Guild Wars 2

Yes, yes, this probably has been suggested before, but I’d like to put together a move set that could be utilized if scythes are added to Necro’s.

What role would a scythe take?
Looking at weapon choices Necros lack:

• An AoE weapon for Power Builds (Staff leans more towards Conditions)
• A 2 handed melee weapon
• A melee weapon with cleave

These points make Scythes look like a promising addition to the Necro repertoire this along with the fact that a staple mechanic of the class is to REAP the LIFE FORCE out of enemies both during combat and once killing which can be likened to the mythos of Death using a scythe to reap souls, does make the class seem like an ideal platform to use scythes!

Onto the skills then:

1. Chain:
   Swipe – Swipe at your foe. 200 damage.
   Slice – Slice at your foe gaining life force. 210 damage 1% life force per enemy hit.
   Slash – Slash at all nearby foes, gaining life force and causing vulnerability. 250 damage, 2% life force per enemy hit, 1 stack of vulnerability for 5 seconds.
2. Dark Beginnings – Strike nearby targets with shadow scythes inflicting vulnerability. 2×350 damage, 2 stacks of vulnerability for 10 seconds, 10 second cooldown.
3. Dark Rift – Teleport to targeted foe causing chill in the area. 250 damage, Chill for 4 seconds. 20 second cooldown, 600 range.
4. Reapers Doom – Strike your target and cause cripple. 350 damage, Cripple for 4 seconds. 25 second cooldown.
5. Reap! – Pull nearby foes to you, inflict vulnerability and gain life force. 500 damage, 2 stacks of vulnerability for 10 seconds, 5% life force per target hit, 600 range, 30 second cooldown.

The damage and conditions could be adjusted, I was just using some values I feel would be appropriate based off of other 2 handed weapon skill sets (Greatswords mostly). I think I got the main points into this, the skills show that fighting multiples is beneficial whilst it also has tools to get into and to stay in melee range which would help with Power builds (People have used Axes due to the difficulties of staying close enough to do damage with main hand dagger)

My main concern is (Aside from Scythes being brought into the game) is how it’s Life Force generation compares, especially when the burst Axe/Focus can generate and the sustained capable from Dagger/X and Staff.

Oddly, my first question is this:

Who else would get the scythe?

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Oddly, my first question is this:

Who else would get the scythe?

Guardians would be a good choice due to Dervishes.

Of course Warriors would also have the option due to being masters of arms.

There could also be a case where thieves could get a scythe though very unlikely, it’d give them a 2 handed melee weapon that also allows them to use more “Dark” skills (Shadow Refuge is a Dark field, this could be extended into more shadowy/dark based weapon skills)

I like this idea of a cleave weapon, and yes the question remains also gets a scythe?
guardian is more a protector than a reaper so lore wise i do not think a murderous weapon like that is fitting, a warrior and thieve do come to mind

TriskaiX.7014:

guardian is more a protector than a reaper so lore wise i do not think a murderous weapon like that is fitting, a warrior and thieve do come to mind

Rant about the lore of using a scythe:
lol @ scythes being murderous weapons…

If you want to talk about who should get a scythe lore-wise then only a Necromancer should be allowed to use one. Despite the Dervish from GW1, scythes are actually not weapons of martial combat because they are incredibly inefficient at actually attacking another foe. Scythes are tools for harvesting crops, and even when peasants would need to fight with scythes they would modify them so that the blade stuck straight up like a halberd.

The only reason the Scythe is so popular as a weapon is because of it’s lore as the weapon of the Grim Reaper. And even in this it was only meant to represent the Reaper’s role as a harvester of souls, not as an actual weapon used by the Reaper. So if you want to talk about which professions should get a Scythe based on lore then really only the Necro should.

Also don’t forget that:
1. There are staff skins out there that look like scythes.
2. The Necro staff autoattack puts a scythe graphic on any staff.
End rant about the lore of using a scythe

Now if you take lore out of the question, I do think it would be pretty cool to introduce scythes to the game because as long as you don’t think about the usefulness of the weapon too much it looks really awesome. Although we may need to wait until a new profession is introduced because at the moment I can really only see a Necro and Warr making use of the scythe. Maybe a Thief but it really would not fit a Thief’s quick and mobile playstyle. Perhaps one of the next professions will be a new heavy armor profession that could make good use of a scythe.

