto.1570:

Every mark cast has different animation already, so your asking for longer cast time on marks so you can better notice that animations are different or what?
Mark of blood – default
Chillblains – hand glows green
Putrid – hand glows black
Reapers – whole animation different and looks like poke with staff

The glow color on the hand doesn’t change the animation; the character animation is still the same on the first 3 even if it has some very tiny and hard to see effect on the necromancer’s hand. As for the fear animation, that doesn’t even work if the necromancer uses Greater marks – it bugs back to the default animation.

An easy way to make it easy to know when to dodge is to make the mark appear at the location it is being cast while it’s being cast – and also to make each mark a different color and make the texture/effect of it a lot brighter and glow (looking at the tiny picture in the middle of the mark isn’t a great way to differentiate the marks, because they’re hard to see and not very well textured).

You even realize how much this would kitten up necro in pvp? If enemy can tell not only that i cast mark + which mark i cast but WHERE i cast it then i might just start working on 4x dagger build :P

Rarnark.5623:

Dodging Mark of Blood only to get hit by Chillbains right after is getting really old. Dodging the right marks can mean the difference between life and death when fighting a necromancer and having absolutely no way to tell what mark the necro is using is unacceptable. This needs to be a priority in the next balance patch.

You’re right! It’s unacceptable!

I’d like to see a huge colored animation when Thieves gonna backstab 5-22k you…

Or when a Warrior decides to pop Berserker Stance and dance on your Marks.

It’s life. You have to adapt.

While we’re at it. Can we mark mesmers clones with a special color so we know who the real mesmer is. That would be greaaat.. thaanks. I also hate having to figure out which one is real and which one isn’t. Kinda sucks having to do all the work.

So if we get distinct warning signs that tell you what to dodge and what is okay not to then lets have some warning signs like a big marker over the head of the real mesmers huh?

XD You see what I did there?

Luke.4562:

Rarnark.5623:

Dodging Mark of Blood only to get hit by Chillbains right after is getting really old. Dodging the right marks can mean the difference between life and death when fighting a necromancer and having absolutely no way to tell what mark the necro is using is unacceptable. This needs to be a priority in the next balance patch.

You’re right! It’s unacceptable!

I’d like to see a huge colored animation when Thieves gonna backstab 5-22k you…

Or when a Warrior decides to pop Berserker Stance and dance on your Marks.

It’s life. You have to adapt.

22k Backstabs don’t happen in pvp. Also when a warrior has berserker stance on it is visible under his name. If you pressed every button on staff and somebody negates that’s your fault for spamming your skills haphazardly.

Imagine fighting a grenade engi where all the grenades have the same animation as shrapnel, or fighting a warrior where all the hammer attacks look like mighty blow. At moment the only way to counter play necro staff is to random dodge when he’s casting marks and hope you dodge the right ones.

Rarnark.5623:

Luke.4562:

Rarnark.5623:

Dodging Mark of Blood only to get hit by Chillbains right after is getting really old. Dodging the right marks can mean the difference between life and death when fighting a necromancer and having absolutely no way to tell what mark the necro is using is unacceptable. This needs to be a priority in the next balance patch.

You’re right! It’s unacceptable!

I’d like to see a huge colored animation when Thieves gonna backstab 5-22k you…

Or when a Warrior decides to pop Berserker Stance and dance on your Marks.

It’s life. You have to adapt.

22k Backstabs don’t happen in pvp. Also when a warrior has berserker stance on it is visible under his name. If you pressed every button on staff and somebody negates that’s your fault for spamming your skills haphazardly.

Imagine fighting a grenade engi where all the grenades have the same animation as shrapnel, or fighting a warrior where all the hammer attacks look like mighty blow. At moment the only way to counter play necro staff is to random dodge when he’s casting marks and hope you dodge the right ones.

Well I think thats fair so how about we allow an indicator to hover above any invis thief so we know where they are all the time also. Or maybe an indicator telling us everything they do while invis? Or how about some kinda flashing light that warns when an invis thief is too close too you?

Why is it always the necros that have to do all the work? Figure out the REAL mesmer. Figure out where the thief is. Time warrior stability or save boon strips for them. What else do you want to ease your struggle vs the immobile, sluggish, non-stability, non-invis/invuln having necro?

Or maybe all other classes need more stuff to make the necro’s work even harder.

A chillbane indicator really? Why stop there? How about we get slower animations like wayy slower than they already are so that you can have a bout 10 seconds to figure out what you want to do. Hows that sound?

