Guild Wars 2

Chopps.5047:

Eurantien.4632:

But you lose moment of clarity and crit damage and the fury from wep swap (which is usually 50% up time). And LB cooldowns.

But you have a lot more power. Look at strength of spirit.

So, good for WvW. But not tPvP. There will always be condi necros/engis on a team.

Might stacking Longbow Ranger the new meta..Yes without Empathetic Bond, no need when you stack like 20 might

Eurantien.4632:

Chopps.5047:

Eurantien.4632:

But you lose moment of clarity and crit damage and the fury from wep swap (which is usually 50% up time). And LB cooldowns.

But you have a lot more power. Look at strength of spirit.

So, good for WvW. But not tPvP. There will always be condi necros/engis on a team.

I agree it’s great in wvw. But, dude, you must not like critical hits.

jcbroe.4329:

Yeah, I thought we decided long ago that Empathic Bond our only source of viable condition removal is the biggest thing that is killing build diversity.

I wish Karl would come back and comment on whether or not there is an internal discussion happening about this very problem (or perceived problem).

I agree it is. Without it, you rely on not taking any focus in a fight and that simply won’t happen. There are some decent changes here, but the only one I see that promotes any build diversity is the spirits unbound and nature’s vengeance swap. Otherwise, rangers are still stuck 30 deep in wilderness survival with 40 points to pick from for their respective build.

Indoles.1467:

jcbroe.4329:

Yeah, I thought we decided long ago that Empathic Bond our only source of viable condition removal is the biggest thing that is killing build diversity.

I wish Karl would come back and comment on whether or not there is an internal discussion happening about this very problem (or perceived problem).

I agree it is. Without it, you rely on not taking any focus in a fight and that simply won’t happen. There are some decent changes here, but the only one I see that promotes any build diversity is the spirits unbound and nature’s vengeance swap. Otherwise, rangers are still stuck 30 deep in wilderness survival with 40 points to pick from for their respective build.

If you can’t rely on your team for condition removal and healing spring won’t cut it, why not go troll + signet of renewal? Now you’re a source of aoe cleanse. I must be missing something about tpvp gameplay at the top levels. You guys are talking top levels right?

Still no where near enough for a power Ranger. Shortbow is still a stronger power weapon it looks like at anything but max range (that can’t be maintained because there’s no kiting allowed in GW2). There’s still no reason whatsoever to use Remorseless. Especially not when Signet of the Beastmaster still exists. Moment of Clarity is still a VERY underwhelming trait. It needs to provide the damage buff for 5 seconds. Next hit has the same problem with remorseless…. we have no real burst! Maul is it. A 30pt trait just to make use of the hilt+maul combo?

These changes look like they’re just going to help the bunker and condi players out there. I’m not seeing enough impact on power builds.

its a good start! The LB1 buff is very nice. If they truly do come through with news skills for weapons, I can see the LB being strong.

I wish there was a damage increase on GS1 though. 2H mastery is good, but a 5-10% increase would of made it viable for more builds.

Atherakhia.4086:

Still no where near enough for a power Ranger. Shortbow is still a stronger power weapon it looks like at anything but max range (that can’t be maintained because there’s no kiting allowed in GW2). There’s still no reason whatsoever to use Remorseless. Especially not when Signet of the Beastmaster still exists. Moment of Clarity is still a VERY underwhelming trait. It needs to provide the damage buff for 5 seconds. Next hit has the same problem with remorseless…. we have no real burst! Maul is it. A 30pt trait just to make use of the hilt+maul combo?

These changes look like they’re just going to help the bunker and condi players out there. I’m not seeing enough impact on power builds.

What about the might stacking?Signets active-pet swap-weapon swap-RaO

Chopps.5047:

Indoles.1467:

jcbroe.4329:

Yeah, I thought we decided long ago that Empathic Bond our only source of viable condition removal is the biggest thing that is killing build diversity.

I wish Karl would come back and comment on whether or not there is an internal discussion happening about this very problem (or perceived problem).

