Guild Wars 2

spoj.9672:

Skill 4 is one of the better skills. But its not perfect. The pulses are really slow. So for blind groups of mobs its kind of weak.

Instant cast and it’s perfect. A bit of life force gen and it’s the best skill on greatsword.

It also needs its after cast removed and radius increased. Its far too easily interrupted and it doesnt hit very reliably. Id make it pulse more frequently for the same total duration as well.

spoj.9672:

It also needs its after cast removed and radius increased. Its far too easily interrupted and it doesnt hit very reliably. Id make it pulse more frequently for the same total duration as well.

You mean like eight 1 second pulses ?!

4 would be great if it didn’t have a massive aftercast

Imo, skill 4 is the only thing good in there.
Auto atks are too slow and not hit hard enough.
Gravedigger – just dagger auto atk, please.
Skill 3 – range so short that you’ll miss it 99% of times.
Skill 4 – good against thief/warr and for stomping.
Skill 5 – no … just no!

Feels too clunky. Auto attack needs decreased cast times for how much damage it produces, just not enough. Gravedigger needs a lower cast time as well and less after cast. Its decent but not there yet. Death spiral is fine I think, a bit wonky and looks like it misses but then hits, its odd (it says its 170 range but it maybe more idk but 170 is definitely too short). Nightfall needs a shorter aftercast, definitely not as fast as mes mind spike like Robert Gee said. Grasping Darkness has some pathing issues, its very inconsistent and misses frequently. Other than this, it has potential but definitely in need of some tweaks.

Called this a while ago.

Great sword is flawed. Necro does not have scaling defense. It does not belong in the front line unless the payback is stellar. But its not. Not to mention you have great melee already with shroud so its redundant.

Reaper shroud, total awesomeness.

Reaper without greatsword = win.

Lopez.7369:

I’m not sure what you guys mean. The greatsword autoattack takes about 0.4 seconds longer than dagger autoattack and does about the same damage. But it’s also a bigger cleave, and it applies chill.

You’re high if you think GS AA takes 2.6s to complete. Its 2.5s with just basic cast times, in reality much longer.

well i got in and played with it a bit…love RS, wish i could make the builds I want, but they went overboard i think with all the nerfs to chill for us, as well as the IcD on Chilling force. The GS skills do way too little damage for their casting times. And the shouts…well….I want to like them, think they have potential, but needs some recharge tweaks. And we still need projectile destruction on something other than RS2.

BUT the good thing is, this is a beta, so it’s the best time to push the issues we have to get them worked out. And overall, I do like reaper a lot, i just need more play time and more options to build other than what we have with the beta equipment.

I will say something weird maybe, but I’m very happy the GS does so bad in PvP. The life force generation is just too small except in “optimal” situation (i.e. every enemy nicely aligned for your nr 3) and the skills are just too slow to be efficient in melee range.

I am happy because I am optimist. I don’t feel like the overall design is bad, I just feel that the damage is just too low (and maybe a tiny bit faster would be good). I believe that we can safely ask for as high as 25% increased damage (in particular for gravedigger) to have any chance of being used in PvP.

And that would mean that both dagger and GS have their niche: dagger = fast LF + “safe”-hitting, GS = if you do a bad move and get caught, you’re dead. And that will mean that GS can be used in PvE to increase significantly our DPS without breaking the PvP balance.

Lopez.7369:

No need to be so aggressive! I could just be wrong, but it feels like 2.6 seconds to me.

If that’s true, they can reduce the cast time or aftercast. But the damage doesn’t seem that far out of line for me for a beta, especially since greatsword seems like it was always meant to be an execute weapon through Gravedigger.

Not being aggressive, just suggesting a wee bit less drugs

But yeah, I’m guessing Reaper is around 3.5s for the total cast time, based on me having about a 2.5s chill and there being about a 1s dropoff. The damage isn’t the problem, in fact if it was 2.6s for the full time the damage would be just fine, the problem is we need to make that chain a bit faster, and also the chill needs to cover a full chain.

Gravedigger is another matter, it needs a full reset and a lot more damage.

My only dilemma is how much GS should be buffed. Doing a bit of math, I found out that the dagger auto is 25% more damage than the GS auto, and 34% more than gravedigger spam.

