Need to be able to switch while in Beastmode

Need to be able to switch while in Beastmode

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Posted by: Tzozef.9841

Tzozef.9841

This.

If I want to be in Beastmode with my other pet, I need to > Get off beast mode > Switch pet > WAIT for cooldown of Beastmode > Then go beastmode again.

I disagree with this process entirely. It’s tremendously awkward.

We should be able to switch while in Beastmode, needing to switch OFF beastmode everytime ruins the playstyle entirely.

“Oh but we want to encourage you to still use your pet” WE’VE BEEN USING OUR PET FOR 5 YEARS. If we wanna have a build with our pet out more often, let us just use the core Ranger, that’s the whole point right?

Let us commit fully to this new Meld/Beastmode playstyle. Not a half-version of it.

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Posted by: Einlanzer.1627

Einlanzer.1627

Yeah, it’s not logical and it results in very clunky gameplay, and it really feels like the only reason they’re doing it this way is to force rangers to still interact with their pet when a lot of ranger players would really appreciate Arenanet not making that decision for them, especially since core Ranger and Druid are both still mandatory pet users.

This elite spec is/was the perfect opportunity to provide the option of a “petless” ranger that still utilizes the core pet mechanic, and they need to fix it and back off of their silly, emotionally-and-not-logically driven insistence that being a ranger has to always mean having and micromanaging pets.

(edited by Einlanzer.1627)

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Posted by: Vavume.8065

Vavume.8065

/signed in agreement with OP.

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Posted by: Dojo.1867

Dojo.1867

Signed.

The whole point of Soulbeast is to merge with your pet so why force us to unmerge? People that want that can play core ranger or druid. The point of elite specs – an I quote Arenanet here – is to open up new playstyles that the class did’t have before.

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Posted by: Cufufalating.8479

Cufufalating.8479

Agreed. It just feels clunky as Einlanzer said. I get that you’re supposed to going in and out of BM and that’s all great, but you shouldn’t HAVE to do it when what you actually want is your other SB skills.

If they want us to use pet on and off they need to make it worth doing (which is actually is IMO) rather than just forcing us to do it.

Cufufalating – Ranger / Part-Time Mesmer
Gunnar’s Hold

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Posted by: psizone.8437

psizone.8437

Agreed.

I’ll still pop out of Beastmode to use my pet at times, but I want to do it when I want to use my pet and not just to go back into Beastmode.

Brotherhood of Blub [blub]

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Posted by: Arshay Duskbrow.1306

Arshay Duskbrow.1306

Agreed. This is the same situation that arose with Revenant not being able to weapon swap, i.e. a ridiculous limitation being forced on the players because the devs are in love with a thematic notion rather than thinking about mechanical realities.

Hopefully the outcry can achieve the same result that it achieved then. Just sad that drowning them in protest is the only way to ever make them see reason.

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Posted by: momophily.3814

momophily.3814

Agree.

Also why does going into water knock me out of Beast mode/ Leaving the water… this should carry over to aquatic as well.

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Posted by: Ralkuth.1456

Ralkuth.1456

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

5 useless class titles
Carrying enemy team since 2012
“Multiclass implies you can actually play the class” – a certain royalty

(edited by Ralkuth.1456)

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Posted by: Jim Hunter.6821

Jim Hunter.6821

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

I ran a power build with longbow and d/wh for a bit yesterday using the trait that makes you unblockable when entering soulbeast (unstoppable union). I’d use the warhorn for the unblockable pet attack, hit hunter’s call, activate beastmode and rapid fire.

I burned down a ton of people that haven’t realized rangers have a way to make their attacks unblockable now. Also I can’t remember what it’s called but the 4th attack skill when you merge with eagle where you jump up and come down doing damage hits hard as kitten. I was regularly hitting 7-10k.

Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN

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Posted by: Dojo.1867

Dojo.1867

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

You can pretty much guarantee 99.99% that Maul applying it’s own AoO strike and Sic Em @ +40% will be nerfed man, seriously.

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Posted by: Bri.8354

Bri.8354

While I don’t think beast-mode should be something you stay in 100% of the time, I agree with the suggestion for usability reasons.

For example, let’s say I’m using a Feline and Smokescale in a power build. I’m doing DPS with the feline then need some quick crowd control options which the smokescale has access to.

