Stun Breaks
I have no idea. Maybe Anet hates us?
[qT] Necro main.
Well you forgot the worm which is actually our lowest cool down stun break
All of our stun breaks give us benefits besides just breaking a stun and they are all traitable as well
Should spectral walk be lower cool down? probably but I think the rest of them are actually very strong
Plague Signet could also use some love too
(edited by Narkodx.1472)
Plague Signet is the worst of them all because if you are not facing your target, the skill will fail and go on cooldown and not even break stun.
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Ahh yes, I did forget the Flesh Worm (which I only ever use in PvP).
I am guessing I just feel much more annoyed by stuns/CC on this class…
Having played other classes, it just seems like they retain vigor, aegis, blocks, evades, mobility, immunity, reflects and absorbs while being able to use their stun breaks when needed. Whereas on this class, you are often choosing to use Spectral skills to generate life force, or for Specral recall, and thus sacrificing your stun break for an effect that is supposedly a replacement for everything we lack (vigor, aegis, blocks, evades, mobility, immunity, reflects and absorbs).
Plague Signet is the worst of them all because if you are not facing your target, the skill will fail and go on cooldown and not even break stun.
It never fails, especially the stun break. It can however get blocked or los.
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Well you forgot the worm which is actually our lowest cool down stun break
All of our stun breaks give us benefits besides just breaking a stun and they are all traitable as well
Should spectral walk be lower cool down? probably but I think the rest of them are actually very strong
Plague Signet could also use some love too
Wurm is a shorter cooldown, but it’s the only stunbreak I’m aware of (could be wrong) that needs to be pre-cast. Also the only stunbreak you can kill.
I’ve been saying this for years now. We need better access to Stability. Not to mention something more to offset the serious weakness we have. No profession is so vulnerable to CC as we are. We do well against soft CC such as Chill, immobilize and crippling, but are absolutely destroyed against Fear, knock back, knock down, launch, and stun. While any other profession has a way to either prevent it easily or avoid it we don’t. We are expected to stay in combat and apply pressure but we struggle to do that because of our lack of appropriate tools.
But remember guys! Before the last feature patch our lowest stunbreak was 60s. We should be praising anet. /s
But remember guys! Before the last feature patch our lowest stunbreak was 60s. We should be praising anet. /s
Nah, Well of Power was 50 seconds for a while before that.
Honestly necromancers are the only class without an instant stun break under or equal 40 seconds. (and no flesh worm doesn’t count since you have a setup of 1,5 seconds).
EverythingOP
But remember guys! Before the last feature patch our lowest stunbreak was 60s. We should be praising anet. /s
Nah, Well of Power was 50 seconds for a while before that.
Oh yes forgot about that. Even so Well of Power originally wasnt a stunbreak.
Personally I’d love to see spectral walk have its swiftness uptime cut by about 1/3 but also have its CD cut by about 1/3
When combined with traits that would make an effective stun break/mobility skill.
As for necro’s having no projectile reflects/blocks. I and other people I know of have been suggesting for a long time that they make it so that Corrosive Poison Cloud & Spectral Wall at least absorb projectiles cast through them.
Personally I’d love to see spectral walk have its swiftness uptime cut by about 1/3 but also have its CD cut by about 1/3
When combined with traits that would make an effective stun break/mobility skill.
As for necro’s having no projectile reflects/blocks. I and other people I know of have been suggesting for a long time that they make it so that Corrosive Poison Cloud & Spectral Wall at least absorb projectiles cast through them.
That’s an idea. Corrosive Poison cloud is one of the most underused skills the necromancer has, so giving it some play would be good.
I do not know how all of you feel but I would dearly love to trade the fields on all wells and corrosive poison cloud for something else that is actually useful. With no leap or whirl out of the water, just one reliable burst on land, and a lot of dark fields, I feel wells and CPC just do not serve their purpose in making combo fields.
I like dark fields. If we had more low hp bosses with invuln phases then they could become pretty useful. Blasting dark fields for blind is kind of weak though. Id prefer aoe 3 stacks of vuln on blast instead of blind. It would then be the opposite of fire fields.
CPC just needs extra utility. Projectile destruction is the obvious choice.
If there was a boss that needed perma blind, I could see those dark fields being useful but Unshakable makes it very weak in PvE and blind only lasts for one strike in PvP / WvW. No outgoing damage, minor incoming damage reduction, and the fact any auto attack can clear it in a fraction of a second make it a tough sell for me. There are also the complaints about Necro fields getting in the way, too. I just do not get much out of them; especially with the lack of finishers.
Blind is really easy to get from other sources without messing with fields and one of our fields already pulses blind. So its kind of pointless. Vuln suffers from duration reduction on bosses and is always useful. So just replacing blind on blast and leap with vuln and you instantly make dark field a decent offensive debuff field. People wouldnt start using necros for that. But it would make them slightly less useless and people wouldnt be bothered about field overlaps as much.
Theoretically, blind is a 10% reduction (when up) on a single strike from bosses, which could be very good if blind stuck for more than one strike.
