Guild Wars 2

I wasn’t sure where to put this, but I figured some people would be interested to see that ROM has been streaming a ton of druid lately.

http://www.twitch.tv/romoncoke/

If you’re not familiar with him, he’s a PvP anet tourney champ, and is one of the best PvP players in the entire game.

Only plays easy mode cheese
“Best player ever”

I don’t think so.

His druid build isn’t even good.

In tournies he plays the most efficient builds, as does everyone else. Otherwise he plays whatever floats his boat.

Not sure why you’re so hostile about it, even if you don’t like him he’s obviously one of the best out there, he won the WTS for pete’s sake. He and phanta dueled to a stalemate in a few matches last night, it was fun to watch.

Then in comes Noscoc, and he gets slaughtered.

There is no one in the game that can 2v1 nos and phanta for any length of time. You really hate rom, don’t you?

I’m saying he couldn’t even 1 v 1 a good reaper. I just don’t think his build is good and think that other players who play high risk high rewards are actually better pvpers than those who role to the flavor of the month low risk high reward.

Hasn’t Rom always played Warrior and Ranger though? Warrior seems to be in such a bad spot atm, you can hardly condemn him for switching to druid…

Nah I don’t I just disagree with the best PvPer ever statement. I think there are other players who are better and probably other druids who are better.

Is this why everyone keeps running like the same builds? Personally i’m not a big fan of this build. There are also a few tricks I think RoM could do to be more successful, but y’know esports and all, I think I should keep secrets for now.

Eurantien.4632:

Is this why everyone keeps running like the same builds? Personally i’m not a big fan of this build. There are also a few tricks I think RoM could do to be more successful, but y’know esports and all, I think I should keep secrets for now.

So hows that longbow staff working out for you? :P

But yeah, everyone’s running the same build because there’s a metabattle build already up.

I don’t have a issue with Fluff but I’ll agree with Swag on this one. Not that it matters because we are all friends here.

Statements like “best” always lead to these replies. Big picture there are a lot of players in the GW2 space so best spvp or xyz player is always subjective. This is why you could get away with it a bit more in DaOC or WoW because they had actual leaderboards that represented “all” players. DaOC had the best one yet because it broke it down by guild, alliance, player, and class…

Anyway – will check out the stream regardless and thanks for the post fluff.

bloodpyrope.8630:

Eurantien.4632:

Is this why everyone keeps running like the same builds? Personally i’m not a big fan of this build. There are also a few tricks I think RoM could do to be more successful, but y’know esports and all, I think I should keep secrets for now.

So hows that longbow staff working out for you? :P

But yeah, everyone’s running the same build because there’s a metabattle build already up.

Most will run the same builds nowadays because of the never ending nerfs, er, changes. Build diversity is a thing of the past.

Crapgame.6519:

I don’t have a issue with Fluff but I’ll agree with Swag on this one. Not that it matters because we are all friends here.

Statements like “best” always lead to these replies. Big picture there are a lot of players in the GW2 space so best spvp or xyz player is always subjective. This is why you could get away with it a bit more in DaOC or WoW because they had actual leaderboards that represented “all” players. DaOC had the best one yet because it broke it down by guild, alliance, player, and class…

Anyway – will check out the stream regardless and thanks for the post fluff.

Fair enough. I didn’t realize people would get upset over something like my opinion.

I just wanted to highlight that he was “one of the best” because usually when I talk about streamers people ask who they are.

I don’t like ROM’s build but I do think he really good player.

I’m not entirely certain what ROMs build from his most recent broadcast is because it isn’t loading for me, but if it was the build he was running on the 30th with Staff/GS, then yeah, I’m with Eura and Sol and I’m not really seeing the draw to his build.

Actually, in general, I’m not really seeing the draw to any celestial build at all (which is what I see the majority of people running and have tried multiple variations of myself), or as Reaper’s get more popular, ANY sort of boonstacking build for that matter.

The mobility of GS/Staff is incredibly fun though.