We have some of the most predictable mechanics in the game. We are the slowest class in the game. We are the most UNstable class in the game XD.

By the way why hasn’t anyone asked why u are dodging into a LINE of marks? Could you not just go around the marks with your ridiculous amount of mobility?

You know what? I say go for it. We need some indicators for our marks so they can tell which is which.

OR! Maybe Anet actually did something right for allowing some of the marks to look alike. If you KNEW then NOBODY would walk on them lol. Them being a MARK would that mechanic completely unnecessary since you would not lay them on the ground and instead ALWAYS nuke them under your enemies. Why even make them marks then? How about just nerf the hell out of them and turn them into ranged aoe nukes? Sound good?

Like I said. How about we have invis indiactors. You can remain invisible just have a big red sign over your invis character telling us where you are.

The complaints against an attack getting better readability is absolutely insane. Nobody is asking for them to have after-cast animations, no one is asking for longer cast times. All that is desired is that you can tell what mark is going your way to make an intelligent decision then or later. As it is now, you can’t even tell what mark the other person is casting unless its reaper’s mark.

This is simply an issue of increasing counterplay in a very healthy way. Holy crap.

I don’t see how this is a good idea at all…

Implementing distinction between the marks WILL allow the opponent to make the smarter choice… always. They will almost never walk on the mark that is highlighted blue or while they saw what was placed. So why put the mark down? You.. wouldn’t? If this actually happened people would not put their chillbains down and instead place them right under their enemy.. always. Which makes the idea of them being a mark extraneous. The only reason to lay a mark would be for preparation long ahead of time.

If you saw chillbains on the ground and had a choice of walking over it or the MoB beside it you will always choose the MoB.

I honestly still believe that there is no visible animation distinction between the first three marks on staff for this reason.

My response might have been over-the-top but that’s the way I sometimes relay my opinion by looking at the grander scheme of things.

This is the reason I brought up mesmer clones because that is the key example of observant counter-play. Just because there is no indicator to tell you who the real mesmer is it doesnt mean you cant still beat a mesmer. It will mean that the mesmer will have a good chance at using their clones for what they’re intended for which includes duping your opponent into hitting the wrong one.

Honeslty. I really don’t care. Go for it lol. I think the only real thing I’m disturbed at is that this (even if it is a good idea) seems like such a trivial challenge. I mean I looked at this as a complaint. Really. And I just feel necro’s are so beat down and lackluster that THIS is like the one few things scrounged for to complain about. Lol.

There are plenty of skills that dont have obvious animations.

Why would you ever purposely walk over a mark? You wouldn’t, ever. So knowing what mark it is (which you already do) doesn’t do anything.

He’s asking for casting animations, which is important. You can’t count CDs if you don’t know the mark that you just avoided, you can’t avoid what you should if you don’t even know what you’re being hit with. Imagine if every warrior GS attack had the same animation, so instead of dodging away from 100b, you dodged away from a little crap attack. Readability is huge for this game, and staff is a big problem in this area.

I would alter mark animations to visually “charge” or something similar. As you cast the mark, the central icon appears at the target location, then some sort of animation
“grows” it out to it’s limits. By making each “growing” animation distinct, you avoid having to alter character animations, while adding discernible visual cues.
For example, maybe Chillblains would have it’s core flash, then green chains extend outward to the max radius. Or maybe Reaper’s Mark starts off tiny then grows while it spirals or something.

That being said, I do think that stacking marks should continue to obscure which marks have been placed, since it’s simply spending resources in a more strategic manner. You know the marks are there, so if you chose to venture in, it’s on you, not the Necro, especially given Mark stacking would require using multiple skills and having to deal with their cooldowns.

Mark stacking has a fairly noticeable effect as well (very muddle center, outsides are usually much brighter than normal).

And I like the idea of them having a seen casting location. As it is now you kind of need to assume the Necro is going to hit you, which isn’t good play either.

Bhawb.7408:

The complaints against an attack getting better readability is absolutely insane. Nobody is asking for them to have after-cast animations, no one is asking for longer cast times. All that is desired is that you can tell what mark is going your way to make an intelligent decision then or later. As it is now, you can’t even tell what mark the other person is casting unless its reaper’s mark.

This is simply an issue of increasing counterplay in a very healthy way. Holy crap.

Counter-play is fine, but are we assuming counter-play is going to get increased across the board?

