Guild Wars 2

Traits are supposed to lead builds into a specific direction and tune certain aspects. For ranger they overdid it though in a way that we HAVE to take most traits that are linked to certain utility slots. They actually balanced those utility skills in a way that they are always considering them traited. They become worthless without the traits and this actually affects 80% of our utilities.

Signets
The passive effect will see a buff soon but the active is what is worthless right now. Rangers run around with perma 25% speedbuff and health regeneration all day. If you ever want to use the active you are forced to take the Marksmanship grandmaster trait which pretty much tripples their efficiency becaue they give the effect to the ranger. This is bullkitten design. It shouldn’t be like that in any game ever.

Traps
Want to mix a single trap into yout build for some variety and interesting plays? NOPE! Arenanet doesn’t want build variety. If you want to play traps you have to pick 2 traits that increase their damage by 100% and their size aswell. Otherwise they are just some small weak circles that barely do anything. It wasn’t enough for them that you already have to go for condition heavier weapons like sword/axe/torch. No, they also want to force you into all the utility slots. Bad design Arenanet. Bad design.

Spirits
Well just understanding what they do and then looking at stuff like warrior banners makes you kind of sad? No problem you get more. Just like the other skilltypes discribed above they added musthave traits that make your spirits follow you or just make the effect somewhat worth it in the first place. Next patch they even buffed the TRAITED effect some more. YEY! Even less variety on what you can mix.

Shouts
Oh I heard about those. They appeared crappy and buggy to me which is why I forgot them soon though. I feel offended as a player that they expect people to use such badly designed and bugged skills over 7 months since release (remember they weren’t even there on release but they weren’t any less unfinished when they introduced them later).

Survival skills
I think those are actually okay and the only option where you can get them without having to trait their efficiency first before they are useful.

Sorry that it turned into a rant a bit. They just completly missunderstood traits for our class though. They made them decrease build variety instead of promoting it which makes me sad.

TLDR: Less traits that force you into specific utility slots. Less traits that add crappy stats to the pet. More traits that actually help the class and our weapon skills. More traits that PROMOTE build variety instead of hindering it.

Some of your points are valid but the argument upon which this whole post is based is kinda silly…

“we HAVE to take most traits that are linked to certain utility slots. They actually balanced those utility skills in a way that they are always considering them traited. They become worthless without the traits and this actually affects 80% of our utilities.”

Um….Gee I have only played all 8 classes and 4 of them to 80, but it seems to me that the whole point of traits is to enhance your skills. You picking a specialty, a skill set, a play style, or a weapon set that you like, and then you pick the appropriate traits that enhance them.

If you are NOT using your skills and traits all in the same family then, in my opinion, you are really curbing your potential. The fact that you can NOT be the jack of all trades, as it seems to me you rather wish you could be, is the whole beauty of this game. However, you can be creative, learn to understand the pros and cons of a build, and just choose skills that give you the best chance of staying alive and hurting your foe.

I only play 2 build types as a ranger. A Zerker and Trapper/condition. Both are lethal and whichever I use depends on my mood and the situation.

On Zerker I am glass cannon with all focus on power, prec, and condition damage my my 7/8/9 skills vary. I use speed sigil when traveling, and have “Active signets also effect you” mainly just to use signet of stone to keep me alive. I use the shout “Protect Me” for a second protection, and if I get a chance I will switch the speed sigil to “sigil of the wild” for added dmg and stability. I can do some serious dmg. My point? I do very well for a glass cannon and my skills 7/8/9 do not all focus around any specific trait line. None of my 7/8/9 skills are on the same skill-type family, and hey each draw from a diff trait, but I make them all work together.

On the flipside, on my condition trapper I am heavy into condition dmg and all traps are dmg traps and I use the precision line traits to enhance the traps. Yes….you “have” to chose traits that enhance them to make them better. I peak at around 2k condition damage and yea I forego the CC traps for the sheer damage traps…but guess what….I made up my mind I want to do that. Other trappers use CC traps and are more CC oriented. We work together and we kick kitten because we each know we bring something to the table, and we’re not all trying to be the best at everything. I fail to see the problem with this. I feel that the whole point is to create a specialized build that suits your style and goals.