I agree it is. Without it, you rely on not taking any focus in a fight and that simply won’t happen. There are some decent changes here, but the only one I see that promotes any build diversity is the spirits unbound and nature’s vengeance swap. Otherwise, rangers are still stuck 30 deep in wilderness survival with 40 points to pick from for their respective build.

If you can’t rely on your team for condition removal and healing spring won’t cut it, why not go troll + signet of renewal? Now you’re a source of aoe cleanse. I must be missing something about tpvp gameplay at the top levels. You guys are talking top levels right?

Chopps.5047:

Indoles.1467:

jcbroe.4329:

Yeah, I thought we decided long ago that Empathic Bond our only source of viable condition removal is the biggest thing that is killing build diversity.

I wish Karl would come back and comment on whether or not there is an internal discussion happening about this very problem (or perceived problem).

I agree it is. Without it, you rely on not taking any focus in a fight and that simply won’t happen. There are some decent changes here, but the only one I see that promotes any build diversity is the spirits unbound and nature’s vengeance swap. Otherwise, rangers are still stuck 30 deep in wilderness survival with 40 points to pick from for their respective build.

If you can’t rely on your team for condition removal and healing spring won’t cut it, why not go troll + signet of renewal? Now you’re a source of aoe cleanse. I must be missing something about tpvp gameplay at the top levels. You guys are talking top levels right?

It’s the cooldown period. A necro/engi can put almost every condition on you in a matter of a few seconds, and they can do this fairly often (I’d say each averages being able to put all conditions on you every 10 seconds). Meaning that in order to survive, you have to have condition removal that’s able to keep up with those classes condition output well enough to be able to get the kill on those classes, and both of those classes have very, very good sustain when played properly.

As to the part about teamfight condition removal, there isn’t much more AoE condi removal that your team can give you, at least not enough to sustain you in such a heavy condition output game with only a 5 man roster. Also, rangers are often used to defend the homepoint, meaning that there are often times when rangers won’t be a part of the teamfight, and that condition removal is important. On top of that, you don’t want to make your team have to blow their cooldowns just for you if you have poor condi removal. It’s a war of attrition, and the team that can retain their cooldowns the longest until they are absolutely necessary is going to be the team that wins, because without cooldowns, classes like Guardians lose a lot of their sustainability, and you really don’t want them to drop that unless they absolutely have to, and not just for you, when you have a good option that can help you manage on your own.

That being said, there are rangers that are at a much higher tier than me that would probably have an even more well explained reasoning than my own.

I don’t know, dude, troll and signet is pretty good. Kill stuff faster. Stop bunkering down so hard. That’s what I do. I also make sure that through immobilization, the enemy cannot get close enough to be a threat until I tilt the battle in my favor and enter melee for the kill. Although you’re saying that won’t cut it and I’m a scrub basically? Lol

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.

ouch

Chopps.5047:

I don’t know, dude, troll and signet is pretty good. Kill stuff faster. Stop bunkering down so hard. That’s what I do. I also make sure that through immobilization, the enemy cannot get close enough to be a threat until I tilt the battle in my favor and enter melee for the kill. Although you’re saying that won’t cut it and I’m a scrub basically? Lol

No not at all lol. Eurantien already said this though haha:

tanky condi ranger or full berzerker ranger are the only viable builds

Zerker builds don’t take Empathic Bond.

The main issue is that there is no in between. Without zerkers, you don’t kill quite fast enough and you need Empathic Bond for sustain against the massive amount of conditions being spammed, which in turn limits the build versatility because for a lot of the different gear setups available, Empathic Bond is still a necessity in order to have the required sustainability to win fights.

This also though is more of a metagame problem than a ranger problem, because if condition spam gets “shaved” enough to the point where sacrificing Empathic Bond isn’t as detrimental to as many builds as it is now, then it will open up quite a number of different options.

These changes look ok on paper but I still think the core problem for the Ranger is the pet mechanics.

