Guild Wars 2

Disclaimer: These observations and suggestions mostly come from a PvE perspective.
I only play PvP casually, so if you have a better idea of the state of condi Reapers/Necros and Dhuumfire in high level PvP than I do, please feel free to share your thoughts on the suggested changes with us to get a more holistic view on this topic.

During the past week I tried really, really hard to make Dhuumfire work in my condi Reaper build for PvE group content and it just didn’t work out for several rather simple reasons:

• If you are playing a condition build you will have to pick Scepter as your main weapon
• If you want Dhuumfire to do anything you will have to sit in Shroud auto-attacking for a significant amount of time
• If you sit in Shroud auto-attacking you lose out on condition application from your Scepter, off-hand and Utility skills

I tried to make it work by creating a rotation that results in a roughly equal amount of time spend in and out of Shroud, but the end result was worse than staying mostly on Scepter and only “flashing” Shroud for #4, the mobility of #2 and additional Chill/CC if needed.
On top of that, Dhuumfire is pretty much the only reason you might want to take Soul Reaping as a condition Reaper, survivability concerns aside maybe. On the contrary, it makes you lose out on the support and utility from Blood Magic, or (if you are not playing in optimized groups e.g.) the self-might and vulnerability stacking from Spite.

In conclusion, I think it is fair to say that Scepter builds and Dhuumfire currently are mutually exclusive if high and consistent condition DPS while also bringing some support/utility to your group is what you are going for.

I’m sure there are multiple ways you could address this issue, but in the But of Corpse thread someone made a suggestion that I personally really like:

• Swap Dhuumfire’s position as Soul Reaping GM trait with that of Weakening Shroud as a Curses GM trait
• Make Dhuumfire work more like Incendiary Powder again, i.e. inflict Burning on critical hits

For this to happen the new/old Dhuumfire probably would need to be a bit weaker than Incendiary Powder (because of the nature of our Scepter auto-attack e.g.). A direct copy-pasta would be overpowered I guess. What I would suggest is:

• Reduce the duration bonus from 33% to only 20% to be more in line with Barbed Precision and Cold Shoulder
• Reduce the application from 2 stacks to only 1 stack per critical hit, but in return give the Burning higher duration (don’t know how much higher would be appropriate tbh), I think that would fit in well with the “slow but consistent ramp”-theme Necro has

I know Weakening Shroud has its own issues, but that way there would at least still be a decent GM option for condition builds in Soul Reaping that is also tied to Shroud and a usable version of Dhuumfire for Scepter condi builds in Curses.

Edit: What I forgot to mention is that in my opinion this would give power builds a decent GM trait option in Curses because of the high base damage of Burning. A problem that I also forgot to bring up is that Dhuumfire and Lingering Curse then would be competing with each other as condi DPS GM traits, with Parasitic Contagion still left in the dust, which means something would need to be changed about those two traits as well.

Let me know what you think. Feedback is always much appreciated.

I’m a bit lost in your argumentation…

Your saying :

In conclusion, I think it is fair to say that Scepter builds and Dhuumfire currently are mutually exclusive if high and consistent condition DPS while also bringing some support/utility to your group is what you are going for.

So I expected you to bring up a solution that make them viable together but… You end up bringing the 2 of them in direct competition for the curse GM spot…

Why do you want to introduce an option as a GM trait in curse for power build? Don’t get it wrong but if they were to do so, a part of the community would ask for “power” option as adept and master.

I believe that what you really want have nothing to do with dhuumfire. I believe that you only want to be able to use lingering curse and weakening shroud together. The issue is that weakening shroud belong to curse because it’s a skill that have it’s maximum efficiency when you flash your shroud while Dhuumfire is a trait that allow you to have an interesting output of condition damage while staying in shroud (something that the community asked for : a condition damage option in shroud).

So what you suggest would create 2 kind of issue :
1- Actual people that want to play dhuumfire in a power build will complain that they are out of option in the curse spec.
2- The shroud will again become something useless for condi spec due to a lack of condition on it’s auto attack.

Now, if they really wanted to make dhuumfire relevant, they could simply buff it’s base duration to 4s oor keep it as it is and be affected by the lingering curse condi duration buff (bringing it up to 4.5 seconds). Sadely it’s obvious that it would create another imbalance leading to people saying :
“You shouldn’t use dhuumfire without lingering curse! This would be to great of a dps loss!”

