Guild Wars 2

I know there are posts about this already, but since necroing threads is frowned upon, I thought I create a new thread about it. I think it really deserves some attention.

Rangers need a better burst heal for powerbuilds, ArenaNet. Currently, you barely see any ranger run with Heal as one, because this heal is worse compared to troll unguent or even healing spring.

Suggestions to improve it:

- Shorter cooldown OR
- Classified as survival skill OR
- Remove 1 or 2 conditions before the heal (just like mending does), decrease casting time OR
- Increase healing to 7205 (10%)

What are your thoughts about this?

Kind Regards

Definite plus one on any of these suggestions.

My personal preference is on making it a survival skill

There was also the suggestion that it would revive your pet if it was dead.

I think even just shortening the cooldown would help it out a lot, but having a unique effect on it would be more interesting. It could be quite a strong skill if it were classified as a survival skill too.

I’ll take all 4, balance be kitten ed.

If I can only choose one then survival skill would be my choice.

It just needs it’s absurd cast time shortened. 1.5 seconds is painful if you are being pressured by an opponent. Heal 6k but take 3k in the time it takes to pop the heal. It either needs a shorter cast time (underwater it’s 1s and works much better) or it needs something like the guardian’s Shelter.

I’d prefer it worked like Mending does. We’d get decent condition control and Warriors don’t use the skill anyway.

As a warrior I formally gift to you, the ranger class, our heal skill Mending. May you take it with the warriors blessing.

Since it is pretty much worthless to us it’s kind of like giving you our old clothes

Pretty much what we expect anyway. You warriors have any old shoes with holes and mouse poop in them we can have?

I feel sorry for power ranger builds, and this is one of the reasons. The survivability is pretty low for a melee build, there isn’t any healing stat taken to boost the chosen heal and without that the heals just don’t cut it. None of them do for power builds, IMO. Heal as One though, I consider trash (since I mainly play BM Regen/Condi, I stick with Spring or at times Ungent).

One thought would be to make Heal as One more Power friendly while not making it more powerful (LOL) for non-power builds. Perhaps have it draw on Power for it’s Healing boost.

Heals for more the less health your pet has maybe? Pet has 10% health, heals for an additional 15% to get massive return?

GOSU.9574:

I feel sorry for power ranger builds, and this is one of the reasons. The survivability is pretty low for a melee build, there isn’t any healing stat taken to boost the chosen heal and without that the heals just don’t cut it. None of them do for power builds, IMO.

This.

“Troll Unguent” is perfect for tanky condition ranger’s because their EHP is much higher than the usual powerbuild and thus allowing them to get the full heal. In a powerbuild however, I often receive more damage during the 4-5 first seconds of Troll unguent than I heal up and therefore nullify most of the healing.

That’s the reason why we need a decent burst heal. Also, since rangers rely on constant movement and evades, we badly need “Heal as one” to be casted faster. It has the same casting time as the necro’s “Consume conditions”, but Consume conditions with its insane condtion clear and extra heal’s per condition is miles ahead.

Please consider the change of our heal ArenaNet. Along with new changes upcoming in the feature pack, I truly believe power rangers could finally become really viable in Tpvp.

Agree. Especially the cast time is misplaced. It’s the weakest heal skill of all the 1,25 sec cast time skills. Having a good burst heal on other professions safed me a lot, but on ranger, (and necro, but on necro the extra cast time is offset by removing conditions/bonus heal) i got interrupted a lot. It seems that 1 sec, need an almost perfect interrupt skill timing, to interrupt it, while 1,25 cast time, you will get 33% more often interrupted against a profession who has access to a fast interrupt. So yes it needs to be more reliable.

Heal 1 sec cast time + any of the above mentioned bonusses. Survival skill is probably the best balanced, and would give a lot of builds ‘more synergy’ without being more overpowered, as they require investment in traits.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Agree. Especially the cast time is misplaced. It’s the weakest heal skill of all the 1,25 sec cast time skills

I suspect whoever balanced the skill evaluated it using the amount it healed the ranger and pet.