Will I know when Elementalists have Diamond Skin? Is that getting any counter-play at all?

Will Black Powder for Thieves have a longer cast time than .5 seconds and actually have an animation I can dodge so I can keep Thieves from going into Stealth whenever they want?

Will Stealth have better counter-play?

Will Asurans have more obvious animations than being tiny? When any player is blocking, will it put a shield above their head so I don’t have to happen to notice their arm to not take thousands of damage or 5 stacks of Confusion?

Will Stealth have better counter-play?

Will Blind have better counter-play when it gets spammed?

I think there are a plethora of things in GW2 that could use some help in the counter-play department. Yes, Marks probably need it, but they don’t need it any worse than other mechanics in the game.

1st person to not simply dredge trough marks because they simply do nothing or the condi’s bounce off..

OP, i salute you.. but as a necro, dissagree..

Bhawb.7408:

And I like the idea of them having a seen casting location. As it is now you kind of need to assume the Necro is going to hit you, which isn’t good play either.

That would be nice but only with unblockable/undodgeable marks (AoE).

Rarnark.5623:

22k Backstabs don’t happen in pvp.

https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/27538/gw402b.jpg

Ask Nemesis also.

Also when a warrior has berserker stance on it is visible under his name

Alright.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Mark_of_Blood.jpg
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Chilblains_symbol.jpg
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Putrid_Mark.jpg

Enjoy yourself discovering them, effectivley, they’re really big and visible on the ground more than a tiny little icon under your name. I’d say in this situation it’s easier keeping the eyes on your target and the surroundings than 20 minutes on his healthbar checking for his cooldowns..

And more, a 3 months Warrior player which enters the Necro subforum with arrogant attitude that wants to win easier in PVP when his class totally counters Necromancer..
Come on!

Bhawb.7408:

He’s asking for casting animations, which is important. Readability is huge for this game, and staff is a big problem in this area.

This would happen only during an engage, when the Necromancer starts yet to set marks on the ground as an opener; unskilled Necros gonna spam every mark, experienced one will wait to land those more important for the best situation. It wouldn’t totally matter during the fight, when the Warrior would stick in melee range and the Necro would drop the marks directly on his face.

So imho it’s worthless, it’s just a rant because he met a troll or a more skilled Necromancer that made him understand his mediocrity.

Luke.4562:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Mark_of_Blood.jpg
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Chilblains_symbol.jpg
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:Putrid_Mark.jpg

The problem here is that at first glance they all look like green dots. In the heat of the battle you usually don’t take a closer look, and depending on the textures of the ground and other skill effects flying around it will be increasingly difficult to tell them appart.

The different symbols are clearly there so you can distinguish the marks once they are placed, but imo they fail to do just that.
It would be much better if the symbol in the middle was a circle, a sqaure, an X and a triangle, for exapmple…

And from an opponent’s perspective this isn’t a matter of “do I walk over this mark rather than the other”, but timing cooldowns or positioning yourself so you can’t be feared/pulled into a specific mark.

And btw, Berserker Stance is super easy to see. If you don’t immediatly notice the clearly distinctive icon, you’ll know once your condis don’t have an effect anymore.

As to the cast animations, I’m all for it, but I’m not sure it’ll have that much of an impact. It will never be like seeing an incoming Earthshaker. Again, more of a feature to instantly recognize marks that aren’t immeditely triggered when placed.

Side note: I was only recently made aware that Reaper’s Mark has a different cast animation. A guildy of mine created a charr (I have a charr too) and asked why my animation didn’t look any different from the rest of the mark casts.
Turns out my character is bugged or something, there really is no difference, and I would have never noticed if I wasn’t specifically asked.
Playing necro since start and I’ve never noticed a difference on any other necro: that’s how insignificant the difference in cast animation is. So if they change it for all marks, it would have to be somthing more that waving your hand in a slightly different angle.

Rampaggge!!!! was just watching archer

but check it.. Those marks are indeed differential but are too hard to tell apart. The issue being brought up is the animation when cast. Which means has to have seperate but (keep in mind) same cast speed (which is very fast).

So whatever if you want to add some indication to what exactly was that was used keep the animations and just have a color-coded skull or whatever pop over the necros head as he uses them. Red for Mob, teal for chillbains, yellow for putrid, black for reapers mark.

This would solve everything.

