Guild Wars 2

Reaper’s might (Spite trait): Shroud skill 1 grants might.

In my opinion this is one of the main aspects that make Necromancers selfish and is probably one of the most important traits this class has for shroud builds. But this trait is located in the Spite tree, which I think is removing any build diversity.

With the release of Reaper shroud, the Necromancer’s shroud finally started to deal some damage. However this requires the Reaper trait line and the Soul Reaping trait line (Dhuumfire and Vital Persistence). Because of this only one choice of trait line remains. However the might from the spite trait line alone already gives around 45% damage increase at level 80, making it a very bad choice to pick any other trait line.

Would it be better if Reaper’s might would be placed somewhere else? My idea would be to make it base line. Either having reduces base duration and that the spite line increases might duration. Or not changing its duration, but applying self vulnerability. The spire trait line can then have a stacking buff based on the number of vulnerability stacks on yourself. Or a buff based on the number of vulnerability stacks that have been cleansed.

I find spite traitline underwhelming. The only good enough trait is Close to Death.
As for the might, Shroud#1 grants might per skill use, not per strike. So if you attack 3 enemies and strike them 5 times, you still get only 5 might. Siphoned power gives 2 stacks of might per enemy, but when he has less than 50%hp, so just when we want to stop our aa and start gravedigger. Death’s embrace is even worse since the treshhold is 33%hp. with gravedigger we hardly see any additional vulnerability.

I personally learned how to stop relying on spite and took Death magic instead, adding sigil of strength, Chilling victory trait from reaper line over decimate defenses, and Ghost Pepper Popper food (40% for might on crit at day and 40% to cause chill at night). With mix of cavalier/assasin/berserker gear i have 2520power in shroud, same amount outside it if i take signet of spite, 51%cc, 205%cd and 3k armor, not mentioning protection when leaving shroud and beautiful condi cleanse. Personal might stack is around 15stacks on single target and 25 on multiple. Gravedigger hits a bit weaker than with spite but it is still good enough. Comparing to Brazil’s video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kNEL3Q8Jl0
when he hits with non-crit gravedigger he hits for 6k. I hit with 4,5k non-crit without spite signet so it’s still worth taking. If you’re interested then i link you my build:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQJARWnMbCV2gdbCubC0biFrBTKAEyKZxZwQYJkaFEDmUA-ThCBABV8EAMUXQXKJGVNgKVJ5MlgYt/oEDgLBgXKHyUVDCBweLA-e

With Corrupter’s Fervor you get 3k armor, easy obtainable with just gs #3. You can switch to sigil of force/night instead of accuracy and still have 95%cc in shroud. Ghost Pepper Popper cost around 4,5 silver

Currently with completely skipping spite we are selfish and not even self sustaining anymore.

Hmmm… If the duration of the might from chilling victory would become 15 seconds, then there is also finally a difficult choice between this and decimated defenses. And that would lower the need for Spite for shroud builds.

Ghost pepper popper seems like a bad idea, because against a single target is only gives around 4 stacks on might. The best power food gives 100 power and 70 ferocity, which is nearly 175 stats or equal to 7 stacks of might.

Azzumy.7685:

Ghost pepper popper seems like a bad idea, because against a single target is only gives around 4 stacks on might. The best power food gives 100 power and 70 ferocity, which is nearly 175 stats or equal to 7 stacks of might.

And yet this is good when using blighter’s boon. With rune of strength we can get longer might duration but what is important to me (especially after BB nerf/change) is might ticking. I just posted a good way to have self sustain without taking spite, since most ppl think this is the only way to make this trait worth something.

What!? Spite is our best damage line! Perma 25 Might and I think 16/8 Vuln while in Death Shroud with a whole 20% damage modifier?! The minors aren’t fantastic, but they are usable. The only “meh” trait in my eyes is the Spiteful Spirit one. (And I guess the axe one – just because axe is “meh”)

I’m just getting tired of the ol’ one two combo of SR and Spite. Narrows my options and with the copious amounts of might being thrown around I often have 15-25 stacks anyway. I use SR and curses.

Way too strong of a trait to be baseline in my opinion. I say we keep it the way it is since it makes taking the Spite line appealing.

We could just find ways to make the other lines just as appealing too to up build diversity instead of killing a strong trait line by making one of its key traits become baseline.

I’ve always thought they should move some of the might out of spite and into other lines. As of now, 90% Of pvp builds are spite/sR/reaper, and I don’t think that’s fun or healthy build diversity.

I used to feel like Spite was too overloaded on might, but after using a bit I honestly think its fair, and other lines should just be boosted on their own merit without hitting spite.

Spite’s boosts are heavily loaded onto low health and shroud, which is really conditional setups, and also nicely themed. Having a lot of shroud buffs is nice, because it allows for the Spite/Soul Reaping pair for builds that heavily rely on Shroud as a DPS form, and use normal weapons as utility. Its a unique style, and I think it should be preserved, and I also think it is perfectly reasonable because while strong, it is specifically strong in its niche (against low health targets, or while in shroud).

Other traitlines should definitely be looked at on their own. I’d much rather they be brought up to Spite’s level, especially on a thematic level with Spite having a nicely cohesive setup and both strong and fun traits. And I don’t think this would imbalance anything considering our slightly substandard place at the moment.

