Guild Wars 2

“To move, or not to move.” That is the question I have for this thread.

I was wondering how people feel about Barrage and Whirling Defense being stationary abilities.

From a WvW zerging point of view, the longbow is a terrible weapon in the open field because the only AoE (Barrage) is a 2 1/2 second stationary/channeled ability that does not come close to the damage potential of other profession’s stationary/channeled abilities and also puts the Ranger in harms way most of the time when casting this ability.

Whirling Defense on the other hand might be a bit OP if Ranger’s were able to run around with this skill yet it could open a door to a new meta that could give Ranger’s a unique nitch in WvW zerg strategizing if used properly?

What do you all thing?

if your use the #3 on the LB your in stealth for the first 2 sec of the LB channel, its part of the reason they put the stealth on the LB.
If they make whirling defense mobile it will be the exact same as the warrior off hand ax move.

Whirling Axe does not block projectiles. That is probably the reason why its stationary.

The times I would get a good use out of barrage (such as vs zerg) I typically don’t have a problem getting it off. In a 1v1 it’s useless as hell. It does feel kind of underwhelming if only because people actually make an effort to get out of the way of it. (Probably fearing it’s a magical AC) Whirling Defense has a pretty cool animation that would just look silly if you were moving. I’d rather Whirling Defense be a skill that made people go “Oh kitten don’t attack that guy!” instead of laughing at us while we stand there making ourselves dizzy.

I have no idea how to make these skills less awkward. To brain storm for you quickly some possible random ideas are;

Whirling Defense:
- Reduce damage taken to 0. (Not Invulnerability. This allows retaliation to still trigger for getting hit.)
- Blocks Melee attacks & causes X effect whenever one is blocked.
- Causes Pet to move to you (inside protective bubble) and a special blast finisher attack.

Barrage:
- Immobilize replaces cripple.
- Interupts every 3rd hit.
- Remove line of sight requirement. (Only fair considering AC get to fire w/o LoS)

Do you have to stop in place when you drink a forty? lol that song you posted.

Edit: it’s a 40 oz water, don’t freak out (or is it?)

I’ve heard whirling defense is stationary because the animation would look like kitten if the ranger could move while doing it…

Eurantien.4632:

I’ve heard whirling defense is stationary because the animation would look like kitten if the ranger could move while doing it…

Not at all, the skill would be unbelievably broken as kitten if it were mobile, you’d deal a large amount of damage, while applying vuln (thus boosting your pets and your teammates damage) while reflecting projectiles back at their owner, and having retal on yourself to punish Melee attackers further, it’s also the longest whirl finisher in the game, making it the strongest (tornados whirl finisher only lasts for 3 seconds but will use it 5 times).

Does the animation play a role? Probably, but that’s hardly the ONLY one.

I often wish barrage was a skill the Ranger got and the #5 ability was an aimed shot. Granted no one in their right mind would take Barrage in its current form as a skill, but that’s the case with a lot of what we have.

Whirling defense I think is fine. ANet has said they aren’t pleased with how 100blades works for Warriors in the past so maybe one day they’ll adjust that and we’ll see something happen with other melee oriented rooting skills.

denimdan.8642:

if your use the #3 on the LB your in stealth for the first 2 sec of the LB channel, its part of the reason they put the stealth on the LB.
If they make whirling defense mobile it will be the exact same as the warrior off hand ax move.

This of course is in case LB skill #3 actually hits!

zackgtie.7421:

denimdan.8642:

if your use the #3 on the LB your in stealth for the first 2 sec of the LB channel, its part of the reason they put the stealth on the LB.
If they make whirling defense mobile it will be the exact same as the warrior off hand ax move.

This of course is in case LB skill #3 actually hits!

Uh it’s a pretty easy shot to land

if you run a longbow if wvw, you should be running piercing arrows, if not, you’re doing it wrong. Piercing arrows makes every attack a multi target attack, and if you drop barrage you should be away from the fight anyway, so the 2s immob shouldn’t be a problem. If you try and drop a barrage inside the enemy, you may have a few issues.

Durzlla.6295:

Eurantien.4632:

I’ve heard whirling defense is stationary because the animation would look like kitten if the ranger could move while doing it…

Not at all, the skill would be unbelievably broken as kitten if it were mobile, you’d deal a large amount of damage, while applying vuln (thus boosting your pets and your teammates damage) while reflecting projectiles back at their owner, and having retal on yourself to punish Melee attackers further, it’s also the longest whirl finisher in the game, making it the strongest (tornados whirl finisher only lasts for 3 seconds but will use it 5 times).

Does the animation play a role? Probably, but that’s hardly the ONLY one.

I have heard this. So, um, “not at all” doesn’t really apply. It also would look very strange if we could do our current animation while moving… Anyway, whirling finishers are the weakest finisher and on top of that at full zerker whirling defense hits for a wopping 5-6k over a time of 5.5s making it one of the weakest skills in the game. Not to mention, it is easily interrupted.

Eurantien.4632:

Durzlla.6295:

Eurantien.4632:

I’ve heard whirling defense is stationary because the animation would look like kitten if the ranger could move while doing it…

Not at all, the skill would be unbelievably broken as kitten if it were mobile, you’d deal a large amount of damage, while applying vuln (thus boosting your pets and your teammates damage) while reflecting projectiles back at their owner, and having retal on yourself to punish Melee attackers further, it’s also the longest whirl finisher in the game, making it the strongest (tornados whirl finisher only lasts for 3 seconds but will use it 5 times).