But to add my subtle skepticism by avenue of sarcasm: Maybe the Chillbains should be red like a stop sign and mob blue for go and putrid same for caution XD

All in all I think the idea is fine I mean whatever I have my doubts about how useful it can actually be but in some instances (probably more often than I’d assume) It could be very useful to know. (edit) ..but again, the “usefulness” is why I think its a hazardous idea to the mark mechanic entirely XD

So you’re asking that players would actually have to have some tactics like most other classes with their skills and not just spam marks?

Absurd.

Furajir.3815:

So you’re asking that players would actually have to have some tactics like most other classes with their skills and not just spam marks?

Absurd.

kinda like spamming invis? or spamming stuns/knockdowns? or spamming dagger 2? or spamming clones? uhhhhhhhhhhh

Hard counter profession players ranting more about the countered profession.

Is this the DoorMat’s profession subforum? Are my bristles too much long? Shall i have to flatten myself more?

THIS is Absurd.

Rarnark.5623:

Dodging Mark of Blood only to get hit by Chillbains right after is getting really old. Dodging the right marks can mean the difference between life and death when fighting a necromancer and having absolutely no way to tell what mark the necro is using is unacceptable. This needs to be a priority in the next balance patch.

As stated they do have separate animations, even is only slightly. Your comment is dangerous because it would mean that being able to dodge marks is a priority for PvP balance (kind of like warrior mace stun)

You might be saying in your head “Of course they do, it needs to be fixed, make it a priority!” but realize that changing the animation will not be enough for 80% of players. The final “solution” to your proposed “issue” is to have a longer cast time on marks and that sir would completely break staff, and therefor necro.

@Luke: That says 2 Backstab hits, so it’s about 9.5k+ damage per Backstab. Still high, but there’s absolutely no context. And it isn’t a 22k backstab.

@Furajir: Spamming marks, or cycling 2-3-4-5 through marks, is a really dumb idea, and doesn’t use the weapon to its full potential. At best, you want to keep Mark of Blood rolling, and maybe Chillblains, but Necro Staff is hardly the only weapon in GW2 that you want to use at least 2 abilities on cooldown.

I hope a lot of you never get into game design… I second your opinion OP even as a necromancer myself.

I could care less if other classes have cheesy animations on powerful skills. I don’t want the class I enjoy playing dropping down to the same level.

Well, if you know Necromancer class, you can always stop before the mark and take a look at the Mark icon.
Go figure it out Sherlock Holmes!
:p

Feel free to do that, but then increase the damage of each mark by around 4 times to fit a two hander which has dodge based animations (10s cd with a 1.1/4 s channel for 6-56k damage depending on build compared to a 4-8k over from our 6s cd over 16 second “channel” is obviously too weak, the 8k optimal condition skill clearly needs to have special animations) – numbers here presented by me are pve obviously, cut 2/3 of them off for about a close estimate for pvp.
Also skull, claws, venom fangs, think its easy to remember.

Monoman.2068:

I hope a lot of you never get into game design… I second your opinion OP even as a necromancer myself.

I could care less if other classes have cheesy animations on powerful skills. I don’t want the class I enjoy playing dropping down to the same level.

So with your declaration you’re asking for your own “skill pride” that Necromancer and other players have drop -not at, but..- down UNDER that level?
Well yes, nerf again the staff. Because of a senseless rant.

Why not giving a different name and a gradient color to Mesmer’s clones etc.? Because that’s what you’re asking for.

“HEYA dudes! I’m dropping my Putrid Mark just right HERE! Please be careful, to get me and play some Pong with my face you’ve to get around it or dodgeroll it, or pop Berserker Stance and walk over my little orchard carelessly, We’ll play again in 30 seconds!” /drops trousers…
-Warrior, 1 second of indecision- -Necromancer 15 seconds of chainStun-

The game should have good tells for abilities, but given every other quality of life thing I’d like to see, and considering Staff does have animations on its marks (even if they are subtle and subtly different), I just really don’t think this should be a priority.

Luke.4562:

Well yes, nerf again the staff. Because of a senseless rant.

No one is asking for a nerf. It’s a sensible request regardless of your opinion of the OP.

Luke.4562:

Why not giving a different name and a gradient color to Mesmer’s clones etc.?

You mean like Phantasms..? Which are all transparent and have different weapons and names?

flow.6043:

Luke.4562:

Well yes, nerf again the staff. Because of a senseless rant.

No one is asking for a nerf. It’s a sensible request regardless of your opinion of the OP.

