Guild Wars 2

As a whole I’m pleased with the mechanics and overall play style of the Scourge. It feels very different and it has good potential in both pve and pvp, also it seems strong with both power and condi damage.

Scourge as support Role.
Why take Scourge as support in a pve group? It need to be at least on par with the Tempest or even better. Its potential must be as strong, so people can maybe consider taking 1 druid and 1 scourge in raids and other organized groups. If its anything less it will never really see any play outside of solo pve.

Here are few suggestions for changes I find fit.

Barriers.

Degeneration must start after a period of time, 5 to 8s. Decrease the degeneration rate by 50%!
Barriers are suppose to be proactive healing, but as they are right now this role is not there. We lose half the potential with instant degeneration. I don’t want to use the barrier and forget about it, but I need to have at least few sec of full potential time frame. In all other games that use similar mechanics, all the similar skills have some duration on their barriers. Not only that, but most not only prevent damage, but also convert some of that damage into healing.

Torch:

-Harrowing Wave: Additionally, grant 5% LF and 2% LF per target hit.
-Oppressive Collapse: Unblockable.

Punishments:

-Sand Flare: Pretty good. Make it 300 radius, Scourge is support after all.
Trail of Anguish: I want it to feel more like Slick Shoes. Apply Burning 2s./per sec. to targets standing in the trail, apply Immobilize for 3sec with its final pulse.
-Dessicate: Should give 5% LF and additionally 4% per target hit/Up to 5 targets, 360 radius.
-Sand Swell: ¼ or even instant cast time! 1200 – 1500 range! The port is good, but especially its range is not enough. We desperately need more.
-Serpent Siphon: Very weak skill or maybe it’s bugged atm?! Make it to pulse 5 times, 1 pulse/sec. Radius 360. Pulsing snakes that deal damage and inflict poison. Cast barrier and corrupt 1 boon with the initial and with the final pulse.
-Ghastly Breach: Need to be aura around the necro with 240 radius(Like old Plague). Or its essentially another Plaguelands, but weaker with the exception of the boon conversion. To niche.

Shade Skills:

This are some ideas for an additional effects that add survivability and add more Shade management. Because even the mechanic is sound its clunky and very hard to use when you or your target is moving constantly.

-Manifest Sand Shade: Make them recharge much faster outside of combat!
-Nefarious Favor: Add flip skill: Destroy the Shade that is furthest away from the necro, reduce next shade cd by 33%.
-Sand Cascade: Add flip skill: Teleport to closest Shade and gain weak barrier (around 1k hp). Affects only the necro. (maybe ICD, once every 12sec so it can be used every other cast of F3)
-Garish Pillar: Additionally, all active Sand Shades and the necro get projectile destruction domes around them, 180 radius for 5sec.
-Desert Shroud: Add flip skill: Destroys all Sand Shades and reduce their cd by 66%

Traits:

My ideas here are mostly oriented toward the support part of the trait lines.

-Abrasive Gift: Also, adds 5sec of Regeneration to barriers.
-Fell Beacon: -
-Nourishing Rot: Additionally, grants 2% LF for every target affected by Torment or Burning (5-8 ICD per target). Up to 5 targets
-Sand Soul: -
-Desert Empowerment: Also, heal for 20% of the prevented damage. (Healing Power modifier)
-Sadistic Searing: Quite weak for people running Non-Punishment Utilities. Maybe add additional bonus if no Punishments are used.
-Unending Corruption: Also steal the corrupted boon.
-Blood as Sand: -
-Sand Savant: -
-Demonic Lore: Lower ICD to 2s. Increase Burn duration to 4s(best split pvp/pve)
-Feed from Corruption: -

PS: As many already stated, traits concerning “entering shroud/exiting shroud/manipulating shroud” need to be changed or they wont be used.

I agree with the radius increase for Sand Flare and the range increase for Sand Swell but the rest sounds just ridiculously OP.