Whatever, right now, these 3 traits are pretty much in a good spot even if, in my opinion, lingering curse need a little extra to strengthen the traitline.

I just want a GM trait in blood line that makes necro bleeding the best type of bleed in the game.

Dadnir.5038:

I’m a bit lost in your argumentation…

Your saying :

In conclusion, I think it is fair to say that Scepter builds and Dhuumfire currently are mutually exclusive if high and consistent condition DPS while also bringing some support/utility to your group is what you are going for.

So I expected you to bring up a solution that make them viable together but… You end up bringing the 2 of them in direct competition for the curse GM spot…

Why do you want to introduce an option as a GM trait in curse for power build? Don’t get it wrong but if they were to do so, a part of the community would ask for “power” option as adept and master.

I actually acknowledged that in the edit I did shortly after the original post. As I said, I think Lingering Curses and Parasitic Contagion would have to be changed/re-balanced as well and since I’m not the biggest fan of either of them I’d be fine with that.

Dadnir.5038:

I believe that what you really want have nothing to do with dhuumfire. I believe that you only want to be able to use lingering curse and weakening shroud together. The issue is that weakening shroud belong to curse because it’s a skill that have it’s maximum efficiency when you flash your shroud while Dhuumfire is a trait that allow you to have an interesting output of condition damage while staying in shroud (something that the community asked for : a condition damage option in shroud).

That’s a pretty interesting assumption lol. I don’t currently use Soul Reaping in any of my PvE builds, just in PvP.

Dadnir.5038:

So what you suggest would create 2 kind of issue :
1- Actual people that want to play dhuumfire in a power build will complain that they are out of option in the curse spec.
2- The shroud will again become something useless for condi spec due to a lack of condition on it’s auto attack.

1. I am an actualy person =D … Joking aside, all PvE power builds for group content I have seen recently neither use Curses nor Soul Reaping. I think having a GM trait in Curses that benefits both power and condition builds would open up a good secondary trait-line choice for Necros in groups that already have another Necro with Blood Magic. It might also bring something similar to the old Shoud flashing builds (Spite/Curses/x) back for casual runs and soloing.
2. Not really, not any more “useless” (it is not, Soul Spiral is great) than it is now imo. With the changes I suggested you would still apply burns via crits in and out of Shroud and not just with your Shroud #1. It also wouldn’t really hurt builds without much Precision, because if there is one thing Necros don’t struggle with, it is getting a high crit chance, which also happens to be one of the sub-themes of the Curses line

Dadnir.5038:

Now, if they really wanted to make dhuumfire relevant, they could simply buff it’s base duration to 4s oor keep it as it is and be affected by the lingering curse condi duration buff (bringing it up to 4.5 seconds). Sadely it’s obvious that it would create another imbalance leading to people saying :
“You shouldn’t use dhuumfire without lingering curse! This would be to great of a dps loss!”

You mean Lingering Curse working in Shroud in general or specifically just with Dhuumfire? Buffing the base duration wouldn’t really solve the main problem I have with the trait, namely that I can’t really use it effectively in condition builds.

The thing you could do without much interference is to give dhuumfire a burn attack when entering shroud while keeping it into soul reaping. The pvp population will problably not like it because A: it is instant and B: it is a straight buff to the frost and burn reaper which they don’t like since damage on a soft cc is OP. This could make the soul reaping line very interesting for pve thanks to speed of shadows, spectral mastery and dhuumfire.

Skoigoth.9238:

I know Weakening Shroud has its own issues, but that way there would at least still be a decent GM option for condition builds in Soul Reaping that is also tied to Shroud and a usable version of Dhuumfire for Scepter condi builds in Curses.

Foot in the Grave, not every necro play reaper.

Skoigoth.9238:

• If you are playing a condition build you will have to pick Scepter as your main weapon
• If you want Dhuumfire to do anything you will have to sit in Shroud auto-attacking for a significant amount of time
• If you sit in Shroud auto-attacking you lose out on condition application from your Scepter, off-hand and Utility skills

I have a conditon build with dagger/focus + greatsword. Outside of Reaper shroud all I do is recharging life force (on this way I have a Reaper uptime of around 80%+). So your first point is not valid.

Dhuumfire is the main trait that gives diversity to condition builds. This means that you either use Dhuumfire and sit in Shroud auto-attacking for a significant amount of time, or you use scepter. I know one hybrid type of build that can use both at ~90% efficiency.