I seriously doubt that’s the build he’ll run in a tourney. Usually he plays crazy builds on streams and does the “real” build for the tourney. Knowing how he is, he’s running it purely for the fun of moving across the map in like .4 seconds. There is a lot to be said for that in solo queuing as well…

Fluffball.8307:

I seriously doubt that’s the build he’ll run in a tourney. Usually he plays crazy builds on streams and does the “real” build for the tourney. Knowing how he is, he’s running it purely for the fun of moving across the map in like .4 seconds. There is a lot to be said for that in solo queuing as well…

Yeah, it’s more of a general thing though. ROM and 4 other people ran Celestial Druid in the only ESL since HoT dropped, and it just seems like these boonstacking based builds in general are going to be extinct as Reaper becomes more popular.

It’s always fun watching ROM play ANYTHING though lol. He’s a very high action, mobile player, and Warrior/Ranger definitely suits him well. Definitely not going to BM him unless he starts claiming he’s some sort of Ranger/Druid expert, which he doesn’t and won’t as far as what I’ve seen from him. He’ll just keep drinking “milk” and having a good time.

tbh i use the GS/Staff.. but i dont like Sword/Torch which is the current one used.

to the guy hating on RoM for “low risk builds” and “Flavor of the Month” builds.

1) Druid isnt FoTM lol, there are higher “FoTM” elites out there then Druid, Also taking Druid Sacrifices ALOT of the Rangers Passive Survivability, so its actually a higher risk build then actually Standard Ranger… and Considering how long Rangers are just considered rubbish, i wouldnt realistically say “low Risk” is something to call it let alone “fotm” as they just arnt. U can pretty quickly Ruin urself as a Druid… Specially if u dont use CF properly.. Or just use it at a moment you really shouldnt have, also causes Instant focus, which can Put u down very quickly.

2) ALOT of top PvPers are saying that ALL the builds are pretty low risk this expansion and things are getting easier.. Specially in 1v1, So screaming this out now is just ridiculous lol, Most of the proffessions are now pretty low risk in comparison to what they were, specially with how much the Elites really have given us.

3) Saying Proffession = How skilled you are is just such a nullified argument, im sorry but Yes proffessions such as the Ranger and Warrior how a Low skill entry, this is because u can use their abilities badly in some builds they own and it’ll still atleast reach medicore, It Doesnt make the proffession as a WHOLE something “noobie” or innately make you “bad” for using it.

Im sorry but Playing Any proffession to a highest of its capability takes skill and Knowledge of ur proffession + alot of practice, U dont ever hear anyone Outside of the Low Tiers of PvP screaming Easymode on anyones proffessions, cause simply to play them to the levels in top tier pvp Isnt Easy.

Cele is taking over, cause its great for 1v1 Proffessions and proffessions such as the reaper are currently excelling in 1v1 situations, Also its Just good for anything that builds on more then 3 stats, which ALOT of proffessions do see now, I dont think its the only alternative out there and ofcourse, multiple set ups fit different people and can work, GS/Staff seems to be working alright for me, I dont know what the alternatives are myself.. but i seme to fairing alright with the set up for now.

At the end of the day Shouting at Players for proffessions they play, or Swapping when their Old mains become irrelevent, at the end of the day in the majorities view, Playing a Warrior is putting ur team at a disadvantage, so am i happy they’re playing different proffessions Yes, it makes winning Easier not relying on someone to try Force something in a Warrior to work.

Sure there are some such as Shin keeping the warrior on and Fighting through even tho their in a bad spot currently, and yes Its great a player has that level of love for his proffession, but Shin can make it Work, some random on your team isnt as Reliable when it comes to playing something Outside of meta currently.

jcbroe.4329:

Fluffball.8307:

I seriously doubt that’s the build he’ll run in a tourney. Usually he plays crazy builds on streams and does the “real” build for the tourney. Knowing how he is, he’s running it purely for the fun of moving across the map in like .4 seconds. There is a lot to be said for that in solo queuing as well…

Yeah, it’s more of a general thing though. ROM and 4 other people ran Celestial Druid in the only ESL since HoT dropped, and it just seems like these boonstacking based builds in general are going to be extinct as Reaper becomes more popular.

