Mirage DPS HYPE
Power Soulbeast Grandmaster in raids
Just don’t.
Ranger weapon power coefficient is way too low compare to other power class.
Our highest dps rotation of sword+axe is about 24k dps, which pet is contribute 3k dps within that 24k, meaning our power build dps is around 21k alone. (Because you’re losing pet in beastmode!)
On top of that, greatsword dps is as low as 17k with pet, and 14k without pet (beastmode has no pet), less than half of what Guardian’s greatsword can do.
Soulbeast is not going to magically double your dps even with Maul bug, and Sick-em only have 1/4 of the uptime compare to its CD.
Guardian can easily hit 34k dps with their greatsword power build rotation.
Soulbeast has to deduct 3k dps from your pet and gain some minor dps increase.
Soulbeast is not going to magically turn Ranger’s 14k greatsword into 34k that’s for sure.
(edited by Aomine.5012)
Go go Power Ranger dream is dead? ;-;
Mirage DPS HYPE
Go go Power Ranger dream is dead? ;-;
You can still go condition build though.
I heard it’s a minor dps upgrade with Soulbeast merge mode when it comes to condition build.
You lose 3k dps from pet but gain 3k+ more dps from the traits.
You literally function exactly the same as vanilla condition ranger as Soulbeast, using the exact same weapons/ slot skills/ traits (except Soulbeast trait), just slightly better dps, and that’s about it. Nothing new to see here, sadly.
well power is going to be affective only at pvp or wvw , the dps is not so great for raids or at least for top raid . if you want to be affective in raids i think druid is te optimal choise
Just don’t.
Ranger weapon power coefficient is way too low compare to other power class.
Our highest dps rotation of sword+axe is about 24k dps, which pet is contribute 3k dps within that 24k, meaning our power build dps is around 21k alone. (Because you’re losing pet in beastmode!)
On top of that, greatsword dps is as low as 17k with pet, and 14k without pet (beastmode has no pet), less than half of what Guardian’s greatsword can do.
Soulbeast is not going to magically double your dps even with Maul bug, and Sick-em only have 1/4 of the uptime compare to its CD.
Guardian can easily hit 34k dps with their greatsword power build rotation.
Soulbeast has to deduct 3k dps from your pet and gain some minor dps increase.
Soulbeast is not going to magically turn Ranger’s 14k greatsword into 34k that’s for sure.
Not sure when did you get the 14k results, but with last balance patch we get 180 ferocity from SOTW, 250 ferocity from vicious quarry(10% crit chance), 200 power100 ferocity from Ferocious. The ferocity bonus alone is ~ 30% extra damage on crits(getting close to 100% in pve raids) which we didn’t have before and will scale with all the new extra dmg bonuses . Now add SB minors(ya, they should buff Twice as Vicious)SB GM(Oppressive Superiority, also could be buffed)SB beast skills+Sicem and maul while in SB. Ya, your 2H dps should be more than doubled, compared to pre AUG patch, DPS checks.
(edited by LughLongArm.5460)
Just don’t.
Ranger weapon power coefficient is way too low compare to other power class.
Our highest dps rotation of sword+axe is about 24k dps, which pet is contribute 3k dps within that 24k, meaning our power build dps is around 21k alone. (Because you’re losing pet in beastmode!)
On top of that, greatsword dps is as low as 17k with pet, and 14k without pet (beastmode has no pet), less than half of what Guardian’s greatsword can do.
Soulbeast is not going to magically double your dps even with Maul bug, and Sick-em only have 1/4 of the uptime compare to its CD.
Guardian can easily hit 34k dps with their greatsword power build rotation.
Soulbeast has to deduct 3k dps from your pet and gain some minor dps increase.
Soulbeast is not going to magically turn Ranger’s 14k greatsword into 34k that’s for sure.Not sure when did you get the 14k results, but with last balance patch we get 180 ferocity from SOTW, 250 ferocity from vicious quarry(10% crit chance), 200 power100 ferocity from Ferocious. The ferocity bonus alone is ~ 30% extra damage on crits(getting close to 100% in pve raids) which we didn’t have before and will scale with all the new extra dmg bonuses . Now add SB minors(ya, they should buff Twice as Vicious)SB GM(Oppressive Superiority, also could be buffed)SB beast skills+Sicem and maul while in SB. Ya, your 2H dps should be more than doubled, compared to pre AUG patch, DPS checks.