The goal with Shroud and Dhuumfire is that you make sure all your utility/weapon skills are on cooldown before entering Shroud, on this way your third point is also not really valid.

Skoigoth.9238:

On top of that, Dhuumfire is pretty much the only reason you might want to take Soul Reaping as a condition Reaper, survivability concerns aside maybe. On the contrary, it makes you lose out on the support and utility from Blood Magic, or (if you are not playing in optimized groups e.g.) the self-might and vulnerability stacking from Spite.

Blood magic has some really nice utility. Having problems deciding between nice traits from Soul Reaping and traits from Blood Magic is what gives Reaper build diversity. Just as that Spite is really nice when soloing, but completely useless when you as condi party up with a Phalax warrior.

Since I play Reaper I am swapping trait lines a lot more based on the situation. I feel like 2 trait lines are required for my play style and the last trait line I pick based on the situation. Currently this works because Soul Reaper has everything Shroud requires, Curse has everything scepter requires and Spite has everything power requires. The last 2 trait lines have nothing that is “forcing” you to pick it, but they do have some really nice traits.

Simple: Increase dhummfire burn duration so we can get more stacks and be competitive in burning with burnzerk and tempest.

@Tim: Changing it to proc Burning when entering Shroud would certainly be an interesting change and would help PvE condi builds a bit that don’t want to camp Shroud, but I’m not sure it would be enough to justify taking SR over BM for group content. Regarding PvP balance, as I noted in the op, I’m a PvP scrub so can’t really comment on that Aren’t many people already concerned/mad about how strong the frostfire Reaper build currently is?

@pierwola: Hmm, do people currently take Foot in the Grave at all in PvE or PvP? I’m under the impression that this trait is not very popular atm, regardless of game-mode (WvW maybe, idk, but WvW seems pretty dead on my server anyways).

@Azzumy: Regarding your first point, granted I’m sure you can make a working condi/hybrid build purely focused on Dhuumfire for general PvE, but what I’m mostly concerned with are competitive condi builds for group content, i.e. high level fractals and raids. As I said in the op, I tried to come up with a competitive build that incorporates Dhuumfire into its rotation, but it just was inferior to more or less pure Scepter/x builds in situations it really mattered (aka longer fights). The Dhuumfire build I tested was great for strolling around the open world, in short fights and for cleaving down trash, but fell flat on its face in long boss fights due to problems with Bleed and Burning up-time and sometimes also life-force issues.
I might be wrong about this, but I think we are almost there to be on par with other top condi classes already and a good change to Dhuumfire could be that little thing we are missing. I’m not claiming what I suggested is that change and absolutely needs to happen btw., that’s why I made this thread and want to have a discussion with you guys =)
Regarding your second point, the way I see it, for group content Blood Magic is pretty much a must right now, because it is our only option for a little bit of group support. Unless ofc there already are enough other Necros filling this spot, which probably means you have too many Necros in your party anyways I agree that Spite and SR are great for solo or low-man game-play, but as a condi Reaper I don’t think there is much choice in trait-lines atm if you want to maximize your damage and be competive with other classes.

@Lynnie: Yeah, a good number of people have been suggesting that too and it would certainly help if you just want to build for maximum personal condi deepzzz. Depending on how big the buff to duration would be, dropping Blood Magic for Soul Reaping might totally be a valid option then, but I’m not sure if this a is realistic thing to ask for because of PvP balance. Again, I don’t know kitten about high level PvP, but I feel this would be an issue probably. So if you have a more informed opinion on that then me, please go for it =P

You misunderstand the purpose of Dhuumfire. It isn’t to add Burning to our Condi rotation. It’s to patch the hole left in a rotation if you’re forced to camp in Reaper/Death Shroud. It’s so you can shift to fighting from the heel without losing all condi pressure, not to take our condi pressure to the next level. Maybe we need that, maybe we don’t, but that isn’t the issue Dhuumfire is attempting to solve.