Aside from that, I like the OP’s point about a scythe being really good for generating life force, nice touch. =)

Prism.5649:

Now if you take lore out of the question, I do think it would be pretty cool to introduce scythes to the game because as long as you don’t think about the usefulness of the weapon too much it looks really awesome.

I’ve read many a debate about the usefulness of Scythes in actual combat (Including the fights where peasants used them as make-shift weapons, Warscythes (Which are essentially halberds) etc)

I’ve even designed a few scythes myself in order to try and see if one could theoretically be used as an actual weapon and came up with the idea of essentially a Battle Axe with a single double edged blade at the end using arcing horizontal swings (As opposed to Axes downward cleaves) as a way to hit an opponent in the sides and from behind (Where armour tends to be weaker – Hence vulnerability in my suggested attacks) would be a functional way to fight, as long as you can keep distance mind (Close range would get you slaughtered, but it’s similar for Battle Axes)

As far as scythes go for combat with current classes:

Not all classes need to use dark magic with them, some could rely purely on the steel they hold and their skills in combat to cause deep bleeding cuts and open vulnerable areas in armour (Warrior and to a lesser extent Thief)

Some classes can use it purely as a focus for magic, using it natural arc as a basis for large area spells as opposed to a single target precision tool (Elementalist and to a lesser extent Necro)

Some could use it as a way to reap peoples souls, damaging their very essence and taking command over Life of Death (Necro and Guardian – Guardians could take people’s souls to be redeemed, they could use the scythes power over life and death to engrave poweful supportive Symbols into the ground etc)

There are many possibilities other than the “Hit things and steal their souls” which I’m using as a basis for these Necro abilities.

I agree with Prism, scythes make terrible martial weapons, they just have a ‘cool’ factor, I wish Arenanet had given dervishes long spears/halberds/pole-arms, that fits the holy warrior image more in my mind. Then guardians could be given halberds or quaterstaff and it would seem they would be continuing on the dervish tradition. I think they did really well giving the staff scythe-like effects, having them symbolic and fleeting was a good idea.

I’d much prefer necros get two handed axes, big executioner style axes, like one looking like maw of the kitten but wielded in both hands. It would be cool to have a profession that is traditionally seen as a caster wield a big martial weapon like that.

Taril.8619:

I’ve even designed a few scythes myself in order to try and see if one could theoretically be used as an actual weapon and came up with the idea of essentially a Battle Axe with a single double edged blade at the end using arcing horizontal swings (As opposed to Axes downward cleaves) as a way to hit an opponent in the sides and from behind (Where armour tends to be weaker – Hence vulnerability in my suggested attacks) would be a functional way to fight, as long as you can keep distance mind (Close range would get you slaughtered, but it’s similar for Battle Axes)

At the risk of turning this thread away from it’s original topic:

Your proposal of using a scythe to swing around and attack someone’s side or back is a good one at first glance, but you need to think further into it. If you don’t kill someone on your first strike then you need to get your weapon back, and if the blade is behind your enemy then you have two options: reverse your swing and bring the scythe outwards away from them or pull it directly towards you. There are huge problems with both of these techniques. The first leaves you completely open with no way to parry your opponent’s counterattack and the second drags your opponent into close range.

The problem with the scythe is not that the blade is at a bad angle for attacking; it is that the angle of the blade does not allow for flowing motions. Now you might say that a battleaxe suffers similar problems and you would be correct. The difference is the battleaxe always remains in front of you and can be retracted much more easily to be used defensively. A scythe does not share this advantage because of its inherent “hooking” tendencies that leave it in a very awkward, slow, and difficult to manage position.

A scythe may be an almost viable weapon in single combat (if no other alternative weapons are nearby) because you can make up for the bad weapon positioning with your own bodily movements, but in any sort of larger skirmish it can only be a detriment.

