Guild Wars 2

…with the ranger skills.
I mean astral force does not regenerate when used:

• nature spirit
• Healing spring (regenerate allies)
• Resounding timbre (regenerate allies)
• Water Sigil.
• Pets
• Traits that make your pet heal when used the F2

I mean, the astral force should regenerate with any healing skill we use to heal others.
Right now the druid can not generate astral force unless he goes all the time with the staff. If you feel like to change to a damage option there is no way you can use the other healing skills to regenerate the astral force quicker (the damage coefficient is still too low)

anduriell.6280:

…with the ranger skills.
I mean astral force does not regenerate when used:

• nature spirit
• Healing spring (regenerate allies)
• Resounding timbre (regenerate allies)
• Water Sigil.
• Pets
• Traits that make your pet heal when used the F2

I mean, the astral force should regenerate with any healing skill we use to heal others.
Right now the druid can not generate astral force unless he goes all the time with the staff. If you feel like to change to a damage option there is no way you can use the other healing skills to regenerate the astral force quicker (the damage coefficient is still too low)

Don’t forget Natural Healing and Signet of the Wild. This is why there is little synergy between the Ranger and Druid. If Natural Healing counted, it would then be an AWESOME trait, instead of the least worse if you don’t need either of the others, because 4s weakness every 30s is pretty crap tbh. Since pets get a 95% damage reduction in PvE now too, it makes Natural Healing even more pointless. Give Druids a reason to use it!

Same goes for Signet of the Wild. The unique Regeneration on this would be simply amazing if it generated AF so that we could use the form without being gated by the staff. You cannot use the active while in the form and the long CD prevents gaining both benefits.

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

That’s what I think too, but I can’t see them removing it now. But yeah, its pretty counter-intuitive for a healing spec, imo.

They could cut the duration further to 10s with a 10s CD and totally remove the AF mechanic and it would be pretty good imo. Although, the 15s duration would be better, if not longer. It is a bad mechanic for a healer who needs to be able to focus healing immediately and not have to wait for the bar to fill, which is also impossible if there is no target, before being able to heal at all.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

That’s what I think too, but I can’t see them removing it now. But yeah, its pretty counter-intuitive for a healing spec, imo.

They could cut the duration further to 10s with a 10s CD and totally remove the AF mechanic and it would be pretty good imo. Although, the 15s duration would be better, if not longer. It is a bad mechanic for a healer who needs to be able to focus healing immediately and not have to wait for the bar to fill, which is also impossible if there is no target, before being able to heal at all.

I don’t think it should have a limited duration at all. There is already a trade-off for going into it since it only offers support skills.

Holland.9351:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

That’s what I think too, but I can’t see them removing it now. But yeah, its pretty counter-intuitive for a healing spec, imo.

They could cut the duration further to 10s with a 10s CD and totally remove the AF mechanic and it would be pretty good imo. Although, the 15s duration would be better, if not longer. It is a bad mechanic for a healer who needs to be able to focus healing immediately and not have to wait for the bar to fill, which is also impossible if there is no target, before being able to heal at all.

I don’t think it should have a limited duration at all. There is already a trade-off for going into it since it only offers support skills.

It has a limited duration because of PvP. It is needed otherwise you would get immortal druids who cannot be killed everywhere in PvP. They are the reason the Minstrel amulet was removed. The EU tourney was so boring because Druids were going 3 vs 1 while just standing still. Imagine if they didn’t even need to build AF and there was no duration for CAF? The game would be pretty boring.

Then have any transformation not count towards point capture

Holland.9351:

Then have any transformation not count towards point capture

That would totally break the Druid for PvP then. Also many other classes like Necro or Rampage Warrior, Tornado, Elixir X, etc. Moa too, that would be even worse if you got Moa’d, not only are you seriously in trouble of being spiked, but you can’t even contribute to the point? Nah.

Ok so the limited duration can stay in PvP, but remove it in PvE and WvW.

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

If we want this then expect the cool down to increase dramatically to at least 20 or 30s. I can already heal to full with CAF #3 in settlers so it would be kinda OP on a 10s cool down only. I would rather have it stay as is.

Photinous.4628:

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

If we want this then expect the cool down to increase dramatically to at least 20 or 30s. I can already heal to full with CAF #3 in settlers so it would be kinda OP on a 10s cool down only. I would rather have it stay as is.

