Guild Wars 2

Too often upon this callous forum one suffers under the innumerability of negative posts. Many a time it seems as if these " [Class] OP ", " [Skill] IS BAD/GOOD" and “ANET U STOOPED” posts are all drawing upon the same base template, and all one has to do is fill in the blanks with your abject feelings. Perhaps this is the fate of any MMO discussion, that warm obscurantism and rhetoric would trump the cold touch of numerics and design.

I would wish for a moment that we could at least within this post, forget about the eternal conflict that is imbalance discussion, and focus on what we enjoy about Necromancers as a class and playstyle.

So I ask, what do you truly love about playing a Necromancer?

My Thoughts

I’ve always admired the design of the necromancer for how well partitioned and discrete its utilities, traits and weapons were. Unlike the ambiguity of say the Warrior’s Sword, you would always be able to tell at a glance how you would employ a build within the context of a power or condition build. Many skills that would scale well in damage for a power build for example would also have a utility function independent of damage.

The Necro is one of the few classes that could use the same skill selection in both power and condi builds and perform on a roughly equal basis.

Consider Death Shroud as an example. From the outset it would seem as if the abilities mismatch eachother, the auto is distinctly power based, the #2 is clearly condi, #3 is condi again, #4 is irredeemably power based and #5? well I ain’ usin’ da’ in moi powah build!

Yet if you look closely, the auto can be traited to apply burning, #2 functions as a gap closer ( perfect for power builds looking to slam a #1 into some poor blokes face), #3 is a CC which only happens to be able to deal damage for condimancers, #4 regenerates life force and #5 has an in built immobilise.

With each skill exists the tools to assist both choices of playstyle. This is the signiture of the Necro design, that one skill can suit the needs of many stat choices, and that you’ll almost never leave an ability off cooldown. It just all makes sense.

Also, Blood Magic, that kittennig is glorious.

Been a big believer that the Necromancer is probably the most balanced class in the game for a while now and I find it funny how low people rank this class in comparison to others.

Either way I’m always glad to see others appreciate good design when they see it and I’ll add Blood is Power to the list of skills that work nicely in both power and condi builds, especially now that it shares the might with nearby allies.

Also the change to vulnerability affecting both power and condi is one of the best things that has happened to this class in while, giving us an added supportive and offensive edge considering how easy it is for us to provide that sweet vuln.

Necro 4 life! … or death if you know what i mean … xD

Gruvel.7059:

Been a big believer that the Necromancer is probably the most balanced class in the game for a while now and I find it funny how low people rank this class in comparison to others.

The funny thing is, I would say Necromancer is the most balanced class in the game right now. The issue is that everyone else is over the top.

When you look at Necro traits and skills, you mostly (coughwellofdarknessand axecough) see things with good effects with an increase in counterplay as the power increases. The stronger something is, the more that can be done to avoid or minimize its effects.

With other professions, the strongest stuff also usually has the least counterplay available, due to short or nonexistant cast times, extremely strong defensive measures, or extremely short cooldowns.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Gruvel.7059:

Been a big believer that the Necromancer is probably the most balanced class in the game for a while now and I find it funny how low people rank this class in comparison to others.

The funny thing is, I would say Necromancer is the most balanced class in the game right now. The issue is that everyone else is over the top.

When you look at Necro traits and skills, you mostly (coughwellofdarknessand axecough) see things with good effects with an increase in counterplay as the power increases. The stronger something is, the more that can be done to avoid or minimize its effects.

With other professions, the strongest stuff also usually has the least counterplay available, due to short or nonexistant cast times, extremely strong defensive measures, or extremely short cooldowns.

I… Well, kitten . I think you’re right

@Drarnor Kunoram.5180

I could not agree more. I feel like the Necromancer was designed with a solid idea in mind and they have not wavered from their vision for the class since the start of the game, while update after update has wrought drastic changes on other classes becoming faster, power-creeped monstrosities of their original designs, the Necromancer has remained a slow yet devastating caster class.