In the current system you’re looking at over 10 seconds to get access to those beast skills. Or you’re looking at a multiple stage process to get your pet out to use one skill, where you need to break meld, swap pets, then wait for the pet to use it.

But what if we could swap pets while melded? 2 clicks and you’re instantly using that crowd control skill. Then you break meld and your pet follows up with another! This would be a massive improvement.

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Posted by: Dojo.1867

Dojo.1867

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

You can pretty much guarantee 99.99% that Maul applying it’s own AoO strike and Sic Em @ +40% will be nerfed man, seriously.

Why? I think there is a chance it stays. I don’t think they will change Maul. Sic’em will propably be adapted toonly giving 30% or something like that to Soulbeast.

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Posted by: borya.2964

borya.2964

While I don’t think beast-mode should be something you stay in 100% of the time, I agree with the suggestion for usability reasons.

For example, let’s say I’m using a Feline and Smokescale in a power build. I’m doing DPS with the feline then need some quick crowd control options which the smokescale has access to.

In the current system you’re looking at over 10 seconds to get access to those beast skills. Or you’re looking at a multiple stage process to get your pet out to use one skill, where you need to break meld, swap pets, then wait for the pet to use it.

But what if we could swap pets while melded? 2 clicks and you’re instantly using that crowd control skill. Then you break meld and your pet follows up with another! This would be a massive improvement.

But if you want to blast your smokefield before to land your melded CC, beastmode swap doesn’t help at all, you’re still locked for 10 sec. I really fail to understand why everybody focus on beastmode swapping whereas the real issue is the beastmode CD.

Coffin Rehearsal X – Bunker Roaming Ranger
Tchuu Tchuu Im A Train [TCHU] – Gandara
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChUmRHtHLgPckvtrPImxK3A

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Posted by: Wondrouswall.7169

Wondrouswall.7169

I really fail to understand why everybody focus on beastmode swapping whereas the real issue is the beastmode CD.

Interesting way to look at it. No sarcasm. The thought occurred to me once if things would be better if Beastmode had no cooldown. Granted, some things would have to be tweaked.

PET PRECISION & DPS TESTS -OUTDATED-
Will update once Path of Fire releases.

(edited by Wondrouswall.7169)

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Posted by: Bri.8354

Bri.8354

While I don’t think beast-mode should be something you stay in 100% of the time, I agree with the suggestion for usability reasons.

For example, let’s say I’m using a Feline and Smokescale in a power build. I’m doing DPS with the feline then need some quick crowd control options which the smokescale has access to.

In the current system you’re looking at over 10 seconds to get access to those beast skills. Or you’re looking at a multiple stage process to get your pet out to use one skill, where you need to break meld, swap pets, then wait for the pet to use it.

But what if we could swap pets while melded? 2 clicks and you’re instantly using that crowd control skill. Then you break meld and your pet follows up with another! This would be a massive improvement.

But if you want to blast your smokefield before to land your melded CC, beastmode swap doesn’t help at all, you’re still locked for 10 sec. I really fail to understand why everybody focus on beastmode swapping whereas the real issue is the beastmode CD.

Even without a cooldown you’re looking at unmerging, swapping pets, and re-merging before you can use any of the skills.

I personally think they should do both, allow pet swap while merged and reduce or eliminate the cooldown on beastmeld.

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Posted by: borya.2964

borya.2964

Even without a cooldown you’re looking at unmerging, swapping pets, and re-merging before you can use any of the skills.

So what ? You can do it pretty fast and besides you can still have pet swap effects via traits.

Same example : i am melded with pet 1, exit beastmode, swap pet and gain lesser quickening zephyr, smokefield + blast, meld again an gain X2 the boon duration, land your melded smoke assault from stealth. Yes it’s a rotation but i don’t see the issue, what is interesting ? this kind of rotation or simply use melded pet 1 skill, swap beastmode and use melded pet 2 skill ? I don’t have the answer here, noboday have it cuz we are all locked. But Anet won’t change both (remove beastmode CD and allow beastmode swap) we’ll have to choose.

Coffin Rehearsal X – Bunker Roaming Ranger
Tchuu Tchuu Im A Train [TCHU] – Gandara
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChUmRHtHLgPckvtrPImxK3A

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Posted by: Cufufalating.8479

Cufufalating.8479

@borya

It’s just bad design and harms gameplay to make people press 3 buttons when it should just be 1.

