Considering to try Longbow

Considering to try Longbow

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Posted by: Guilhermezz.2601

Guilhermezz.2601

I’ve been playing as a condition ranger for the last couple of weeks, and I’m considering to try the longbow.

All my gear and traits will need to be replaced to try the longbow. Is it a good idea? Or should I stick with the cond ranger?

I usually run explorables (90% of time) and WvW (10%).

Whats your thoughts?

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Posted by: Kyias.1845

Kyias.1845

I typically play 90% WvW 10% explorables, so whatever I rec keep that in mind.

If you are going to use the longbow you just have to remember to spec into power and some prec to make the dmg respectable. First and foremost though it is a utility weapon.

I tend to like it, it lets me battle boss fights at longer range, drop down healing springs and keep an eye on friendlies who get in trouble.

I would say that the secondary weapon you use is going to define your role for when you have aggro on you.

My general setup: Signet Ranger, LB/GS weapon sets. I have a full rampager armor set for prec bonuses and a full valkyrie set of jewelry and weapons. LB sigil is superior perception (+10 prec per kill) GS has the sigil for 3 stack might on weap switch.

The dmg is respectable and having GS and stone signet for emergency gives me mediocre tanking ability.

I can’t stress it enough: In my experience LB can deal some dmg and makes a good consistent source from range. It is primarily a utility weapon and you want to be sure to be switching weapon kits when available to take advantage of fury, and in GS case, might.

Build: 30/20/5/10/5

Kyias Lightsun
Myrmidons of Kryta (MOK)
Blackgate Server

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Posted by: Solid Gold.9310

Solid Gold.9310

I played with a longbow for a while, have used a shortbow for ages now, when I try a long bow it’s so pathetically slow.

Jumping puzzles, love them or hate them, I hate them. Thread killer.

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Posted by: Guilhermezz.2601

Guilhermezz.2601

I typically play 90% WvW 10% explorables, so whatever I rec keep that in mind.

If you are going to use the longbow you just have to remember to spec into power and some prec to make the dmg respectable. First and foremost though it is a utility weapon.

I tend to like it, it lets me battle boss fights at longer range, drop down healing springs and keep an eye on friendlies who get in trouble.

I would say that the secondary weapon you use is going to define your role for when you have aggro on you.

My general setup: Signet Ranger, LB/GS weapon sets. I have a full rampager armor set for prec bonuses and a full valkyrie set of jewelry and weapons. LB sigil is superior perception (+10 prec per kill) GS has the sigil for 3 stack might on weap switch.

The dmg is respectable and having GS and stone signet for emergency gives me mediocre tanking ability.

I can’t stress it enough: In my experience LB can deal some dmg and makes a good consistent source from range. It is primarily a utility weapon and you want to be sure to be switching weapon kits when available to take advantage of fury, and in GS case, might.

Build: 30/20/5/10/5

Thanks for the advice. So all my set should be replaced for Power + % crit dmg ?

When you are in the WvW and thiefs poup right in your back, do you live enough to swap to GS and “tank him”?

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Posted by: Katsumoto.9452

Katsumoto.9452

With that low survival, if the Thief gets the jump on you, goodbye. Of course if you manage to catch the Thief, bye bye Thief.

Aurora Glade [EU]

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Posted by: YumCHA.8706

YumCHA.8706

Although the longbow is visually slow, its damage can be surprising, especially when you land a critical.

The main usefullness I see when using the Long Bow is the skills ‘Birrage’, “Hunter’s Shot” and “Rapid Fire”. If you put these 3 skills into one combo, you dish out alot of damage. I mean ALOT. More than what a shortbow can achieve with just basic attacks, despite all those bleeds. Which I should add is only affective when your up close (roughly 200 range), in order for the bleeds to stack properly. (due to the nerf)

The Long Bow is best used at max distances, to its capable hitting range. If anything gets too close just switch to something more useful. No harm done.

I urge you to reconsider and try it once more.

Rangetastic, 80 Ranger | Archers United [ARC]
Sea of Sorrows

(edited by YumCHA.8706)

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Posted by: theeagleeye.7693

theeagleeye.7693

I am a LB ranger. Have been since day 1, and I pretty much knew what I wanted. You see a lot of people giving the LB flack for its “pathetic” attack speed. Yes, they are absolutely correct that the attack speed of the LB is slow, but it’s not really just about the attack speed. IMHO, using the LB takes more skill than using a SB. For shortbows, it’s always easy mode. You press 1 and just move around, which I find extremely boring. Attacks faster, sure. But that’s about it. It’s only interesting for a couple of minutes, and you only appreciate it when you get to compare yourself to a LB ranger. Range is also a lot shorter than the LB (with the Eagle Eye trait). 1500 max range is extremely valuable. Before they increased the range of the Nightmare Vines in TA, I was always a source of consistent dps as I never died, while the rest of the group had to move closer so they can hit the vines, but constantly died and was too far away from being revived by my Spirit of Nature. I stood comfortably at the back, because my attack range was farther than what the Nightmare Vine can hit.

