Guild Wars 2

Rise; shout, 40s cd
summons one jagged horror plus one per enemy hit, they take x% of the masters incoming direct damage. x is 50% if I remember that right

spectral armor; spectral, 50s cd
6s protection, gain 8% LF for each hit you take for 6s, stunbreak

in your experience which one is better in terms of
-life force generation?
-damage migration?

for me rise! keeps me alive.

for some reasons the shambling horrors can survive until the timer is up.
that is like 25 seconds ?

6s protection boon can be very easily removed or corrupted, life force is easy for reapers to acquire.

the only way to remove 50% damage reduction from rise is to kill all the shambling horrors or prevent them from attacking.

or deal so much damage until the shambling horrors die due to shock.

rise is 36 seconds with trait, and 26 seconds if rise manage to hit 5 targets.

quite easy to hit 5 targets if team fight or versus reapers with shambling horrors or versus mesmers with lots of illusions (clones and phatasm)

Rise is fantastic for dealing with DH traps as well.

Rise is very strong compared to Spectral Armor. It is quite strong compared to most utilities.

What make the biggest difference between the 2 skills is the uptime. Rise! near 100% uptime of defense, which make it superior to Spectral armor. However, spectral armor have it’s strong point as well.

Going to say spectral armor since its more flexible, rise really isn’t very flexible. It’s more of a fire-and-forget skill. You’ll always get some value out of it while a badly used spec armor can end up doing nothing at all. If you ever find yourself with no lf and you’re running a build a bunch of traits invested in shroud, which would be most builds, the lf gain from spec armor can help turn a fight as well as act as a pseudo-invuln in some circumstances. It’s also a stunbreak. Rise on its own is definitely stronger though.

SA is probably better for 1v1s, but overall, traited “Rise!” is superior in Conquest for me.

good players will kite your horrors. it shines in teamfights only if you are attacking someone that is not actively kiting or can disengage easily. sa is better in some cases.

i think that Rise is the best def skill we have
work amazing in pvp and pve

i use it alot with my MM build

Rym.1469:

SA is probably better for 1v1s, but overall, traited “Rise!” is superior in Conquest for me.

the thing is both skills get a lot better in teamfights..

on a 20k lifeforce base (mercenary, paladin or marauder amulet) spectral armor gives you 1600k effective HP per hit you take, no matter if you fight a power or condi spec. if you activate ot just before going into shroud you are almost invulnerable for 6s no matter how many players hit you as long as they hit for less than 1600 damage per hit..

rise on the other hand has a better uptime in theory but in teamfights I feel like those little things get kitten d in like 5 seconds every time.. anyone knows how mutch lifeforce they give on death?

DEATHsCLAW.1978:

Rym.1469:

SA is probably better for 1v1s, but overall, traited “Rise!” is superior in Conquest for me.

the thing is both skills get a lot better in teamfights..

on a 20k lifeforce base (mercenary, paladin or marauder amulet) spectral armor gives you 1600k effective HP per hit you take, no matter if you fight a power or condi spec. if you activate ot just before going into shroud you are almost invulnerable for 6s no matter how many players hit you as long as they hit for less than 1600 damage per hit..

rise on the other hand has a better uptime in theory but in teamfights I feel like those little things get kitten d in like 5 seconds every time.. anyone knows how mutch lifeforce they give on death?

Life Force generation on SA and SW has 1s ICD, so it doesn’t really scale. Was changed somewhere in 2013.

I personally prefer SA, since it allows me to break out of stun without blowing my Plague Signet. “Rise!” is a great skill though and I can see why some people prefer it.

I prefer Rise!.

It is quite handy for triggering DH traps, Necro Marks, body blocking some projectiles, makes you take less hits from smoke assault and Unrelenting assault and PS from druids and revs.

Rise is overall better, like others said more uptime, easier…

The only arguments for armor are:
-6 seconds of extra shroud time
-stunbreak
-the minions + signet will make you pull condies even in 1v1
- SA pseudo invuln may under some circumstances – like 2v2/3 and youre focused with lots of condies – make you able to tank the condies with shroud
-reaper ditto: the rise guy will provide the other one with more target to to staff#1 or RS#1 while armor guy will not have his RS bar move down for 6s. this is only case where armor straight up counters rise

So spectral armor is more of a cover for lacking lifeforce.
And if you take chilling victory, you can squeeze another +5% LF from rise like with every aoe. Or you can staff auto while half invulnerable. Rise wins overall

The one minor down side to “Rise!” is that the Shambling Horrors have to be attacking someone/thing to give you the damage reduction.

