Guild Wars 2

Rennoko,

you hit the nail right on the head. Necro, with its slow speed, lack of escape, and no invulerability (no, ds just delays the inevitable) we cannot run a full beserker setup and expect to live. This is why, I strive to have either high toughness, or at least some vitality to let me live long enough to be effective.

This is also why I think the class traits need to be redesigned to allow us to actually build tough, and be an attritiion class, while still doing decent damage. We just don’t cut it right now. We do NOT have the mechanisms that allow us to build damage like everyone else, unless we balance it with armor/hps.

I will solve your problems in one post

use 2 runes of krait, 2 runes of afflicted, and 2 runes of the mad king.

this will emulate 30 points in spite, without the 30 points in spite. (but beware, the tooltip won’t show it)

use the 30 points elsewhere. stack curses for fun.

use rare veggie pizza at all times. /faceroll

I love the Lettucemode list. People do this all the time and it does look impressive. BUT how many of those can you fit into any one build? Generally we have to adopt many “meh” traits just to get to one of the better ones. I doubt any ONE viable build could get two or even three of those listed abilities. Like I said the list IS impressive but is misleading when you look at what is actually doable at the moment…and that lack of synergy is what many have been complaining about.

if you are dying in WvW as a necro with glass cannon stats despite having spectral walk and plague form on your utility bar, you are bad, sorry. if i rarely die with 1k toughness and 20k hp why would i waste stats on more?

like i said only time i die is if we get completely overrun, in a 5v5 or 10v10 fight im last one alive if we are losing. Sure defensive spec’d mesmer or thief can survive longer by basically being able to run away, but they put zero pressure offensively in a wvw fight. Even glass cannon thieves and mesmers are a joke in WvW with the exception of picking off stragglers. In terms of making a dent in the overall scoreboards? worthless.

and necros aren’t thief or mesmer, if you do manage to survive a lot of times you will still get chased down by larger numbers, making that tough/vit stacking again, worthless. And again, if you are dying DURING the fight, youre bad. I mean seriously what are you dying to? You can clear conditions 3+ ways and any non-idiot can dodge out of burst. Only way you die is if you are positioned horribly or your entire team gets straight up rolled.

Sprawl.3891:

if you are dying in WvW as a necro with glass cannon stats despite having spectral walk and plague form on your utility bar, you are bad, sorry. if i rarely die with 1k toughness and 20k hp why would i waste stats on more?

So when those are both on cooldown, you basically just chillax and watch your teammates fight?

Sprawl.3891:

if you are dying in WvW as a necro with glass cannon stats despite having spectral walk and plague form on your utility bar, you are bad, sorry. if i rarely die with 1k toughness and 20k hp why would i waste stats on more?

like i said only time i die is if we get completely overrun, in a 5v5 or 10v10 fight im last one alive if we are losing. Sure defensive spec’d mesmer or thief can survive longer by basically being able to run away, but they put zero pressure offensively in a wvw fight. Even glass cannon thieves and mesmers are a joke in WvW with the exception of picking off stragglers. In terms of making a dent in the overall scoreboards? worthless.

and necros aren’t thief or mesmer, if you do manage to survive a lot of times you will still get chased down by larger numbers, making that tough/vit stacking again, worthless. And again, if you are dying DURING the fight, youre bad. I mean seriously what are you dying to? You can clear conditions 3+ ways and any non-idiot can dodge out of burst. Only way you die is if you are positioned horribly or your entire team gets straight up rolled.

So if you were to fight against a team of 5 decent necros you would automatically lose as necros cant die unless they are bad players ?

alanis.6094:

Sprawl.3891:

if you are dying in WvW as a necro with glass cannon stats despite having spectral walk and plague form on your utility bar, you are bad, sorry. if i rarely die with 1k toughness and 20k hp why would i waste stats on more?

So when those are both on cooldown, you basically just chillax and watch your teammates fight?

if they are both on cooldown it means you are running for your life back to a keep or tower or you overextended yourself and deserve to die.

Sprawl.3891:

alanis.6094:

Sprawl.3891:

if you are dying in WvW as a necro with glass cannon stats despite having spectral walk and plague form on your utility bar, you are bad, sorry. if i rarely die with 1k toughness and 20k hp why would i waste stats on more?

So when those are both on cooldown, you basically just chillax and watch your teammates fight?

if they are both on cooldown it means you are running for your life back to a keep or tower or you overextended yourself and deserve to die.

So the only time you use your Well (I say singular, because you already cited that you used Epidemic, and Spectral Walk) is when SW is available.

What are you actually doing the rest of the time?

If you are fighting a 10 vs 10, of a variable group of people on both sides, some people in that group are going to be defensively speced, some are hybrid, and some are offensive. I for one am quite useful to my group when cloud and spectral walk are off cooldown, and do not rely on them in those situations. I also frequently fight bad odds fights (2v7 last night) because its just more fun that way and rewarding if you can pull off a win.

Bottom line is that damage is being dealt by both sides, much of it not avoidable, and if you are not soaking up at least some portion of that (as much as you can without hurting your damage contribution to the team), then someone else is.

Good players know to ignore Guardians, warriors with shields, bunker eles/memers and go for the other players involved. As I mentioned before, since we can’t really do anything to get away once recall and cloud are on cooldown, I prefer not to be running away to the keep when my team is trying to win the fight.