I’m not saying you shouldn’t have the option of doing it by dropping BM, pet swapping, and then re-entering BM. You absolutely should be able to do that so you can proc pet-swap and enter BM traits. But not every build takes those, and they shouldn’t be forced through the motions.

As I keep saying.. Dropping out of BM can still, and maybe should, be the ideal rotation, but it should be done because it’s ideal and not because the mechanics force us to do it.

Cufufalating – Ranger / Part-Time Mesmer
Gunnar’s Hold

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Posted by: borya.2964

borya.2964

@borya

It’s just bad design and harms gameplay to make people press 3 buttons when it should just be 1.

I’m not saying you shouldn’t have the option of doing it by dropping BM, pet swapping, and then re-entering BM. You absolutely should be able to do that so you can proc pet-swap and enter BM traits. But not every build takes those, and they shouldn’t be forced through the motions.

As I keep saying.. Dropping out of BM can still, and maybe should, be the ideal rotation, but it should be done because it’s ideal and not because the mechanics force us to do it.

Of course both changes would be awesome, don’t get me wrong here. But it still remains two diffents ways to use rotations, melded pet 1 skills to melded pet 2 skills and melded pet 1 skills to pet 2 f2 to melded pet 2 skills. For now the first solution won’t resolve the second one while the second one resolve both (even if it’s still a bit clunky to make the first kind of rotation, but at least you’re not as locked as we are for now). Besides the second solution is a real go in&out active playstyle like Anet designed it. Remove the beastmode CD is more interessting rather than beastmode swap, i mean, if we would have to choose.

Coffin Rehearsal X – Bunker Roaming Ranger
Tchuu Tchuu Im A Train [TCHU] – Gandara
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChUmRHtHLgPckvtrPImxK3A

(edited by borya.2964)

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Posted by: Combatter.5123

Combatter.5123

/signed in agreement with OP

I think that we should be encouraged to come out of beastmode for other reasons; e.g. there could be a trait that gives some boons to the pet when the ranger leaves beastmode

Maetheryl Thorswood (Ranger), Bennish (Guardian), Lex Sabre (Elementalist)
Tyria, Underworld

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Posted by: Krispera.5087

Krispera.5087

Totally agree !

Instead to make it an active play, people will most likely play a guessing game and turtle with one pet.

Active play : You’re on Smokescale, you need to Stun Break ? You Swap to Black Bear.
Annoying stationary play : I’m on Black Bear, in case something happens, because it would take me 20 secs to come back on the Black Bear.

Yes, putting a number on the BMode cooldown makes you realise it’s a 20 sec cooldown to come back on your first pet. Out of first pet (10 secs) + Out of second pet (10 secs) + back to first pet. It’s actually longer than 20 secs, with all the juggling around.

And no, it doesn’t make the pet useless. Using pet for their F2 and burst/utility is still very useful.

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

You can pretty much guarantee 99.99% that Maul applying it’s own AoO strike and Sic Em @ +40% will be nerfed man, seriously.

Why? I think there is a chance it stays. I don’t think they will change Maul. Sic’em will propably be adapted toonly giving 30% or something like that to Soulbeast.

Ok, because this.


Damage = (Weapon strength * Power * Skill coefficient) / Armor

GS midpoint for damage = 1047.5
Power main stat with runes and food = 2784
Maul Co-efficient = 1.75
Let’s assume 2500 armor.

(1047.5 × 2784 × 1.75) / 2500 = 2041 damage.

Then add in the multipliers you can stack. Total multiplication will be Steady Focus 1 × 1.1 = 1.1. Remorseless 1.1 × 1.25 = 1.375. Critical Damage 1.375 × 2.5 = 3.47. Furious Strength 3.475 × 1.07 = 3.67. Twice as Vicious 3.67 × 1.05 = 3.86. Oppresive Superiority 3.86 × 1.1 = 4.24.

So that damage has gone up to 8655.40 now already. Then add in AoO.
4.24 × 1.5 = 6.36
2041.368 × 6.36 = 12983.10

Now add 40% Sic Em.
6.36 × 1.4 = 8.904
2041.368 × 8.904 = 18176.34 damage on a target with 2500 armor. From a single attack you can land 3 times every Sic Em duration. I didn’t even include 2HT or the additional stats from beastmode or beastmastery.