The F fucntions need to be reworked

F1 and F3 should proved boons so the pet can attack and escape better.
Ex:
F1 should proved 10 secs of Swiftness and Stability on a 20 to 30 sec CD
F3 should proved 10 secs of Protection and Swiftness on a 20 to 30 secs CD

Also, F1 IMHO should work like “Guard” when it comes to positioning your pet rather than sacrificing a utility slot for it.

F2 for pets with AoE skills should all be ground targeted. This will improve Ranger’s viability in large group situations such as, in WvW, Dungeons or on World Boss fights.

Pet switching CD should be reduced slightly

Pet resurrection CD need to go down to 30 secs IMHO

The pet needs an evade mechanic or passive condition removal so the pet can keep up with Ranger and effectively execute the Ranger’s commands

Pet pathing and attacks on the move needs to be improved

Stability Training should be base line for all pets

Guess I’m not the only one who’s unimpressed with these changes. Ah well I should hold my judgment for the actual patch.

Some good stuff in here, but nice they way they simply can’t buff the ranger without swinging that nerf bat at the same time.

Marksmanship is still a heavily overloaded line, really needs some of the useful traits moved our for diversity. And really disappointed that SB is still basically a melee weapon, was hoping Eagle Eye would include that for a +300.

Nothing to address pet mechanics, the single biggest issue with rangers.

Traps still in a tree that give 300 precision and 30% crit damage. So useful when running a trapping build.

Chopps.5047:

Even with EB and SoR, a ranger fighting a condi engi/necro is an up-hill battle. They can dish out so many conditions that it will overwhelm you. I’ve fought rangers that didn’t have EB on, my 30/20/0/0/20 necro (the most op build evah) and they drop like flies, even with healing spring.

You’re really crippling yourself without EB.

The ones that concern me.

Long Range Shot. Increased the damage at 500 range by 20%.
Long Range Shot. Increased the damage at 500-1000 range by 15%.
While a step in the right direction it’s not enough. Currently it’s 56%:72%:100% and the change will place it at 67%:83%:100% I don’t think it should be any worse (and this is the lowest I’d accept) than 80%:90%100%. At least then you wouldn’t be completly hamstringed in close range, especially in a game were melee is king.

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.
Just thank you.

Wilderness VIII – Oakheart Salve. Decreased the recharge of this trait from 20s->15s
The regen is like 5 seconds, even with this change there are far more interresting traits in that line.

Wilderness XII – Bark Skin Increased the damage reduction from 30% to 50%.
This is good. It’s still a bit overshadowed by Empathic Bond, but good non the less.

Nature Magic IX – Two Handed Training. Added the following functionality to this trait. Greatsword and Spear attacks have a chance to grant Fury on hit. 50% chance. 3s Fury. 10s cooldown.
On top of current functionality this is completly ok.

Nature Magic VII – Nature’s Vengeance. Moved to Grandmaster Tier.
Nature Magic XI – Spirits Unbound. Moved to Master Tier.
This ok, I can’t find any complaint on this.

Beastmastery VI – Mighty Swap. The might from this trait is now applied to you and your pet.
Good, we need more of this.

While the proposed changes are a step in the right direction it still feels very lackluster. I’m not very impressed and ultimately it’ll change nothing for me. And as other poeple have noted, still missing some love to pet AI, utilities, sword 1 etc that have been discussed for a months.

Xsorus.2507:

lol, I must admit
I about kitten myself when I read this

Skirmishing XII – Moment of Clarity. Stun Duration increased from 50% to 100%.

then I realized it was just for stuns lol

Shortbow 5 did just kitten itself when it heard that.

So many of my older builds are up for serious review when these hit. I feel like I’ll have meaningful options finally.

Longbow #1 finally gets the tiniest amount of love and we lose endurance regen for it. I’ll meet you in the middle, Anet... 33% endurance regen. Kthankxbye.

So that means… Moment of clarity:

• Boar rock: 2s daze = 4s daze
• Boar bone: 2/3s stun = 4s stun
• Boar skull (with 30% condi duration) = 8s fear (on a 120 sec CD or something)
• Asura: technobabble: 3s daze = 6s daze.