Solandri.9640:

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Agree. Especially the cast time is misplaced. It’s the weakest heal skill of all the 1,25 sec cast time skills

I suspect whoever balanced the skill evaluated it using the amount it healed the ranger and pet.

One thing I never understood about that heal skill is it gives you the impression it’s the only skill that heals your pet as well, when literally every other skill heals the pet too. There is absolutely no benefit to using heal as one. If you want an instant heal, use healing spring and throw in a leap or blast, even the regen pulls it way higher in terms of total healing. And troll ungent is strong if you time it right, arguable the strongest heal, but again you have to time it right other wise it won’t save you.

Heal As One is a really strong Heal, but it just takes so long to cast. Maybe reducing the cast time to 3/4ths would help.

All ranger Healing skills are bad. All of them need help.
Just look at all of them… and compare cast time vs passive effects/ offensive and defensive utility effectiveness, cooldown, mobility/armor weight, class mechanic… There’s not a single ranger healing skill superior to what other classes are using in a power build.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Healing_skill

New heals were introced and we got the WS… that no one ever uses, go figure.

Neko.9021:

Heal As One is a really strong Heal, but it just takes so long to cast. Maybe reducing the cast time to 3/4ths would help.

I disagree with heal as one being a strong heal because of the reasons stated above. You don’t see any rangers in spvp and higher lvl tpvp running it, that has to mean something.

Kraljevo.2801:

Neko.9021:

Heal As One is a really strong Heal, but it just takes so long to cast. Maybe reducing the cast time to 3/4ths would help.

I disagree with heal as one being a strong heal because of the reasons stated above. You don’t see any rangers in spvp and higher lvl tpvp running it, that has to mean something.

It’s the highest (or one of) amount of health on a burst heal, but the fact that you can easily eat half of the heal as damage during the ridiculous cast time makes it worthless in pvp. I even struggle to find it worth messing around with in pve just to use something that isn’t trolls/spring.

warriorjrd.8695:

Solandri.9640:

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Agree. Especially the cast time is misplaced. It’s the weakest heal skill of all the 1,25 sec cast time skills

I suspect whoever balanced the skill evaluated it using the amount it healed the ranger and pet.

One thing I never understood about that heal skill is it gives you the impression it’s the only skill that heals your pet as well, when literally every other skill heals the pet too. There is absolutely no benefit to using heal as one. If you want an instant heal, use healing spring and throw in a leap or blast, even the regen pulls it way higher in terms of total healing. And troll ungent is strong if you time it right, arguable the strongest heal, but again you have to time it right other wise it won’t save you.

The skill reads like some throwback to the days when the game behaved VERY differently than even what we saw in early Betas. I suspect, at some point, the fact that it healed both pet and Ranger was it’s bonus effect but they then made all heals work like this when they made the pet more central to the class and in their infinite oversight, simply neglected to update a skill that may very well be years old in design.

It smells like a skill straight out of GW1 that just doesn’t work in GW2.
Which is sad because the GW1 pet skills where much more dynamic and interesting.

Imagine if it worked like the old Heal as One did. http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Heal_as_One

Substance E.4852:

The skill reads like some throwback to the days when the game behaved VERY differently than even what we saw in early Betas. I suspect, at some point, the fact that it healed both pet and Ranger was it’s bonus effect but they then made all heals work like this when they made the pet more central to the class and in their infinite oversight, simply neglected to update a skill that may very well be years old in design.

It smells like a skill straight out of GW1 that just doesn’t work in GW2.
Which is sad because the GW1 pet skills where much more dynamic and interesting.

You may very well have hit the nail on the head. It does come off as something that at one time was a good option, then the other heals got worked on and fleshed out, but no one bothered to revisit this skill.

Either reduce the cast time to 3/4s and make this a survival skill, or just make it a shout.