Luke.4562:

Why not giving a different name and a gradient color to Mesmer’s clones etc.?

You mean like Phantasms..? Which are all transparent and have different weapons and names?

So the deal is, he/she is asking for nerf… Anet will NOT simply redesign animations (i couldn’t care less about the tell, most players cant/wont read the tell)

If you read my earlier post what the OP is really achieving is longer cast time on marks… even if that’s not what they asked for.

-The “Issue” marks are hard to dodge
-The “Solution” will be made by Anet balance tam (we all know what that means)

In theory having different animations would be ok, pointless but ok. In practice this post is claiming that Marks/Staff is OP and hard to dodge, that’s just not a real issue and its definitively not unbalanced.

Deal with it bro.

If the staff were to get more obvious skill animations, then I want this
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Spiteful_Marks
to apply to the staff and the base power damage of Mark of Blood to be tripled.

No one wants longer cast times. We want the exact same cast time, with an animation that will actually show the enemy what I’m casting. It’s stupid that three skills on the same weapon have almost the exact same animation.

Its also dumb that there is no way to tell where the marks are going. This is simple readability stuff that should be done. If it makes staff too weak then buff it, but this is basic game design.

Bhawb.7408:

No one wants longer cast times. We want the exact same cast time, with an animation that will actually show the enemy what I’m casting. It’s stupid that three skills on the same weapon have almost the exact same animation.

Its also dumb that there is no way to tell where the marks are going. This is simple readability stuff that should be done. If it makes staff too weak then buff it, but this is basic game design.

Again i must ask, then mesmer shatter effects need to be vastly more different at higher graphics options because the actual universtal shatter effect (the glassy parts) overlaps over any stars or pink lines, unique granade animations, all traps (be it thief or ranger) having special setups animations which light the character up on what they do, special character pose for point blank shot and stealth not to remove targeting, it might not make sense, but its “basic game design”
Seriously staff deals less damage even with terror and max cond damage for its cooldowns and base power damage compared to any other two hander (and no most of them deal aoe damage so thats not a issue).

If it becomes predictable, then what will be the necro’s speciality ? Necro is an instant-caster class unlike elementalist. And this is how marks work. They deal so little damage to compensate this, they even nerfed them more by reducing bleed stacks
to 2.

If you want such thing, then also add glowing dagger sign to stealthed thieves’ heads and slowdown their attacks so we can predict their backstab skills and position…
Good deal.

Luke.4562:

Monoman.2068:

I hope a lot of you never get into game design… I second your opinion OP even as a necromancer myself.

I could care less if other classes have cheesy animations on powerful skills. I don’t want the class I enjoy playing dropping down to the same level.

So with your declaration you’re asking for your own “skill pride” that Necromancer and other players have drop -not at, but..- down UNDER that level?
Well yes, nerf again the staff. Because of a senseless rant.

Why not giving a different name and a gradient color to Mesmer’s clones etc.? Because that’s what you’re asking for.

“HEYA dudes! I’m dropping my Putrid Mark just right HERE! Please be careful, to get me and play some Pong with my face you’ve to get around it or dodgeroll it, or pop Berserker Stance and walk over my little orchard carelessly, We’ll play again in 30 seconds!” /drops trousers…
-Warrior, 1 second of indecision- -Necromancer 15 seconds of chainStun-

If you want to fight people with as many small cheese advantages you can muster together, Asura/Thief is that-a-way. I personally could care less if they gave mesmer clones different colors/animations or not because I’m not defending their current abilities and would happily praise anet if they did a mass purging of these indistinguishable animations and colors.

This two wrongs makes a right attitude makes me sick.

Monoman.2068:

This two wrongs makes a right attitude makes me sick.

Actually the negative of a negative is a positive, be it math or nature.

Leeto.1570:

Every mark cast has different animation already, so your asking for longer cast time on marks so you can better notice that animations are different or what?
Mark of blood – default
Chillblains – hand glows green
Putrid – hand glows black
Reapers – whole animation different and looks like poke with staff

I have to admit that I’d like every mark to have the Reaper’s mark animation I like the way you ‘slam’ the mark on someone to see them running away

Leeto.1570:

Every mark cast has different animation already, so your asking for longer cast time on marks so you can better notice that animations are different or what?
Mark of blood – default
Chillblains – hand glows green
Putrid – hand glows black
Reapers – whole animation different and looks like poke with staff

Lol… i’ve had more than 2 necros and alwas used staff and i still haven’t ever noticed this… now i feel bad.