How about you try it on Raid Golem yourself instead of theory crafting and lecturing me?
14K is about camping in GS not swapping. (17k when add in pet)
Camping in Sword + Axe is around 23k dps after the update. (20k without the pet)
For reference, Guardian can reach 34k dps with just camping in GS and spam traps.
This is all base on actual testing on Golem, not throw in some tool tip and imagine the number.
This is DPS testing, so big numbers doesn’t mean much, consistent high damage is the key. Sick em has an up-time of 1/4 of its CD, and merging into SB loses 3k dps from pet.
Do note grabbing Soulbeast means you need to give-up something else too.
Marksmanship, Skirmishing, and BM are all our most important dps traitline. By sacrificing any of them and go for Soulbeast inherently lowers the expected dps by a large margin from the get go. So unless Soulbeast can boost our power damage by 100% CONSISTANTLY with 100% uptime, there’s no-way Soulbeast going to take over the dps spot in raid. (Guardian and Tempest brenchmark is 35~36k dps)
(edited by Aomine.5012)
I’m not lecturing anyone(why getting so defensive) and I cant go golem cus SB is not out yet, and that’s why I do need to theory crafting and that’s exactly what you do when you talk about SB position in raids before we really tried to raid with SB, so just relax m8.
I’m not lecturing anyone(why getting so defensive) and I cant go golem cus SB is not out yet, and that’s why I do need to theory crafting and that’s exactly what you do when you talk about SB position in raids before we really tried to raid with SB, so just relax m8.
So do you think Soulbeast will magically make a 14k dps weapon (because we have no pet anymore) goes to 36k dps?
That’s the real question.
You give up your pet, you giveup either Marksmanship/ Skirmishing or BM, losing alot of dps from get go.
You got some other dps traits to compensate with your original dps lost.
You got a Maul 50% damage bonus, but you still have to wait 3.5 cd per cast.
You got some bonus stat from merging.
You got a F4 called Wordly impact.
You got sick-em, which lasts for 8 sec with 32 sec cd, meaning the 40% dps increase is actually 10% in the long-run.
With all this being considered, do you think our 14k dps GS is going to reach 34k dps?
My answer is clearly a big no. I’d be happy if it reaches 20k dps at least, but that’s still nowhere near the raid dps requirement. (minimum 32k dps)
(edited by Aomine.5012)
First off most people aren’t setting records and just need to hit 20k on a dps meter in real scenarios to have a happy group. Second, and more importantly, we don’t even know if 2 druids will be used in mirror comps. 1 is sufficient for gotl to 10 people. Condi soulbeast loses a lot more DPS bringing frost spirit/spotter than a power soulbeast. That’s 33% less bleed damage just for spotter. Having to bring sun and frost spirit over 2 traps is a big loss. So you shouldn’t be comparing power soulbeast to tempest/DH.
Condi soulbeast compared to tempest/DH makes more sense as pure DPS spots and I think condi SB will be fine.
Power soulbeast is more about comparing 2 metas. Mirror comp with 2 druids or a new comp with only 1 druid and 1 power soulbeast that brings spotter/frost spirit so that those tempests and DH can actually hit 36k. If you ignore spotter and realize that 7% of that dmg comes from the power soulbeast, then just buffing 2 power DPS people is worth 5k for the soulbeast to be there. Buffing the other 2 ppl in the subgroup won’t be 5k but this changes the threshold to beat closer to 25k not 32-36k.
——————-
The general rotation is going to be something like Sword/Axe 10 seconds. Swap to GS for burst rotation for 10 seconds. Repeat. Use sic’em every other GS burst rotation.
More specifically, something like GS2, GS5 (Twice as vicious), GS2, F4, GS3, GS2, F1/F2 (ToV again) GS2 (maybe 1 or 2 auto fillers in there). Swap back to Sw/Axe. Axe 4 (ToV) Axe 5. Sword auto. Then use Axe 4 (ToV) right before going to GS again.