You are right, though. It is kind of pointless. All Necromancer can do is use AA through the field or hope a minion or ally can use it. Light fields and poison fields are almost as disappointing.
The problem with blind on bosses is that it has 10% chance to work. Its complete RNG whether it works. If it was 10% change to apply rather than 10% chance to work then it might not be so bad for bosses.
I don’t know about the rest of you, but i’ve always thought that Locust sig should be a stunbreak. The active for it is pretty garbage, it would be less crappy though if it broke stuns atleast.
I agree that Signet of the Locust should be a stunbreak, or maybe grant 3 sec. stability. I’d like both but that’s asking too much. Still I put it on my bar for he speed boost and it does grant me around 1000 point heal when I need it, but I’d like more out of it.
And to a poster above….shush about spectral walk, they may nerf that, then what do we have?
Also if mobility is a problem, spectral skills and traiting (in curses and soul reaping) for them can help with the pinballing we all know about. It takes away some dps, but adds durability, stun breaks and escapability.
I like dark fields. If we had more low hp bosses with invuln phases then they could become pretty useful. Blasting dark fields for blind is kind of weak though. Id prefer aoe 3 stacks of vuln on blast instead of blind. It would then be the opposite of fire fields.
CPC just needs extra utility. Projectile destruction is the obvious choice.
The problem is a lack of good traits that trigger on blind.
The one trait that triggers off of blinding an enemy that a necro has is “Chilling Darkness”.
It understandably has a crappy duration cause it can be massively abused in PVP with Plague Form.
If necromancers had a trait like the guardian trait “Blind Exposure” though (albeit on a slightly lower duration) then that would make it a good combo.
I don’t know about the rest of you, but i’ve always thought that Locust sig should be a stunbreak. The active for it is pretty garbage, it would be less crappy though if it broke stuns atleast.
Not only do I think it should be a stunbreak I think it should have a 40 second base CD.
The active for it is absolute crap
But remember guys! Before the last feature patch our lowest stunbreak was 60s. We should be praising anet. /s
Nah, Well of Power was 50 seconds for a while before that.
Oh yes forgot about that. Even so Well of Power originally wasnt a stunbreak.
Cd reductions for wells and WoP becoming a stun break all happened in the same patch (June 25th, 2013).
Blasting dark fields for blind is kind of weak though. Id prefer aoe 3 stacks of vuln on blast instead of blind.
That would be a huge nerf in PvP for us. And I don’t think it would make us any more viable in PvE since we use a single well every 35 seconds and we would rely on other classes blasting it who are usually perma stacking vuln anyway.
I don’t know about the rest of you, but i’ve always thought that Locust sig should be a stunbreak. The active for it is pretty garbage, it would be less crappy though if it broke stuns atleast.
Not only do I think it should be a stunbreak I think it should have a 40 second base CD.
The active for it is absolute crap
Both active and passive are bad unless you’re in a city or something.
I might consider using it over other skills if the cd was 10 sec or lower.
Reducing the cd to 40 sec and making it a stunbreak would just make it a bad skill that is also a stun break. Absolutely pointless.
Altough we have an instant cast fear.
Blasting dark fields for blind is kind of weak though. Id prefer aoe 3 stacks of vuln on blast instead of blind.
That would be a huge nerf in PvP for us. And I don’t think it would make us any more viable in PvE since we use a single well every 35 seconds and we would rely on other classes blasting it who are usually perma stacking vuln anyway.
I dont see how that would be a huge nerf. We have limited blasts as it is. And how many people blast wells for blind in PvP? I suppose i can see it as a cover for a stomp instead of slotting WoD or using dagger OH. But what blast are you going to use for that? Staff 4 doesnt work on downed state (or did it get changed?). If you are going to rely on teammates for the blast then it seems like a pretty niche use. You probably wouldnt need to waste a dark field for a single stomp blind in that situation. :P
In terms of PvE. It would be pretty strong. You prestack might before a fight. Then in the fight your eles can spam blasts on top of dark fields for 25 stacks of vuln. I would assume it would have similar duration to blasted might as well.
(edited by spoj.9672)
Consider something like this, too:
WoP light field replaced by a water field.
WoC dark field replaced by a retaliation/reflection dome
WoS dark field replaced by AoE cripple
WoB light field replaced by AoE 1 condition removed per pulse
CPC poison field replaced by AoE weakness
Consider something like this, too:
WoP light field replaced by a water field.
WoC dark field replaced by a retaliation/reflection dome
WoS dark field replaced by AoE cripple
WoB light field replaced by AoE 1 condition removed per pulse
CPC poison field replaced by AoE weakness
WoP is a dark field not light.
CPC already does AoE weakness in addition to the poison + poison field.
And I dont really like these changes except for the reflection dome. But I would put that on WoD not WoC. Although i think it would be better to have reflect on spectral wall and projectile destruction on CPC instead. Id also quite like to see projectible block on enfeebling blood/weakening shroud. It would be similar to how Ring of Earth does it.
But were getting off topic lol. Just realised this thread was about stun breaks.
