Guild Wars 2

If it’s the all condition cleansing that’s the issue then fine if they limit it to 5 I would like my 25 sec CD back and decreased stack of vulnerability 5 would do the trick and obviously significant improvements for the other heals.

Ragion.2831:

Tim.6450:

Yes actally I go spite, blood magic soul reaping power necro. No curses and no transfers so CC is a nerf for me. Also how does an increased cooldown and extra vulnerability on your heal will help a condi necro when you have just cleansed your condi’s so transferring them is not a good option and the corruption trait competes with both terror and path of corruption?

Also I mained necro for at least 1 or 2 years now.

Blood magic was improved, the siphons now works through shroud and there is quite a number of them on top of all the siphon sigils and runes. Think about how much time you spend in DS, think about the reaper spec and how much healing that line alone has, the attacks are faster which affects the blood magic line, and then there is the chilling nova, chilling force and blighters boon combo.

Base necromancer must be balanced as well so no reaper.

Ragion.2831:

If you are going into blood magic then you are probably focused on healing, so not just from blood magic alone because if there is anything we know about Anet is that they dont allow players to be effective at doing any one thing using one single source.

What healing? I go rez trait (unless lesser signet only requires you hit a foe with a bleeding skill and having 4 bleed stacjs (not all from you) to proc). The warhorn trait and the well trait.

Ragion.2831:

Spite also has a healing trait and we know how fast a necro can burst with that line, so its not going to be hard to get the trait to proc often.

The fact is we kill better when the foe is at low health so we won’t proc this trait often

Imagine you are trying to balance the necro with all this in mind, are you trying to say that increasing the CD on consume conditions makes no sense?

Yes because other classes got the same types off buffs as well.

Ragion.2831:

Also one other thing, with these many changes it is possible you might have to rethink your combination. I run Curses Death Magic and Soul reaping, had a lot of success with it, more so than the meta but with all the new stuff, i will be changing it because a lot of the new traits seem to have gotten better at doing what i typically try to do. You might also have to change things up as well.

I do run curses for the warhorn trait and I ran two wells so bloodmagic is fine.

KrHome.1920:

And what would you call the massive heal options (you heal even when you’re in Shroud) you get from Bloodmagic?

Negligible?

Compared to other classes yes. Other classes get another traitline to choose from as well.

Meanwhile, nobody even put a finger on Shelter… If anything CC should have the same treatment.

Breedlove.1245:

Then just pop the CC and go into Shroud. Done. It so pointless to constantly complain about this one nerf. Its 4s. Just dodge and dodge after you use the Heal. There’s at least 2 secs down. I mean come on, we’re the masters of condition manipulation. It will still heal us all the way basically. If you spec it it has an even shorter cooldown. If you rely so heavily on this 1 skill so much than you’re not playing Necromancer right. I just think its ridiculous that we’re all focusing on this 1 little thing here.

A bad idea is a bad idea, it doesn’t matter how impactful. Every decision sets the game down a path, and this path is just strange on all accounts. It doesn’t even seem to synergize with their idea for it, being able to transfer conditions easily on a Necro.

And are you seriously telling me that it’s OK for a class to have a heal that requires the player who used the heal to counterplay an opponent by blowing both of their dodges immediately afterwards? This doesn’t sound like a bad idea to you?

Honestly, the 10% damage increase for 4 seconds probably won’t be that big of a deal. Maybe it will bait out burst and allow you to time dodges, as silly as that seems (saving burst for after an enemy heals instead of interrupting the heal and bursting?). And 10% isn’t an enormous amount. It’s just… what is going on with this change? Why? Do they think CC is too strong? Do they want the other heals to be used? Do they think Necros just don’t need reliable heals anymore because of impending expansion changes, even though Chill stacking through Reaper is going to apparently convert into Resistance for classes that have said conversion?

And CC has never healed us “all the way”. If it does, you’re packed with Conditions and you’re probably getting wrecked. I will say, one thing people always seem to forget with CC is that by removing damaging conditions, your effective heal increases by the amount that condition would have otherwise dealt, which does add up.