Survival: -20% recharge, remove two conditions and give fury on activation.
With Survival of the Fittest

Shout: Instant cast, -20% recharge, gives regen and swiftness.
With Shout Mastery and Nature’s Voice.

I would personally love to see either, but a shout would be nice, if they took the cast time off “Guard” then we could have an actual shout build.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Either reduce the cast time to 3/4s and make this a survival skill, or just make it a shout.

Survival: -20% recharge, remove two conditions and give fury on activation.
With Survival of the Fittest

Shout: Instant cast, -20% recharge, gives regen and swiftness.
With Shout Mastery and Nature’s Voice.

I would personally love to see either, but a shout would be nice, if they took the cast time off “Guard” then we could have an actual shout build.

+1 for either of these.

Also, for those here saying Troll Unguent isn’t very good, I personally consider it one of the best heals in the game. It’s not easy to use it properly, especially if you’re using a squishy build, but because of it’s duration it feels like the recharge is 10 seconds and it gives the illusion of being a lot more tanky than you are. I suppose it’s just IMO, but I consider it our best heal.

The survival syngergy is already very strong and very popular, making heal as one a “shout” is realy interesting, opens up new builds and new rune set options(the “on heal effect” with 16 sec cd heal etc…) making it also insta with the same healing amount sounds abit 2 much, perheps redcuse it to 6k healing and 3/4 cast time.

Kraljevo.2801:

Neko.9021:

Heal As One is a really strong Heal, but it just takes so long to cast. Maybe reducing the cast time to 3/4ths would help.

I disagree with heal as one being a strong heal because of the reasons stated above. You don’t see any rangers in spvp and higher lvl tpvp running it, that has to mean something.

Erm, Heal As One heals a lot (6,520 with 1:1 Healing Power scaling on a 20 sec CD is very strong), but it has a long cast time. If you reduced the cast time to 3/4ths, it would probably become really good.

Thematically speaking, Heal as One should be categorized as a shout. Troll Unguent would be more aptly classed as a Survival Skill.

Fun fact, Rangers are the only class that have none of their original heals (before they gave every class a 4th heal) classified as a “family” of skills. I’m not exactly sure why that is, but it would be pretty nice QoL addition, especially to Heal as One.

Neko.9021:

Kraljevo.2801:

Neko.9021:

Heal As One is a really strong Heal, but it just takes so long to cast. Maybe reducing the cast time to 3/4ths would help.

I disagree with heal as one being a strong heal because of the reasons stated above. You don’t see any rangers in spvp and higher lvl tpvp running it, that has to mean something.

Erm, Heal As One heals a lot (6,520 with 1:1 Healing Power scaling on a 20 sec CD is very strong), but it has a long cast time. If you reduced the cast time to 3/4ths, it would probably become really good.

If you want an instand heal, healing spring will always be better. It cleanses conditions and the regen it gives deals a higher total heal than Heal as one. Throw in some leaps,blasts and even projectile finishers, and healing spring is potentially the best heal we have.

I personally have never seen any benefit to using Heal as one. I mean the only thing you could say that’s good about it is the shortest CD of the lot. Each other heal has better strengths imo. Troll ungent heals for the most but not all at once, so some timing is involved with using it effectively. Healing spring has the second lowest base heal but is a water field that grants regen and clears conditions, it’s also a water field, the longest ingame, did I mention it’s a water field? Water spirit isn’t really a main contender for most builds, but because it’s a spirit there are traits that can influence it’s effectiveness.

So what do we have?

Troll ungent —> Highest base heal, but is over 10s and not all at once. Second lowest cast time
Healing spring -->Second Lowest base heal but is a water field with other benefits. Lowest cast time
Water spirit —> Lowest base heal, but can be greatly improved with traits. Not the most flexible heal. Longest cast time
Heal as one -->Second highest raw heal, shortest CD, second longest cast time

It’s quite straightforward really, heal as one struggles to compete. The shortest CD doesn’t make up for the long cast time and relatively weak heal. I saw weak heal because it has no other bonuses. Spring is a water field, spirit heals on attacks, but HaO is just a heal, nothing fancy. You could say the same about TU, but atleast TU heals for the most without anything fancy.