Yup, in agreementioned that necro is the most balanced class, being able to switch from power to conditions with a few stat changes. Though we get really kitten angry when another class something the class could benefit from (looking at you Rev) really can’t complain when I say necro is now the most diverse in terms of class combos (aka: Condimancer w/ lifesteal, power wellomancer, etc)

call me odd but i fell in love with the condition-mancer, even in pve. and i still ran with it even when i was face rolled many many times. something about being a walking petri dish of death and diesease

EVERYONE CHOKE AND DIE!

Just can’t agree with the statement that the design is “good”.

Sure, if you look at the surface traits support well DS to support each role in a traditional game. You can trait to tank, you can trait to powermancer, trait to condimancer and even trait to heal.

But this is where the limitation lie. The Necromancer lack basics things to graduate from the solo profession that is barely OK at everything, to the profession that fit well in the game and use all tools to their full extent.
- No trait, no skill give what is the bare minimum needed to be acceptable : a reliable blast finisher.
- No trait, no skill allow the necromancer to fully enjoy it’s combofield (At this point if the skill weren’t combofield, there would be no difference in the necromancer gameplay. The sad part being that these combofield even are an hindrance in most teamplay because they have an inferior overall value).
- To focus on DS, there is no combofield nor combo finisher on DS. It’s so totally selfish that it’s not needed in teamplay. And basically, that’s why most of the time Necromancers are not needed/wanted in party.

So yeah! I don’t want my necro to be OP, I just want to be able to use some whirlwind finisher or projectile in it’s own well or poison field like every single other profession. I want to be able to blast a field without wondering whether my minion will make it into the field or if the field will last long enough for a foe to trigger my staff mark. I want the necromancer not to only look well balanced, I want him to be balanced deep into the game mechanisms which he isn’t.

Nice topic guess this is the resson Necro are not in any meta not in Pve nor PVP .. we are just too good for meta that why we get instantly kicked from every where ..

Tristan.5678:

Nice topic guess this is the resson Necro are not in any meta not in Pve nor PVP .. we are just too good for meta that why we get instantly kicked from every where ..

Read again. Necromancer and Ranger currently feel like the only balanced professions. Everyone else is over the top, though, which means N/R can’t compete.

ITT: a bunch of people don’t know the difference between design and balance.

The design of the class is very solid. The class, as a whole, has well defined strengths and weaknesses, with all of its tools (aside from axe) being fairly useful no matter how you build or play, even moreso now that conditions got fixed and vuln works on conditions. The class has a very strong theme (slow, durable, better at keeping someone in a fight than escaping from one, powerful but selfish buffs) and that central theme is a heavy part of every single skill and weapon.

The balance isn’t too great, because the pve meta is so broken that it rewards burst damage, fire fields and blast finishers, aoe might, reflects, and literally nothing else. None of those things are things that the necromancer (or ranger) are meant to be good at. And that’s fine. The problem lies with the horrendous encounter design, not the necromancer’s design. Hopefully, since HoT is planned to alleviate the uselessness of both durability and non-might-stacking support, the necromancer’s strengths will actually be able to shine.

The design of necromancer is good in that skills have ample counterplay.
The design of necromancer is bad in that survivability in this game comes from active defense and necros have very little. It is also bad in that necromancers do poor damage, and have poor utility and support compared to other classes. A lot of people think the last sentence is part of balance, but it is also part of design.

Unfortunately for threads like this, the other classes will never get nerfed down. If that was going to happen it would have by now. Thieves, mesmers, and eles will always have 1/4 second or instant cast skills that do way too much. Warriors and guard will always have absurd group support, and sustain. The only hope for necros and rangers is for some implementation of a lot of the stuff that makes everything over the top.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Tristan.5678:

Nice topic guess this is the resson Necro are not in any meta not in Pve nor PVP .. we are just too good for meta that why we get instantly kicked from every where ..

Read again. Necromancer and Ranger currently feel like the only balanced professions. Everyone else is over the top, though, which means N/R can’t compete.

I’d also add engineer to the mix. Sure cele rifle was OP in the previous meta, but trait changes prevent it from being able to have high physical damage, condi pressure, and sustain all in one build.