Immediately I jumped onto “10% AA, 33% increase chill duration, 35% bonus to gravedigger, gravedigger fully recharges”. That would in a perfect world, provide a sense of balance between the two weapons, where the dagger has a higher sustained AA, but the greatsword can match it on enemies at <50% health.

But in the real world, attacks get interrupted frequently, and the reaper doesn’t have invulnerability. So now, I’m not sure if I should buff it more.

spoj.9672:

sniperman.1738:

idk why ppl say the reaper is bad honestly I haven’t had any issues with it, there is such a thing as you can’t learn how to play a class right away in just a couple of minutes or an hour, the reaper is a learning curve some catch on right away and know exactly how to use it and kick butt and have 0 issues with it. I know I don’t see any issue with the current Reaper to me it feels smooth and fine if you know how to use it right.

This isnt about learning. This is a numbers and feeling issue. It feels too slow to be fun. And it feels far too weak for how slow it is. And the numbers prove that that is completely true.

They specifically said that GS would be slow but hit harder to compensate. This is not true currently.

That’s my issue with GS atm. It’s just not really fun, because it’s too slow and clunky. If it hit harder I could get over how disjointed it feels, but as it stands shiro Rev is far more fun.

RS though is wonderful. The only problem power was #5, and once I figured that out it was nice enough.

Reaper is great for in and out cleaving. It doesn’t really feel tough enough to be a full on frontliner, but rather a skirmisher.

Lopez.7369:

Reaper’s Shroud, however, seems great. I’m interested in seeing DPS numbers for it.

There is not a single thing in this game as satisfying as executing someone with a 9k crit Executioner’s Strike.

Edit: GS AA chain is 3 seconds, if it was sped up a little bit and say 2.5s base chill I think it would be solid.

Time is everything and so far it’s exactly as many predicted, so many skills are way to bloody slow to be effective against a moving AI and a player. Please stop thinking chill compensates, it just doesn’t….at all!

Maybe the problem lies with the dagger. Necro weapons were designed to have terribad auto attacks, I mean look at Staff Scepter Axe and Greatsword….
Dagger needs a nerf to be on par with his terribad counterparts

/sarcasm

Silverkey.2078:

I will say something weird maybe, but I’m very happy the GS does so bad in PvP. The life force generation is just too small except in “optimal” situation (i.e. every enemy nicely aligned for your nr 3) and the skills are just too slow to be efficient in melee range.

I am happy because I am optimist. I don’t feel like the overall design is bad, I just feel that the damage is just too low (and maybe a tiny bit faster would be good). I believe that we can safely ask for as high as 25% increased damage (in particular for gravedigger) to have any chance of being used in PvP.

And that would mean that both dagger and GS have their niche: dagger = fast LF + “safe”-hitting, GS = if you do a bad move and get caught, you’re dead. And that will mean that GS can be used in PvE to increase significantly our DPS without breaking the PvP balance.

Problem is the Greatsword has no niche. I have no reason to switch to it from dagger if both equipped. Even if i am trying to finish somebody off, the dagger and offhand is still superior to GS in every way. The sluggishness of it makes it useless in SPvP. In WvW maybe… because anything can be useful in a zerg. But when people are cordinated with their attacks such as SPvP you are dead meet.

in PvE i cant find a use for it. Npc hit too hard and just too slow and sluggish for action combat.

a weapon like this may work on a mmo without action combat because attacks dont miss. But not here.

Lopez.7369:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

My only dilemma is how much GS should be buffed. Doing a bit of math, I found out that the dagger auto is 25% more damage than the GS auto, and 34% more than gravedigger spam.

If this is true, then greatsword definitely needs buffs. Gravedigger should do way more damage than dagger autoattack. I think it should get you to about 17,000 DPS just to be in-line with engineers and elementalists (at least during an execute phase).

Seems like I’m wrong and the weapon will need DPS buffs across the board.

Reaper’s Shroud, however, seems great. I’m interested in seeing DPS numbers for it.

I broke down the math in another thread. Here is the method I used to obtain the base numbers. Here is the method I used to obtain the attack animation rates.

The results that came back were horrible. And that is the math only. As other people will attest, the long animation times means that their skills get interrupted way to often, whether it is to dodge or by enemy action. So the GS is weaker than the math shows.