It’s always fun watching ROM play ANYTHING though lol. He’s a very high action, mobile player, and Warrior/Ranger definitely suits him well. Definitely not going to BM him unless he starts claiming he’s some sort of Ranger/Druid expert, which he doesn’t and won’t as far as what I’ve seen from him. He’ll just keep drinking “milk” and having a good time.

Rabid or Wanderer’s Necro, beats Druid. I’ve tried so many different versions of Cele with max condition remove and still can’t overcome the condition pressure from the new builds. Half problem is you need to pressure Necro fast and hard and Cele boon stacking build loses its Might to often to keep pressure.

Marauder build seems to do alright vs Necros, with right positioning that is.

Sol.4310:

jcbroe.4329:

Fluffball.8307:

I seriously doubt that’s the build he’ll run in a tourney. Usually he plays crazy builds on streams and does the “real” build for the tourney. Knowing how he is, he’s running it purely for the fun of moving across the map in like .4 seconds. There is a lot to be said for that in solo queuing as well…

Yeah, it’s more of a general thing though. ROM and 4 other people ran Celestial Druid in the only ESL since HoT dropped, and it just seems like these boonstacking based builds in general are going to be extinct as Reaper becomes more popular.

It’s always fun watching ROM play ANYTHING though lol. He’s a very high action, mobile player, and Warrior/Ranger definitely suits him well. Definitely not going to BM him unless he starts claiming he’s some sort of Ranger/Druid expert, which he doesn’t and won’t as far as what I’ve seen from him. He’ll just keep drinking “milk” and having a good time.

Rabid or Wanderer’s Necro, beats Druid. I’ve tried so many different versions of Cele with max condition remove and still can’t overcome the condition pressure from the new builds. Half problem is you need to pressure Necro fast and hard and Cele boon stacking build loses its Might to often to keep pressure.

Marauder build seems to do alright vs Necros, with right positioning that is.

Yeah, I have been the most successful on Marauder builds myself. Still having trouble deciding whether or not I like LB/Staff or LB/GS. The issue I’ve had is that I’ve definitely lost fights by not having either one or the other. Particularly, I feel like GS is better against other Druids, but Staff is definitely better against DHs, and staff is probably the better weapon in general when building for teamplay.

If I was going to run cele…. yeah, I’m still working out that process. Will have to find a way to pick up condition removal without hurting the build too much, and possibly forego the boon stacking entirely (at which point, why run cele?).

jcbroe.4329:

Sol.4310:

jcbroe.4329:

Fluffball.8307:

I seriously doubt that’s the build he’ll run in a tourney. Usually he plays crazy builds on streams and does the “real” build for the tourney. Knowing how he is, he’s running it purely for the fun of moving across the map in like .4 seconds. There is a lot to be said for that in solo queuing as well…

Yeah, it’s more of a general thing though. ROM and 4 other people ran Celestial Druid in the only ESL since HoT dropped, and it just seems like these boonstacking based builds in general are going to be extinct as Reaper becomes more popular.

It’s always fun watching ROM play ANYTHING though lol. He’s a very high action, mobile player, and Warrior/Ranger definitely suits him well. Definitely not going to BM him unless he starts claiming he’s some sort of Ranger/Druid expert, which he doesn’t and won’t as far as what I’ve seen from him. He’ll just keep drinking “milk” and having a good time.

Rabid or Wanderer’s Necro, beats Druid. I’ve tried so many different versions of Cele with max condition remove and still can’t overcome the condition pressure from the new builds. Half problem is you need to pressure Necro fast and hard and Cele boon stacking build loses its Might to often to keep pressure.

Marauder build seems to do alright vs Necros, with right positioning that is.