But why can’t we have other heals that are useful, then?

It isn’t that this is going to single-handedly break the class, per se. But it’s a big red flag. It’s nonsensical. It’s counter-intuitive.

It’s poor design, and poor design should be held to account. No matter how seemingly insignificant.

This is so funny.
Consume conditions is one of the worst heal skills. It’s also the best heal necro has!

They could have added some way of helping necros make sure they get it off. Currently they have to use line of sight, spectral walk or wurm etc. because everybody that sees them casting it gonna spam them interrupts on that huge cast time.

Adding 1 stack of stability while casting, reduce cast time, literally anything to secure them getting it off. Especially since necros are the main target cuz they so easy to kill.

Well they got 5s nerf and 10 vuln stacks.
They also seem to buff the other 2 heals which are horribly bad. It’s like venomshare buffs all over again.

If it really needed a category for the “necromancer feel” they keep talking about just make it spectral and call it Spectral Feast or whatever.
So so funny!

There is one single thing that is currently keeping my hope burning at least on a very small flame (but even if it holds true it is BS) : The changes to Blood Magic might be enough to cover the other heal’s problems, and siphoning in DS will help a little aswell.

However being pidgeonholed into BM is still bullkitten, sooo… kitten give CC the “Shelter” treatment.

Ragion.2831:

Cmon man, reaper is i would guess 3 maybe 4 months away (most likely this year) Anet is going to consider the reaper line as they make these core spec changes. They wouldn’t rebalance based on the current game then over haul everything in just a few months.

Its a little shortsighted if anyone isn’t already considering what the classes will play like when HoT drops.

When you account for what the reaper shroud is capable of traited, heals like “Your Soul is Mine” might actually be useable, more so now with some of the core changes. If you can achieve a decent amount of cleanses and toss in some of the new healing traits, It is very possible to make Consume Conditions unnecessary, maybe even a bad choice since it has a long cast time.

Honestly i want to get rid of having to use Flesh wurm and consume conditions because that cast time is a problem when facing groups of good players with stun heavy builds

It’s pure nonsense to balance a core class around the fact that you may take an optional elite spec that will never be part of the core spec. At most you rebalance the elite spec to fit in an healthy core spec profession as an option. If any Necromancer feel forced into taking the “reaper spec” then that mean the whole profession is unhealthy.

Having good base is always important. This elite spec is like if as base you had “addition” and as elite spec you were granted “multiplication”. If in your base capacity you had : 2+2 = 5 (which is wrong) what would happen to 2×2 ? Would it become 4 or 5?
Here, Necromancer core say : 2+2 = 5 and reaper say : 2×2 = 4 . This is an issue.

I think the whole point of this change was because of the way players use death shroud. Either players pop it for offensive pressure and/or pop it immediately after using consume and waiting out the cd for a very long time thanks to vital persistence. This caused a large imbalance with deathshroud which is probably the most powerful profession mechanic because it is essentially a 2nd lifebar so therefore it was either making consume have a longer cd and causing vuln+extra cond (if traited for reduced cd) to cause players to be more conservative and defensive with using death shroud or reworking deathshroud to be less useful/powerful which would have been more extreme.

This caused a large imbalance with deathshroud which is probably the most powerful profession mechanic because it is essentially a 2nd lifebar

Lost all credibility right here.

X T D.6458:

I think the whole point of this change was because of the way players use death shroud. Either players pop it for offensive pressure and/or pop it immediately after using consume and waiting out the cd for a very long time thanks to vital persistence. This caused a large imbalance with deathshroud which is probably the most powerful profession mechanic because it is essentially a 2nd lifebar so therefore it was either making consume have a longer cd and causing vuln+extra cond (if traited for reduced cd) to cause players to be more conservative and defensive with using death shroud or reworking deathshroud to be less useful/powerful which would have been more extreme.

Death shroud is not a second health bar. It’s a more a downstate then anything.People can damage a necromancer out of death shroud (it’s not that difficult either). Also how many skills/traits are used to get all that life force?