I also have some condition damage, as I use Sharpening Stone whenever I can. You get to dish out significant damage when you use Hunter’s shot first, which causes vulnerability on the enemy, then use Sharpening stone, quickening zephyr, Rapid fire, then Barrage. I run on full TA gear (not the full condition damage set), and all exotic jewelry. Attack power is at 3,350-3,400 (iirc), with crit chance of 47% and 85% crit damage. I’d want to get crit damage up a little bit more, but it’s just too fun to have 47% crit chance. Using the Superior Sigil of Fire on my Destroyer Longbow assures me an extra 1300-ish damage every time the flame blast AoE triggers – which happens a lot, since I have pretty high crit chance. Normally, Rapid fire goes up to 10-11k, and that’s not even using Rampage As One. Yes, when I say 10-11k, I know that’s the overall damage dealt by Rapid fire. :P

The most ideal would be a high power, high crit build, but that often entails you being very squishy. I’ve done some research, and if I go all power and crit damage, I’ll only be sitting at around 16k health, which I refuse to accept. If I had it my way, I’d want armor pieces that had power, precision, crit damage, and vitality, but that would be asking too much.) Just experiment with armor combinations. Each dungeon set has 3 variations anyway.

Ultimately, it depends on your play style. Both SB and LB have their strengths and weaknesses. I just jumped on this opportunity to throw in my 2 cents, because the LB has gotten so much flack, and people just turned a blind eye when it was time to criticize the SB. I highly encourage you to dedicate some time to learn the Longbow, and not be bothered too much about the attack speed. What’s the use of attacking fast, if damage per hit is inferior to a LB? I also completely disagree that the LB is a utility weapon. :P It isn’t. It’s one of the hardest hitting weapons in the game, if used correctly.

Best of luck, man! I hope you will learn to love the Longbow.

Some must fight, so that all may be free!

Fort Aspenwood

(edited by theeagleeye.7693)

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Posted by: Zsymon.8457

Zsymon.8457

The longbow is one of the lowest dps weapons in the entire game, so don’t expect to do any damage or down any player on your own. Don’t expect to do any tough solo content with this weapon either, because again, the dps is so incredibly low, it’s less than half of other ranged weapons across professions.

Especially rapid fire has an incredibly low damage output across the five seconds it needs to finish, where as long range shot is the weakest auto attack in the entire game, even from maximum range. Its base damage at maximum range is about 270 dps, where as most other auto attacks are between 500 and 650 dps. Rapid fire has a base dps of 264, even lower.

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Posted by: SirDiealot.8672

SirDiealot.8672

Unless you are rolling in money or still in greens I wouldn’t swap. I don’t think there is a whole lot of difference pve, but I do think the longbow is far underrated by most. I think most are just bad and not using their rapid fire with zephyr’s speed which both increases damage output and lowers the effective cooldown.

I don’t get the ultra short bow love honestly. It IS good, don’t get me wrong. But it comes with some many “you should bes”. Like you should be closer for max effect of poison volley. And you should be behind your target, which is truly harder and more hazardous than it sounds. Your potential damage should be higher, provided everything is perfect for you and you don’t mind running in circles. Yeah, I like the point and shoot of a longbow thanks. =)

In pve really you have a simple job. Stand back, and rotate your hunter’s shot → rapidfire/zephyr combo as often as possible. Mix in barrage if you aren’t forced to move too much. Knock back stragglers that leave the melee pile or interrupt baddies doing bad things.

A long bow is the king of WvW. Why? Because WvW is not about 1v1. You’ve seen the roaming bands of bot rangers. Ever wonder why they use longbows? In large groups it is truly king. If you are fighting in a groups much under 5v5 you are doing it wrong. Longbow is range, burst, support, AOE goodness. If you love assaulting or defending walls a longbow is just better. At everything.

Now if you like structured using a longbow will get you murdered and poop smeared on your face in the shape of an L. If you try it, make an alt named “free kill” just to keep the theme going. The few places where sniping is effective just don’t balance out how badly melee, especially thieves, will rock you.