For RS, I’m tackling a bug that I do not understand at the moment. When I first took an AA survey, it came back with the same time as the greatsword. Every subsequent trail came back at 49 seconds, whether Reaper’s Onslaught was equipped or not. Anyway, the numbers for RS came back as follows

Relevant DPS: 397, which is 23% less than the dagger AA. The good news is that RS has a myriad of relevant traits that boost it up, such as vulnerability on hit, might on hit, rending shroud, deathly perception or dhuumfire, etc. So, once reaper’s onslaught is fixed and the whole thing gets a 15% speed boost, then RS will be more than competitive with the dagger.

This is moot, though, since RS doesn’t replace the dagger. There is one complaint, though: Soul Spiral currently takes twice as long than listed, lasting 4 seconds instead of two.

I’m underwhelmed and very disappointed. The reality is there is no sustained dps and still no way to break off, catch anything nor finish. Reaper and Necro are destined to stay this way until someone understands the math on a static object cannot match live game play…sigh.

AA is good dmg and nice cleave just way to slow
Gravedigger cast time should be reduced some (but I like this skill)
3 is very weak imho
Nightfall is best GS skill hand down
Grasp its main issue is the range I would say (maybe 900)

just my view after a evening n some more (sleep? nah)

Greatsword really some hard work, Anet.
Only place where it works is Pve.

Lynnie.7213:

Greatsword really some hard work, Anet.
Only place where it works is Pve.

Anything works in PvE.

Any classes in this game are super for pve

My 2 mos old can pve with the best

It’s Pvp that reaper he is terrible. And ghee needs to go to ram for wow as he’s doing a terrible job for this community

Sagat.3285:

Lynnie.7213:

Greatsword really some hard work, Anet.
Only place where it works is Pve.

Anything works in PvE.

Exactly my point!

punahou.3986:

Any classes in this game are super for pve

My 2 mos old can pve with the best

It’s Pvp that reaper he is terrible. And ghee needs to go to ram for wow as he’s doing a terrible job for this community

Well he seems to have done well by the mes community; won’t see (m)any tears there. Also posts like yours are the reason we see very little dev attention in these forums, so please don’t insult the only dev willing to even post here now, thanks.

As for PvE, yes a child can do it in it’s current iteration and we will have to see what comes up with HoT. The GS is still far to chunky a weapon to even bother with in PvE as the dagger/wh is not only quicker, but offers commensurate (better) damage to the GS.

Lopez.7369:

I’m not sure what you guys mean. The greatsword autoattack takes about 0.4 seconds longer than dagger autoattack and does about the same damage. But it’s also a bigger cleave, and it applies chill.

I think the idea with greatsword will always be to use it as a cleave or execute, while using dagger for targets that are above 50 percent. And Reaper’s Shroud, which seems to be better damage than both dagger and greatsword, will be used as long as you have more than 50 percent life force. That makes sense to me.

PvP is a different story, where greatsword and dagger will likely compete for a slot. But I think greatsword stands a good chance here due to the execute, although its poor life force generation might hold it back.

If the weapon and skills it brings cant stand on their own, i think this has no place as an elite spec.

Changing Shroud skills is not worth a trait line, its worth a grand master trait, that is it.

The issue with reaper is 2 fold, one GS 1 needs to have it’s full cast time adjusted the cast animations make it take to long, gs 5 needs a 750-900 range.

Second is shouts, right now I have found no real use for them, I tried for 5 hours last might to find a way to make them a better choice then either wells or spectral skills. I just couldnt. Not that they didn’t have a use, I did use them and I like would even use the elite shout if it didn’t have a 2 minute cooldown.

The Reaper is really just reaper shroud so you want to have skills that get you life force and prolong your time in RS. I fewould like the reaper spec needs to go into spite for the synergy and you need to go into soul reaping for the shroud skills

Greatsword lifeforce regen is so bad. You’d think it would be better. I feel like for a shroud spec I wouldn’t even bother using the GS.

After testing greatsword bit more my impression improved by bit but only by a little bit it feels rather incomplete.