Maul 50% bonus and 2.1 second CD with alacrity and swapping to GS only when GS 5 is ready means that you rarely use that abysmal auto attack because you can use GS3, F1, F2, F4 as filler (not just filler they also hit hard and have CD that line up with this rotation from smokescale for example).
This means using your 14k benchmark that camps only GS for an entire golem is a horrible representation of what will actually happens because so much of that benchmark is waiting for GS2/GS5 and using GS1 while a soulbeat will hardly touch GS1. Using Sic’em for the 40% bonus during the burst means sic’em isn’t worth 10% but more because you are using it every other burst phase when the dmg is weighted higher.
Side note: Did anyone test if loud whistle buffed beast mode by 10%? Otherwise, I think BM will be dropped for power soulbeast in raids.
I’m not lecturing anyone(why getting so defensive) and I cant go golem cus SB is not out yet, and that’s why I do need to theory crafting and that’s exactly what you do when you talk about SB position in raids before we really tried to raid with SB, so just relax m8.
So do you think Soulbeast will magically make a 14k dps weapon (because we have no pet anymore) goes to 36k dps?
That’s the real question.You give up your pet, you giveup either Marksmanship/ Skirmishing or BM, losing alot of dps from get go.
You got some other dps traits to compensate with your original dps lost.
You got a Maul 50% damage bonus, but you still have to wait 3.5 cd per cast.
You got some bonus stat from merging.
You got a F4 called Wordly impact.
You got sick-em, which lasts for 8 sec with 32 sec cd, meaning the 40% dps increase is actually 10% in the long-run.
With all this being considered, do you think our 14k dps GS is going to reach 34k dps?
My answer is clearly a big no. I’d be happy if it reaches 20k dps at least, but that’s still nowhere near the raid dps requirement. (minimum 32k dps)
What I said is that I’m not sure if you got your numbers(14k+3k -dps) before or after the big AUG balance patch. If it was before, the patch itself added power ranger a lot of dps boost which scales amazingly with the SB traits and skills(beast skills and weapon skills). Damage modifiers scales exponentially with high ferocity bonus, and we got extra 530 ferocity+10% crit chance+200 power + extra 22% dmg boost from SB traits. With the boost Given by maul, Sicem, SB(F1-F3) etc… I think we can more than double our power build dps compared to pre AUG power builds.
I do think some of the SB traits/skills could use a boost. Twice as Vicious is weak, the master traits are weak, the GM traits could sue some improvements, but the potential for dps power build is there.
It also opens up room for druid build going NM/BM/DRUID with spirits, and SB going MM/Skrimish/Soulbeast with Spotter.
Side note: Did anyone test if loud whistle buffed beast mode by 10%? Otherwise, I think BM will be dropped for power soulbeast in raids.
Damage bonus did not apply when in Beastmode during the demo weekend when tested. Unknown if intended or otherwise.
PET PRECISION & DPS TESTS -OUTDATED-
Will update once Path of Fire releases.
Will update once Path of Fire releases.
Gotta say it’s pretty funny when someone’s being all reasonable and someone else is freaking like they kicked their dog or something. Longarm makes some solid points, would be cool if you see power soul beast, core cranger and healing druid all in one comp.
[Snky] FC don’t worry I’m just a scrub until I’m OP
would be cool if you see power soul beast, core cranger and healing druid all in one comp.
Think that should be done regardless – for science!
PET PRECISION & DPS TESTS -OUTDATED-
Will update once Path of Fire releases.
Will update once Path of Fire releases.
I’m not lecturing anyone(why getting so defensive) and I cant go golem cus SB is not out yet, and that’s why I do need to theory crafting and that’s exactly what you do when you talk about SB position in raids before we really tried to raid with SB, so just relax m8.
So do you think Soulbeast will magically make a 14k dps weapon (because we have no pet anymore) goes to 36k dps?
That’s the real question.You give up your pet, you giveup either Marksmanship/ Skirmishing or BM, losing alot of dps from get go.
You got some other dps traits to compensate with your original dps lost.