Brb… re rollin asura and using boar again.

Karl McLain.5604:

Nature Magic X – Enlargement. This trait now uses Signet of the Wild to trigger. This reduces the cooldown to 60 seconds and allow it to interact with the Signet of the Beastmaster and Signet Mastery traits.

This trait is now basically the active portion of Signet of the Wild, meaning it can be reduced with Signet Mastery and will also apply to the ranger when Signet of the Beastmaster is equipped and Might if you have Beastmaster’s Might equipped.

Oh believe me, as a Signet Ranger, I understood the patchnote perfectly the first time – and started mentally rearranging my points to get this new trait ASAP!!

So. (*#($&@ing. Cool.

Indoles.1467:

jcbroe.4329:

Yeah, I thought we decided long ago that Empathic Bond our only source of viable condition removal is the biggest thing that is killing build diversity.

I wish Karl would come back and comment on whether or not there is an internal discussion happening about this very problem (or perceived problem).

I agree it is. Without it, you rely on not taking any focus in a fight and that simply won’t happen. There are some decent changes here, but the only one I see that promotes any build diversity is the spirits unbound and nature’s vengeance swap. Otherwise, rangers are still stuck 30 deep in wilderness survival with 40 points to pick from for their respective build.

I’m not going to disagree with you directly, but for what environment are you talking about (…’cause I rarely ever build for Empathic Bond…)?

Nike.2631:

Karl McLain.5604:

Nature Magic X – Enlargement. This trait now uses Signet of the Wild to trigger. This reduces the cooldown to 60 seconds and allow it to interact with the Signet of the Beastmaster and Signet Mastery traits.

This trait is now basically the active portion of Signet of the Wild, meaning it can be reduced with Signet Mastery and will also apply to the ranger when Signet of the Beastmaster is equipped and Might if you have Beastmaster’s Might equipped.

Oh believe me, as a Signet Ranger, I understood the patchnote perfectly the first time – and started mentally rearranging my points to get this new trait ASAP!!

So. (*#($&@ing. Cool.

This traits looks nice

Nike.2631:

Indoles.1467:

jcbroe.4329:

Yeah, I thought we decided long ago that Empathic Bond our only source of viable condition removal is the biggest thing that is killing build diversity.

I wish Karl would come back and comment on whether or not there is an internal discussion happening about this very problem (or perceived problem).

I agree it is. Without it, you rely on not taking any focus in a fight and that simply won’t happen. There are some decent changes here, but the only one I see that promotes any build diversity is the spirits unbound and nature’s vengeance swap. Otherwise, rangers are still stuck 30 deep in wilderness survival with 40 points to pick from for their respective build.

I’m not going to disagree with you directly, but for what environment are you talking about (…’cause I rarely ever build for Empathic Bond…)?

PvP and arguably WvW (there are those of the mindset that WvW is all about zerging, in which case if that’s the role you take, then no, because you’ll already be so glassy a breeze will kill you, let alone conditions). In general, any place you can think of that will relentlessly spam conditions at you on a very short cooldown.

Still not following the enlargement trait. So it now does the same thing as SotW, but is activated with SotW…. ? Implying it doesn’t trigger off 25% hp anymore. So… why not just use SotW and not use this trait at all….

jcbroe.4329:

Nike.2631:

Indoles.1467:

jcbroe.4329:

Yeah, I thought we decided long ago that Empathic Bond our only source of viable condition removal is the biggest thing that is killing build diversity.

I wish Karl would come back and comment on whether or not there is an internal discussion happening about this very problem (or perceived problem).

I agree it is. Without it, you rely on not taking any focus in a fight and that simply won’t happen. There are some decent changes here, but the only one I see that promotes any build diversity is the spirits unbound and nature’s vengeance swap. Otherwise, rangers are still stuck 30 deep in wilderness survival with 40 points to pick from for their respective build.

I’m not going to disagree with you directly, but for what environment are you talking about (…’cause I rarely ever build for Empathic Bond…)?