No4. feels like it lacks the range that tooltip says it have and considering the after cast i’d love that its ranged like wells considering how similar it is to well skills maybe not 900 range
No3. feels off in both animation and its effect i have hard time hitting more then 1 enemy in pve maybe if it had some range indication like when you cast certain GS skill on warrior
No2. just sux really cast time on pair with 2x auto attack with just about same dmg i mean what is the point, aoe?
Still on pair with aa only positive thing is combo finisher as i cant think of any whirl combo finisher on necro
No5. sound great on tooltip i mean poison + 600 range aoe pull well if it really worked like that it probably would be. Pull part is rather unreliable for some reason it does its job really bad as in stuff never gets pulled to me even when i make sure that there is nothing between me and my target.

Sagat.3285:

Lynnie.7213:

Greatsword really some hard work, Anet.
Only place where it works is Pve.

Anything works in PvE.

The ironic thing is, with the copious amount of self interrupting needed to survive, Greatsword doesn’t work in PVE either.

When i get home i am going to try to make GS work out in SPvP….

Knighthonor.4061:

When i get home i am going to try to make GS work out in SPvP….

Not possible, good luck though.

The ammount of times i tried to use GS in the opening story was just ruff. trying to melee peopel was not a good idea. So i went with staff a well and 2 shouts guess what. Crushed skulls as i went to the bank. What bothers me the most is the fact that GS is just weak on auto attacks the CD for 5 and other skills cant justify the low fail Gain for RS. RS is nice the dps feels good, but its odd that when in RS i lose more RS points per cast even auto attacks. This is just odd even with sloted lose less points when in Shroud. So that skill is not wokring as intended.
GS 1 auto attack is just lame and needs super loves, for the 3 hits and slow damage its a joke really your better off with dagger and Ohand

EDIT: before you blast me, I agree it needs a damage buff.

It’s not “bad”. It’s very fun to play at least, so you can’t say it’s bad.
It also has some very cool mechanics.
It just needs a damage buff to be AT LEAST on par with dagger.
Same for reaper shroud (that is also very fun to use, good job devs).

1. and # 2 either need more damage or shorter cast/aftercast. number 3 could use more damage but could stay as is if they buff #1 &/or #2 I actually like #4 and #5 idk what to think of it.
   Now reapershroud… ILOVEIT<3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Knighthonor.4061:

When i get home i am going to try to make GS work out in SPvP….

It worked the first 4h when people didn’t know the tells and you could set them up with GS5 and GS4. Now good luck at hitting anything with the massive cast and animation times. Same thing for shouts. The elite was actually fun, but now you are interrupted when they hear the shout. So the damage is applied and the skill goes in full cooldown, but the stun effect is interrupted.

I kinda feel like Gravedigger should hit a lot harder with the windup it has. Or hit more than once. Even if they doubled the number of hits I feel it wouldn’t be great, let alone OP.

Tasao.4623:

I kinda feel like Gravedigger should hit a lot harder with the windup it has. Or hit more than once. Even if they doubled the number of hits I feel it wouldn’t be great, let alone OP.

I would really love a second spin immediately following the first with the same damage coef. Because avoiding it is one thing and I think it is part of the design (high cast but high power, right now the power is missing) but it can also be blinded/blocked so easily, which would be fixed by the second turn.

I’m not normally a necromancer main, i have one i like him and hes fun when i want to play him.

that being said wow, the reaper is so slow i get the great sword having to be a heavy weighty option for the class, but holy crap i could run to the fridge grab a soda and come back to my pc and my auto attack still would not be done casting. if it could be sped up just a bit id be fine. i came into playing reaper thinking it’ll be like holding a hammer on a guardian but its as if the reaper took a look at a hammer guard and thought “woah slow down speed racer!” and decided to take his time to pantomime his attacks before doing them then stopping to reflect on what he just did with a very long after cast.

the chill traits are very inconsequential and i have no reason to use them, and i think the healing shout is so underpowered that i might as well just keep consume conditions. “Rise” needs to be re-worked because i have no reason to use minions and its a wasted utility absolutely not worth my time. “chilled to the bone” this i like this i can keep, might need some work on the cast time but ill take it at this point.

Reaper shroud i love this please give me this now, its great.

cheers~

Greatsword itsel feels like wielding a hammer on classes like Warrior or Guardian but with completely sub-par utility attached to it.

Chill as a whole even fully traited is barely noticeable, only the ‘Chilled to the bone’ shout does something significant, but the Cooldown is way too high.