You got a Maul 50% damage bonus, but you still have to wait 3.5 cd per cast.
You got some bonus stat from merging.
You got a F4 called Wordly impact.
You got sick-em, which lasts for 8 sec with 32 sec cd, meaning the 40% dps increase is actually 10% in the long-run.
With all this being considered, do you think our 14k dps GS is going to reach 34k dps?
My answer is clearly a big no. I’d be happy if it reaches 20k dps at least, but that’s still nowhere near the raid dps requirement. (minimum 32k dps)
What I said is that I’m not sure if you got your numbers(14k+3k -dps) before or after the big AUG balance patch. If it was before, the patch itself added power ranger a lot of dps boost which scales amazingly with the SB traits and skills(beast skills and weapon skills). Damage modifiers scales exponentially with high ferocity bonus, and we got extra 530 ferocity+10% crit chance+200 power + extra 22% dmg boost from SB traits. With the boost Given by maul, Sicem, SB(F1-F3) etc… I think we can more than double our power build dps compared to pre AUG power builds.
I do think some of the SB traits/skills could use a boost. Twice as Vicious is weak, the master traits are weak, the GM traits could sue some improvements, but the potential for dps power build is there.
It also opens up room for druid build going NM/BM/DRUID with spirits, and SB going MM/Skrimish/Soulbeast with Spotter.
These numbers are AFTER the buff, meaning before it’s even worse.
I have two questions:
How much damage could increase with realistic fury refresh and Remorseless?
Predator’s Onslaught will double its effect while in Soulbeast?
(I don’t have tested it yet)
Gotta say it’s pretty funny when someone’s being all reasonable and someone else is freaking like they kicked their dog or something. Longarm makes some solid points, would be cool if you see power soul beast, core cranger and healing druid all in one comp.
I’m just tired of people SPECULATING we have good dps without actually do the testing themselves. Ranger power build dps is low even with all the appropriate triats, and Soulbeast is not going to magically doubled our power build damage.
Soulbeast is not a straight upgrade of our class, it’s an alternative way of playing ranger without pet, that’s all.
(edited by Aomine.5012)
The issue is nobody play raids anymore, just like those pve dungeons. People can get their legendary armours in pvp and wvw. They don’t need to worry about another 9 players in the team to beat a boss npc.
The issue is nobody play raids anymore, just like those pve dungeons. People can get their legendary armours in pvp and wvw. They don’t need to worry about another 9 players in the team to beat a boss npc.
Correct me if I am wrong but, While you do get legendary armors in PvP, you do not get the skin. You actually only get an upgraded version of your ascended armor. In short just the tier, same ascended skin.
So..I think people do still play raids.
Champion Illusionist Champion Hunter Champion Phantom Champion Magus
While not a lot play raids, a majority does play Fractals daily which is almost half a raid.
Mirage DPS HYPE
I’m not lecturing anyone(why getting so defensive) and I cant go golem cus SB is not out yet, and that’s why I do need to theory crafting and that’s exactly what you do when you talk about SB position in raids before we really tried to raid with SB, so just relax m8.
Oh, just stop. You don’t need SB to figure out the DPS output of gratsword or mainhand sword.
An elite spec isn’t going to close a 16k+ DPS gap. Just stop with the BS.
The issue is nobody play raids anymore, just like those pve dungeons. People can get their legendary armours in pvp and wvw. They don’t need to worry about another 9 players in the team to beat a boss npc.
Um, it takes virtually 8+ months of spvp to get legendary armor and WvW is also way longer hours to get what raiders get in a fraction of the time and cost.
Well still how much of a DPS increase would One Wolf Pack+Leader of the Pack would be on a power focused subgroup? For the entire duration, it hits 8+4x4=24*2=48 times maximum. It takes the stats of the ones affected and not the ranger (unlike Thief venoms). With a Daredevil or DH which has lots of modifiers it would increase Soulbeast DPS much. So it would be pretty possible even if SB DPS ends up like 24k~ and it adds so much dps it becomes worth it.
This is just speculation of course :P
Mirage DPS HYPE
Oh, just stop. You don’t need SB to figure out the DPS output of gratsword or mainhand sword.