@Blaine Tog: Yeah, maybe I’m misunderstanding the intended purpose of Dhuumfire, but that doesn’t change my opinion that Dhuumfire doesn’t do the best job at preventing loss of condi pressure (in PvP maybe it does, idk) and that I wish it WOULD bring our condi damage to the next level =P
Also, I don’t think there are any “holes” in a rotation that heavily relies on auto-attacks. With the build I’m running at the moment I haven’t really been forced to camp Shroud for longer periods of time just for survival and I also don’t think doing that is a good idea anyways, because a) your healer can’t heal you up in Shroud, b) the loss of condi application I mentioned above and c) because camping Reaper Shroud for survival entails that I have to stay in melee range, which could be the nail in the coffin if I take an unexpected hit that kicks me out of Shroud.
The Scepter build I’m using now is generally a very safe build to use. If you accidentally stayed to close and feel you have taken to much damage, you just back off a little bit, get out of the fray and keep auto-attacking with Scepter + casting #2, #3 on cooldown and cast your utilities + transfers when available until your health is back up. The only important thing you will be missing out on is maybe one or two Soul Spirals and that’s about it.

But maybe you are right and changing Dhuumfire really isn’t the way to go. Maybe it is the Curses Adept and Master traits, or maybe also Unholy Martyr as the Blood Magic GM trait condi option, which is, to put it lightly, not the most useful trait ever if you ask me.

Doesn’t do that either though Blaine, remaining in shroud as a condi necro plummets your dps, Reaper has done very little to change this. Not dissing you, that may well be the idea behind it, but it fails if it is.
It only seemed slightly better at first because RS applies it a bit faster and on a cleave, giving some nice extra AoE condi-burst.
Unfortunately the most challenging content is almost always the one where you’re hitting a single target and/or high HP damage sponges, so it doesn’t actually ‘fix’ condi-shroud there either.

My pie-in-the-sky dream is still that they’ll just scrap Dumbfire altogether (let everyone else spam fire, necro too cool for that baby) and give condi necros a somewhat unique and viable trait for extra condi-pressure in Shroud.

They actually did something unique and cool with ‘deathly chill’, unfortunately it does very little for shroud and has a bunch of it’s own issues still (give everyone ‘limitless’ condition stacks, give necros another damaging condition that doesn’t stack … yeah, thanks for that).

There’s only 2 ways in which I see prolonged shroud use working for condi:

1: Much longer condi applications on whatever trait gets put on the AA. The cheapest fix imo.

2: A trait that allows you to increase the duration of existing conditions when you AA something in shroud.

Skoigoth.9238:

@Blaine Tog: Yeah, maybe I’m misunderstanding the intended purpose of Dhuumfire, but that doesn’t change my opinion that Dhuumfire doesn’t do the best job at preventing loss of condi pressure (in PvP maybe it does, idk) and that I wish it WOULD bring our condi damage to the next level =P

Burn stacks loose out to the Scepter’s autoattack when boosted in duration, but they’re still pretty decent condi pressure on their own. You absolutely lose damage by focusing on Dhuumfire application if your build is otherwise oriented towards Scepter bleeds, but if you have to hop into DS for 10-15 seconds to tank through some heavy fire, it’s better than losing condi pressure entirely.

Skoigoth.9238:

Also, I don’t think there are any “holes” in a rotation that heavily relies on auto-attacks.

It patches the hole left if you’re sitting in Death Shroud. That’s all it’s intended to do. That’s why it’s in the Soul Reaping line: to boost DS so you can viably stay in it longer if you need to. Power builds lose damage by swapping into DS/RS as well, which is why they get Death Perception to help keep their damage up. This is the same idea.

Skoigoth.9238:

With the build I’m running at the moment I haven’t really been forced to camp Shroud for longer periods of time just for survival and I also don’t think doing that is a good idea anyways, because a) your healer can’t heal you up in Shroud, b) the loss of condi application I mentioned above and c) because camping Reaper Shroud for survival entails that I have to stay in melee range, which could be the nail in the coffin if I take an unexpected hit that kicks me out of Shroud.

I’m not saying camping shroud is a great idea. I’m saying that the purpose of Dhuumfire is much more specific than what you seem to think its purpose is: if staying in Shroud is necessary, then and only then is Dhuumfire helpful. Though I guess it’s also decent AoE condi damage if Epidemic is down and you really need the cleave.

That said, there are three main ways we can heal ourselves through Shroud: Vampiric + Vampiric Presence from Blood Magic, Unholy Sanctuary from Death Magic, and Blighter’s Boon from Reaper. One of those + the stall time for our heal skill cooldown and Endurance generation can allow waiting out heavy damage in Shroud a very good idea.

Skoigoth.9238:

The Scepter build I’m using now is generally a very safe build to use. If you accidentally stayed to close and feel you have taken to much damage, you just back off a little bit, get out of the fray and keep auto-attacking with Scepter + casting #2, #3 on cooldown and cast your utilities + transfers when available until your health is back up. The only important thing you will be missing out on is maybe one or two Soul Spirals and that’s about it.