Bhawb.7408:

I used to feel like Spite was too overloaded on might, but after using a bit I honestly think its fair, and other lines should just be boosted on their own merit without hitting spite.

Spite’s boosts are heavily loaded onto low health and shroud, which is really conditional setups, and also nicely themed. Having a lot of shroud buffs is nice, because it allows for the Spite/Soul Reaping pair for builds that heavily rely on Shroud as a DPS form, and use normal weapons as utility. Its a unique style, and I think it should be preserved, and I also think it is perfectly reasonable because while strong, it is specifically strong in its niche (against low health targets, or while in shroud).

Other traitlines should definitely be looked at on their own. I’d much rather they be brought up to Spite’s level, especially on a thematic level with Spite having a nicely cohesive setup and both strong and fun traits. And I don’t think this would imbalance anything considering our slightly substandard place at the moment.

Pretty much what I think.

Do fellow necros seriously want to see us get nerfed again (messing with the strong spite trait line), or do you guys want other trait lines to be just as strong so we have tougher choices to make when building?

Bhawb.7408:

I used to feel like Spite was too overloaded on might, but after using a bit I honestly think its fair, and other lines should just be boosted on their own merit without hitting spite.

Spite’s boosts are heavily loaded onto low health and shroud, which is really conditional setups, and also nicely themed. Having a lot of shroud buffs is nice, because it allows for the Spite/Soul Reaping pair for builds that heavily rely on Shroud as a DPS form, and use normal weapons as utility. Its a unique style, and I think it should be preserved, and I also think it is perfectly reasonable because while strong, it is specifically strong in its niche (against low health targets, or while in shroud).

Other traitlines should definitely be looked at on their own. I’d much rather they be brought up to Spite’s level, especially on a thematic level with Spite having a nicely cohesive setup and both strong and fun traits. And I don’t think this would imbalance anything considering our slightly substandard place at the moment.

Yeah that’s a good point. Anything that gives us more viable build diversity besides spite/SR in nearly every build is good.

Bhawb.7408:

I used to feel like Spite was too overloaded on might, but after using a bit I honestly think its fair, and other lines should just be boosted on their own merit without hitting spite.

Spite’s boosts are heavily loaded onto low health and shroud, which is really conditional setups, and also nicely themed. Having a lot of shroud buffs is nice, because it allows for the Spite/Soul Reaping pair for builds that heavily rely on Shroud as a DPS form, and use normal weapons as utility. Its a unique style, and I think it should be preserved, and I also think it is perfectly reasonable because while strong, it is specifically strong in its niche (against low health targets, or while in shroud).

Other traitlines should definitely be looked at on their own. I’d much rather they be brought up to Spite’s level, especially on a thematic level with Spite having a nicely cohesive setup and both strong and fun traits. And I don’t think this would imbalance anything considering our slightly substandard place at the moment.

I’m okay with Spite’s might generation because of how it is conditional it is. Curses seems to be our weakest line imo and it needs some love.

The problem is see is that Reaper’s might has as condition that you have to be in shroud. In order to make shroud a viable option you need the Reaper trait line and the Soul Reaping trait line.

Should there be 3 trait lines that affect the Shroud so much?

Azzumy.7685:

The problem is see is that Reaper’s might has as condition that you have to be in shroud. In order to make shroud a viable option you need the Reaper trait line and the Soul Reaping trait line.

Should there be 3 trait lines that affect the Shroud so much?

I think there should be 6 trait lines that affect shroud so much. Shroud is our main mechanic, and as such each traitline should do something significant to it

Azzumy.7685:

The problem is see is that Reaper’s might has as condition that you have to be in shroud. In order to make shroud a viable option you need the Reaper trait line and the Soul Reaping trait line.

Should there be 3 trait lines that affect the Shroud so much?

You don’t need Reaper at all for shroud, it actually provides very little to shroud compared to other trait lines, besides changing shroud itself. Soul Reaping will obviously be taken in any shroud build, which is fine since that’s somewhat assumed. And still, Spite only has 3 shroud related traits (one of which you don’t take in shroud builds anyway).

Shroud traits:
Spite – 3
Curses – 3
Death Magic – 5
Blood Magic – 3
Soul Reaping – 6 (3 of which are GM)
Reaper – 3

So overall our shroud based traits are pretty fairly spread out. Furthermore, they all are pretty thematically fitting, spite relates to damage, curses is crit/condi, death magic is defense, blood magic is support, and soul reaping has general shroud traits.

The issue with these lines is that unlike spite/soul reaping, they don’t combo well into a full build. Blood Magic wants to support, but it lacks the weapons to back that playstyle up. Death Magic wants to be a bunker, but lacks strong enough defensive traiting to fill that out. And finally, since ANet refuses to give us strong non-shroud defenses (the only exception is MM), Soul Reaping is required on too many builds.

But again, those are all issues that the trait lines themselves should have addressed. As an example, if Death Magic is supposed to be our core defensive tree, why doesn’t it have strong enough defensive traits to enable defensive builds without relying on Soul Reaping?