Guild Wars 2

Let’s review what the devs said about Terror:

“If you take Terror you’re building a Terrormancer (…) and because it’s build defining we want it to be recognized as such”

@Lingering Curse: “…if you wanna be condi, this is the one you want to take!”

Just to clarify, there is no such thing as a “Terrormancer”.
The only question is: do you play condi? If yes, you have Terror… the end!
This trait is in no way build-defining, it’s just a trait that slightly buffs damage for a build type that – even with the trait – has subpar damage to power builds in both PvP and PvE.

So what would it mean if this trait was made baseline for all necros (or at least merged with a minor trait in Curses):

1. Condition builds would have the choice between a defensive and an offensive trait: Parasitic Contagion vs Lingering Curse.
This is how it should be, extended durations or more sustain.

2. There would be a vacancy in the Curses grandmaster tier.
One of the biggest complaints about the new traits so far: There is no power gm trait in Curses.
Seriously, this is a big problem. Power builds will still pick this line for fury, Banshee’s wail, crit chance and probably Enfeebling Blood. But what the hell are they supposed to do with the gm slot? Conditions heal you? A scepter trait? Or terror… for a build that does very low condition damage?
But if Terror was baseline it would give power builds a negligable damage buff while having an actual power option in the gm tier.
For example: the current form of Target the Weak. So this way a power build could get both more damage and more crit chance for conditions on a target.

Thoughts?

I think it’d be fair and not overpowering. It would be like how they made pew pew rangers baseline (which is ridiculous imo), then on top of it gave them a trait that reduce skill recharge by 66% upon weapon swap (which just means more rapid fire bs). Those are some darn earth shattering changes and good trait synergy. Necros got nothing close to it.

Making terror baseline would be nice. This way it would have good trait synergy with master of terror. It’d then come close to what they did for other classes.

100% agree with your conclusions. Without this change condi builds take a huge dive

Would be a solution. I think fear shouldnt deal so much damage though, i dislike the idea that terror makes fear kinda bursty. So yeah, terror is baseline, terror damage reduced by 33%,; fear skills should have their CD reduced, making them more of a defensive option with interrupting while adding a little bit of damage to it.

This would also open a slot for traits that alter conditions like ranger and thief can alter poison. I would love a trait that modifies chill or cripple or poison or weakness.

A few examples:

Chilled enemys take damaged every second, damage is improved when the target is standing still

Crippled enemies take damage while moving, OR crippled enemies take damage when they dodge, use a mobility or leap skill.

Weakened enemies will loose boons faster.

Poisons you apply reduces incoming healing by 50%

Poisons you apply heal the same ammount they reduce incoming healing on the target

Vulnerability siphons a small amount of life if they are removed or expire (per stack)

Yes please, or make it minor.

Brujeria.7536:

Would be a solution. I think fear shouldnt deal so much damage though, i dislike the idea that terror makes fear kinda bursty. So yeah, terror is baseline, terror damage reduced by 33%,; fear skills should have their CD reduced, making them more of a defensive option with interrupting while adding a little bit of damage to it.

I’d be ok with that, although Terror really doesn’t deal that much damage to begin with.

Brujeria.7536:

This would also open a slot for traits that alter conditions like ranger and thief can alter poison. I would love a trait that modifies chill or cripple or poison or weakness.

Like I said, the biggest issue with Curses in the preview was that there is no power grandmaster trait even though power builds will definitely take this trait line over Death or Blood Magic (for PvE at least).

Terror does like 1250 a tic, which is less than an auto attach on any zerker build. You can get it to tick twice in the time some else can land two autoattacks. Are we really talking huge numbers? Are you seriously? Terror only does decent damage on condi builds and is dependent on duration. Now they won’t let us have duration and terror so at best your damage gets dropped a lot if you take terror, or condi duration without terror because unlike condi builds on other classes we cannot stack condis as fast. It was a Net nerf. I grow tired of the devs continually weakening this class. We are so far behind the other classes in gw2’s evolution and I think necro is done compared to classes like the engie, thief, and guardian, classes already in all three metas.

Agreed, with terror where it is atm 2 very nice traits which have finally been made viable are NEVER getting used….

Yea completely agree. On a note of power necro not having anything to pick for, i think the scepter condi duration is bad. Its not like power necros dont use any condis like vulnerability, weakness, criple, chill, imobilize, poison …. i think they sould change this one so both condi and power can benefit of it. Something like increase condi duration + some form of acess to some extra these utility condis (personaly i would pick chill, poison and weakness proc).

