Guild Wars 2

What proposed changes would u make to this? I doubt many people would take the trait because a 25% health threshold isn’t a lot. So, what if it activated at a 33% health threshold or 50% at the most and reduced the damage by 33% – 25%

or what would u do with it?

Until we get something that is a viable replacement to empathic bond nothing will make Bark skin good enough, they could make it 100% physical damage reduction at 25% I still wouldn’t take it.

this Trait is already freaking ridiculously strong… Hint Protection + Barkskin = taking almost no damage.

Also, this trait, unlike EB, doesn’t butcher your pet (you know that very important part of your profession), AND it occurs individually on you and your pet IE if you’re at 25% or lower you take 50%, and then if your pet is at 25% or lower THEY take 50% less, makes them very had to bring down.

Where would Bark Skin see the most use in what builds?

CMstorm.8679:

Where would Bark Skin see the most use in what builds?

I’ve used it in “tanky” dps builds (by tanky i mean something like valk or barbarian/knights something that isn’t totally damage oriented) and i’ve also used it in bunker builds and it works really well in both, ESPECIALLY if you’ve got a heal like TU or are running a lot of regen because it makes you extremely hard to kill once you drop into that 25% threshold unless they’re condi damage.

I personally think it works best when using HaO paired with high regen uptime, the regen itself tends to keep you alive long enough for HaO to come back off CD and allow you to shoot back up in health and really throw people off.

Durzlla.6295:

CMstorm.8679:

Where would Bark Skin see the most use in what builds?

I’ve used it in “tanky” dps builds (by tanky i mean something like valk or barbarian/knights something that isn’t totally damage oriented) and i’ve also used it in bunker builds and it works really well in both, ESPECIALLY if you’ve got a heal like TU or are running a lot of regen because it makes you extremely hard to kill once you drop into that 25% threshold unless they’re condi damage.

I personally think it works best when using HaO paired with high regen uptime, the regen itself tends to keep you alive long enough for HaO to come back off CD and allow you to shoot back up in health and really throw people off.

Pve/dungeons/fractals/wvw?

And also it just negates direct damage, not condition damage :/
does the beast master signet trait affect Signet of Stone being able to negate conditions? or not? i haven’t tried that yet, though i’ve wanted to since like forever lol

CMstorm.8679:

Where would Bark Skin see the most use in what builds?

Vitality based builds. Otherwise it only gives maybe one or two hits extra before dying (assuming the hit that enters you into that 25% HP threshold leaves you with any viable amount of HP to begin with). The problem with it is more in that when you enter the 25% HP threshold, a lot of the time you will actually have a lot less than 25%. You are more likely going to be at 15-20% HP when its effect even starts taking effect. If you’re unlucky, you could be looking at something even much lower, but at best, you can’t have much more. At this point, unless you are using a high vitality build, you’re only looking at like ~3k HP. How much will 50% damage reduction REALLY help you at this point? Not much in comparison to the much more constant effect of empathic bond.

Vitality based builds will allow you to enter the threshold with much more of a health pool to work with. Additionally, you are less likely to enter it after a big hit that leaves you with only 1k-2k HP (in which case, 50% damage reduction doesn’t really do you any good anyways).

CMstorm.8679:

Durzlla.6295:

CMstorm.8679:

Where would Bark Skin see the most use in what builds?

I’ve used it in “tanky” dps builds (by tanky i mean something like valk or barbarian/knights something that isn’t totally damage oriented) and i’ve also used it in bunker builds and it works really well in both, ESPECIALLY if you’ve got a heal like TU or are running a lot of regen because it makes you extremely hard to kill once you drop into that 25% threshold unless they’re condi damage.

I personally think it works best when using HaO paired with high regen uptime, the regen itself tends to keep you alive long enough for HaO to come back off CD and allow you to shoot back up in health and really throw people off.

Pve/dungeons/fractals/wvw?

And also it just negates direct damage, not condition damage :/
does the beast master signet trait affect Signet of Stone being able to negate conditions? or not? i haven’t tried that yet, though i’ve wanted to since like forever lol

Normally sPvP, but i’ve used it in Dungeons/Fractals before, didn’t really notice it there but that’s because i normally don’t get downed very much….

Also, it’s good for toughness AND vitality builds, toughness builds it cuts the balls off of like all damage you take, and for vitality builds it gives you the tankyness you normally lack (granted only for a short time)

sounds awesome sauce

Durzlla.6295:

CMstorm.8679:

Durzlla.6295:

CMstorm.8679:

Where would Bark Skin see the most use in what builds?