There is PLENTY of build variety. I have yet to play a CC/Bunker ranger but they are awe-inspiring if done correctly. Spirit rangers are rare because most ppl who roll ranger aren’t thinking of “support” otherwise they might choose a diff class, but hey…there are traits for that too! And you are complaining that traits are there to enhance a specific build type because you want to run around all nimbly bimbly (jumping from tree to tree) without just making up your mind and picking a specialty?

Mandar I said that traits are ofcourse supposed to enhance specific skills/playstyles.

The way they made it though is that it increased efficiency by 100-200%. Example here are trap condition duration and size or Signets not only giving buff to pets but you. Without that nobody ever uses the signet active to buff his pet because it is really really weak to give up the passive for that. Without the traits traps are just too kitten small and giving up 50% of their damage/utility.

These traits are just too polarizing. It is bad and what they need to do is bring the untraited version closer to the traited version for this kind of stuff. If these traits added 30% strength they would still be good but 100% is kitten and the reason why our utilities appear bad. It is bad design.

Dojo.1867:

It is bad design.

Don’t forget, this means other classes get more out of less traits as well. 20 points for war to max out rifle or longbow. 10 to make ele cantrips give vigor and regen.

ranger goes from crap > viable
else goes from viable > added bonuses

Ranger goes from crap to great . At least for traps

It happens for particular utility lines in every class.
But Ranger seems more burdened by the phenomenon than most. I think Survival is just about our only Utility line that feels like it works ‘straight out of the box’. Though, Traps are pretty close.

I turned my ranger into my main as I started to feel the potential in the class and the amount of versatility it possess. Now this thread feels like a cry baby making excuses about one of the few classes that take actual skill.

Signets: Their passives are ok, their actives are ok, they aren’t a big deal could use a bit of improvement but yeah until then they are rather ok. Deciding between passive effect and active effect is a decision that is part of actually building skills in game, happens to pretty much every class I played thus far.

Traps: In my first condition build I had a single trap along sharpening stone and some other crap, it worked fine, sure building into traps will make em more useful/powerful but hey no kitten?

Spirits: Yup, pretty much useless, no arguing here lol.

Shouts: I use them and they seem to work ok for me, specially under water in spvp!

Survival skills: They work right off the box cause they are the simplest, bleeds, evades, cripples they are simple and useful, just like stances are for warriors overall they are the ones most people prefer because they are straight to the point.

Now, judging the company’s ideas or will to fix things based on simple “OMFG BAD DESIGN” isn’t gonna solve anything, if they increase the utility of X thing for X class then another class will suffer and the problem will simply bounce, adding vit and tough to pets was a really needed move that will make pets much more useful and pets being the ranger’s unique mechanic that benefits the class as a whole. Fixing the pet’s AI also makes shouts more useful in the long run along with making the class as a whole more useful once again.

Building things the way people want them will only build another guardian, a class with virtually no weakness…oh and before someone says: “Our ranger options sucks” When you have that make get into target instantly skills you really don’t need any ranged.

I use the signet of the hunt ablity all the time. 150% damagefor me and my pet. Once activated you have 16 minutes to use it. You can get attack of oppertunity twice in the same fight. With the right set up this skill can help you do 23k damage in 3 seconds between you and your pet (jaguar).

The passive ablities are nice but the actives can be a game changer you just need to know when to use them. natures renewal is nice but if you have 25 stacks of any condition you cant wait for the passive affects.

SoS that signet is all about the active ablility.

We have skill that dont need to be traited to be good like healing springs is an example you dont need to have any points in healing and it still removes condtions for the party and heals. a simple weapon change can help with the healing as well.

It would be nice if we had that ele trait that lets you keep the passive ablity of signet when you use them.

I think were expected to be more support but we as players just have to go dps. Also Spirits arent loved,maybe this patch will change that.

Chokolata.1870:

Ranger goes from crap to great .

I now think I could have made my opening post shorter.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

I use the signet of the hunt ablity all the time. 150% damagefor me and my pet. Once activated you have 16 minutes to use it. You can get attack of oppertunity twice in the same fight. With the right set up this skill can help you do 23k damage in 3 seconds between you and your pet (jaguar).