(edited by spoj.9672)
Yeah, I messed up, Spoj. I originally had WoB there and did not edit it correctly. For CPC, I meant to drop the poison field and extend weakness much longer or have it pulse like a well to prevent it from being cleansed so easily. Necromancer could use even more weakness access than it already has, IMO, to help with sustain, especially when sacrificing some more useful utility for CPC. Think about CPC as powerful, defensively as spectral armor. The poison is only 3 seconds, the Necro gets weakness for six and has to transfer or consume it while the opponent can cleanse passively or actively. SA gives LF, is a stun break, and gives protection for 6 sec, which is much more reliable.
Does CPC not pulse already? I thought it did.
Does CPC not pulse already? I thought it did.
It does, but only once every 3 seconds. I think he wants it to pulse once per second like wells do.
My bad, again. I went to the wiki and it says it has 3 second pulses, not that I, or anyone else, stays in it for longer than absolutely necessary. Maybe I should run it in PvP a while to refresh my thoughts on why I do not like it. I could easily not be using it right.
Shorter duration with quicker pulses would probably be better for PvE. But for PvP i think 3s duration and 3s pulses is better. Obviously CPC is quite weak as it is. Its a mediocre area denial. Which is why a lot of people want it to projectile destruct as bonus. But i dont think the duration and pulses is the problem. The self weakness is definately not justified in the skills current state though.
In my opinion they should:
- Reduce Plague Signet cooldown to 50s;
- Reduce Spectral Walk to 50s;
- Add 5 sec of stability on Signet of the Locust and reduce it’s CD to 50s.
Sorry for my english.
Blasting dark fields for blind is kind of weak though. Id prefer aoe 3 stacks of vuln on blast instead of blind.
That would be a huge nerf in PvP for us. And I don’t think it would make us any more viable in PvE since we use a single well every 35 seconds and we would rely on other classes blasting it who are usually perma stacking vuln anyway.
I dont see how that would be a huge nerf. We have limited blasts as it is. And how many people blast wells for blind in PvP? I suppose i can see it as a cover for a stomp instead of slotting WoD or using dagger OH. But what blast are you going to use for that? Staff 4 doesnt work on downed state (or did it get changed?). If you are going to rely on teammates for the blast then it seems like a pretty niche use. You probably wouldnt need to waste a dark field for a single stomp blind in that situation. :P
No, marks don’t trigger on downed players. And a single pre-stomp blind won’t secure a safe stomp anyway, so the only way to combo blind in the right moment would be if another opponent triggers it or have Flesh Worm or Bone Minions explode on the well during the stomp. Either way, not reliable (or viable).
However, blindness is arguably one of the best conditions in any PvP scenario. I will take a single blindness over 25 stacks of vuln any day.
So whenever the opportunity presents itself I do use Putrid Mark on wells. I sometimes even tell other people to combo with my wells, because most players don’t even know what dark fields do. They are likely to combo once in a while by chance, but consciously inflicting blinds or leeching bolts is a very valuable asset in team fights.
In terms of PvE. It would be pretty strong. You prestack might before a fight. Then in the fight your eles can spam blasts on top of dark fields for 25 stacks of vuln. I would assume it would have similar duration to blasted might as well.
That sounds nice, but even if that was possible, would your dungeon dream team be 1 necro + 4 eles?
2 eles is enough. Other classes have some blasts. And you also have banner #5 from the warrior which the rest of the team can also use 1 after the other for prestacking might to save combat blasts.
(edited by spoj.9672)
Shorter duration with quicker pulses would probably be better for PvE. But for PvP i think 3s duration and 3s pulses is better. Obviously CPC is quite weak as it is. Its a mediocre area denial. Which is why a lot of people want it to projectile destruct as bonus. But i dont think the duration and pulses is the problem. The self weakness is definately not justified in the skills current state though.
You are supposed to use skills to transfer condition away or use them to boost consume conditions.
It’s usually not very effective though, because how condition transfer works. CPC is just horrible skill overall, it gives poison which is very nice but how it works is just crappy.
Necromancer has nice conditions and all but some mediocrely useful skills/traits were nerfed into oblivion for no apparent reason and then there’s also so many ways to cleanse conditions away which makes sense when it comes to spamming DOT conditions but absolutely not when it’s something like weakness. In my opinion there’s too much condition spam and too much cleanse to make use of it cleverly.
Funnily enough stun break is almost only thing you try to use only when needed. Even though if you’re necro against spammior™ you stand no chance.
Guardian 80 Necromancer 80 Ranger 80 Mesmer 80 Elementalist 80 Warrior 80
Honestly..if im not mistaken, DS works during a control skill, foot in the grave makes necros the best stun breakers in the game.
Honestly..if im not mistaken, DS works during a control skill, foot in the grave makes necros the best stun breakers in the game.
It does and it doesn’t. Foot in the Grave will grant the Necromancer stability at instant speed, but it doesn’t actually break stuns. So you need to be anticipating the control condition to really get usage out of it.
Which is still very useful! But you can’t always see a stun coming.
Mixing insults with your post is like pooping in a salad.
It’s pretty obvious, and nobody’s impressed.
It’s pretty obvious, and nobody’s impressed.