IMO they need to make it a survival skill. Then it could have 16s CD, grant fury and vigor as well as cleanse 2 conditions, potentially. This would give it the buff it would need to compete with the other heals.

warriorjrd.8695:

it could have 16s CD, grant fury and vigor as well as cleanse 2 conditions, potentially.

Now that is really overpowered. Should it also make you breakfast?

GOSU.9574:

warriorjrd.8695:

it could have 16s CD, grant fury and vigor as well as cleanse 2 conditions, potentially.

Now that is really overpowered. Should it also make you breakfast?

Few slices of toast and a cup of coffee thank you!

GOSU.9574:

warriorjrd.8695:

it could have 16s CD, grant fury and vigor as well as cleanse 2 conditions, potentially.

Now that is really overpowered. Should it also make you breakfast?

Not unless you’re willing to spend 8 trait points.

Sarision.6347:

GOSU.9574:

warriorjrd.8695:

it could have 16s CD, grant fury and vigor as well as cleanse 2 conditions, potentially.

Now that is really overpowered. Should it also make you breakfast?

Not unless you’re willing to spend 8 trait points.

Exactly, the two condis cleansed and fury are from a grandmaster, and vigor and reduced CD require atleast 4 points in WS. If you wanted the maximum benefit from a survival skill, it wouldn’t leave you with much breathing room.

Neko.9021:

Kraljevo.2801:

Neko.9021:

Heal As One is a really strong Heal, but it just takes so long to cast. Maybe reducing the cast time to 3/4ths would help.

I disagree with heal as one being a strong heal because of the reasons stated above. You don’t see any rangers in spvp and higher lvl tpvp running it, that has to mean something.

Erm, Heal As One heals a lot (6,520 with 1:1 Healing Power scaling on a 20 sec CD is very strong), but it has a long cast time. If you reduced the cast time to 3/4ths, it would probably become really good.

I know, I mentioned the casting time.

After having read all the posts, I believe we can all agree on the following consideration: Reduce the casting time of the heal.

warriorjrd.8695:

Sarision.6347:

GOSU.9574:

warriorjrd.8695:

it could have 16s CD, grant fury and vigor as well as cleanse 2 conditions, potentially.

Now that is really overpowered. Should it also make you breakfast?

Not unless you’re willing to spend 8 trait points.

Exactly, the two condis cleansed and fury are from a grandmaster, and vigor and reduced CD require atleast 4 points in WS. If you wanted the maximum benefit from a survival skill, it wouldn’t leave you with much breathing room.

Gotcha, I was thinking you meant baseline in the skill itself.

GOSU.9574:

Substance E.4852:

The skill reads like some throwback to the days when the game behaved VERY differently than even what we saw in early Betas. I suspect, at some point, the fact that it healed both pet and Ranger was it’s bonus effect but they then made all heals work like this when they made the pet more central to the class and in their infinite oversight, simply neglected to update a skill that may very well be years old in design.

It smells like a skill straight out of GW1 that just doesn’t work in GW2.
Which is sad because the GW1 pet skills where much more dynamic and interesting.

You may very well have hit the nail on the head. It does come off as something that at one time was a good option, then the other heals got worked on and fleshed out, but no one bothered to revisit this skill.

not so much hit the nail…, as its the actual truth.

Heal as One exists the way it does because other healing skills originally didn’t heal the pet, you can read past versions of all heal skills on the wiki, or you can read this massively article from 2010 ::: http://massively.joystiq.com/2010/07/15/new-information-on-the-guild-wars-2-ranger-massivelys-intervie/

it just might make you sad to read that article though….