Again, I’m not arguing that Dhuumfire can compete with Scepter damage. It can’t, and it isn’t actually trying to at all. It’s just trying to give you the option of staying in DS/RS without losing all condi pressure. Your DPS is still going to take a hit, but at least you won’t be left slapping your foe with no Power to back your sad autoattack.

Skoigoth.9238:

But maybe you are right and changing Dhuumfire really isn’t the way to go. Maybe it is the Curses Adept and Master traits, or maybe also Unholy Martyr as the Blood Magic GM trait condi option, which is, to put it lightly, not the most useful trait ever if you ask me.

The Curse minor traits are all pretty solid. The Major Adept and Master traits could potentially use some work, but that’s another ball of wax. Blood Magic clearly needs a selfish GM trait that doesn’t involve Wells.

@Blaine: I think we are more or less on the same page since I can agree with a lot of what you say. I just wish it was different and wish I could use the trait to boost my condi output effectively.
I think it would be nice if, for ONCE, we could say, “in general, Necromancers are the BiS class option for X” and I think that X could very well be condi DPS if only we’d get another buff to what we have now. I think it is something our class kinda deserves after 2 years of being in a very poor spot PvE-wise.

But, as I said, maybe I’m wrong and Dhuumfire does what it is supposed to do and I’m just too stubborn to acknowledge that =P

Blaine Tog.8304:

Power builds lose damage by swapping into DS/RS as well, which is why they get Death Perception to help keep their damage up. This is the same idea.

Ironically, power builds sometimes use Dhuumfire for this, because extra crit chance from Death Perception more often than not is wasted on Reaper X)

Skoigoth.9238:

I just wish it was different and wish I could use the trait to boost my condi output effectively.

That’s fair. I do think our standard condi rotation could use a bit of a boost, though Deathly Chill helps out here to some extent. I’d need to run some tests to be able to make any claims, but I’ve noticed a distinct increase in my condi build’s effectiveness now that I’ve added Reaper into it.

Skoigoth.9238:

I think it is something our class kinda deserves after 2 years of being in a very poor spot PvE-wise.

Tish tosh. I’m not going to say we’re the strongest PvE profession or even that we couldn’t use buffs, changes, and additions, but I have to shake my head every time someone exaggerates like this. While we can’t clear content as quickly or as easily as some other professions, we’re still perfectly capable of clearing everything without too many headaches (a few headaches, sure, but every profession will run into problems here and there).

We have to stop measuring ourselves solely by speed runs. That’s the one metric which gives us real trouble. If you want to do open-world PvE, there’s literally nothing easier to play in the entire game than a Minionmaster Necro. If you want to run dungeons, Necros can PUG better than almost anyone thanks to our self reliance. We have a couple of good tricks we can pull in Fractals as well, not that anyone really cares about Fractals these days. Heck, there’s even some indications that we might become meta in raids as the tank. The tank. How nutty is that?

The bar for success in PvE just isn’t high enough to justify all this self-hatred. I swear, sometimes it seems like it’s as much Player Vs Our Persecution Complex as much as it is Player Vs Environment.

Sorry, went on a bit of rant there. Suffice it to say, I don’t think we’re anywhere near as bad a profession as everyone else seems to think we are. I have a level 80 for every profession and yet I still choose to play my Necro more than anyone other than my Ele (my main since GW1). I think they both have about an equal number of hours by this point, actually.

Skoigoth.9238:

Blaine Tog.8304:

Power builds lose damage by swapping into DS/RS as well, which is why they get Death Perception to help keep their damage up. This is the same idea.

Ironically, power builds sometimes use Dhuumfire for this, because extra crit chance from Death Perception more often than not is wasted on Reaper X)

[/quote]Yeah, ANet usually has good intentions when it comes to concepts. It’s just the implementation that’s a problem. They have a particularly bad habit of adding mechanics that end up working out exactly the opposite of how they intended them to be used. That’s how we ended up with the berserker meta of the last three years, for example.