I know about all that but are you really trying to tell me the active is good because you can precast it in your WvW base? Really? Oh and it only gives you the damage if you traited it. It is crap without 30 into Marksmanship and this is what this thread is saying.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

SoS that signet is all about the active ablility.

Can you tell me your build where you use untraited SoS for the active? If you talk about the traited version again you are proving my point. Our utilities go from crap to great which limits build variety. The only skills you can really mix are survivals and some rare other exceptions.

I have to agree with the traps section. I have one ultility slot on my build that I change around as the mood takes me and I have tried several times to put spike trap there because its pretty awesome, but it just isnt that awesome without traiting it which means I need to give up my reduced SB skill recharge and maybe even MoC just to make this one trap work well. Its just not worth it so traps become something I want to use but feel I cant unless I go all in.

On the flip-side, how do other professions feel regarding utilitiy skills?

People mentioned Elementalists and their cantrips, well what about their glyphs? Or their signets? Or arcane?

For Warrior, how do their shouts or banners go?

While I can sort of see where the OP is going, I also see the potential with the utilities traited nd untraited.

Signets needing Signet of the Beastmaster…yeah, it feels exactly the same as Written in Stone. The only reason one would bother with 2 or more signets on an Elementalist is because Written in Stone lets you keep the passive regardless of use. and mainly just for Signet of Restoration…

Traps…I use traps just fine and I don’t have traits for it. No, I don’t rely on traps, but they still serve their purpose being drops at my feet.

Shouts are probably the only thing that doesn’t need traits. They are just as they are although decreasing the cooldown takes the bite off of S&R when you use it and it fails.

Spirits are just not very good regardless. So complaining about that is like complaining you got poo on your hand when you go to wipe yourself. They’re a messy utility to use regardless of traits now but they overall serve the same mean.

I also mained engi for a long time so I can atleast speak for that.

While there is also stuff like HGH all those elixirs can still be kind of useful without that. You can also play certain turrets without a turret build and untraited. Their gadgets are a bit weak in general but all in all similiar to our survival skills.

Our utilities really are total garbage without the traits in most instances and the gap between traited/untraited is way to big and kittens up the balance. Before the devs realize that and rework some traits our number of builds will remain limited.

I’ve posted this view a few times now, but I think it is still relevant. The ranger traits seem (to me) suffering from going from the non-tier selection of the early BWE’s to the current Adept/Master/Grand Master system where the profession has many options weak for the tier they are placed into (in a few case ranger master major traits are inferior to similar adept traits).

Shouts on the ranger feel (to me) to be a last minute change in the overall development of the skills as the only things they share with other shouts in the game is the activation conditions and triggering the rune of the soldier 6th piece set.

I feel that they should have been grouped as ‘Pet skills’ like Rampage as One instead of this only the solider group profession have shouts we might want to have another for some reason.

Anytime you have a 30 second window between fight is a good time to pop signet of the hunt. Running with the zerg you dont need the speed buff because everyone is use aoe buffs. As far as solo you pick your spots. In Spvp it pretty much the same.

Traits are only part of a build. Armor, Jewelry, runes and skill choices make up a build. Just becuase I spend 30 in WS doenst mean I have to run a trap build or that I’m a bunker.

I tend to run 30 in marksmanship how many Grandmaster traits do I have to chose from. I could go Beast Master with 30 In BM and and point here and there for pet regen,faster pet movement and more crit. I would still use signet of the hunt without it being traited. I would still pre load it so I could get two attack of oppertunity in a fight.

SoS is all about the active traited or untraited. Meaning even when not traited its on my bar for the active. The fact that you would only use it to save you own hide doesnt mean that is the only way to go.

Rangers traps are good. Thief traps are bad, rarely used and never traited.

Ranger Traps are good traited, not traited they’re not that great.

Well, they could be as bad as physical utilities on Warrior…I think the only one people use is Bull’s Rush…

Xsorus.2507:

Ranger Traps are good traited, not traited they’re not that great.

When not traited for them, they seem more like they’re for helping out with kiting. Spike Trap? Immobilize that sucker. Muddy Terrain? Cripple it. Frost Trap? Chill it.