The problem with getting Terror as base, or even as a different tier to Lingering Curse, is the ability for Lingering Curse to double the duration of all non-staff fears (assuming it works in DS for Doom as well). This takes Terror from being a burst threat, to being a sustained damage threat that still deals burst-damage levels of DPS.

I think they should reduce Terror’s damage, and then move it, or change all fear-giving skills to deal damage if you interrupt with the fear (so make it baseline, but only on interrupts, and the damage is dealt immediately). But fear dealing this much damage baseline plus allowing Lingering Curses to effectively double fear damage on top is probably too much.

Bhawb.7408:

The problem with getting Terror as base, or even as a different tier to Lingering Curse, is the ability for Lingering Curse to double the duration of all non-staff fears (assuming it works in DS for Doom as well). This takes Terror from being a burst threat, to being a sustained damage threat that still deals burst-damage levels of DPS.

I think they should reduce Terror’s damage, and then move it, or change all fear-giving skills to deal damage if you interrupt with the fear (so make it baseline, but only on interrupts, and the damage is dealt immediately). But fear dealing this much damage baseline plus allowing Lingering Curses to effectively double fear damage on top is probably too much.

If they thought this would be a problem they could cap fear duration in a similar manner as confusion.

A more radical, but better solution would be to separate the damage component and the CC component. Have the CC unaffected by condition duration, but leave the damaging condition as is. Make the damage condition called “terror” and leave the CC as fear.

Bhawb.7408:

The problem with getting Terror as base, or even as a different tier to Lingering Curse, is the ability for Lingering Curse to double the duration of all non-staff fears (assuming it works in DS for Doom as well). This takes Terror from being a burst threat, to being a sustained damage threat that still deals burst-damage levels of DPS.

I think they should reduce Terror’s damage, and then move it, or change all fear-giving skills to deal damage if you interrupt with the fear (so make it baseline, but only on interrupts, and the damage is dealt immediately). But fear dealing this much damage baseline plus allowing Lingering Curses to effectively double fear damage on top is probably too much.

Why 100% in the first place? Make it reduce recharge on scepter skills by 20%,grant 150 condition damage to you and allies 600 radius,outgoing condition duration is increased by 33%,increase damage of terror by 15% don’t make it baseline, move Parasitic Contagion to master change to 5-7% allow heal in DS it replaces useless Reaper’s Precision, New GM power trait increase crit damage for each condition on foe 3% per condition.

I’ll try to recreate my variation but hearing necro has 2 HP bars,siphons are fine,engi needs the biggest overhaul,nothing about core fixes created my greatest depression in GW2 . Their new recharge system doesn’t look good on paper either CC and HP threshold are not necro friendly , they are turning condition necro more into a power copy.

Bhawb.7408:

The problem with getting Terror as base, or even as a different tier to Lingering Curse, is the ability for Lingering Curse to double the duration of all non-staff fears (assuming it works in DS for Doom as well). This takes Terror from being a burst threat, to being a sustained damage threat that still deals burst-damage levels of DPS.

The stun duration would be more of an issue than the actual damage from Terror. Like others have pointed out, a simple auto attack of zerker classes will easily outdamage fear ticks.

Also, like they said on stream, the numbers can be altered most easily. And I really don’t think +100% duration for every condition is appropriate. It’s too big on its own and it will conflict with other duration increases if the 100% cap still exists. So I’m pretty sure this number will be much lower when the patch is released.

Sagat.3285:

Why 100% in the first place? Make it reduce recharge on scepter skills by 20%,grant 150 condition damage to you and allies 600 radius,outgoing condition duration is increased by 33%,increase damage of terror by 15% don’t make it baseline, move Parasitic Contagion to master change to 5-7% allow heal in DS it replaces useless Reaper’s Precision, New GM power trait increase crit damage for each condition on foe 3% per condition.

That doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. So your master tier would be: Path of Corruption – Banshee’s Wail – Parasitic Contagion, and gm: Terror – Lingering Curse – stronger version of Target the Weak. You’d have no gm minor trait, and Terror is not baseline or merged into one of the Curses minor traits?

Also, I think the proposed master traits are well placed. It’s a trait for warhorn users and a defensive or offensive trait for other builds. The gm tier should follow a similar pattern: offense vs defense (Lingering Curse vs Parasitic Contagion) and an additional trait for power builds.

flow.6043:

Bhawb.7408:

The problem with getting Terror as base, or even as a different tier to Lingering Curse, is the ability for Lingering Curse to double the duration of all non-staff fears (assuming it works in DS for Doom as well). This takes Terror from being a burst threat, to being a sustained damage threat that still deals burst-damage levels of DPS.