“Damage foes around you. Summon a shambling horror plus additional horrors near each enemy struck. Shambling horrors absorb damage for their master as long as they are attacking.”

So running onto a point covered in DH traps with no enemies around, you will not get the damage reduction, for example. But it’s a very niche scenario for the most part.

sa is also better if you are entering a fight with low lf.

Rise is beyond useful. 50% damage reduction and ALOT of people are forgetting that six horrors up is six more bodies for the purpose of AoE targeting. Now I believe AoE randomly picks targets in the circle. But more targets is less chance my 20% HP dragon hunter team mate takes a mark. Or my Low HP aura share ele getting bombed by something.

WereDragon.6083:

Rise is beyond useful. 50% damage reduction and ALOT of people are forgetting that six horrors up is six more bodies for the purpose of AoE targeting. Now I believe AoE randomly picks targets in the circle. But more targets is less chance my 20% HP dragon hunter team mate takes a mark. Or my Low HP aura share ele getting bombed by something.

This is a good point of AI/minion builds in general but it’s worth keeping in mind that Rise will only activate 6 minions if it strikes 5 targets. The dream 6 minions is feasible but only in good group engagements.

Rise! feels kind of cheesy with its 50% damage reduction.

Perhaps Rise! should have something like a passive 8% damage reduction per active Horror rather than a flat 50% for attacking minions. That might help diversify MM builds away from Death Magic. Add more damage on the shout or a brief stun to promote more active play.

I would also like to see Reapers Protection changed to support shouts by adding a 1 second Fear to Shambling Horror deaths.

Anchoku.8142:

Perhaps Rise! should have something like a passive 8% damage reduction per active Horror rather than a flat 50% for attacking minions. That might help diversify MM builds away from Death Magic. Add more damage on the shout or a brief stun to promote more active play.

MM will never move out of Death Magic. Death Nova is too strong to move out of.

Sarrs.4831:

Anchoku.8142:

Perhaps Rise! should have something like a passive 8% damage reduction per active Horror rather than a flat 50% for attacking minions. That might help diversify MM builds away from Death Magic. Add more damage on the shout or a brief stun to promote more active play.

MM will never move out of Death Magic. Death Nova is too strong to move out of.

Exactly, one has no lived as a MM till they’ve relished in the 6 shambling 2 bone minion explosipocolypsegeddon.

I’ve gotten mine to burst nearly 10k on a single target not counting poisons from 6 shamblings, a flesh golem and two bone minions all popping at the same time. With 9 poison fields up. It’s a beautiful slurry of burst.

WereDragon.6083:

Exactly, one has no lived as a MM till they’ve relished in the 6 shambling 2 bone minion explosipocolypsegeddon.

I’ve gotten mine to burst nearly 10k on a single target not counting poisons from 6 shamblings, a flesh golem and two bone minions all popping at the same time. With 9 poison fields up. It’s a beautiful slurry of burst.

I just love it when you manage to get a good Rise, you move off point, and a thief chases you. He hits you with panic strike and starts spamming AA and then boom he gets flattened by 6 explosions.

I’ve used rise on almost any build since it cam out, it’s one of the few great tools to survive focused dmg in teamfights.

Spectral armor is decent, but the alternatives are IMHO just better.

Rise.
When cast against players who use hidden traps the horrors will trigger those traps without you having to.

It will spawn off of mesmer clones. It will also body block mesmer clones.

They count as targets when in AoE fields which can only hit max 5 targets.

They ruin revenants unrelenting assault.

Can be used through walls or doors to spawn minions on the opposite (battle of champions dusk.)

They are a shout so can be used during CC.
They are a shout so can be used with soldiers runes.

With death magic they can be traited to poison on death, absord conditions, increase toughness or siphon health.

Without death magic they still absorb damage.

Whats not to like about this list?

+1 for rise for helping against heavy focus. It actually works really well for that even in medium sized group fights. I believe the dmg reduction pulses in like 3 secs so good chance you’ll get at least a few seconds reduction even in heavy aoe.

Love spectral armor too though. Wish I had room for both.