If you did that to a light armor target, it would be 23101.60 damage in a single hit. Rapid Fire will do 30k plus, easily.

TLDR; As much as I like it, it’s crazy OP. Nothing that can do that much damage is good for the game.

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Posted by: Holland.9351

Holland.9351

I completely agree.

We need to be able to swap pets while in Beastmode. I fear we can’t “because the tech isn’t there yet”, which would be the only valid reason, but then we need instant Beastmode switching without delay.

Also, currently it’s better for me to NOT use Beastmode at all because Beastmode doesn’t have the pet F2 skills. Why doesn’t it? It really blows my mind. It must be because of time constraints because Weaver already had 180 new skills to look at.

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Posted by: FrouFrou.4958

FrouFrou.4958

I completely agree.

We need to be able to swap pets while in Beastmode. I fear we can’t “because the tech isn’t there yet”, which would be the only valid reason, but then we need instant Beastmode switching without delay.

Also, currently it’s better for me to NOT use Beastmode at all because Beastmode doesn’t have the pet F2 skills. Why doesn’t it? It really blows my mind. It must be because of time constraints because Weaver already had 180 new skills to look at.

I’m guessing it’s intentional, the weaving kind of gameplay Anet mentioned in the preview so you don’t just camp beastmode but pop out of it to utilize the pet and go back in again.

Froudactyl // Herp Derp Druid // Judge Legends [JDGE] // Seafarer’s Rest

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

I completely agree.

We need to be able to swap pets while in Beastmode. I fear we can’t “because the tech isn’t there yet”, which would be the only valid reason, but then we need instant Beastmode switching without delay.

Also, currently it’s better for me to NOT use Beastmode at all because Beastmode doesn’t have the pet F2 skills. Why doesn’t it? It really blows my mind. It must be because of time constraints because Weaver already had 180 new skills to look at.

I’m guessing it’s intentional, the weaving kind of gameplay Anet mentioned in the preview so you don’t just camp beastmode but pop out of it to utilize the pet and go back in again.

Yeah, if the pet F2 skills were available in beastmode, there would be no reason to ever use your pet or swap in/out. I still think we should be able to swap pets while in though.

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Posted by: Einlanzer.1627

Einlanzer.1627

I completely agree.

We need to be able to swap pets while in Beastmode. I fear we can’t “because the tech isn’t there yet”, which would be the only valid reason, but then we need instant Beastmode switching without delay.

Also, currently it’s better for me to NOT use Beastmode at all because Beastmode doesn’t have the pet F2 skills. Why doesn’t it? It really blows my mind. It must be because of time constraints because Weaver already had 180 new skills to look at.

I’m guessing it’s intentional, the weaving kind of gameplay Anet mentioned in the preview so you don’t just camp beastmode but pop out of it to utilize the pet and go back in again.

I’m pretty sure it’s intentional, because someone at Arenanet has this misguided zeal that Rangers “have to have pets at all time because I say so”.

Why bother with this elite spec at all, then? This spec should be a fantastic way to allow for a petless ranger that still uses the pet mechanic.

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Posted by: Holland.9351

Holland.9351

F5 -> F2 -> wait 10 seconds -> F5 is just so clunky.
Having pet F2 available in Beastmode would have been so much less clunky.

F5 -> F4 -> wait 10 seconds -> F5 is equally clunky.
Having pet swap available in Beastmode would have been so much less clunky.

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Posted by: Dojo.1867

Dojo.1867

Okay the more I play this beta weekend the more I think we have to be able to swap pets while in beastmode. The current implementation really ruins the flow of fighting.

If they really want to force us out of beastmode I suggest linking this to the beast skill instead (F3). These are really powerfull and could be used as “finishers” for beastmode and after casting you are unmerged and have to wait 10 sec to enter beastmode again.

I would prefer if they just added the swap but if they really want us to leave beast mode from time to time this would still be fine for me.

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Posted by: Dojo.1867

Dojo.1867

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

You can pretty much guarantee 99.99% that Maul applying it’s own AoO strike and Sic Em @ +40% will be nerfed man, seriously.