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Posted by: monepipi.5160

monepipi.5160

If you mention that using the SB to the fullest potential, you need to be behind the target, don’t forget you also need to have the LB at a max range to pretty much TRY to match SB’s damage output. More often than not, you’ll be hard pressed to have such luxury. Good luck trying to solo in Orr, or PVP with the LB. A ranger with a LB in PVP is pretty much free food—-its too slow, people will zerg you. Its only good role is in WvW or tagging mobs with barrage while loot farming.

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Posted by: Arekai.5698

Arekai.5698

People who way longbow does no damage probably aren’t rangers.
I the right gear, i do my constant 10k damage with the 2 skill (sure, any warrior laughs about that) but for a ranger it’s kitten much.

Also, 1500 range is good in wvwvw and the 2 skill with haste is really nice, though, good people will just dodge it in wvw, but not many.

However, for spvp or pvp upfront (1vs1 and that stuff) shortbow is better. Not because of the damage, that’s always super low, but because of the utility that shortbow gives you, for not having an aoe and such.

If you run longbow + shortbow, you’re not doing anything wrong, except may be in hard dungeons where you should buff with horn. But if you don’t trait, they even have the same range, which is also stupid imo, but well. Game balance and all.

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Posted by: SirDiealot.8672

SirDiealot.8672

If you mention that using the SB to the fullest potential, you need to be behind the target, don’t forget you also need to have the LB at a max range to pretty much TRY to match SB’s damage output. More often than not, you’ll be hard pressed to have such luxury. Good luck trying to solo in Orr, or PVP with the LB. A ranger with a LB in PVP is pretty much free food—-its too slow, people will zerg you. Its only good role is in WvW or tagging mobs with barrage while loot farming.

So pretty much exactly what I said… Except the solo Orr part. I’m not sure what you’re doing wrong but 1 volley of rapid fire takes things down to 20-30% by itself.

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Posted by: Sleepy.2647

Sleepy.2647

Longbow attack speed is fine, the feeling about it being too slow it’s because shortbow simply shoots too fast.

However, it’s not the most optimal weapon damage wise for PvE as you won’t always be in max range to take advantage of it, it’s a situational weapon and a very good one.

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Posted by: Guilhermezz.2601

Guilhermezz.2601

A lot of good responses, and from both parts (SB and LB).

I think that I will finish my condition set, and then start the power +% crit dmg.

Thank you very much guys

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Posted by: Sir Wai.4052

Sir Wai.4052

Let me just say I only use the LB/GS build since i started day 1. LB unlike the people above don’t know has phenomenal burst power. I am using full power/perc/crit gear and stat at 20/25/20/5/0. In wvw im pretty much great, I done many 3 vs 1 and came out top half of the time, its all skill really. from afar at the beginning you wanna keep spamming 1 cause it actually your strongest damage – depending on who it ranges from 2-3k a hit, which in a large zergs entices that player to back up (no one likes to see that much damage on them lol) if it 1 vs by the time they come near you turn on rampage as one (why? stability, fury, and swiftness) and the amount of damage you have done to him should be about 25%-50% of his health. then around 40% health hp they have left you turn on your QZ press 4 to knock them down (don’t want them dodging your burst xD) then press 2 to build that damage to 10k usually since fury is on and with my build thats around 80% crit chance so yea lol. then 3 cause that almost has 0 charge shooting time. so in a matter of 3 seconds you did 2k + 10k+ 1k, not including your pet (i prefer to use range (spiders) since the dps is actually there and not running in circles), if they survive your initial burst, you should have been moving towards him and with my GS i have the sigil of hydromancy, does around 1k damage and chills them when i switch to the weapon, then you hits 3 4 5 in different orders responding on what he does. Also the GS is more for utility use, 3 to either chase or run away, 4 to block those warriors when they immobilzie you, you can also hit 5 to daze them, or stun them from behind. also 1 with QZ can be devastating, you are hitting 3 targets and that 3rd attack is always an evade so it also hard to kill you. btw with my build, glass cannon thief are fodder, you can tell by the initial damage you want to hit them a few times, and when you can feel that they are about to go stealth hit 2, why? because it keeps shooting at them even while in stealth usually guaranteeing a down mwhahaha.