An elite spec isn’t going to close a 16k+ DPS gap. Just stop with the BS.
First off, I think the assumption that 35k DPS is the minimum requirement for use as a DPS slot in a raid is pretty silly. Raids in GW2 aren’t so tightly balanced that the absolute highest possible DPS becomes a minimum requirement. Players often seem to take the view that “optimal” and “viable” mean the same thing but they really don’t.
Second, the soulbeast’s damage output with the greatsword will improve over the core ranger’s not just because of the extra ferocity and other passive stats and traits, but because they’ll be able to fill time waiting for the weapon swap cooldown with soulbeast abilities instead of having to use the awful greatsword autoattack (which is the main reason the ranger greatsword has such terrible DPS.) So they’re likely not going to be using the same rotation.
Guardian, Engineer
[SIC] Strident Iconoclast – BP
[SIC] Strident Iconoclast – BP
power soul beast in no where near thee top power builds out there , so idont think it is going to be meta or optimal for raids here look this is power tempest https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpA9IwmC5N0
and this is power soul beast : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lGm9sCKlvA
as you can see the power soul beast has two attack F3 and maul that work with sick em to do good dmg and after that it is pretty crappy so why whould raid team accept your friends whould take you as apower soul beast while you can take druid and actully buff power tempest?
To be honest, I’m not sure why anet even bothers to keep pure power weapons on ranger around at all at this point.
They’re all complete garbage and they don’t seem to want to do anything about it.
Just look at the kitten tier damage they gave our SB pet skills. Use a cat bite for 400 damage? Wow! Watch out staff eles!
I half expect them to fix the “maul bug” because greatsword was doing damage above Pool Noodle Level and we just can’t have that.
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Correct me if I am wrong but, While you do get legendary armors in PvP, you do not get the skin. .
Players transmute items, like different tastes and styles. Never keep the same looks in 5 years.
While not a lot play raids, a majority does play Fractals daily which is almost half a raid.
Its easier to find 4 players with guildies or friends than 9 slots without looking for group.
Um, it takes virtually 8+ months of spvp to get legendary armor and WvW is also way longer hours to get what raiders get in a fraction of the time and cost.
If you are pvp Gold division up or wvw Gold rank up; a full set of legendary can take less than 7 months. However, less than that will require more time. Each raid legendary armour requires 50 faction provisioner; a total set is 300 for 10 months. Now, you know the true reason why people dont play raid anymore.
To be honest, I’m not sure why anet even bothers to keep pure power weapons on ranger around at all at this point..
Check the Path of Fire expansion, the new feature does not include any new raids. So take a guess.
While not a lot play raids, a majority does play Fractals daily which is almost half a raid.
Its easier to find 4 players with guildies or friends than 9 slots without looking for group.
And your point is? Raid builds can be applied to fractals. So… the question is still relevant.
Mirage DPS HYPE
Keep in mind that’s done with PvP equipment, in PvE with ascended weapons/armor etc it’s gonna be a fair bit higher.
Obviously we’ll have to wait until we can actually try it on the raid golem, but it looks a LOT better than any power option we have right now. Maybe it’s gonna be a viable choice, maybe it won’t, but I wouldn’t throw power soulbeast into the trash can already.
Sukkla
Probably still playing ranger.
Probably still playing ranger.
Keep in mind that’s done with PvP equipment, in PvE with ascended weapons/armor etc it’s gonna be a fair bit higher.
Obviously we’ll have to wait until we can actually try it on the raid golem, but it looks a LOT better than any power option we have right now. Maybe it’s gonna be a viable choice, maybe it won’t, but I wouldn’t throw power soulbeast into the trash can already.
you can see he realy on sic em and honstly i cant belive arenet ill leave sic em as is is 40 % dmg boost idont think so
Oh, just stop. You don’t need SB to figure out the DPS output of gratsword or mainhand sword.
An elite spec isn’t going to close a 16k+ DPS gap. Just stop with the BS.
First off, I think the assumption that 35k DPS is the minimum requirement for use as a DPS slot in a raid is pretty silly. Raids in GW2 aren’t so tightly balanced that the absolute highest possible DPS becomes a minimum requirement. Players often seem to take the view that “optimal” and “viable” mean the same thing but they really don’t.