Why? I think there is a chance it stays. I don’t think they will change Maul. Sic’em will propably be adapted toonly giving 30% or something like that to Soulbeast.

Ok, because this.


Damage = (Weapon strength * Power * Skill coefficient) / Armor

GS midpoint for damage = 1047.5
Power main stat with runes and food = 2784
Maul Co-efficient = 1.75
Let’s assume 2500 armor.

(1047.5 × 2784 × 1.75) / 2500 = 2041 damage.

Then add in the multipliers you can stack. Total multiplication will be Steady Focus 1 × 1.1 = 1.1. Remorseless 1.1 × 1.25 = 1.375. Critical Damage 1.375 × 2.5 = 3.47. Furious Strength 3.475 × 1.07 = 3.67. Twice as Vicious 3.67 × 1.05 = 3.86. Oppresive Superiority 3.86 × 1.1 = 4.24.

So that damage has gone up to 8655.40 now already. Then add in AoO.
4.24 × 1.5 = 6.36
2041.368 × 6.36 = 12983.10

Now add 40% Sic Em.
6.36 × 1.4 = 8.904
2041.368 × 8.904 = 18176.34 damage on a target with 2500 armor. From a single attack you can land 3 times every Sic Em duration. I didn’t even include 2HT or the additional stats from beastmode or beastmastery.

If you did that to a light armor target, it would be 23101.60 damage in a single hit. Rapid Fire will do 30k plus, easily.

TLDR; As much as I like it, it’s crazy OP. Nothing that can do that much damage is good for the game.

One trick pony claculations like this were always possible and never good. You will never connect a full rapid fire like that. Your build will be squishy, etc.

Like I said I anticipate a nerf to 30% or something like that but it isn’t that strong. SB needs to pull its weight in terms of dps to compete with druid. Maul is a well telegraphed skill (melee on top of that) and so is rapid fire so there is a lot of counter play.

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Posted by: EnderzShadow.2506

EnderzShadow.2506

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

You can pretty much guarantee 99.99% that Maul applying it’s own AoO strike and Sic Em @ +40% will be nerfed man, seriously.

Why? I think there is a chance it stays. I don’t think they will change Maul. Sic’em will propably be adapted toonly giving 30% or something like that to Soulbeast.

Rapid Fire will do 30k plus, easily.

No argument here, just curious, have you personally got 30k Rapid Fire on a Test Dummy?

I can do ridiculous dmg with GS—that’s a given and I could do that before the beta.
But I haven’t seen the same thing with RF.

Shadowbane DarkAges Of Camelot WoW AION WarHammer GuildWars2

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Posted by: Last Warrior Lord.7248

Last Warrior Lord.7248

This.

If I want to be in Beastmode with my other pet, I need to > Get off beast mode > Switch pet > WAIT for cooldown of Beastmode > Then go beastmode again.

I disagree with this process entirely. It’s tremendously awkward.

We should be able to switch while in Beastmode, needing to switch OFF beastmode everytime ruins the playstyle entirely.

“Oh but we want to encourage you to still use your pet” WE’VE BEEN USING OUR PET FOR 5 YEARS. If we wanna have a build with our pet out more often, let us just use the core Ranger, that’s the whole point right?

Let us commit fully to this new Meld/Beastmode playstyle. Not a half-version of it.

Yeah my impression was you can stay in Beastmode and still swap pet (buff and skills) and not leave the form but we have to ummerg than merg back throttles-necks the gameplay and with this 10 cd in between don’t help. Oh well anet tryed and failed. Back to druid or core my friends.

(edited by Last Warrior Lord.7248)

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Posted by: borya.2964

borya.2964

No argument here, just curious, have you personally got 30k Rapid Fire on a Test Dummy?

I had a lot of duels in wvw with poor and bad exotic gear versus full ascended hot spec players and well, let’s say that it’s pretty effective. That being said maybe for once, rangers could achieve the same (or near) amount of damage thieves, warriors or mesmer can do with very simple rotations.

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

You can pretty much guarantee 99.99% that Maul applying it’s own AoO strike and Sic Em @ +40% will be nerfed man, seriously.

Why? I think there is a chance it stays. I don’t think they will change Maul. Sic’em will propably be adapted toonly giving 30% or something like that to Soulbeast.

Ok, because this.