I’ve used it in “tanky” dps builds (by tanky i mean something like valk or barbarian/knights something that isn’t totally damage oriented) and i’ve also used it in bunker builds and it works really well in both, ESPECIALLY if you’ve got a heal like TU or are running a lot of regen because it makes you extremely hard to kill once you drop into that 25% threshold unless they’re condi damage.

I personally think it works best when using HaO paired with high regen uptime, the regen itself tends to keep you alive long enough for HaO to come back off CD and allow you to shoot back up in health and really throw people off.

Pve/dungeons/fractals/wvw?

And also it just negates direct damage, not condition damage :/
does the beast master signet trait affect Signet of Stone being able to negate conditions? or not? i haven’t tried that yet, though i’ve wanted to since like forever lol

Normally sPvP, but i’ve used it in Dungeons/Fractals before, didn’t really notice it there but that’s because i normally don’t get downed very much….

Also, it’s good for toughness AND vitality builds, toughness builds it cuts the balls off of like all damage you take, and for vitality builds it gives you the tankyness you normally lack (granted only for a short time)

I’d argue its effectiveness on toughness builds. I have toughness up the butt and still get hit with some pretty heavy damage depending on the opponent. If you’re fighting an opponent that doesn’t hit hard, you don’t need it in the first place. I still get hit with 5k+ damage at times, and that’s more than enough to skip the entire pool of HP that would even trigger your bark skin. Even if it doesn’t, a single hit from a thief or warrior can do 1000s of damage even with 3000+ armor. Bark skin still won’t keep you alive for more than a couple hits if you don’t have a high health pool. This isn’t for all enemies of course, but for most scenarios Empathic Bond is a better alternative since it weighs as a much more beneficial skill over the course of a fight than one that only keeps you alive for a few more hits when you’re already going down.

And in response to an earlier post of yours, even using a regen build, I’d still recommend Empathic Bond over Bark Skin. We don’t have much condition removal and a regen build is centered around strong regens and large uptimes. Poisons generally last for a long time when they’re applied, so without Empathic Bond, we’re suffering huge losses in HP just from 33% reduced healing due to poison. This doesn’t even account for the other effects of conditions that can completely kill a rotation or flip a fight that are removed instantly by your pet. Overall, I just view Empathic Bond as a much more useful skill to regen builds in this conditions meta. Even a glassy thief will drop poisons on you. The only times that Bark Skin might be a better choice would be when fighting warriors and mesmers, and fighting one of these rather than something else (not even counting when you run into a group) is in the minority of encounters from my experience. Empathic Bond has got it beat in almost every aspect outside of strictly determined 1v1 dueling, at least in my opinion.

As for proposed changes to the skill, I think it should be 33% reduced damage and condition duration at 33% HP or something along that standard… basically work as a condition removal alternative that is stronger than empathic bond but only works for important parts of the fight like when you’re going to die. The nerf to the reduced damage more to help along the lines of keeping it a balanced skill.

I also think it would work much better if damage was calculated slightly differently when the skill triggered. For example, say you take 5k damage normally and only 1k damage is needed to put you under 25%… then the remaining 4k damage has 50% removed from it so you only take 3k damage overall instead.

I have to agree with Faux on this one. I’ll admitt I havent used it since it was increased to 50%, but I always found the same problem hes just described. It wont activate till you’re on 3-5k HP, which even with a 50% damage reduction is still within easy bursting range for DPS heavy builds (especially a thief who at this point could spam HS correctly to inflict huge damage due to your low health).

And then the same problem as always.. its competing with EB. Since I like to run traps, I dont afford to take SoR easily, and trying to mash together enough Cond Removal from lots of little sources to fill the gap becomes frustrating and costly.

To fix it? They might consider lowering it back to 33% instead of 50% and putting in a master slot? I’m not sure really, but that certainly would make it more attractive to me.

Faux Sheaux.6179:

As for proposed changes to the skill, I think it should be 33% reduced damage and condition duration at 33% HP or something along that standard… basically work as a condition removal alternative that is stronger than empathic bond but only works for important parts of the fight like when you’re going to die. The nerf to the reduced damage more to help along the lines of keeping it a balanced skill.

-33% condi duration would help a lot, making bark skin actually a viable option, the problem of ranger has always been its ability to cleanse conditions.

Crazy idea : why not moving empathic bond to Beast mastery ? but that could actually be a little bit OP :P

This is a PvE trait first and foremost. Very good at it too

How do conditions affect bark skin? Are they reduced as well, even if they were applied before the threshold? I suspect they aren’t, which would be another drawback to the skill.

Faux Sheaux.6179:

Durzlla.6295:

CMstorm.8679:

Durzlla.6295:

CMstorm.8679:

Where would Bark Skin see the most use in what builds?