Monoman.2068:

Luke.4562:

Monoman.2068:

I hope a lot of you never get into game design… I second your opinion OP even as a necromancer myself.

I could care less if other classes have cheesy animations on powerful skills. I don’t want the class I enjoy playing dropping down to the same level.

So with your declaration you’re asking for your own “skill pride” that Necromancer and other players have drop -not at, but..- down UNDER that level?
Well yes, nerf again the staff. Because of a senseless rant.

Why not giving a different name and a gradient color to Mesmer’s clones etc.? Because that’s what you’re asking for.

“HEYA dudes! I’m dropping my Putrid Mark just right HERE! Please be careful, to get me and play some Pong with my face you’ve to get around it or dodgeroll it, or pop Berserker Stance and walk over my little orchard carelessly, We’ll play again in 30 seconds!” /drops trousers…
-Warrior, 1 second of indecision- -Necromancer 15 seconds of chainStun-

If you want to fight people with as many small cheese advantages you can muster together, Asura/Thief is that-a-way. I personally could care less if they gave mesmer clones different colors/animations or not because I’m not defending their current abilities and would happily praise anet if they did a mass purging of these indistinguishable animations and colors.

This two wrongs makes a right attitude makes me sick.

I don’t think it boils down to wrongs making rights for many of us. It boils down to priorities. The fact is that the marks do have different animations, for the most part. Reaper’s Mark is noticeably different. Putrid Mark has a green/black cloud covering the hand throughout the duration. The two that are going to be impossible to read appropriately are Chillblains and Mark of Blood, as the only difference between the two is right at the end, when the mark is put on the ground.

However, that’s 3 animations for 4 marks. Their subtlety is the point of contention, and the game has seemed to establish varying degrees of subtlety to the reads you have to make. For example, almost an entire fight with a Thief, my reads have nothing to do with the character animations and everything to do with their movement, and general timings. For Warriors, you can do a much better job of reacting to character animations, but that doesn’t mean you completely forget about the situation.

ANet has set the standard that tiny arm movements and looking at tiny icons near a player’s health bar are “good enough”, it would seem. I don’t get to know an Ele has Diamond Skin until I see if a condition lands. I have to watch the buff bar for Zerker’s Stance to see if a Warrior has condi immunity. You don’t know if an enemy has Stability without look for that ‘I’.

So with the idea that they have limited amounts of time and have to prioritize development efforts/fixes, is giving each mark it’s own unique and clearly distinguished animation really at the top of the list for you folks? If it is, do you think it’s going to pass given the fact that each has a 3/4ths second cast time already (seemingly a standard for “dodgeable” actions) and you can distinguish 2 of them based on uniqueness already?

Had they come to us in the design phase and said “Are these animations enough?” I would have said “No, that’s far too subtle in a game that is too much in motion”. However, at the current phase, I would never vote this in for a change given all the other things I’d rather see.

Marks are balanced… You have ample time to dodge them. Unlike instant hitting skills which you have significantly less time to decide what you’re going to do against. If you’re present when they are cast you have the animation of the necro to tell you what mark it is, and if not, you can likely just walk around them. On top of that, their effects have counters: abilities granting stability, invulnerability or condition immunity.

If it’s one mark, you don’t know what it is, but you can simply dodge over it or avoid it.
It there are 2 marks, you know the necro has used at least one skill with a 20s or more cd.
If there are 3 marks, you know the necro has used at least one skill with 25s or more cd. If the necro is not in combat, it is likely to include the reaper’s mark since using putrid would be a waste, meaning a 40s cd skill used.

You cannot complain that they should have a nice label telling you what will happen if you step on it because you don’t want to, in turn, use a skill with a 20s+ cd to counter the possible effects. If you want to avoid getting hit, use a skill of your own to avoid it, take a chance, or just take the damage. It’s not like they hit high anyway.

If any changes are to happen to marks, it should be a significant damage increase. The damage is terrible. Weaker than auto attacks. There’s a trait to increase the damage by 10%. Why would you want to waste a master level trait slot for the equivalent of a +0.03 skill coefficient for one skill every 6 seconds, and +0.12 for one skill every 25 seconds. That’s how low they are, and how weak they are considering the cool downs (cool downs are fine if you’re running condition). For a condition build they are going to hit low regardless, but buffing the direct damage to make staff viable for direct damage builds could be an easy method to give necro some sustainable AoE damage to be more useful in PVE content, and increase build diversity.
Yes, I know the easy counter would be “but staff is a condition weapon”. Well necro has no sustainable AoE. No cleave. This is a huge disadvantage, and buffing the staff in this way is the alternative to significant reworks and access to another weapon, which has been asked for countless times by many people for their classes, and it hasn’t been done.