The stun duration would be more of an issue than the actual damage from Terror. Like others have pointed out, a simple auto attack of zerker classes will easily outdamage fear ticks.

Also, like they said on stream, the numbers can be altered most easily. And I really don’t think +100% duration for every condition is appropriate. It’s too big on its own and it will conflict with other duration increases if the 100% cap still exists. So I’m pretty sure this number will be much lower when the patch is released.

Sagat.3285:

Why 100% in the first place? Make it reduce recharge on scepter skills by 20%,grant 150 condition damage to you and allies 600 radius,outgoing condition duration is increased by 33%,increase damage of terror by 15% don’t make it baseline, move Parasitic Contagion to master change to 5-7% allow heal in DS it replaces useless Reaper’s Precision, New GM power trait increase crit damage for each condition on foe 3% per condition.

That doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. So your master tier would be: Path of Corruption – Banshee’s Wail – Parasitic Contagion, and gm: Terror – Lingering Curse – stronger version of Target the Weak. You’d have no gm minor trait, and Terror is not baseline or merged into one of the Curses minor traits?

Also, I think the proposed master traits are well placed. It’s a trait for warhorn users and a defensive or offensive trait for other builds. The gm tier should follow a similar pattern: offense vs defense (Lingering Curse vs Parasitic Contagion) and an additional trait for power builds.

GM minor is increased crit chance and new GM is increased crit damage. Terror alone is kind underwhelming but as a GM it deserves a bit of boost of damage. It looks bad on paper and comparison but hopefully our feedbacks feeds necro this time Curses needs a power GM trait Death Magic and Blood are restrictive and meh. New Lingering Curse makes it a bit more condition support that should be considered as well.

Ah sorry, I misread.
Still, I don’t think Terror should have to compete with any of the proposed traits in Curses. I’d rather have it do less damage as a minor or baseline trait than being forced to simply ignore any of the others.

flow.6043:

Let’s review what the devs said about Terror:

“If you take Terror you’re building a Terrormancer (…) and because it’s build defining we want it to be recognized as such”

@Lingering Curse: “…if you wanna be condi, this is the one you want to take!”

Just to clarify, there is no such thing as a “Terrormancer”.
The only question is: do you play condi? If yes, you have Terror… the end!
This trait is in no way build-defining, it’s just a trait that slightly buffs damage for a build type that – even with the trait – has subpar damage to power builds in both PvP and PvE.

So what would it mean if this trait was made baseline for all necros (or at least merged with a minor trait in Curses):

1. Condition builds would have the choice between a defensive and an offensive trait: Parasitic Contagion vs Lingering Curse.
This is how it should be, extended durations or more sustain.

2. There would be a vacancy in the Curses grandmaster tier.
One of the biggest complaints about the new traits so far: There is no power gm trait in Curses.
Seriously, this is a big problem. Power builds will still pick this line for fury, Banshee’s wail, crit chance and probably Enfeebling Blood. But what the hell are they supposed to do with the gm slot? Conditions heal you? A scepter trait? Or terror… for a build that does very low condition damage?
But if Terror was baseline it would give power builds a negligable damage buff while having an actual power option in the gm tier.
For example: the current form of Target the Weak. So this way a power build could get both more damage and more crit chance for conditions on a target.

Thoughts?

100% agree.

Why would it be too much? I have 100% condi duration now and the most I can get it to tick is like 3 times, for 1250 each!!!!!!! HOW IS THAT TOO MUCH!! LOL

Its like saying we are too powerful right now! LOL?

Are we too powerful right now? HELL NO, we are weaker than most classes in damage output, and now they will make us even weaker??!?! how can you not see that?

If this change goes live, we will be WEAKER than we are right now?

Gryph.8237:

Why would it be too much? I have 100% condi duration now and the most I can get it to tick is like 3 times, for 1250 each!!!!!!! HOW IS THAT TOO MUCH!! LOL

It wouldnt be too much at all. Thieves can spike for 6k with auto attacks and fire/air procs. And we are worried about 1200 fear procs? Makes no sense.

I was suggesting this a lot yesterday. If they’re set on creating an arbitrary distinction between Terrormancer and Condi necro, even making it baseline at a reduced effectiveness and making Master of Terror or Terror trait increase the damage back to current baseline or slightly above, to give condi necros the option of “specializing” in it if they really want to. It wouldnt fix the problem fully, but I would accept such a change.