I’ve used it in “tanky” dps builds (by tanky i mean something like valk or barbarian/knights something that isn’t totally damage oriented) and i’ve also used it in bunker builds and it works really well in both, ESPECIALLY if you’ve got a heal like TU or are running a lot of regen because it makes you extremely hard to kill once you drop into that 25% threshold unless they’re condi damage.

I personally think it works best when using HaO paired with high regen uptime, the regen itself tends to keep you alive long enough for HaO to come back off CD and allow you to shoot back up in health and really throw people off.

Pve/dungeons/fractals/wvw?

And also it just negates direct damage, not condition damage :/
does the beast master signet trait affect Signet of Stone being able to negate conditions? or not? i haven’t tried that yet, though i’ve wanted to since like forever lol

Normally sPvP, but i’ve used it in Dungeons/Fractals before, didn’t really notice it there but that’s because i normally don’t get downed very much….

Also, it’s good for toughness AND vitality builds, toughness builds it cuts the balls off of like all damage you take, and for vitality builds it gives you the tankyness you normally lack (granted only for a short time)

I’d argue its effectiveness on toughness builds. I have toughness up the butt and still get hit with some pretty heavy damage depending on the opponent. If you’re fighting an opponent that doesn’t hit hard, you don’t need it in the first place. I still get hit with 5k+ damage at times, and that’s more than enough to skip the entire pool of HP that would even trigger your bark skin. Even if it doesn’t, a single hit from a thief or warrior can do 1000s of damage even with 3000+ armor. Bark skin still won’t keep you alive for more than a couple hits if you don’t have a high health pool. This isn’t for all enemies of course, but for most scenarios Empathic Bond is a better alternative since it weighs as a much more beneficial skill over the course of a fight than one that only keeps you alive for a few more hits when you’re already going down.

And in response to an earlier post of yours, even using a regen build, I’d still recommend Empathic Bond over Bark Skin. We don’t have much condition removal and a regen build is centered around strong regens and large uptimes. Poisons generally last for a long time when they’re applied, so without Empathic Bond, we’re suffering huge losses in HP just from 33% reduced healing due to poison. This doesn’t even account for the other effects of conditions that can completely kill a rotation or flip a fight that are removed instantly by your pet. Overall, I just view Empathic Bond as a much more useful skill to regen builds in this conditions meta. Even a glassy thief will drop poisons on you. The only times that Bark Skin might be a better choice would be when fighting warriors and mesmers, and fighting one of these rather than something else (not even counting when you run into a group) is in the minority of encounters from my experience. Empathic Bond has got it beat in almost every aspect outside of strictly determined 1v1 dueling, at least in my opinion.

Yeah i agree with this, even when taking the regen focused builds into account. Like mentioned in the quote some classes can stack poison on you for upwards of 45 seconds. Although this is due to be nerfed somewhat Empathic Bond is still the most bang for your buck in the current condi meta.

my idea for buffing Bark Skin in this post ::https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/RANGER-PETS-6/3520859

The idea is that you instead have 13% (1/4 of 50, rounded up) damage reduction for all 100% of your Hp, so long as your pet is alive. You lose that bonus if your pet dies, but you still go up to 50% damage reduction at 25% health regardless. (I didn’t specify, but it should be physical and condition damage reduction for both bonuses)

Another proposal would be to keep it as it is. But just add a complete condition removal once you pass the 25% HP mark (on like a 60 second CD. Could even be signet of renewal active but for that I’d rather have the active reworked first) and give rangers 10% conditions duration reduction whilst below 25%hp.

Ill use this post to also petition for a trait which gives rangers a – 33% condi duration on cripple / chill/immob etc. I feel ranger should have been the first class to get this. Maybe even through a signet (signet of the hunt maybe?)

I think rangers need a big trait reshuffle that at leat puts empatic bond into a 20 pt tier. That single trait limits any ranger build in pvp.

Ideally I want to see tanky dps ranger become viable, traps moved out of skirmishing, and spotter/another trait moved out of marksmanship into skirmishing.

Ryan.9387:

I think rangers need a big trait reshuffle that at leat puts empatic bond into a 20 pt tier. That single trait limits any ranger build in pvp.

Ideally I want to see tanky dps ranger become viable, traps moved out of skirmishing, and spotter/another trait moved out of marksmanship into skirmishing.

Considering what some of the other classes have in the master tier slots i would have to agree. Some have some really nice trait’s at the 5pt trait such as mesmer’s perma vigor. I think thats due to be nerfed but still a shinning example.