Why can warrior have full adrenalin in 10 sec, 2x if desired?
Necro can refill shroud in matter of seconds.
Why should ranger then have 20-30 sec for CA?

Astral force is nice, but very stupid way of getting it. In BW3 when i tried it, it was actually fun, as soon as we released Druid i tried it, never touched it again, why?

Firelysm.4967:

Photinous.4628:

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

If we want this then expect the cool down to increase dramatically to at least 20 or 30s. I can already heal to full with CAF #3 in settlers so it would be kinda OP on a 10s cool down only. I would rather have it stay as is.

Why can warrior have full adrenalin in 10 sec, 2x if desired?
Necro can refill shroud in matter of seconds.
Why should ranger then have 20-30 sec for CA?

Astral force is nice, but very stupid way of getting it. In BW3 when i tried it, it was actually fun, as soon as we released Druid i tried it, never touched it again, why?

Warrior is one skill that hit or fail it removes all resource and drains OOC.

Necromancer is slow build that has skills with long CD.

Druid is “slowest” build.

So would you like the 300-500% increase in CAF skills’ CD or the drain on miss/ooc?

Justine.6351:

Firelysm.4967:

Photinous.4628:

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

If we want this then expect the cool down to increase dramatically to at least 20 or 30s. I can already heal to full with CAF #3 in settlers so it would be kinda OP on a 10s cool down only. I would rather have it stay as is.

Why can warrior have full adrenalin in 10 sec, 2x if desired?
Necro can refill shroud in matter of seconds.
Why should ranger then have 20-30 sec for CA?

Astral force is nice, but very stupid way of getting it. In BW3 when i tried it, it was actually fun, as soon as we released Druid i tried it, never touched it again, why?

Warrior is one skill that hit or fail it removes all resource and drains OOC.

Necromancer is slow build that has skills with long CD.

Druid is “slowest” build.

So would you like the 300-500% increase in CAF skills’ CD or the drain on miss/ooc?

I think you are missing a couple factors in your argument. Please note that the list of skills/utilities/traits that I provide are probably not complete.

Celestial Avatar Form/Force

• Transformation. Exchanges weapon skills for short-CD healing skills and CC.
• Limited or no synergy with pet (can heal pet)
• Two hard gates: 10 second cooldown and a full bar
• Two methods of gaining Celestial Avatar Force: damage ticks and healing ticks
• No dedicated CAF generating skills
• Cannot be generated while transformed
• Lasts a maximum of 15 seconds
• Upon leaving CAF, the bar is set to half of its remaining value
• No traits or utility skills dedicated to increasing CAF generation
• No synergetic reward for maintaining a high or full CAF bar
• Can be traited for stunbreak+condition cleanse on CAF entry, and 3s Stealth+Superspeed on exit
• No traits that improve CAF during transform

Adrenaline

• Acts as DPS buff and hard CC (Burst skills). Synergy with Berzerk.
• Drains out of combat
• Full Adrenaline not required to activate Burst skills. 8 second CD (hard gate).
• Burst skills improved by higher Adrenaline values (3 tiers, soft gate)
• Berzerkers can also activate Berzerk (15 seconds with a 15 second recharge), which acts as a stance (+15% attack speed, +10 Adrenaline, access to new Burst skills)
• Adrenaline can be traited for faster generation (Axe Mastery, Berzerker’s Fury, Furious, Cleansing Ire, Vigorous Shouts)
• Skills with dedicated Adrenaline generation (All Rage skills, Counterblow, Riposte, “To the Limit!”, Blood Reckoning, Signet of Fury, Berzerker Stance, Signet of Rage)
• Adrenaline levels can be traited to increase the performance of certain utility skills (Physical)
• Trait to regenerate health based on Adrenaline level (Adrenal Health)
• Burst skills and Berzerk mode can be traited for additional damage and effects (Fatal Frenzy, Savage Instinct, Blood Reaction, Dead or Alive, Bloody Roar, Eternal Champion, Burst Precision, Berzerker’s Power, Burst Mastery)