now in pve, i dont use magic find gear because in my opinion what i can do compensates it, with barrage you basically tag everything in my build with 1 hit no matter what. instead of eagle eye or w/e to increase range use piercing arrow. I can gaurentee you will tag alot more. for instance I don’t even need a group in orr to tag stuff. (advantage much) then again you have to be a good farmer know where to go and WHEN to tag. maybe it just luck but i profit more than most of my other guildies running full MF, why? because i have more loot and it builds up fast – grenth for instance i need to empty 2-3 times with 80 slots…(salvage kits oh yea)

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Posted by: SirDiealot.8672

SirDiealot.8672

I agree on the attack speed thing, but I also think that is also what leads to the confusion on LB dps. Since so many are using their SBs and the vast bulk of their dps is their 1 attack and the bleed it applies they get used to that idea. Your damage is from your 1 attack everything else is gravy. LB dps is weighted more in the 2 (rapid fire) attack. If you do nothing but push your 1 and 2 buttons, its going to be seven 1 shots to ten 2 shots. Mix in your 345 abilities where appropriate and the weight of 1 goes down even further.

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Posted by: Sleepy.2647

Sleepy.2647

And don’t get me wrong, i love longbow and use it a lot, it’s just not a weapon you will use all the time unlike shortbow that can be used anytime with no penalty…honestly i rarely use shortbow anymore (full berseker gear).

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Posted by: Kam.8109

Kam.8109

I love the long bow. The build I run is 30/25/15/0/0 or 30/20/20/0/0. Put a superior sigil of perception on your bow. The sigil stacks will eventually add 250 to your precision and you should be sitting around 45-50ish % crit (depending on your gear of course). This makes the longbow hit like a truck. The weapon is slow both in rate of fire and projectile speed but in WvW most people don’t even realize they’re getting hit by a ranger so you don’t have to worry about them dodging as much as others will lead you to believe. In a 1v1 situation the longbow is sort of kittened because of the speed, which is why I never take one to sPvP.

Very important: Stay at max range. If you are <1,000 away from your target the longbow starts to underperform. If you find yourself too close to the enemy, use rapidfire (as it’s damage is not based on distance) and/or switch weapons. For this reason my secondary is the greatsword. The block attack is a very good counter to some of the melee “wtf roflstomp” moves other classes have, as soon as you see someone spinning use it, and you’ll knock them right on their rear.

But even more importantly the number 3 ability – swoop covers an amazing 1,200 distance, making it a perfect escape tool allowing you to get back to max range. Simply whack your target some to kill time while your weapon swap comes off cooldown, then clear your target, turn around, swoop, and you’re at max distance again for the longbow.

And obviously the main hand axe is also good weapon for when <1,000 from the enemy also. Plus it allows you to equip the warhorn which is great as well. I feel the greatsword/swoop escape is worth mentioning because it works so well and I don’t ever see anyone doing it.

(edited by Kam.8109)

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Posted by: neoxide.7320

neoxide.7320

Longbow isn’t really good for PvP if the enemy is focusing you. However, using a longbow can be very useful for its reach and trait utility.

You can trait for improved signets which allow you 6 seconds of guaranteed invulnerability with Signet of Stone and 10 seconds of stability with Signet of the Wild. However signet of the hunt and renewal need to be improved so they work with this trait.

One thing you will notice with longbow compared to shortbow is it’s wayyy slower, suffers from “obstructed” and “miss” arrows more often and finally that it just less viable in PvP than shortbow.

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Posted by: Quarktastic.1027

Quarktastic.1027

The issue I have with the longbow is twofold. Firstly, we have Long Range Shot. The range penalty on this skill makes it vastly inferior to the longbow’s other skills unless fired from 1000+ range, which isn’t going to happen often. Secondly, is the longbow’s lack of mobility. Barrage roots the user in place for the duration of the channeling, and any movement will cancel the skill. Rapid fire allows movement, but dodge rolling will cancel the skill.

So, If you’re attacking stationary targets at maximum range, where you yourself don’t have to move much…is the perfect situation in which to use a longbow. Unfortunately these situations rarely happen. I find the shortbow to be superior for these reasons.

Those armadillos would be a lot cooler if they looked more like real armadillos. mmm armadillos
-BnooMaGoo.5690

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Posted by: bri.2359

bri.2359

Finally, some LB love from rangers who understand the weapon and know how to use it!!

I mainly PvE (no dungeons yet …) I dropped shortbows after lvl 20-something. It has been all LB for me to lvl 80. I briefly tried a SB again around lvl 60-something, but dropped after a few battles.

My build is the classic ‘glass cannon’: 30/30/0/0/10 with all Berserker exotic armour and weapons (LB/GS). No runes yet, saving up for a full set of Superior Doylaks to deal with my current squishyness.