PvP and arguably WvW (there are those of the mindset that WvW is all about zerging, in which case if that’s the role you take, then no, because you’ll already be so glassy a breeze will kill you, let alone conditions). In general, any place you can think of that will relentlessly spam conditions at you on a very short cooldown.

WvW is a place where with stat stacking with both ascended gear and individual stat gear, classes like mesmer and engi are able to make some of the most op 1on1 builds out there and are probably the best in terms of that due to both skill ceiling + utility availability and like i said, stat combination.

Atherakhia.4086:

Still not following the enlargement trait. So it now does the same thing as SotW, but is activated with SotW…. ? Implying it doesn’t trigger off 25% hp anymore. So… why not just use SotW and not use this trait at all….

Now when you get to 25% if you have signet of the beastmaster traited you get to be buffed. Before, the ranger could never be buffed from this trait.

For those not familiar, Nature Magic X – Hulk Out (pardon, Enlargement) will now give a Beastmaster’s Signet Ranger 8 second of +25% damage, +50% speed, and stability when your drop below 25% health (along with Fluffy going similarly super-seiyan) on a 60 second or potentially 48 second internal cooldown. And if you’re running that trait combo odds are good you’ve got the signet too, so you’ve got a 16 out of 48 second uptime in seriously pitched fights.

That’s got all kinds of clutch potential.

Nike.2631:

I’m not going to disagree with you directly, but for what environment are you talking about (…’cause I rarely ever build for Empathic Bond…)?

jcbroe.4329:

PvP and arguably WvW (there are those of the mindset that WvW is all about zerging, in which case if that’s the role you take, then no, because you’ll already be so glassy a breeze will kill you, let alone conditions). In general, any place you can think of that will relentlessly spam conditions at you on a very short cooldown.

Ah. Thanks . I usually found Shared Anguish sufficient for my needs in dungeons and solo camp flipping. You’re talking primarily player-based incoming threats.

Nike.2631:

For those not familiar, Nature Magic X – Hulk Out (pardon, Enlargement) will now give a Beastmaster’s Signet Ranger 8 second of +25% damage, +50% speed, and stability when your drop below 25% health (along with Fluffy going similarly super-seiyan) on a 60 second or potentially 48 second internal cooldown. And if you’re running that trait combo odds are good you’ve got the signet too, so you’ve got a 16 out of 48 second uptime in seriously pitched fights.

That’s got all kinds of clutch potential.

Keep in mind you still can’t stomp players while this is activated.

Honestly, I tend to use downed players as walls to ricochet the Axe #1 off of for extra hits if I’m under any sort of time pressure . Interrupts their Downed #4 and doubles my damage on the guy near them :p.

Losing the stomp is certainly something to be aware of though.

Nike.2631:

For those not familiar, Nature Magic X – Hulk Out (pardon, Enlargement) will now give a Beastmaster’s Signet Ranger 8 second of +25% damage, +50% speed, and stability when your drop below 25% health (along with Fluffy going similarly super-seiyan) on a 60 second or potentially 48 second internal cooldown. And if you’re running that trait combo odds are good you’ve got the signet too, so you’ve got a 16 out of 48 second uptime in seriously pitched fights.

That’s got all kinds of clutch potential.

Ahh, not convinced it’s really that feasible to run 30marks and it. Wish signet of beastmaster wasn’t a GM trait. 30/0/15/25/0 doesn’t seem doable.

jcbroe.4329:

Chopps.5047:

I don’t know, dude, troll and signet is pretty good. Kill stuff faster. Stop bunkering down so hard. That’s what I do. I also make sure that through immobilization, the enemy cannot get close enough to be a threat until I tilt the battle in my favor and enter melee for the kill. Although you’re saying that won’t cut it and I’m a scrub basically? Lol

No not at all lol. Eurantien already said this though haha:

tanky condi ranger or full berzerker ranger are the only viable builds

Zerker builds don’t take Empathic Bond.