Yeah, I have been the most successful on Marauder builds myself. Still having trouble deciding whether or not I like LB/Staff or LB/GS. The issue I’ve had is that I’ve definitely lost fights by not having either one or the other. Particularly, I feel like GS is better against other Druids, but Staff is definitely better against DHs, and staff is probably the better weapon in general when building for teamplay.

If I was going to run cele…. yeah, I’m still working out that process. Will have to find a way to pick up condition removal without hurting the build too much, and possibly forego the boon stacking entirely (at which point, why run cele?).

I’ve been working on new build that replaces Cele with Crusaders, you more or less have same survival and 30% crit chance with fury, problem I’ve found is the HP pool seems to become problem vs Conditions.

low HP druid definitely doesn’t work. ive gotten my best results running marauder with staff/x, and carrion traps.

cele druid is crushed by condi pressure, which i basically called in all the cele druid threads the moment they appeard. unless the druid runs some survival with WK instead of BM, and gives up might stacking. when people figure this out and actually start running some effective condi builds, I’m not sure how far the build will go. right now people are starting to run condi reapers, and it’s just nasty. cele scrappers can put out lots of condis as well.

the pressure might stacking cele puts out is nothing to laugh at, but it’s insignificant compared to might stacking marauder running WK/survival, which has the same if not more survivability. there are a lot of marauder builds that work right now.

mistsim.2748:

low HP druid definitely doesn’t work. ive gotten my best results running marauder with staff/x, and carrion traps.

cele druid is crushed by condi pressure, which i basically called in all the cele druid threads the moment they appeard. unless the druid runs some survival with WK instead of BM, and gives up might stacking. when people figure this out and actually start running some effective condi builds, I’m not sure how far the build will go.

the pressure might stacking cele puts out is nothing to laugh at, but it’s insignificant compared to might stacking marauder running WK/survival, which has the same if not more survivability. there are a lot of marauder builds that work right now.

Definitely.

Honestly, the best cele “might stacking” build I’ve come up with is WS/BM/Druid with Aristocracy Runes.
I either have to run Glyphs and Empathic Bond or Survival Skills (except WHaO) and WK.

Even then, losing out on Protective Ward hurts the “goal” of the build so much that it would be hard to say it’s worth it.

btw, I like rom’s build a lot. I played a MoC/Remorseless GS/staff variant during BWE3, and I just dusted it off again after hitting my head against the wall for a bit. GS/staff is definitely a thing.

glyph of alignment/ equality w/ verdant etching along with hoelbrek, evasive purity, and ca form are plenty of condi clear if played right. Especially with high up time of protection, regen, and steady stream of healing has given me enough sustain to last through a fight.

It gets even better in wvw, with lemongrass poultry. I have wiped the floor with all the condi-cheese builds out there.

The only time condi’s have overwhelmed me was when I was kittened already.

mistsim.2748:

low HP druid definitely doesn’t work. ive gotten my best results running marauder with staff/x, and carrion traps.

cele druid is crushed by condi pressure, which i basically called in all the cele druid threads the moment they appeard. unless the druid runs some survival with WK instead of BM, and gives up might stacking. when people figure this out and actually start running some effective condi builds, I’m not sure how far the build will go. right now people are starting to run condi reapers, and it’s just nasty. cele scrappers can put out lots of condis as well.

the pressure might stacking cele puts out is nothing to laugh at, but it’s insignificant compared to might stacking marauder running WK/survival, which has the same if not more survivability. there are a lot of marauder builds that work right now.

There are very few effective condition builds that can beat the NM/BM/Druid build, there so many versions people running of it now.

I’m starting to beat most Condition builds there is limited few which extremely hard and high chance of I won’t win but rarely do I see them push far and if they did push far at the start I can almost 100% say I will win E.g. Necro, simply due to fact they don’t have DS to sustain my burst damage early fight, if you know other team doesn’t have high burst damage of has E.g Rev or Thief you could drop Stone Signet for Renewal, only class atm that really hurts us with burst is DH Trap builds.