The change for Harrowing Wave and Dessicate are at least going in the right direction but your LF values just way to high.

Ghastly Breach would be to strong as an aura considering that Sand Shroud already is one, but changing it to a low range (shorter then wells) ground target, so you can better place it onto a node, whiteout having to stand in the center yourself, would be great.

And the whole barrier discussion here and anywhere is just short sided. Barrier is not just “the think that replaces necro shroud” it’s a new gameplay mechanic and we are NOT the only once getting access to it.

mazut.4296:

Trail of Anguish: I want it to feel more like Slick Shoes.

You want to limit it to 1 hit per target?

Glott.7239:

And the whole barrier discussion here and anywhere is just short sided. Barrier is not just “the think that replaces necro shroud” it’s a new gameplay mechanic and we are NOT the only once getting access to it.

Barrier is too clumsy to use for scourge most of the times. If you see a low health ally you need to waste 0,75 seconds to cast the shade, you have to predict where hes moving because the range is so limited and then you have to get the timing right to prevent damage.

The decay is fine for classes that give that effect to themself, without the need to precast other skills and paying attention to your teammates. In the current literation the most barrier comes from placing a shade, and using a shade skill. If all people are clustered this isnt an issue, but this isn’t the case in pvp and isn’t the case in roaming, even in PvE this isnt the case some times as people need to split up or spread out. Its not like a druid that can instantly threw a few heals over there to that ally within 1200 range, its a delayed application, with a dimishing effect.

Either the effect must be much bigger, or the dimishing effect much lower to compensate. The application oi too sluggish for a rather fast paced game, at least IF you decently wanna support your allies with it. You get all the effects just fine, though, it’s very limiting for supporting allies.

I just add my suggestions here:

Torch

• Harrowing Wave : Should get a sequence skill to call the wave back, causing conditions again, including the scourge. For synergy with the f2 and potential condi transfers.

• Opressive Collaps : Unblockable, and castable while moving / without the need to face the target.

Punishment Skills:

• Sand Flare: Should be a 900 range ground target. If you aim at a shade you port to that shade and provide the effects there, is you dont target a shade it works just like now.

• Serpent Siphon: Should be an AoE Poison field that actually deals damage. Its weak right now.

Traits:

• Sand Savant: Should share 50% of the minor trait effects with allies, providing 7,5% condi duration, boon duration and reduced damage.

• Abrasive Gift: Ditch the might, add regeneration or blind.

• Sadistic Searing: Replace the burn on shade summon with something different. You don’t pick these skills for their condi application, its makes no sense.

• Nourishing Rot : Reduce icd to 2 seconds

• Sadistic Searing reduce icd to 1 or remove icd in PvE only.

Shade Skills:

They need something defensive thats not hard limited to healing power, or condi remove. Like stability, protection, blind, weakness or mobility. Maybe in form of sequence skills, like OP mentioned.

Glott.7239:

I agree with the radius increase for Sand Flare and the range increase for Sand Swell but the rest sounds just ridiculously OP.

The change for Harrowing Wave and Dessicate are at least going in the right direction but your LF values just way to high.

Ghastly Breach would be to strong as an aura considering that Sand Shroud already is one, but changing it to a low range (shorter then wells) ground target, so you can better place it onto a node, whiteout having to stand in the center yourself, would be great.

And the whole barrier discussion here and anywhere is just short sided. Barrier is not just “the think that replaces necro shroud” it’s a new gameplay mechanic and we are NOT the only once getting access to it.

This are just ideas and I hope somebody from the dev team is reading all posts on the forums. Because I’m pretty sure they can get ideas for us and even sometimes implement them. You see you even put an idea, by turning the elite into ground target, which is better then what it is atm.
About the barriers, this is probably my favorite way of healing and the most interesting and engaging I found in any game i have played. Its different then direct healing and Im talking from experience here, more or less. The current barrier state is not good enough.

Too many stuff you suggested that will make this spec stronger then it should be.