And for the record, being the last one alive in a 10 v 10 doesn’t mean a thing, if you stayed alive by hiding in the back and making sure to be ready to run away if things get rough. I much prefer to be the first person to go down if it means we took down three of them.

I really would like know this amazing trick you have developed to being a powerhouse of damage, easily able to survive in 10v10’s, with no mobility. I see about 5-10 necros a day in wvw on a good day, and would love to meet one like that.

I am so confused why necromancers have trouble running away in WvW. In WvW, with some care they can be an incredibly obnoxious class to chase down, second only to thief and mesmer.

If you’re gate holding against a zerg, drop your flesh worm far away from that point and use it to withdraw. If you’re conditionmancing, you are probably fine keeping that slot used anyways. You can also use spectral walk and terrain juking to just lose people. Defensively applied reapers and chill marks help keep leapers from getting into range. Shooting a critter with chilling grasp then running 120 degrees from it also has funny effects when timed correctly.

Necros are not the most mobile class, but certainly not the worst at running I could imagine.

I sometimes run in WvW with a roaming necromancer (to complement my engineer) and while my engineer can put up more invulnerability time, the confusing tricks the necromancer can play usually mean I am the bait they res me later (which is part of what being an engineer in WvW is right now: a slow but easy kill).

alanis.6094:

Sprawl.3891:

alanis.6094:

Sprawl.3891:

if you are dying in WvW as a necro with glass cannon stats despite having spectral walk and plague form on your utility bar, you are bad, sorry. if i rarely die with 1k toughness and 20k hp why would i waste stats on more?

So when those are both on cooldown, you basically just chillax and watch your teammates fight?

if they are both on cooldown it means you are running for your life back to a keep or tower or you overextended yourself and deserve to die.

So the only time you use your Well (I say singular, because you already cited that you used Epidemic, and Spectral Walk) is when SW is available.

What are you actually doing the rest of the time?

Uh no, was just saying that sometimes SW can be beneficial to get in very deep, not just “to the front” but beyond enemy lines to drop a critical well and staff marks then insta port back. Or jump down to the enemy, drop well/staff then port back up to safety.

900 range is plenty to not have to rely on stacking vit/tough or using SW to get off s/d aoes or wells.

Rennoko.5731:

And for the record, being the last one alive in a 10 v 10 doesn’t mean a thing, if you stayed alive by hiding in the back and making sure to be ready to run away if things get rough. I much prefer to be the first person to go down if it means we took down three of them.

I really would like know this amazing trick you have developed to being a powerhouse of damage, easily able to survive in 10v10’s, with no mobility. I see about 5-10 necros a day in wvw on a good day, and would love to meet one like that.

Who said anything about hiding? staff marks are 1200 range, everything else is 900 range. Like I said above if you are taking heavy damage you are doing it wrong. you are exactly right – necros are not extremely mobile, which is the exact reason they are not good on the front lines, if you are bad and overextend you are dead, necro is not a thief or mesmer built to spike people and run away. That’s why I kinda lul at dagger necros in WvW.

I don’t need extra tough/vit to move to the edge of a keep wall, drop all my marks, aoes and wells then back off without dying. So you stack tough/vit, do less damage, but get off an extra auto attack or 2, good job bro.

on keep attack or defense you should not die even in glass cannon spec. Same with 10v10, you aren’t gonna get focused if you are positioned properly at 900-1200 range, yet you can still dish out all the dps you want. Being at that range you should be the last to die with the exception of maybe tank eles.

if there is a fight 5v5, 10v10, zerg v zerg, whatever and our side wins, 99% chance I didn’t even get to downed state. I always have people in my party saying wtf how did you not die there? Maybe it’s because I spent most of my time in tpvp first, but in WvW most people just rush in, overextend, spam dodge when they see red numbers on the screen, leaving them OOE when they really need it. oh cool you just dodged 2 of my auto attacks here’s a snare and well, have fun.

Sprawl.3891:

alanis.6094:

Sprawl.3891:

alanis.6094:

Sprawl.3891:

if you are dying in WvW as a necro with glass cannon stats despite having spectral walk and plague form on your utility bar, you are bad, sorry. if i rarely die with 1k toughness and 20k hp why would i waste stats on more?

So when those are both on cooldown, you basically just chillax and watch your teammates fight?

if they are both on cooldown it means you are running for your life back to a keep or tower or you overextended yourself and deserve to die.

So the only time you use your Well (I say singular, because you already cited that you used Epidemic, and Spectral Walk) is when SW is available.

What are you actually doing the rest of the time?

Uh no, was just saying that sometimes SW can be beneficial to get in very deep, not just “to the front” but beyond enemy lines to drop a critical well and staff marks then insta port back. Or jump down to the enemy, drop well/staff then port back up to safety.

900 range is plenty to not have to rely on stacking vit/tough or using SW to get off s/d aoes or wells.

Well, maybe 900 range is fine back on T2. I know you guys really didn’t get a chance to stick around T1 too long, but 900 range is laughable with low tough/vit versus the competition here. Pretty much every profession has countless ways to damage you from 900 — let alone the number of pulls and immobilizes that can, and do, happen.

I have 1600 toughness and 23000 HP, and 900 range can get a bit hairy for me.

I run with SW consistently, but I’d rather not wait for it to be available for me to get to 900 range. I’d be bored the other 48/60 seconds.