Would be nice, even if they moved traps traits to mid tier and combined them. That way a trap ranger could go 20 into the health line (forget what its called >.<) for poison removal and blind removal on dodge, or even a spirit ^-^. Would open up some builds nicely, even if it didn’t put trappers into competition with necros or engineers for dps condition spots.

Iv’e ran with Barkskin over EB since I started playing Ranger and have had zero issues. I am also a BM condi ranger that uses masters bond and birds w/ chill stacking, so, in that regards I want my pet to stay up as long as possible. I have never had an issue with conditions even now, running only signet of Renewal, in fact I will upload a clip of me fighting 2 fully stacked condition necros and winning (thanks Entangle) today.

I think a lot of it is personal preference and play style. Nothing like getting to the 25% health threshhold, and let’s say you get hit with an Earthshaker, or a Bask Venom, Barkskin kicks in, pop TU in my case, few dodges, and I’m back to full.

You literally control when you want a massive dmg reduction in the form of protection, so, there are deffinitely pros.

I have yet to die to a melee class in any 1vx situation where I wasn’t zerged in over 6 months and I run full dire armor/weps and apoth trinkets.

I have never ran EB extensively because I like my pet to be useful, which EB doesn’t allow, and I’ve never had issues with conditions, just gotta know what to dodge, the same as any physical damage.

Also a lot of you are saying 50% damage reduction isn’t much but it seems this applies before your armor reduction which nerfs their damage by a lot more than 50%, not to mention that this stacks with protection, which you get everytime you dodge, which nerfs their damage even more.

It literally gets to the point where 13k back stabs begin to tickle you for 2k, the damage reduction is absolutely MASSIVE. Not to mention you don’t have EB, so your pet won’t be totally kitten either, which is a huge advantage.

If you’re having issue with condis running Barkskin I’d suggest grabbing Melandru runes, and/or healing spring and/or sig of renewal, and if you’re bunkering? Take a brown bear + protect me, you’ll oversee the rise and fall of nations with that tankyness.

I’ve ran without EB before, I dislike doing that…..I also don’t like running without Speed Rune as well…

However Barkskin is amazing for a PvE trait.. that much is sure.

Bark skin would have to kick in at 50% to consider it. Mind you they could reduce the damage negation to 25% then.

Being at 25% is such an aggro magnet in wvw it doesnt help much as is. And it doesnt come into play enough to matter a majority of the time, while EB is working for you all the time.

Kilger.5490:

Bark skin would have to kick in at 50% to consider it. Mind you they could reduce the damage negation to 25% then.

You want the damage taken to be equivalent, not the damage reduction.

• Say without the trait you need to take 100 units of damage to die.

• With the trait (and assuming damage comes in small enough increments), you need 75 + 25 / (1 – .5) = 125 units of damage to die.

• With your 50%/25% proposal, you need 50 + 50 / (1 – .25) = 116.7 units of damage to die.

• The correct equivalency if it kicks in at 50% is 33% damage reduction. 50 + 50 / (1 – .33) = 125 units of damage to die.

The fact that damage taken is (1 – damage reduction) makes bark skin + protection an incredibly potent combo. 75 + 25 / (1 – .5 – .33) = 222 units of damage.

Solandri.9640:

• The correct equivalency if it kicks in at 50% is 33% damage reduction. 50 + 50 / (1 – .33) = 125 units of damage to die.

Thanks for looking at that again, I was going to say 33% at first but my brains tired.

I take it as it is now, yeah 50% would be nice, but the cost of losing some more damage reduction off the top of it wouldn’t be worth it to me. I can’t tell you how many times I clung to life around 25% and brought the fight back to my favor thanks to this trait. And yes there’s a noticeable difference when I don’t take it. Without it, hitting 25% usually means there’s no way back out, but with it you have a reasonable chance of recovering the fight.

It is noticeable on my pets too, especially in bigger fights. It doesn’t make them any tankier in the traditional sense, but what it does is allow me more time to swap them out before they die so I get half cooldown time on them rather them hitting that 25% and me not having any chance in the world of swapping them out before they get splattered.

Barkskin – SoR – Poultry Lemongrass+Melandru is a very powerful combo. More hits in the build the earlier Barkskin kicks in…

I ran a power/Vit build with Barkskin and had 32K hits for kittenz n gigglez and it was nuts vs power based enemies when it kicks in at 8K hits. with smart dodging and natures protection it made for some ridiculous damage reduction and that was before they buffed it to 50%

I ran BS often before the condi meta took over…now its difficult not to take EB even with Melandru+Poultry…now I mostly run the best condition removal I can as it is effect all the time and not when you drop below a threshold.