I feel LB/Staff Cele build is strongest of Druid builds atm, I do like Marauders version allot but its just a Solo Que hero build won’t ever be Top Tier Tourney build, back to Cele version reason I feel LB is more viable if you’re on game you should never get decapped and you should always decap them. I’m still learning my build but with every game my combos and awareness of what to look for is getting better, I’m still having problems holding cap vs Scrappers they just have insane amount of blocks/dazes.

I think with given time meta will settle with Druid builds, you will see Settlers as your condition version and Cele as your Power version, not sure you will see many WS version they just don’t have protection required and weakness output. Without Protection/Weakness output from NM Druid Cele build becomes rather weak.

I feel we will get more nerfs soon, our Pets are too strong if you ask me they need shave in damage output and they need to scale the healing bit better so you are rewarded for running higher healing power, atm you can get away with just Cele stats which is stupid.

This thread…

Ofc he is one of the best ranger players. It is totally legit to say that. Most people disagreeing with his build never even played in an actual tournament setup. So many solo queue heroes in here…

If he thinks he needs 21k hp instead of 16k to win duels on a good average then I believe he has more experience than you guys. I already said that I dislike the idea of cele on druid due to the lack of actual condi dmg but hybrid stats also means offense/defense hybrid and cele just offers the best mix especially if you can stack might.

After all condi dmg is just one out of eight stats it offers so it is kind of okay to waste it or just leave it for geomancy and some poison uptime. It actually hurts a lot more to not have condi applicators for the 25 might stacks but other amulets dont solve this problem.

Besides mobility, is there really a point to running GS though? The burst is a bit more on demand but makes you sacrifice positioning, and almost all other things are equal, except that LB has more decap capability and works “better” with Ancient Seeds.

Nobody can deny the map roaming capability of GS/Staff is absurdly good, but doesn’t LB bring more pressure, reliability, and utility?

I find these are legitimate questions, because I’ve played pretty extensively so far with both weapon setups and haven’t really seen one weapon peak in a way that makes it a clear choice beyond another.

Doesn’t really matter to discuss this any further. All hail the reaper overlords.

Eurantien.4632:

Doesn’t really matter to discuss this any further. All hail the reaper overlords.

Does Hoelbrak (or some other condition reduction rune) + Natural Stride + Survival Skills not do anything about this?
Or is the issue something different than what I’m thinking?

I love watching Forum PvP.

jcbroe.4329:

Eurantien.4632:

Doesn’t really matter to discuss this any further. All hail the reaper overlords.

Does Hoelbrak (or some other condition reduction rune) + Natural Stride + Survival Skills not do anything about this?
Or is the issue something different than what I’m thinking?

Instead of being chilled forever you get chilled almost forever.

All hail our reaper overlords.

You can run natural stride and svanir runes – 83% chill duration and still get chilled to death.

All hail our reaper overlords.

Ozie.4176:

jcbroe.4329:

Eurantien.4632:

Doesn’t really matter to discuss this any further. All hail the reaper overlords.

Does Hoelbrak (or some other condition reduction rune) + Natural Stride + Survival Skills not do anything about this?
Or is the issue something different than what I’m thinking?

Instead of being chilled forever you get chilled almost forever.

All hail our reaper overlords.

It isn’t like this was a non-issue before today’s patch though…. The damage is just more over the top now.

It’s time to stop running boon-stacking builds though, that’s for sure. Less for Reapers to corrupt.

Eurantien.4632:

Doesn’t really matter to discuss this any further. All hail the reaper overlords.

no I guess it doesn’t, as your job is done. your Smokescale whine cost us quite a bit. re-roll reaper I guess.

mistsim.2748:

Eurantien.4632:

Doesn’t really matter to discuss this any further. All hail the reaper overlords.

no I guess it doesn’t, as your job is done. your Smokescale whine cost us quite a bit. re-roll reaper I guess.

Objectively smoke field F2 > smoke assault F2 because it is way easier to control a smoke assault not on F2 than a smoke field.