Since hitting lvl 80, I have been helping a friend (an Ele…) level through some lower level maps, so being squishy has not been a problem. I should have enough gold for the Doylaks before hitting the tougher maps.

Btw, Ele and Ranger work well together. We have good attack tactics that take advantage of combo fields and conditions. The Ele is lvl 76 and not fully spec’ed yet. She is waiting to hit 80 to spec her final build.

Haven’t decided on sigils yet, but after reading this thread, will start shopping for a superior perception for the bow and the might stack one for the GS. Currently using
all Valkyrie jewelry.

Lvl 80’s: Ranger; Guardian; Mesmer; Necromancer; Thief
Gandara Megaserver

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Posted by: Jake Dressler.8204

Jake Dressler.8204

You honestly just have to know how to play longbow… Look for the positions on the map where you can take advantage of your 1500 range, that should be your main goal. Find a spot where you can oversee a decent portion of a fight and rain arrows down upon your enemies. If you are at max range, you should be critting for 2.5k-3.4k every shot if you are built correctly.

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Posted by: Kyias.1845

Kyias.1845

I typically play 90% WvW 10% explorables, so whatever I rec keep that in mind.

If you are going to use the longbow you just have to remember to spec into power and some prec to make the dmg respectable. First and foremost though it is a utility weapon.

I tend to like it, it lets me battle boss fights at longer range, drop down healing springs and keep an eye on friendlies who get in trouble.

I would say that the secondary weapon you use is going to define your role for when you have aggro on you.

My general setup: Signet Ranger, LB/GS weapon sets. I have a full rampager armor set for prec bonuses and a full valkyrie set of jewelry and weapons. LB sigil is superior perception (+10 prec per kill) GS has the sigil for 3 stack might on weap switch.

The dmg is respectable and having GS and stone signet for emergency gives me mediocre tanking ability.

I can’t stress it enough: In my experience LB can deal some dmg and makes a good consistent source from range. It is primarily a utility weapon and you want to be sure to be switching weapon kits when available to take advantage of fury, and in GS case, might.

Build: 30/20/5/10/5

Thanks for the advice. So all my set should be replaced for Power + % crit dmg ?

When you are in the WvW and thiefs poup right in your back, do you live enough to swap to GS and “tank him”?

For gear: rampager armor is prec/power/con dmg. It isn’t optimal but I had to mix and match to get power/vit/prec in my build..and use that sigil to get some numbers for it. I number crunched several different sets/options but this seemed the best.

When fighting a thief it depends. If they spend most of their time abusing culling you probably won’t win no matter what. IF you can see them, your GS can stand toe to toe with them in a melee. Let them burst you to 30% health, then pop stone signet, switch to GS and start rotating all your quickness buffs to burst them as fast as possible.

Chances are the thief will be heartseekering you since you are at 30% not realizing he’s doing no dmg (until 2-3 heartseekers in.) Pop your heal after you begin your counterattack and he will either die or run away (via stealth.)

I’d practice against thiefs in sPvP first to get your timing down and some practice but even in sPvP you will only lose against the best of thiefs. You have to remmeber, thiefs are overconfident and if you can burst them to death while they are trying to get off their entire burst chains then you are going to beat them.

The moment they use their cooldowns to try and escape you rather than as a means to attack then you already have the upper hand.

Side note:

1) you can solo in Orr with a LB, I spend lots of time doing just that.
2) In PvP the fact people underestimate you is a strength not a weakness.
3)When I can do 2k crits before someone even GETS in melee range with me means they are that much weaker when I pull out my “nerfed GS.” with 40% crit…PLUS FURY for crits every other hit (over 14k dmg with quickness.) thank goodness they think I’m weak.
4) You can be successful and competitive with this build.
5) I cannot take full credit for this setup. I found it via the help of another member of these forums. I don’t remember his name but I took his ffedback and tweaked it to find something viable for me.

Don’t take other people’s word for how a LB or any weapon can perform. Use some of the things mentioned here by people and tweak it to fit your own style and you’ll do great; both in PvP and PvE..orr explorables and all.

Kyias Lightsun
Myrmidons of Kryta (MOK)
Blackgate Server

(edited by Kyias.1845)

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Posted by: Guilhermezz.2601

Guilhermezz.2601

I’ve started my CoF set with +%crit damage yesterday, I will finish this set and try this builds that you guys told me.

A lot of good information here, and I am grateful for your replies =)