Damage = (Weapon strength * Power * Skill coefficient) / Armor

GS midpoint for damage = 1047.5
Power main stat with runes and food = 2784
Maul Co-efficient = 1.75
Let’s assume 2500 armor.

(1047.5 × 2784 × 1.75) / 2500 = 2041 damage.

Then add in the multipliers you can stack. Total multiplication will be Steady Focus 1 × 1.1 = 1.1. Remorseless 1.1 × 1.25 = 1.375. Critical Damage 1.375 × 2.5 = 3.47. Furious Strength 3.475 × 1.07 = 3.67. Twice as Vicious 3.67 × 1.05 = 3.86. Oppresive Superiority 3.86 × 1.1 = 4.24.

So that damage has gone up to 8655.40 now already. Then add in AoO.
4.24 × 1.5 = 6.36
2041.368 × 6.36 = 12983.10

Now add 40% Sic Em.
6.36 × 1.4 = 8.904
2041.368 × 8.904 = 18176.34 damage on a target with 2500 armor. From a single attack you can land 3 times every Sic Em duration. I didn’t even include 2HT or the additional stats from beastmode or beastmastery.

If you did that to a light armor target, it would be 23101.60 damage in a single hit. Rapid Fire will do 30k plus, easily.

TLDR; As much as I like it, it’s crazy OP. Nothing that can do that much damage is good for the game.

One trick pony claculations like this were always possible and never good. You will never connect a full rapid fire like that. Your build will be squishy, etc.

Like I said I anticipate a nerf to 30% or something like that but it isn’t that strong. SB needs to pull its weight in terms of dps to compete with druid. Maul is a well telegraphed skill (melee on top of that) and so is rapid fire so there is a lot of counter play.

It’s not a one trick pony calculation, it’s just a standard zerk ranger running around with the zerg. Rapidfire doing that is absurd, especially since you could trait it to pierce for a reduced damage multiplier. You are forgetting how fast RF is with Quickness.
You are forgetting that is only taking two traitlines, you still have a 3rd to build defense into and it’s only 1 utility skill too. I used to play zerk LB on the pheriphery all the time and done correctly, you can just nuke people. Sic Em applying to the Ranger as well, even at 30% is a HUGE damage increase. Don’t be surprised if it’s nerfed to lower than 20% while in beastmode.

While Holosmith has a smooth transition into Photon Forge (lulburst) and always-available utilities that interact with the F-bar mechanic…

Soulbeast has to manage pet swap and beastmode separately and it’s extremely clunky. Not to mention most of the melded skills don’t have any meaningful impact, with the Beast abilities having awkward animation locks or extremely long CDs.

We might need a smoother mechanic. Don’t want to fight my UI while I’m fighting people already.


Off topic, is Condi the only way to go for Soulbeast?

Most likely I haven’t figured out how to boonstack/use pet traits like the spec suggest yet, maybe that’s the new way to play Ranger.

Cant talk much about PvE but power got a lot of tools. Improved Maul is amazing. Sic em is a crazy damage buff. Free quickness/fury. With all that increased melee damage I wonder if Paladin is the best PvP stats now for a power build.

You can pretty much guarantee 99.99% that Maul applying it’s own AoO strike and Sic Em @ +40% will be nerfed man, seriously.

Why? I think there is a chance it stays. I don’t think they will change Maul. Sic’em will propably be adapted toonly giving 30% or something like that to Soulbeast.

Rapid Fire will do 30k plus, easily.

No argument here, just curious, have you personally got 30k Rapid Fire on a Test Dummy?

I can do ridiculous dmg with GS—that’s a given and I could do that before the beta.
But I haven’t seen the same thing with RF.

Not on a test dummy and I have not played Soulbeast at all, I will not be able to log on until November.

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Posted by: Levetty.1279

Levetty.1279

Maul already had a one shot gimmick build for a while and nobody really cared.

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Posted by: Miellyn.6847

Miellyn.6847

Beastmode is meant to be a tactical ressource like necromancer shroud. The CD will never go away. Maybe we will get pet swap in beastmode.

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(edited by Miellyn.6847)

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Posted by: Hyper Cutter.9376

Hyper Cutter.9376

I really fail to understand why everybody focus on beastmode swapping whereas the real issue is the beastmode CD.