Second, the soulbeast’s damage output with the greatsword will improve over the core ranger’s not just because of the extra ferocity and other passive stats and traits, but because they’ll be able to fill time waiting for the weapon swap cooldown with soulbeast abilities instead of having to use the awful greatsword autoattack (which is the main reason the ranger greatsword has such terrible DPS.) So they’re likely not going to be using the same rotation.
Even at a 30k minimum the spec falls well below that. I despise arguments like yours because they underplay the need of buffs for these weaponsets.
Greatsword has terrible DPS not because just autoattacks, but because maul is also a pile of crap.
A thief’s bounding dodge hits for what a maul hits.
The coefficients on ranger power weapons are atrocious.
Which is why historically the ranger builds have been condi, because condi weapons pay no pet tax.
Even the concept of the pet tax is ridiculous, because pets scale so poorly. For some reason, pets don’t function like mesmer illusions where they benefit from your own boosts. So they don’t get your crit, your crit damage, or might unless you sacrifice a traitline for it.
And in exchange for these terribly scaling pets who benefit from no food or pots, they gave us power weapons with coefficients that are half the output of other classes.
These developers just fail at math terribly. Look at power necromancer and engineer, they have also been utter garbage for PvE because these people would rather buff thief autoattacks so thief staff auto does more DPS than a warrior’s 100 blades.
Keep in mind that’s done with PvP equipment, in PvE with ascended weapons/armor etc it’s gonna be a fair bit higher.
Obviously we’ll have to wait until we can actually try it on the raid golem, but it looks a LOT better than any power option we have right now. Maybe it’s gonna be a viable choice, maybe it won’t, but I wouldn’t throw power soulbeast into the trash can already.
you can see he realy on sic em and honstly i cant belive arenet ill leave sic em as is is 40 % dmg boost idont think so
Ya, anyone who thinks 40% sic em is sticking around is fooling themselves. It’s even less likely than the 10k gazelle burst.
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These developers just fail at math terribly
QFT
It would be interesting if they for once came out with official numbers, and their reasoning as to why class A should be able to deal so much higher damage than class B.
Win10 pro | Xeon 5650 @ 4 GHz | R9 280x toxic | 24 Gig Ram | Process Lasso user
First off, I think the assumption that 35k DPS is the minimum requirement for use as a DPS slot in a raid is pretty silly. Raids in GW2 aren’t so tightly balanced that the absolute highest possible DPS becomes a minimum requirement. Players often seem to take the view that “optimal” and “viable” mean the same thing but they really don’t.
Indeed. If your group is using safe tactics then having one or two dps dealing around 25k/30k is fine, it’s not going to be the fastest clear, but if the players are good they won’t have that much problem clearing the raids, though you’ll likely don’t receive much love if you want to pug.
Second, the soulbeast’s damage output with the greatsword will improve over the core ranger’s not just because of the extra ferocity and other passive stats and traits, but because they’ll be able to fill time waiting for the weapon swap cooldown with soulbeast abilities instead of having to use the awful greatsword autoattack (which is the main reason the ranger greatsword has such terrible DPS.) So they’re likely not going to be using the same rotation.
That’d be true if the skills given by the Beastmode were good, because as it stands right now only Worldly Impact deals good damage, and it has a 25 seconds cooldown and you cannot pet swap to another power pet to get a new one (cooldown seems to be shared by both pets), otherwise the other abilities deal so little damage is laughable, most of those skills deal between five to ten less damage compared to what the pet outside of Beastmode deals, when it should only be slightly inferior damage for the sake of balance.
I want Power Soulbeast to be a thing, but for that to happen they need to highly buff the pet skills in Beastmode, otherwise it’d be fun in open world but will never see the light of day in hardcore content.
Bite from soul beast is such a joke, it does about an autoattack’s worth of damage. Meanwhile thief vault hits for 14k+ and can be used about every 4 seconds, is a leap, has evade frames, and is aoe.
Ranger aoe is terrible and they could have fixed that by fixing the pitiful damage on our melee weapons and barrage.