Taril.8619:

Some classes can use it purely as a focus for magic, using it natural arc as a basis for large area spells as opposed to a single target precision tool (Elementalist and to a lesser extent Necro)

I thought about this as well but the problem with Ele is that they already have exactly the type of weapon you describe with their staff. Giving them a scythe would mean ANet needs to completely redesign the staff and would be completely redundant. I’m not opposed to giving casters a scythe because as you said yourself there is nothing inherent about a scythe that makes it a dark and sinister weapon, but we still have to be careful about what role the scythe would fill for casters.

Taril.8619:

Some could use it as a way to reap peoples souls, damaging their very essence and taking command over Life of Death (Necro and Guardian – Guardians could take people’s souls to be redeemed, they could use the scythes power over life and death to engrave poweful supportive Symbols into the ground etc)

I like the idea of Guardians using the scythe as a more beneficial weapon, good point there. Giving a scythe to Warrs/Guards/Necros would be a viable number of professions so it’s definitely doable.

I also hope they add sickle as a 1h weapon at some time.

As for lore there where war scythes heavier blade that came to a point for punching thru armor. They also could be used to hook legs and knock people over. But yes the blade was mounted to stick forward more then the side. So Vuln and knockdown would be good choices for attacks

I would love to have a 2h melee weapon for Necro, we actualy have the survival skills to do it.

I’d die to have a weapon like that…. unfortunatly it’ll probably never happen since another class would have to use the weapon as well and staff already turn into a scythe when you use it also. There is a Halloween skin that turns your staff into a scythe.

I have a feeling that we would never get a scythe, simply because:
1. Like others have said, the type we want isn’t a true martial weapon
2. Our staff turns into a scythe, and a few staff skins are already scythes

Not that I wouldn’t like a new weapon, I just don’t see it being this one.

Prism.5649:

TriskaiX.7014:

guardian is more a protector than a reaper so lore wise i do not think a murderous weapon like that is fitting, a warrior and thieve do come to mind

Rant about the lore of using a scythe:
lol @ scythes being murderous weapons…

If you want to talk about who should get a scythe lore-wise then only a Necromancer should be allowed to use one. Despite the Dervish from GW1, scythes are actually not weapons of martial combat because they are incredibly inefficient at actually attacking another foe. Scythes are tools for harvesting crops, and even when peasants would need to fight with scythes they would modify them so that the blade stuck straight up like a halberd.

The only reason the Scythe is so popular as a weapon is because of it’s lore as the weapon of the Grim Reaper. And even in this it was only meant to represent the Reaper’s role as a harvester of souls, not as an actual weapon used by the Reaper. So if you want to talk about which professions should get a Scythe based on lore then really only the Necro should.

Also don’t forget that:
1. There are staff skins out there that look like scythes.
2. The Necro staff autoattack puts a scythe graphic on any staff.
End rant about the lore of using a scythe

Now if you take lore out of the question, I do think it would be pretty cool to introduce scythes to the game because as long as you don’t think about the usefulness of the weapon too much it looks really awesome. Although we may need to wait until a new profession is introduced because at the moment I can really only see a Necro and Warr making use of the scythe. Maybe a Thief but it really would not fit a Thief’s quick and mobile playstyle. Perhaps one of the next professions will be a new heavy armor profession that could make good use of a scythe.

Aside from that, I like the OP’s point about a scythe being really good for generating life force, nice touch. =)

Just to mention it wasnt just a farming tool, they were often used a poleaxes with a more visceral and durable but way more clumsy way by both local priests, undertakers and other importantish people in pegan villages having a giant sharp blade ontop of a stick makes you kinda stick out of a crowd also by general mythos transfered into GW2, Necro, Guardian and Mesmers would be the ones to get em, but as also said no, it would make most necromancer animations either redundant or plain confusing.
Maybe instead adding a different attack (just like a thief gets different attacks while in stealth) if you get into melee with a staff would be cool, but overall actually adding new weapons would probably make the game kinda unabalanced for a while.

I’ve been wanting a scythe weapon on my necro for so long, we need a melee weapon that can cleave at least. I’m hoping an expansion brings in a scythe class / weapon type as the ‘tool’ is one of my favorite in games that have it in.

So classes that could use it… Necro, Guardians maybe Eles… No one else should get it really. Hammer can only be used by 2 classes, so can the scythe. Warriors shouldn’t get it… they already have enough weapon combinations they can use.

People say we have scythe thing on our staff but staff is ranged not melee.