It’s because they want to camp in beastmode and don’t like that it’s specifically designed to discourage that.

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

I really fail to understand why everybody focus on beastmode swapping whereas the real issue is the beastmode CD.

It’s because they want to camp in beastmode and don’t like that it’s specifically designed to discourage that.

It having a 10s CD would seem it is not designed to discourage camping, also, your pet continually losing the boons you traited for and built around is also not condusive to in/out play. The most fluid way to play is to just pick a single pet you like the skills from and camp beastmode all the time or keep the pet out all the time, only entering every now and again when you need the pet skills. ’

For in/out type play to work, the pet needs to get your boons on exiting and the cd on entering needs to be drastically reduced.

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Posted by: Rym.1469

Rym.1469

Swapping beastmodes would likely result in a nerf to Beastmode as a whole.

I could see this functionality as a trait, replacing Eternal Bond maybe, but it would be still quite powerful. Name of the trait and odd lack of synergy would suggest that Eternal Bond had been what I’m saying in the past, but turned out to be too broken so they changed it to the proc.

I doubt the idea of the specialization is to camp Beastmode and never see your pet again.

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(edited by Rym.1469)

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Posted by: Einlanzer.1627

Einlanzer.1627

I doubt the idea of the specialization is to camp Beastmode and never see your pet again.

It clearly isn’t, but it clearly should be an option.

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Posted by: Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582

Swapping beastmodes would likely result in a nerf to Beastmode as a whole.

I could see this functionality as a trait, replacing Eternal Bond maybe, but it would be still quite powerful. Name of the trait and odd lack of synergy would suggest that Eternal Bond had been what I’m saying in the past, but turned out to be too broken so they changed it to the proc.

I doubt the idea of the specialization is to camp Beastmode and never see your pet again.

The beastmode doesn’t actually do anything itself. So there is no real way to nerf it. Except for increasing the CD for it.

Think of beastmode as an ele attunement, but you only get the 3 skills. For an ele to swap attunements, they have a CD of 10s to swap back to that attunement, but there are 4 attunements you can choose from, each providing 5 skills. Ele can also trait to reduce the CD on these attunements.

Beastmode has a 10s CD, it only provides 3 additional skills and you lose your pet for the duration of it. This makes no sense at all.

Beastmode provides some decent skills at the expense of your pet, but having a 10s cd on the mode is just crazy. It should be more like 3s at most, if not 1s.

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Posted by: Anela.3867

Anela.3867

/signed
I don’t like having a pet so I will stay in beast mode. Swapping would be something I would want very much.

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Posted by: FranzM.1298

FranzM.1298

Agreed with this suggestion. Beast Mode should reward you for staying in Beast Mode since that is the sole purpose of the elite spec. All the other classes are rewarded for using their new mechanic with their elite specialization.

Also agree with the reduce cooldown suggestion on Beast Mode swap.

A cooldown reduction on stances would be nice as well.

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Posted by: HeavenSwordz.2813

HeavenSwordz.2813

Agreed !

If they want us to alternate between pet and Beast skill, they should give us reward by doing so, not force us to do so.

Like Bonus (Boons, Damage Boost, Damage Reduction, etc) when entering and leaving Beastmode while being able to swap pet in Beastmode.

The CD reduction on the beastmode is needed, 10s is huge.
And I would even split this cooldown between going in Beastmode and going out of Beastmode. like 4~5s to leave Beastmode when you enter it and 4~5s to re-enter Beastmode when you leave it, would be awesome!

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Posted by: Matt H.6142

Matt H.6142

The swap would need a tell to another player like the rev legend swap. There are 12 terrestrial families and 5 archetypes, so that’s a lot to watch and adapt to for what will likely be an effect icon, and there’s already a lot of effect reading as it is. I’d rather a pet swap refreshed beast mode after leaving it.
The petless ranger would be pretty flavourless in-game. Besides, imagine having a dog and cat in your head at the same time…

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Posted by: Ankaran.1029

Ankaran.1029

I totally agree, i have been waiting for a petless ranger for so long and this is def what i would like, i feel like uncontrolably AI as a part of a skill is very clunky (specially in pvp).
U can do your best to make the AI good and smooth but it will never be really viable, like pathfinding and stuff like that.

Allow us to choose if we want to fight with the pet or not, is that not the whole point?