I agree about the torch.
Garish Pillar would replace the fear for the dome to make it not too strong.
Barrier: make Healing power a stat that delay Barrier degeneration and Vitality stat that add max Barrier(instead of healing power).

Sandrox.9524:

Too many stuff you suggested that will make this spec stronger then it should be.

I agree about the torch.
Garish Pillar would replace the fear for the dome to make it not too strong.
Barrier: make Healing power a stat that delay Barrier degeneration and Vitality stat that add max Barrier(instead of healing power).

I seriously think Scourge should have some way of destroying existing shades to replace them faster, where they are needed. Its pretty clunky in an action game with constant movement and dodges.

mazut.4296:

I seriously think Scourge should have some way of destroying existing shades to replace them faster, where they are needed. Its pretty clunky in an action game with constant movement and dodges.

I get what you mean but resource and therefore shade management is part of this specs gameplay. Maybe a functionality like this could be rolled into Serpent Siphon which feels quite at the moment anyway.

Barrier would be better if it pulsed it’s total amount instead of being frontloaded like it currently is. This would also extend the lifespan of barrier, as pulses refresh the duration. (Eg. Ele’s Molten Armor) 5k over 2sec, would be easier to work with than 5k that decays rather quick – as a good chunk of the effect is lost almost instantaneously. The alternative is to decrease decay time/amount as others have suggested.

Absorption effects are best used as a proactive device instead of reactive like standard heals are. If you can anticipate incoming damage, absorption effects can be very strong – and make for good support.

Don’t touch anything, it’s already awesome, barier works as intended and anet will not change it for sure… decay after 5s hah ;d that would be crazy op…
Maybe change Dessicate? Should it not be Desiccate? It should drain life force from more targets – now it’s mostly useful in pvp to stack life force before match :/

mazut.4296:

Sandrox.9524:

Too many stuff you suggested that will make this spec stronger then it should be.

I agree about the torch.
Garish Pillar would replace the fear for the dome to make it not too strong.
Barrier: make Healing power a stat that delay Barrier degeneration and Vitality stat that add max Barrier(instead of healing power).

I seriously think Scourge should have some way of destroying existing shades to replace them faster, where they are needed. Its pretty clunky in an action game with constant movement and dodges.

It is not that hard I mean in spvp you have cap points there is no much room for movement if you want to stay on point, in wvw granted on big fights there is alot of movement but it all comes down to experience where to put them like when you put wells. in Pve Raids I dont know much but I think most fights are close to boss and there is alot of stacking so movement is somewhat limited with the range the shades got. Wasn’t a real problem to me when I tried it.

i think scourge is in a good spot offensively.

defensively on the other hand, it wouldn’t hurt to help it a tiny bit.

(condi clear is fine)

barrier however seems a bit non existent for anyone not running celestial or any other heal power gear. even in full celestial, the ratios seem weak. . . maybe that’s fair. but, the decay is insanely short. possibly pair it with your heal power in a negative way? much like regeneration’s positive but opposite? should slow it to a reasonable decay rate. (im just spitballing here)

shade mechanic is lackluster, i found it easier to use sand savant in zerg scenarios. i know you lose expertise per shade, but the larger radius made it easier to apply considerable pressure on zergs. demonic lore was useful in SMC lord fights being able to cover all 3 hallways, and mid

honestly that’s it.. i mainly WvW so i have no perspective on Spvp
and until pve is tested(crossing fingers) i don’t have an opinion there. but, so far it seems solid on dps..

and no i don’t think it’s overpowered.. just unknown, people will figure out how to counter it eventually.

I feel pigeonholed on traits. Some traits are clearly meant for core necromancer/reaper and are super underwhelming on scourge, some are really strong on scourge.

I couldn’t test it in WvW and I see people say there are no problems with LF regen, but outside I found that we need another source of LF. Maybe we will be forced into dagger/x after all. Will see…