And condis and burst damage eat it alive.

Now power engi builds are more popular, and in the case of marauder engi… you need to be amazing to even survive since a block, stealth, and two invulns won’t be enough to save you from a mesmer.

So yeah the non meta pvp classes are in fact the only ones with actual exploitable weaknesses, even though they are strong at many things in their own right, thus being balanced.

nearlight.3064:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Tristan.5678:

Nice topic guess this is the resson Necro are not in any meta not in Pve nor PVP .. we are just too good for meta that why we get instantly kicked from every where ..

Read again. Necromancer and Ranger currently feel like the only balanced professions. Everyone else is over the top, though, which means N/R can’t compete.

I’d also add engineer to the mix. Sure cele rifle was OP in the previous meta, but trait changes prevent it from being able to have high physical damage, condi pressure, and sustain all in one build.

And condis and burst damage eat it alive.

Now power engi builds are more popular, and in the case of marauder engi… you need to be amazing to even survive since a block, stealth, and two invulns won’t be enough to save you from a mesmer.

So yeah the non meta pvp classes are in fact the only ones with actual exploitable weaknesses, even though they are strong at many things in their own right, thus being balanced.

Yeah, I forgot engie. I’m not as familiar with them post-patch.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

nearlight.3064:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Tristan.5678:

Nice topic guess this is the resson Necro are not in any meta not in Pve nor PVP .. we are just too good for meta that why we get instantly kicked from every where ..

Read again. Necromancer and Ranger currently feel like the only balanced professions. Everyone else is over the top, though, which means N/R can’t compete.

I’d also add engineer to the mix. Sure cele rifle was OP in the previous meta, but trait changes prevent it from being able to have high physical damage, condi pressure, and sustain all in one build.

And condis and burst damage eat it alive.

Now power engi builds are more popular, and in the case of marauder engi… you need to be amazing to even survive since a block, stealth, and two invulns won’t be enough to save you from a mesmer.

So yeah the non meta pvp classes are in fact the only ones with actual exploitable weaknesses, even though they are strong at many things in their own right, thus being balanced.

Yeah, I forgot engie. I’m not as familiar with them post-patch.

Trust me, even just trying them out will only make you feel frustrated and dispaointed compared to non condi necromancer.

What i love about th…
oh yea, “Necro is hate, Necro is death” -mac 2015

What i love about the necromancer is the FACT that its the most durable damage in the game. So many times i have been the last man standing with everything on my shoulders. and TADA guess who rallies the ‘meta’ ? you guessed it, that unwanted one.

To delve deeper into my statement. YES we are selfish, and YES we have a lack of group defensive, and to an extent offensive support. BUT, people fail to realize we are the same with or without the party, so when they fail we succeed. On the topic of group support. we offer a wide variety of offensive debuffs to hinder enemies on a large scale. not to mention we have the highest AND fastest burst in game (built zerk) with these new changes 10k life blasts without cheesing your weapon for each dungeon, or using race specific utility buffs is easily obtainable. OH, and don’t you dare discount Dagger Auto Attack. you can sit back and say “necro damage is sub-par” i challenge you to prove that statement. until then, i still say paired with a phalanx warrior necro tops the rest easily (even without one, 50% of the fight we can self stack 25 might) making this the only class i will play.

I’ve liked the necromancer since GW1 because of minions. The guild wars series is one of the few to do minion master style of play correctly. I can basically make my own mini version of a party!

hell, in GW1 I would often take an entire portion of the map by myself if I got my minion army going, and in GW2 I can almost do the same thing in dungeons! Once reaper gets released I might be able to do just that.

One of my favorite things is that, in the Mai Trin fractal, I can kite and hold off Mai Trin and her brute of a norn if everyone else is down (or most) and still manage to get my team back on their feet, even if it takes a while. Basically, being able to prevent a wash by being durable as all hell (granted, lower level fractal, but the point remains that Necros are, if not tanky in the traditional sense, then extremely resilient to punishment)