@Bhawb It was good enough of a weapon for the Dervish ^^

Andele.1306:

Just to mention it wasnt just a farming tool, they were often used a poleaxes with a more visceral and durable but way more clumsy way by both local priests, undertakers and other importantish people in pegan villages having a giant sharp blade ontop of a stick makes you kinda stick out of a crowd also by general mythos transfered into GW2, Necro, Guardian and Mesmers would be the ones to get em, but as also said no, it would make most necromancer animations either redundant or plain confusing.
Maybe instead adding a different attack (just like a thief gets different attacks while in stealth) if you get into melee with a staff would be cool, but overall actually adding new weapons would probably make the game kinda unabalanced for a while.

The poleaxe version of scythes are not what most people think of; they are not what you get when necros auto attack with a staff. What farmers would do is take their farming implement, and move the blade part of it 90 degrees, so that it was completely straight (instead of the normal farming tool which had the blade at a right angle).

Nijjion.2069:

@Bhawb It was good enough of a weapon for the Dervish ^^

Yeah, in fantasy games they make a lot of fake weapons work, just look at what Soul Calibur has passed off as “weapons” :P

Bhawb.7408:

Andele.1306:

Just to mention it wasnt just a farming tool, they were often used a poleaxes with a more visceral and durable but way more clumsy way by both local priests, undertakers and other importantish people in pegan villages having a giant sharp blade ontop of a stick makes you kinda stick out of a crowd also by general mythos transfered into GW2, Necro, Guardian and Mesmers would be the ones to get em, but as also said no, it would make most necromancer animations either redundant or plain confusing.
Maybe instead adding a different attack (just like a thief gets different attacks while in stealth) if you get into melee with a staff would be cool, but overall actually adding new weapons would probably make the game kinda unabalanced for a while.

The poleaxe version of scythes are not what most people think of; they are not what you get when necros auto attack with a staff. What farmers would do is take their farming implement, and move the blade part of it 90 degrees, so that it was completely straight (instead of the normal farming tool which had the blade at a right angle).

The Warscythe (starting use mid 18th century) is a different story, there were actual scythes designed for manual tillage of small plantages usual for local churches and keeping of graveyards that are sharpened on both sides with quite a fascinating type of treatement since only one blade used by one man was almost as efficient as its evolution, the easier to use cradle scythe. Essencially one put a big, almost crescent piece of sharp fine metal (rarely steel since in older pagan rituals using steel to work on graveyards was one of the causes for “undead”) on a ornament big curved stick (often while not attached also used for holiday rituals) so that the stick not quite attached on the actual middle but a bit to one side of the inner blade. Sadly evolution, comfort, Barbarian attacks and the Christian religion purged most relics of pagan time, but you can still find quite simmilar tools in different keeps over middle european keeps and museums (Slovenia and Croatia having quite the collection of examples with the numerous remains in keeps that probably had more owners than a street dog has fleas)

While much more flashy the only example of it in popular culture would be from the manga Soul Eater where a special attack called the Witch hunter has a similar form.

Make it a stance or attunement off of staff that keeps the spectral blade out at all times then you don’t have to worry about “who” should be able to use it. I think its only fair since Ele and Eng gets so many skills and fun things to play with.

Another weapon, working for a 2h power-build would really help. Otherwise, everyone’s going to be a warrior/guardian/mesmer in the next few months.

Or give us some useful buffs. Or good utilityskills other than epidemic which only amplifies the otherwise inferior condition damage; just anything Anet, pretty please?

Give me a Battle Axe over a scythe any day! I am an executioner not a farmer! I deal in death, not hope I can hook someone and trip them up. I am not a helper or a peasant. I am an instrument of death.

The Battle Axe fits better and can cross over to other classes much easier.

I like the Idea, I myself have suggested Scythes as a weapon used by Necromancer’s. I really like how you presented the skill’s it’s almost perfect. The only thing I would disagree with is: Guardian’s having Scythes, I think the Scythe would be more realistic and viable on a class like Thief or Ranger, As their both classes which don’t have a stable 2h Melee DPS (Ranger GS isnt all that great).