@Skoigoth : In reality, the real issue of the necromancer be it power or condi in group content is still the lack of meaningfull support. That where the real issue lie. When you prepare your group composition you look at the profession and say :
Ok, we will need a lot of DPS so every profession that can grant us this is welcome :

Elementalist : best DPS, good ability to allow everybody to gain might : check
Warrior : +power + might, decent dps : check
Revenant : + ferocity + might/fury : check
ranger : +damage + precision : check
mesmer : celerity and utility : check
engineer : might share : check
guardian : celerity/might/aegis : check

Which leave necromancer and thief that are almost “naked” in regard of meaningfull support when they enter in a raid. Will you change these fact by switching dhuumfire and weakening shroud? No. The new group content ask for more dps buff than ever and it’s an area where the necromancer can’t compete with any other profession (and the dev clearly don’t want the necromancer to be able to compete in this area).

So yes, some will say that might and fury are already boon that are overlaping in a party and so it doesn’t matter if the necromancer can’t do that, but when you’re forced to split and there is a dps check on a condiboss what will you take? 2-3 engi that can buff themself in a split second to 25 might or 2-3 necromancer that will strugle until 50% life to be at the required amount of might for maximum dps? Can we expect BiP to fill this gap? no. Can we expect a change to dhumfire, making it a burn that apply even outside of the shroud to fill this gap? no.

Lynnie that have already answered in your post have done a video showing that a condi reaper is in a pretty good spot dps wise, even slightly above the meta condi engineer. Does this make it more valuable in group content? No.

The PvE group content is not designed in way that would make any of the necromancer’s specificity shine. The necromancer is forced into being the selfish black sheep of GW2. Thing that is pretty ironic since the necromancers were among the best support professions into GW1.

@Blaine: I know that you shouldn’t measure the strength of class solely by its performance in speed-runs and the like, but now that the first raid wing is out and people care a lot more about efficiency, I think class balance is more important than ever in PvE. Please don’t get me wrong, this is no “self-hatred”. I play Necro as my main character since launch and I think we are in a very solid spot right now. We can do power DPS, condi DPS and tanking just fine, but I also think we still don’t really stand out in any of those roles and that bugs me (maybe a bit too much ) I guess.

@Dadnir: Yeah, lacking support is definitely still another big issue and the reason why we now have this “Blood Magic or bust” thing going on, which limits build creativity even more. But that is an issue that should be discussed separately I think.
Also, as someone that plays both condi Necro and condi Engineer (both in ascended Viper’s/Sinister gear), I don’t share the sentiment that Necros can out-damage a halfway decent Engineer player. I mean, yes, condi Necro is definitely surprisingly stronger than I original thought it was and yes, condi Engineer might be a bit overrated, but as far as I can tell and as long as the circumstances of the fight do not heavily favor the Necro in the first place (mobs moving around all the time e.g.), I can still put out more damage with it than I can with my condi Necro and I’m not particularly amazing at playing condi Engi. That’s just anecdotal of course, but without a proper DPS meter (or similar tool) supported by the developer, my own testing and discussing things with other people is all I can trust in. A version of Dhuumfire that can be effectively used to boost DPS in our condi builds would bring us far enough to catch up I think, which is why I wanted to have a discussion on this in the first place.
I also agree with you, however, that encounter design is an issue as well, but I feel it is becoming better now with raids and just HoT in general.

I still think that what you suggest would be a huge loss.

For this to happen the new/old Dhuumfire probably would need to be a bit weaker than Incendiary Powder (because of the nature of our Scepter auto-attack e.g.). A direct copy-pasta would be overpowered I guess. What I would suggest is:

Reduce the duration bonus from 33% to only 20% to be more in line with Barbed Precision and Cold Shoulder
Reduce the application from 2 stacks to only 1 stack per critical hit, but in return give the Burning higher duration (don’t know how much higher would be appropriate tbh), I think that would fit in well with the “slow but consistent ramp”-theme Necro has

1 burn every 10s with a low duration bonus on burn that would only affect this one burn in the end… That’s pretty sad. Incendiary powder work on engi because they have a lot of burning source, a necromancer’s version of it would be almost useless. At least it wouldn’t even compete with lingering curse.

I’m still against hurting traits that actually work while their are plenty of traits that need work. Still, dhumfire could endure a slight increase in it’s burn duration.

NB.: I don’t think the condi Engi is overrated but the perfect rotation is really a pain in the… neck. I also think that the necro condi dps is in a good spot and the rotation easy enough to make it a good contender dps wise. But this easier dps will never fill the gap left by the lack of might/fury/ferocity/precision/power sharing. And the only way for vampiric aura to become something relevant in regard of dps would be against bosses immun to critical strikes (not sure that it would really be a thing but…).