Like, I get people are a little upset by this but if you can’t see this then it has to be a l2p issue. Nothing has changed for smoke assault lovers, they can still might stack they just have to press their keys slightly differently. For smoke field lovers, they can actually use this skill, you could call it a learn to play, sure but god tier pet control was required for smoke field use before and even mediocre pet control can make full use of smoke assault still.

Eurantien.4632:

mistsim.2748:

Eurantien.4632:

Doesn’t really matter to discuss this any further. All hail the reaper overlords.

no I guess it doesn’t, as your job is done. your Smokescale whine cost us quite a bit. re-roll reaper I guess.

Objectively smoke field F2 > smoke assault F2 because it is way easier to control a smoke assault not on F2 than a smoke field.

Like, I get people are a little upset by this but if you can’t see this then it has to be a l2p issue. Nothing has changed for smoke assault lovers, they can still might stack they just have to press their keys slightly differently. For smoke field lovers, they can actually use this skill, you could call it a learn to play, sure but god tier pet control was required for smoke field use before and even mediocre pet control can make full use of smoke assault still.

Have to agree with Eura on this, nothing has changed.

A good ranger never starts the fight with his Burst Pet out, he waits for right time to burst and then swaps pet. So guess what nothing changed at all he will still use his burst skill burst. So it might require bit more thinking as a ranger which I’m all for I don’t want us to be FOTM class, decent but not OP broken and face roll like it is atm.

Reapers aren’t hard to kill I just dropped stone signet when other side has more then 1.

it’s not a l2p issue, it’s a difference in play style. I found it more valuable to have a higher on-demand burst and a little bit more might because micromanaging the smoke field and spending my blast finishers on it instead of on Sublime Conversion for instance was less efficient to me.

oh, SA was gutted though. target can now mitigate most of its damage with a single dodge roll, and u get less might out of it as well. in other worse, SA isn’t nearly as bursty as it was. anyway, don’t bother responding to this any more, it’s just my opinion and I think I’m done with this discussion.

jcbroe.4329:

Besides mobility, is there really a point to running GS though? The burst is a bit more on demand but makes you sacrifice positioning, and almost all other things are equal, except that LB has more decap capability and works “better” with Ancient Seeds.

Nobody can deny the map roaming capability of GS/Staff is absurdly good, but doesn’t LB bring more pressure, reliability, and utility?

I like GS for the extra survivability, hilt bash, mobility, and a bit more spike. it synergizes nicely with staff in general. but I’m biased, I really like ROM’s playstyle because that’s how I play my ranger.

mistsim.2748:

it’s not a l2p issue, it’s a difference in play style. I found it more valuable to have a higher on-demand burst and a little bit more might because micromanaging the smoke field and spending my blast finishers on it instead of on Sublime Conversion for instance was less efficient to me.

oh, SA was gutted though. target can now mitigate most of its damage with a single dodge roll, and u get less might out of it as well. in other worse, SA isn’t nearly as bursty as it was.

I wasn’t saying its L2P issue for people like you, it’s going to be less viable for none ranger players being carried by the current builds.

I wanted our pet’s to get nerfs I’m honestly sick of seeing Rangers that Pre HoT didn’t play Ranger cause it was toooo hard are now playing ranger and being carried. You can still stack might rather easy.

@Mistsim;

Oh I understand the playstyle, it’s been my roaming build in WvW since I got Druid day 1 of HoT lol.
I just think it’s a constructive conversation to be had since neither setup lacks viability. More so, it actually becomes pretty important to have the conversations because the majority of us just post threads like “I play this and this and it’s good and it works so use it” which we sort of have to do because if we take the time to explain, all of the information we share gets buried on the forum within a day or 2, so when any of us make those threads it ends up being a waste.

So, seeing as how I had you guys here, I figured we’d have these sorts of discussions before the conversation is forever lost, especially since it isn’t exactly like there are resources outside of the vocal players we can look to (metabattle is a source of observational data only and doesn’t streamline builds to their most effective state or alternatives for counterbuilding).