The main issue is that there is no in between. Without zerkers, you don’t kill quite fast enough and you need Empathic Bond for sustain against the massive amount of conditions being spammed, which in turn limits the build versatility because for a lot of the different gear setups available, Empathic Bond is still a necessity in order to have the required sustainability to win fights.

This also though is more of a metagame problem than a ranger problem, because if condition spam gets “shaved” enough to the point where sacrificing Empathic Bond isn’t as detrimental to as many builds as it is now, then it will open up quite a number of different options.

I bet I could prove some of your statements wrong. I wish I could play with you. A lot of the drawbacks you point out can be made up for by superior skill. Also, you underestimate other builds and playstyles you haven’t personally tested.

Chopps.5047:

I bet I could prove some of your statements wrong. I wish I could play with you. A lot of the drawbacks you point out can be made up for by superior skill.

Now you’re not even discussing the topic. Yes, you can beat a 10 year old kid playing the most-op-rofl-build ever. He doesn’t know how to play as well as you. When discussing builds, traits, and such, you leave out player skill.

Not posted to this thread, but possibly worth mentioning when evaluating the need for damaging condition removal – several other classes get their damaging conditions toned down on Dec 10. Necros had a stack of bleed shaved off here, and shaved off there. Some of the Guardian burns were converted to direct damage. It may add up to a (slight) change in the meta for conditions and condition removal.

Ryan.8367:

Keep in mind you still can’t stomp players while this is activated.

Karl McLain.5604:

It’s in the works that this is changing as well, so that you’ll be able to interact with downed players while under the signet’s active effects.

Can I get a ‘booyah’?

BOOYAH! ((does the hulk-stomp on a nearby Toxic Courtier’s face))

Please give the shortbow some love!!!!

Karl McLain.5604:

Ryan.8367:

Nike.2631:

For those not familiar, Nature Magic X – Hulk Out (pardon, Enlargement) will now give a Beastmaster’s Signet Ranger 8 second of +25% damage, +50% speed, and stability when your drop below 25% health (along with Fluffy going similarly super-seiyan) on a 60 second or potentially 48 second internal cooldown. And if you’re running that trait combo odds are good you’ve got the signet too, so you’ve got a 16 out of 48 second uptime in seriously pitched fights.

That’s got all kinds of clutch potential.

Keep in mind you still can’t stomp players while this is activated.

It’s in the works that this is changing as well, so that you’ll be able to interact with downed entities while under the signet’s active effects.

Edit: clarification :P

Hooray!!!!!!!!!!! Finally!!!!!!!!

Karl McLain.5604:

Ryan.8367:

Nike.2631:

For those not familiar, Nature Magic X – Hulk Out (pardon, Enlargement) will now give a Beastmaster’s Signet Ranger 8 second of +25% damage, +50% speed, and stability when your drop below 25% health (along with Fluffy going similarly super-seiyan) on a 60 second or potentially 48 second internal cooldown. And if you’re running that trait combo odds are good you’ve got the signet too, so you’ve got a 16 out of 48 second uptime in seriously pitched fights.

That’s got all kinds of clutch potential.

Keep in mind you still can’t stomp players while this is activated.

It’s in the works that this is changing as well, so that you’ll be able to interact with downed entities while under the signet’s active effects.

Edit: clarification :P

Thanks for the clarification, that helps alot

I misread the Two Handed Training changes and thought the fury was being added to the cooldown trait at first.

Oh well still some good changes but still a lot more that needs to be done.

am really happy about this,and i dont wont to be an kitten but even though we got a longbow boost,i was wondering will this have that bigg impact since are skill2 is our main burst and having our longbow 1 stronger wont is great but will just make longbow 2 feel even weaker so it would be nice if this dmg buff would go for longbow 2 also,or make longbow 2 somehow more appealing… idk faster shots or chain… Please anet think about it. couse this buff even though it is great it will make our lb 2 actually debuffing our dmg or people will just stop to use it.

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Wilderness 5 Natural Vigor. Reduced the increased endurance regeneration from 50% to 25%.

This really ruins it for me. Again a big nerf out of nowhere.