In terms of straight up damage, the traps are useless unless traited for. In terms of just effects that can be useful for kiting, they’re pretty good regardless.

RyuDragnier.9476:

Xsorus.2507:

Ranger Traps are good traited, not traited they’re not that great.

When not traited for them, they seem more like they’re for helping out with kiting. Spike Trap? Immobilize that sucker. Muddy Terrain? Cripple it. Frost Trap? Chill it.

In terms of straight up damage, the traps are useless unless traited for. In terms of just effects that can be useful for kiting, they’re pretty good regardless.

And after the update if you do that to a warrior, you give them a free hp boost!

“Dogged March replaces turtle defense -33% duration of movement conditions and when struck by any of those conditions you gain some regeneration on a cd no specifics”

RyuDragnier.9476:

Xsorus.2507:

Ranger Traps are good traited, not traited they’re not that great.

When not traited for them, they seem more like they’re for helping out with kiting. Spike Trap? Immobilize that sucker. Muddy Terrain? Cripple it. Frost Trap? Chill it.

In terms of straight up damage, the traps are useless unless traited for. In terms of just effects that can be useful for kiting, they’re pretty good regardless.

Spike only immobilizes when traited.

Flame trap is pretty kitten good when used on a melee build that has decent condition damage. It hits hard and gives you a quick recharging fire field.

Leo G.4501:

On the flip-side, how do other professions feel regarding utilitiy skills?

People mentioned Elementalists and their cantrips, well what about their glyphs? Or their signets? Or arcane?

For Warrior, how do their shouts or banners go?

While I can sort of see where the OP is going, I also see the potential with the utilities traited nd untraited.

Signets needing Signet of the Beastmaster…yeah, it feels exactly the same as Written in Stone. The only reason one would bother with 2 or more signets on an Elementalist is because Written in Stone lets you keep the passive regardless of use. and mainly just for Signet of Restoration…

Traps…I use traps just fine and I don’t have traits for it. No, I don’t rely on traps, but they still serve their purpose being drops at my feet.

Shouts are probably the only thing that doesn’t need traits. They are just as they are although decreasing the cooldown takes the bite off of S&R when you use it and it fails.

Spirits are just not very good regardless. So complaining about that is like complaining you got poo on your hand when you go to wipe yourself. They’re a messy utility to use regardless of traits now but they overall serve the same mean.

Ele arcane utilities are stupidly amazing. The popular s/d burst build that dominates a lot of spvp uses these, and in dungeons many eles take arcane wave.

Zenith.7301:

Ele arcane utilities are stupidly amazing. The popular s/d burst build that dominates a lot of spvp uses these, and in dungeons many eles take arcane wave.

Arcane is good but Arcane can be Great!

It’s about opportunity costs and while I’m no cantrip ho, one can’t deny the need for them. You can also make your Arcane skills stack vulnerability as well as doing more damage to vulnerable foes while in water but you need to trait for that. You can also stack crit damage on the use of Arcane skills but again, you have to trait for it. Then you can also apply conditions depending on your attunement with arcane but you have to trait for it.

The hard part isn’t really traiting for the effects, it’s sacrificing for those traits as you have to choose like Arcane Lightning over Bolt to the Heart, Ice Shards/Piercing Shards over Cantrip Mastery/Cleansing Wave or Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana.

Personally, I never had a problem choosing ES over EA but I really dislike dipping that far into Arcane in the first place But the combos one can pull off with Elemental Surge and Arcane Power are quite fun.

The only trait I wanna see gone is the one for spirit hp.

I do not agree with OP about other traits being toxic at all. Our class has a lot of utility especially when it comes to traits.

The OP is right, although he did go into a bit of a rant.

The problem with most, if not all of ranger traits is that there is very little synergy between specializations, and even worse synergy between traits and weapons.

When you look at something like the Guardian altruistic healing build, so much of everything they do works well and supports multiple aspects. Then you look at elementalist and its the same thing: multiple different aspects coming together well.

Then you try to get something decent going with ranger and it’s just a mess. Even some of the best builds I’ve seen out there are still really inefficient, with lots of filler traits that don’t really serve any purpose in the build.

Anet really just needs to go back and refine ranger skill/trait/weapon synergy.