Shroud

• Does not drain out of combat
• 10 second cooldown (hard gate, can be traited for reduced cooldown with Speed of Shadows) but does not need to be filled completely for access
• Acts as both a combat transform and additional health bar
• Degenerates during use and upon taking damage
• Can be traited to reduce rate of degeneration (Vital Persistence)
• No hard gate on duration
• Can be generated while transformed
• Amount of Shroud can be increased by traits and Vitality
• Dedicated generation from weapon and utility skills, including: Warhorn 5, Greatsword 3, Dagger autoattacks, Focus 4, Spectral Armor/Grasp/Walk, “Your Soul is Mine!”
• Improved generation from traits (Soul Comprehension, Soul Marks, Spectral Mastery, Gluttony, Chilling Victory, Blighter’s Boon)
• Can be traited for benefits and effects upon entry (Spiteful Spirit, Furious Demise, Weakening Shroud, Armored Shroud, Shrouded Removal, Foot in the Grave)
• Can be traited for benefits during transform (Reaper’s Might, Rending Shroud, Path of Corruption, Shrouded Removal, Deadly Strength, Unholy Sanctuary, Transfusion, Unholy Martyr, Unyielding Blast, Vital Persistence, Dhuumfire, Death Perception, Relentless Pursuit, Blighter’s Boon, Reaper’s Onslaught)
• Can be traited for benefits upon exit (Beyond the Veil, Life from Death)
• Can trait to benefit out-of-Shroud from higher Shroud levels (Strength of Undeath)

Scrimschaw.5784:

Justine.6351:

Firelysm.4967:

Photinous.4628:

Holland.9351:

Astral Force should not even be a thing. CA should only have a cooldown after leaving it and nothing else.

If we want this then expect the cool down to increase dramatically to at least 20 or 30s. I can already heal to full with CAF #3 in settlers so it would be kinda OP on a 10s cool down only. I would rather have it stay as is.

Why can warrior have full adrenalin in 10 sec, 2x if desired?
Necro can refill shroud in matter of seconds.
Why should ranger then have 20-30 sec for CA?

Astral force is nice, but very stupid way of getting it. In BW3 when i tried it, it was actually fun, as soon as we released Druid i tried it, never touched it again, why?

Warrior is one skill that hit or fail it removes all resource and drains OOC.

Necromancer is slow build that has skills with long CD.

Druid is “slowest” build.

So would you like the 300-500% increase in CAF skills’ CD or the drain on miss/ooc?

I think you are missing a couple factors in your argument. Please note that the list of skills/utilities/traits that I provide are probably not complete.

Celestial Avatar Form/Force

• Transformation. Exchanges weapon skills for short-CD healing skills and CC.
• Limited or no synergy with pet (can heal pet)
• Two hard gates: 10 second cooldown and a full bar
• Two methods of gaining Celestial Avatar Force: damage ticks and healing ticks
• No dedicated CAF generating skills
• Cannot be generated while transformed
• Lasts a maximum of 15 seconds
• Upon leaving CAF, the bar is set to half of its remaining value
• No traits or utility skills dedicated to increasing CAF generation
• No synergetic reward for maintaining a high or full CAF bar
• Can be traited for stunbreak+condition cleanse on CAF entry, and 3s Stealth+Superspeed on exit
• No traits that improve CAF during transform

Adrenaline

• Acts as DPS buff and hard CC (Burst skills). Synergy with Berzerk.
• Drains out of combat
• Full Adrenaline not required to activate Burst skills. 8 second CD (hard gate).
• Burst skills improved by higher Adrenaline values (3 tiers, soft gate)
• Berzerkers can also activate Berzerk (15 seconds with a 15 second recharge), which acts as a stance (+15% attack speed, +10 Adrenaline, access to new Burst skills)
• Adrenaline can be traited for faster generation (Axe Mastery, Berzerker’s Fury, Furious, Cleansing Ire, Vigorous Shouts)
• Skills with dedicated Adrenaline generation (All Rage skills, Counterblow, Riposte, “To the Limit!”, Blood Reckoning, Signet of Fury, Berzerker Stance, Signet of Rage)
• Adrenaline levels can be traited to increase the performance of certain utility skills (Physical)
• Trait to regenerate health based on Adrenaline level (Adrenal Health)
• Burst skills and Berzerk mode can be traited for additional damage and effects (Fatal Frenzy, Savage Instinct, Blood Reaction, Dead or Alive, Bloody Roar, Eternal Champion, Burst Precision, Berzerker’s Power, Burst Mastery)