So we should now disengage before we can use this heal safely…

checks disengage options

oh.

I was confused when I first read the changes, but honestly the skill is the best heal in the game. Putting in with Corruption skills adds synergy Necromancers had trouble finding. I think people are mostly upset because the skill works less well when not traited.

I’ll add my voice to this thread. I agree this is about the worst change I’ve seen and I don’t see what the H E double hockey sticks it balances.

When I saw Consume Conditions post-patch, I immediately said, aloud, “What is this garbage?”

ANet, you can’t put an idiotic caveat like that on a skill that’s meant to get us out of trouble. That was essentially our ONLY burst heal and now we are at a severe disadvantage to other professions capable of the same without crippling themselves.

Soja.5918:

When I saw Consume Conditions post-patch, I immediately said, aloud, “What is this garbage?”

ANet, you can’t put an idiotic caveat like that on a skill that’s meant to get us out of trouble. That was essentially our ONLY burst heal and now we are at a severe disadvantage to other professions capable of the same without crippling themselves.

We complained for a week. They are determined to make us unviable.

Keep!!! Wait until meta settles down please.

I much rather see condi being useful in the game than 1 skill being OP.

Cecilia.5179:

Soja.5918:

When I saw Consume Conditions post-patch, I immediately said, aloud, “What is this garbage?”

ANet, you can’t put an idiotic caveat like that on a skill that’s meant to get us out of trouble. That was essentially our ONLY burst heal and now we are at a severe disadvantage to other professions capable of the same without crippling themselves.

We complained for a week. They are determined to make us unviable.

The funny part is we are currently at the most viable spot excluding the dumbness that was release Dhuumfire. It will propably stop soon, but there are actually pugs that want a Blood-Magic Necro, and there are quite a few Necro-Builds that are decent or more for sPvP. On the other hand, Condition Necro is pretty bad compared to every single class that has burning avaiable. “Bleeding is more readily avaiable” my kitten , on worldbosses there are constantly 10-15 burning stacks more than bleeding… Anet done kittened up there.

It is clear that burning is ridiculous right now, and classes with access to stacking 7+ burnings are terrors. That said, while we are weaker on condi builds, but we do send their condis back at them, which helps, but our access to burning does suck, and dhuumfire is terrible, thus will never be used.

In addition, what is more terrifiying are the mesmer dmg spikes, engie 100 nade (and occasional elixor rampage), and warrior rampages/spike dmg. It is ridiculous that they can spam damage like they do, while being completely immune. Its game breaking imo.

Gryph.8237:

Anet you get an f for this class and the changes. A big fat zero. If I could give you less than nothing I would.

^This.

A big fat F, and Anet gets to stand in the corner for the rest of the day.

Please revert the changes!

Yep, I tried using CC but the blind and the vulnerability essentially balance the healing out to wasted time.

This is bullcrap.

Corruptions in general are just lackluster. None are a stun breaker, and only BiP and Epidemic have some use. I was hoping Consume Conditions would become Spectral…but instead got the Corruption gimmick which is a heavy nerf. I rather it just stay baseless then like Shelter. Plague being a Well would of been a great option too.

Traited version is just outright terrible. How in the world are you supposed to transfer a BLIND if it’s just going to miss? To heck if it lowers the recharge time.

Someone may have pointed this out. If i’m duplicating, i’m sorry. i only read the front half of the thread. The replies seem to be focusing on PvP. I feel bad for the brand new player in PvE. Your starting heal is Consume C. You start with an ax and the second weapons slot doesn’t open ‘til when? level 5 ? And you can’t even trait against it until level 10? We’ve all been in fights where we bite off more than we can chew.. This poor new player is gonna hit CC in a bad fight and get puddled. Necro population, due to that frustration alone, will see a severe drop..
My main is a sylvari necro. Healing seed is the next best option in my opinion, but that is based solely on recovering health, not condi control. Non-sylvari don’t have that option. A class should not have to trait or make weapons choices based on surviving its own heal spell.

milo