Impact.2780:

There’s a trait to increase the damage by 10%. Why would you want to waste an adept level trait slot…

Spiteful Marks is a master trait! And yes, it’s a waste in every possible build.

flow.6043:

Spiteful Marks is a master trait! And yes, it’s a waste in every possible build.

Thanks for the correction! That’s what I meant lol. If it were adept it would be understandable. Every class has plenty of pointless and useless adept traits. But for master? And one of the few skills we have that grants direct damage increase (also considering we can’t stack multipliers via traits very well), it’s not allowed to be useless!

I wouldn’t touch mark animations at all. All you need to know is that its a “necro red circle” its bad for you, so don’t be there, or if you are out of dodges, get out ASAP or if immobilized in it, use well of power or purging flames or other alike ability on top of it to counter.

I certainly dont want any more elaborate animations if it contributes to lag and wastes dev time which could be spent adressing much bigger and higher priority issues.

Andele.1306:

Monoman.2068:

This two wrongs makes a right attitude makes me sick.

Actually the negative of a negative is a positive, be it math or nature.

Ha I knew someone would say that.

@ Cogbyrn: Agreed with most of everything you had to say. I’m putting down my 2 cents since it was brought up and would otherwise likely not have said anything about the subject but it’s something that I hope the developers will change if ever given the chance.

Tongku.5326:

I wouldn’t touch mark animations at all. All you need to know is that its a “necro red circle” its bad for you, so don’t be there, or if you are out of dodges, get out ASAP or if immobilized in it, use well of power or purging flames or other alike ability on top of it to counter.

I certainly dont want any more elaborate animations if it contributes to lag and wastes dev time which could be spent adressing much bigger and higher priority issues.

The problem isn’t so much the red circles, its that a Necro can cast 1 of 3 marks on top of your head, without you being able to know:
1) Where the mark is going
2) Which mark is being cast (until it lands)
3) If the mark misses or fails by getting proc’d without taking effect, which mark just went on CD

Those are very key things to understand in a game with no cast bars and that is all around managing few but key CDs. If a Necromancer is about to cast Putrid Mark, I need to know those things, because it will drastically change my response to say, Mark of Blood.

The cast times don’t need to be longer, or more “HOLY CRAP HE’S CASTING SOMETHING RUN”, but even a very toned down but different animation between all 4 marks would be really useful. Look at Reaper’s Mark, you won’t notice what is being cast unless you were already looking, but it still allows you to know what’s happening. And it hasn’t made it any weaker at all.

Bhawb.7408:

The problem isn’t so much the red circles, its that a Necro can cast 1 of 3 marks on top of your head, without you being able to know:
1) Where the mark is going
2) Which mark is being cast (until it lands)
3) If the mark misses or fails by getting proc’d without taking effect, which mark just went on CD

Those are very key things to understand in a game with no cast bars and that is all around managing few but key CDs. If a Necromancer is about to cast Putrid Mark, I need to know those things, because it will drastically change my response to say, Mark of Blood.

The cast times don’t need to be longer, or more “HOLY CRAP HE’S CASTING SOMETHING RUN”, but even a very toned down but different animation between all 4 marks would be really useful. Look at Reaper’s Mark, you won’t notice what is being cast unless you were already looking, but it still allows you to know what’s happening. And it hasn’t made it any weaker at all.

Case 1 where marks are stacked: Dodge trough them all are wasted

Case 2 where they are one after eachother: Take a second at skull, claw or snake fangs, dodge the second 2 cases or plain walk around, if you are too lazy/a thief just dodge trough trough em if you really dont wanna take oh so mighty 5k damage and a chill… (and no you cannot make the terror case since we both know you dont drop reapers mark for nothing, the cc is too valuable)

Case 3 where necro casts it on you: Difference of it and a enemy being ontop of you and using a spin2win or any other such move is? Or a Ranger using bow which you cannot dodge by animation since they are the same except for barrage and all their arrows fly at 1500 range pre half a second

Animations are one thing but all ground targeted abilities are stealth for every class. If they could see where we were about to cat the mark that would be game breaking.