Does the animation play a role? Probably, but that’s hardly the ONLY one.

I have heard this. So, um, “not at all” doesn’t really apply. It also would look very strange if we could do our current animation while moving… Anyway, whirling finishers are the weakest finisher and on top of that at full zerker whirling defense hits for a wopping 5-6k over a time of 5.5s making it one of the weakest skills in the game. Not to mention, it is easily interrupted.

It’s actually NOT easily interrupted, it forces them to use a non projectile interrupt, and it’s called whirling DEFENSE what part of that makes you think it should be mainly offensive? And whirls are only weak when they’re short, you get some actual synergy going on between your teammates and it will destroy people, for example, my engi (CC engi) paired with my friends ranger can put up like 30s of burning on some poor kitten due to him spinning to win in my fire field alone… not to mention i can normally pull the poor kittens into him (aoe pull) and room them all for a good amount of hits which causes multiple of them to burn for that long.

If that were an etheral field? That’s 15 stacks of confusion, and seeing as how etheral comes from mesmers, you combo that and their entire team is now able to not touch a single one of their skills, dodge, or rez, without exploding.

Yup, whirls weakest in the game…

Am I the only one who doesn’t mind Whirling Defense being Stationary?

Honestly, I wouldn’t change a thing about the Ranger’s OH axe. It’s an overall solid weapon with a great pull, projectile reflect, and retaliation.

If we had to buff it, I’d simply give Whirling Defense a radius buff, but nothing beyond that.

I’m still not ready to make an assessment on Whirling Defenses, mainly because I play mostly PvP game modes (including WvW), and power builds just don’t have the necessary tools to compete imo.

My initial opinion on the skill itself is that it doesn’t do enough damage to be a rooted skill.

But at the same time, ranger power builds lack important necessities, like damage coefficients, reliable condition removal, and reliable ways to counter protection, among other boons. At least from a PvP perspective. Just one of those things might make ranger builds scary strong compared to their current iterations, and Whirling Defense might have some more merit then, though the damage per hit still doesn’t seem worth it.

That pull though, that makes offhand axe worth it alone, controlling the opponent into melee range.

Durzlla.6295:

Eurantien.4632:

Durzlla.6295:

Eurantien.4632:

I’ve heard whirling defense is stationary because the animation would look like kitten if the ranger could move while doing it…

Not at all, the skill would be unbelievably broken as kitten if it were mobile, you’d deal a large amount of damage, while applying vuln (thus boosting your pets and your teammates damage) while reflecting projectiles back at their owner, and having retal on yourself to punish Melee attackers further, it’s also the longest whirl finisher in the game, making it the strongest (tornados whirl finisher only lasts for 3 seconds but will use it 5 times).

Does the animation play a role? Probably, but that’s hardly the ONLY one.

I have heard this. So, um, “not at all” doesn’t really apply. It also would look very strange if we could do our current animation while moving… Anyway, whirling finishers are the weakest finisher and on top of that at full zerker whirling defense hits for a wopping 5-6k over a time of 5.5s making it one of the weakest skills in the game. Not to mention, it is easily interrupted.

It’s actually NOT easily interrupted, it forces them to use a non projectile interrupt, and it’s called whirling DEFENSE what part of that makes you think it should be mainly offensive? And whirls are only weak when they’re short, you get some actual synergy going on between your teammates and it will destroy people, for example, my engi (CC engi) paired with my friends ranger can put up like 30s of burning on some poor kitten due to him spinning to win in my fire field alone… not to mention i can normally pull the poor kittens into him (aoe pull) and room them all for a good amount of hits which causes multiple of them to burn for that long.

If that were an etheral field? That’s 15 stacks of confusion, and seeing as how etheral comes from mesmers, you combo that and their entire team is now able to not touch a single one of their skills, dodge, or rez, without exploding.

Yup, whirls weakest in the game…

Necro fear, mesmer pull/push, stun lock war, ranger pet, and thief stun/daze, are all candidates that pop into my head for interrupts. None of these listed have to projectiles and the necro’s fear is pretty much on demand so it is easily interrupted. Most interrupts used at the moment aren’t projectiles because longbow rangers just aren’t that viable and most thieves will learn pretty quick not to headshot whirling defense.

I thought it was offensive because you referred to it doing a large amount of damage which I stated that it does not.

The whirl finisher’s projectiles are random and forces you to sit surrounded by enemies for maximum effectiveness to cause an effect that does not linger for an extended period of time during which you are getting hit by all manners of things. So it’s risk:reward is the worst in the game.

Simply put, the skill would not be “unbelievably broken” if we were allowed to move while in it but it may actually be viable.

From a pvp perspective:
The main issue with Whirling Defense is that is that the ranger has no effective means of keeping the target stationary for the damage to hit, such as the warrior’s 4 sec mace stun or immobilize which is the only reason 100b works.

Entangle would do it for you but, alas, it’s an elite on a very long cooldown. It may be possible to combine Muddy Terrain with a pet immobilize and even haste but it’s very impractical and it would require you to build around it. Who would want to create an entire build around one mediocre skill.

Thus, in reality the skill’s only function becomes defense against ranged attacks all the while you do little damage trough retaliation while being an easy target unable to move.

One could also combo the skill with a fire field but that means speccing for condition damage and it would simply be ineffective to slot a power based offhand weapon.

Conclusion: the skill is not feasible in its current state, in particular not in the current meta. I agree with the above poster: the risk/reward ratio is out of place.