Honestly my favourite option would and will still be the ability to have 2 dual wield options, offhand Axe and having 2 swords shred the battlefield, but not in a sissy ranged pink lazor way, but manly giant claws of death that obliterate the enemy upon each swing.
Also @Martin The Brave.8731 WEAKLING, KNEEL BEFORE THE BEAR BlTCHSLAP SWORD!

I’d love to have a Scythe as an actual melee weapon.
Or possibly as an Elite Skill where you transform into a Grim Reaper using one.
We have a 1200 range transform and an AoE defensive one relying on Conditions but no power-based melee one.

While I think that Scythes would fit Necros, Guardians and Warriors there are problems with them, too.

Namely that adding a new weapon type is a lot of work and to justify it they should considerably add to the game.
As it is Greatsword and Hammer already cover the AoE melee role.

I can’t think of anything new a Guardian or a Warrior would gain from a Scythe.
Granted I’m not well versed on those professions, so perhaps good Warriors or Guardians would disagree?

Either way any skills put on a Scythe for Necro could simply be added for Greatsword or Hammer without the need to create an entire new series of weapons.

In case you think that Greatswords and Hammers sound like ridiculous choices for a Necromancer think of the Death Knights from the Warcraft series or the Cultists from the Fractals dungeon.

When you then consider that there are Staffs skinned as Scythes and that Anet is adding 2-handed Axes the chances of us ever seeing a true Scythe are even slimmer…

LastDay.3524:

Namely that adding a new weapon type is a lot of work and to justify it they should considerably add to the game.

I’d assume that Scythes are brought in when they’re already thinking and working on bringing in other weapons, especially since if they only brought in Scythes all classes who didn’t get them (Also classes who did get it but wanted something else instead) would complain.

LastDay.3524:

I can’t think of anything new a Guardian or a Warrior would gain from a Scythe.

Guardians: Symbol based skill set (They have a Trait Line where all the Minor Traits are to do with Symbols, yet very few Symbols to use), additional fields (They get a bunch of Light fields and some Fire fields, they could use Scythes to create a defensive Dark field or something)

Warriors: AoE Bleed weapon (Gun is single target, Sword is only AoE for 2 parts of its #1 chain, also most of the Bleed comes from off-hand sword which skills are a bit lackluster especially if trying to go for a dedicated condition build) some more Vulnerability stacks to combine with other skill sets, additional mobility (Would be a godsend to most if not all PvP warriors to get some extra mobility in-combat)

LastDay.3524:

When you then consider that there are Staffs skinned as Scythes and that Anet is adding 2-handed Axes the chances of us ever seeing a true Scythe are even slimmer…

Everyone says this, but from what I can tell (Looking at every staff skin in the game) there are only 2 Staffs that are skinned as Scythes – 1 of them (As far as I can tell) hasn’t been put into the game in PvE and the other is from a seasonal skin item (Which is unobtainable outside of buying it off people who got it, kept it and are selling it)

Also, could you provide a link to where Anet said they’re adding 2 handed axes?

Taril.8619:

LastDay.3524:

When you then consider that there are Staffs skinned as Scythes and that Anet is adding 2-handed Axes the chances of us ever seeing a true Scythe are even slimmer…

Everyone says this, but from what I can tell (Looking at every staff skin in the game) there are only 2 Staffs that are skinned as Scythes – 1 of them (As far as I can tell) hasn’t been put into the game in PvE and the other is from a seasonal skin item (Which is unobtainable outside of buying it off people who got it, kept it and are selling it)

Final Rest and Sinister Scythe Skin, but also about 60% of necro animations have the scythe effect (and a few theif ones like Shadow Refuge).

Samhayn.2385:

I also hope they add sickle as a 1h weapon at some time.

The Krait daggers look something like that, I think. Can’t remember if the inside, outside or both are sharp.

LameFox.6349:

Samhayn.2385:

I also hope they add sickle as a 1h weapon at some time.

The Krait daggers look something like that, I think. Can’t remember if the inside, outside or both are sharp.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Krait_Ripper

Also to an extent: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reaper_of_Souls

I want the Scythe so bad. My main from GW1 was a Dervish. Please please please Anet you know how to do cool scythe fighting animations, just give Necro the scythe. I don’t want to be a silly priest class…Scythes are for Necromancers