Let me add it to the list:
- endurance regen nerfed from 50% to 25%
- Healing Spring no longer gives vigor each tick and water field duration reduced
- shortbow nerfed from 1200 to 900 range
- damage skills from many pets reduced by 50%
- pet leash range reduced drastically
- “Search & Rescue” can’t revive dead players anymore
- quickness on pet swap moved from Minor Adept to Major Grandmaster (swapped with worthless trait)
- “Guard” no longer works up or down ledges
- “Signet of the Beastmaster” moved from Adept to Grandmaster.

I probably missed some.

Other unsesolved issues:
- Guard is a shout, but has a 1 second cast time
- Nearly all AoE attacks hit 3 targets instead of 5
- Require grandmaster traits to make signets, shouts, traps and spirits useful.
- Require grandmaster trait to have relatively useful condition removal.
- “Sic ’em” gets cancelled if the pet is told to activate another skill or told to change target.
- Signet of Renewal fails if pet is out of range.
- a healing skill (Healing Spring) is the only reliable on-demand condition removal rangers have.
- pets f2 often doesn’t activate or very late.
- sword auto-attack has too many leaps and makes the character feel out of control and prevents dodging.
- shortbow auto-attack bleed requires a flank.
- longbow Barrage too long cooldown.
- longbow requires to spend 50 trait points to get its basic traits (20% cooldown, piercing arrows, 1500 range)
- skirmishing has too many bad traits.

If these were fixed/changed we might actually be getting somewhere with this class.

Tricare.2946:

Chopps.5047:

I bet I could prove some of your statements wrong. I wish I could play with you. A lot of the drawbacks you point out can be made up for by superior skill.

Now you’re not even discussing the topic. Yes, you can beat a 10 year old kid playing the most-op-rofl-build ever. He doesn’t know how to play as well as you. When discussing builds, traits, and such, you leave out player skill.

Apparently you also leave out tact.

Some interesting changes.. nice to see they are actually finally changing things at all.

Like others have mentioned I’d like to have seen condition removal changes / buffs, but generally this seems promising and at the very least interesting.

Chopps.5047:

Tricare.2946:

Chopps.5047:

I bet I could prove some of your statements wrong. I wish I could play with you. A lot of the drawbacks you point out can be made up for by superior skill.

Now you’re not even discussing the topic. Yes, you can beat a 10 year old kid playing the most-op-rofl-build ever. He doesn’t know how to play as well as you. When discussing builds, traits, and such, you leave out player skill.

Apparently you also leave out tact.

Eh you just told someone you would stomp all over them with your ‘superior skill’

endurance nerf e.e’ wtf… a big one at that.

pho.9412:

endurance nerf e.e’ wtf… a big one at that.

Its global – ALL classes are seeing less endurance/vigor.

If I had to guess, the PvE content designers had a little talk with the class designers that players have so much ready-to-dodge uptime they largely IGNORE all damage spikes which leads to berserker-uber-alles gearing because your actual defensive attributes and traits are MEANINGLESS compared to the power of dodging.

In a funny way, its a backdoor fix to our pets. When players can no longer dodge every single hit (like out pets), we might see start to encounters with less dodge-or-die design.

Nike.2631:

pho.9412:

endurance nerf e.e’ wtf… a big one at that.

Its global – ALL classes are seeing less endurance/vigor.

If I had to guess, the PvE content designers had a little talk with the class designers that players have so much ready-to-dodge uptime they largely IGNORE all damage spikes which leads to berserker-uber-alles gearing because your actual defensive attributes and traits are MEANINGLESS compared to the power of dodging.

In a funny way, its a backdoor fix to our pets. When players can no longer dodge every single hit (like out pets), we might see start to encounters with less dodge-or-die design.

You do realize nothing changed in pve. The vigor on crit traits are hardly touched so guardians have high vigor, and warriors never relied on vigor to begin with as they used whirlwind attack

In fact, by nerfing the self sufficiency of some classes with survival they only solidified the stacking of guardians that was already happening in high level fractals.