Shroud

• Does not drain out of combat
• 10 second cooldown (hard gate, can be traited for reduced cooldown with Speed of Shadows) but does not need to be filled completely for access
• Acts as both a combat transform and additional health bar
• Degenerates during use and upon taking damage
• Can be traited to reduce rate of degeneration (Vital Persistence)
• No hard gate on duration
• Can be generated while transformed
• Amount of Shroud can be increased by traits and Vitality
• Dedicated generation from weapon and utility skills, including: Warhorn 5, Greatsword 3, Dagger autoattacks, Focus 4, Spectral Armor/Grasp/Walk, “Your Soul is Mine!”
• Improved generation from traits (Soul Comprehension, Soul Marks, Spectral Mastery, Gluttony, Chilling Victory, Blighter’s Boon)
• Can be traited for benefits and effects upon entry (Spiteful Spirit, Furious Demise, Weakening Shroud, Armored Shroud, Shrouded Removal, Foot in the Grave)
• Can be traited for benefits during transform (Reaper’s Might, Rending Shroud, Path of Corruption, Shrouded Removal, Deadly Strength, Unholy Sanctuary, Transfusion, Unholy Martyr, Unyielding Blast, Vital Persistence, Dhuumfire, Death Perception, Relentless Pursuit, Blighter’s Boon, Reaper’s Onslaught)
• Can be traited for benefits upon exit (Beyond the Veil, Life from Death)
• Can trait to benefit out-of-Shroud from higher Shroud levels (Strength of Undeath)

Well you wasted a lot of time in that. (yes tl;dr).

Justine.6351:

Well you wasted a lot of time in that. (yes tl;dr).

Nah, I know you don’t care one way or the other. You’ve made that very clear since the beginning. I typed it out for anyone who does care.

Scrimschaw.5784:

Justine.6351:

Well you wasted a lot of time in that. (yes tl;dr).

Nah, I know you don’t care one way or the other. You’ve made that very clear since the beginning. I typed it out for anyone who does care.

Of the forum rangers I don’t like,

You>heim>mist>aundell>knighthood>tragicmess

Don’t be offended, you are worlds above the others on that list.

Justine.6351:

Scrimschaw.5784:

Justine.6351:

Well you wasted a lot of time in that. (yes tl;dr).

Nah, I know you don’t care one way or the other. You’ve made that very clear since the beginning. I typed it out for anyone who does care.

Of the forum rangers I don’t like,

You>heim>mist>aundell>knighthood>tragicmess

Don’t be offended, you are worlds above the others on that list.

That’s just childish, no matter if you like this person or not, if he gave you reasons why you are wrong you should respect that, and not bash as your own defence.

And I agree with Scrimschaw, we again, invest to much for no good benefit.

Firelysm.4967:

Justine.6351:

Scrimschaw.5784:

Justine.6351:

Well you wasted a lot of time in that. (yes tl;dr).

Nah, I know you don’t care one way or the other. You’ve made that very clear since the beginning. I typed it out for anyone who does care.

Of the forum rangers I don’t like,

You>heim>mist>aundell>knighthood>tragicmess

Don’t be offended, you are worlds above the others on that list.

That’s just childish, no matter if you like this person or not, if he gave you reasons why you are wrong you should respect that, and not bash as your own defence.

And I agree with Scrimschaw, we again, invest to much for no good benefit.

ahahahahahahahahahahahaha

Firelysm.4967:

That’s just childish, no matter if you like this person or not, if he gave you reasons why you are wrong you should respect that, and not bash as your own defence.

And I agree with Scrimschaw, we again, invest to much for no good benefit.

Thank you for the support. I’m not sure why asking for better integration of Druid mechanics into base Ranger is so controversial, but everyone has their own opinions. It is very nice of Justine to continue bumping this thread, considering I find it a serious issue with Druid that is compounded by the likelihood of future nerfs.

anduriell.6280:

…with the ranger skills.
I mean astral force does not regenerate when used:

• nature spirit
• Healing spring (regenerate allies)
• Resounding timbre (regenerate allies)
• Water Sigil.
• Pets
• Traits that make your pet heal when used the F2

I mean, the astral force should regenerate with any healing skill we use to heal others.
Right now the druid can not generate astral force unless he goes all the time with the staff. If you feel like to change to a damage option there is no way you can use the other healing skills to regenerate the astral force quicker (the damage coefficient is still too low)

Sigil of renewal (AOE heal on weapon swap) doesn’t charge up AE as well