Guild Wars 2

Disclaimer: The entire post has been edited in favor of what Heimskarl & naphack suggested.

It’s been mentioned many times that Ranger lacks a way to strip boons without resorting to external means. Below is a simple and brilliant suggestion offered by Heimskarl & naphack to give Rangers access to boon removal and give Rending Attacks more utility.

Add boon removal to Rending Attacks
Pet attacks remove a boon on hit with an internal cooldown of X seconds.

All in favor?

Add Boon removal to Rending Attacks and make Rending Attacks proc on any attack, not just crits, then give it an appropriate CD.

Rending attacks. ’Nuff said.

Edit: Ninja’d

Mind. Blown. I completely forgot about Rending Attacks.

Edit: Added Rending Attacks to the suggestion list with credit to you both. Seriously, that’s a kittening simple but brilliant solution.

Why is Ranger not removing Boons a problem?

Half the professions can’t remove boons either.

Because it is perceived that ppl pick thieves over rangers because they have boon strip.

Could also work if you add it to Moment of Clarity
When you interrupt a foe, you remove one boon
Has a _ seconds cooldown

or

Poison Master
When you poison a foe, you remove 1 boon
Has a _ seconds cooldown

or

Beastly Warden (currently adds taunt effect to foes when executing F2 abilities, on a 15s cooldown)
Add boon stripping too!
Remove 1 boon from nearby foe(or foes?) when executing pet’s F2 ability
Has a _ seconds cooldown (should obviously be pretty long if it affects numerous foes in range)

ProtoMarcus.7649:

Could also work if you add it to Moment of Clarity
When you interrupt a foe, you remove one boon
Has a _ seconds cooldown

or

Poison Master
When you poison a foe, you remove 1 boon
Has a _ seconds cooldown

or

Beastly Warden (currently adds taunt effect to foes when executing F2 abilities, on a 15s cooldown)
Add boon stripping too!
Remove 1 boon from nearby foe(or foes?) when executing pet’s F2 ability
Has a _ seconds cooldown (should obviously be pretty long if it affects numerous foes in range)

MoC: Sounds like stuff a Mesmer would do…
Poison Master: Sounds like stuff a Necromancer would do…
Beastly Warden sounds interesting.
Nah, I really think, the mechanic needs to be tied to specific skills or to pets. That’s just how the ranger rolls.
So either roll it into some Spirit active ability or give it to the pet.

I don’t know about Boon removal, but I have an idea for boon punishment.

What if there was a grandmaster trait (lets call it fungal spores or something) that would, when the Ranger is equipped with shortbow, dagger, or torch, create field of effect around the Ranger where each boon on an enemy pulses a corrisponding condition every few seconds? The boons wouldn’t be removed, but it would still be a unique way for Rangers to pressure boons.

Sube Dai.8496:

Because it is perceived that ppl pick thieves over rangers because they have boon strip.

Oh they pick thieves for more reasons. Every class should have boon hate not necessarily boon removal.

runeblade.7514:

Why is Ranger not removing Boons a problem?

Half the professions can’t remove boons either.

With the focus on boons being the general direction they are going for the idea of not being able to deal with them as being part of the ‘weakness’ of the profession is just backward thinking.

It would be like them looking back at the ‘weaknesses’ of the professions and it will pretty much be similar to the issues that got the warriors a way to deal with one of the professions major weaknesses conditions.

As for boon hate any mechanic short of removal (theft or corruption being just better removal) is generally lackluster and usually passive (and probably weak) or random neither of which makes for a good play experience.

I think it would be super cool if pets removed 1 boon on a critical, say every 10 seconds or less. adding this to rending attacks would be practical. rangers don’t have to have the best boon removal in the game, but we need some. even the guard can remove boons with Searing Flames. gaps like these really need to be filled. every profession should be able to do anything if specced appropriately.

mistsim.2748:

I think it would be super cool if pets removed 1 boon on a critical, say every 10 seconds or less. adding this to rending attacks would be practical. rangers don’t have to have the best boon removal in the game, but we need some. even the guard can remove boons with Searing Flames. gaps like these really need to be filled. every profession should be able to do anything if specced appropriately.

Correction, we really don’t have anything to begin with

This is going to so get back to the basic pets are not reliable enough to have addition dependency on their performance. Then the pet system will be brought into discussion along with the fact that while the developer know the problems exist, they are not ready/able/willing to take the time and effort to work on correcting them for fear of breaking the game.

Razor.9872:

I don’t know about Boon removal, but I have an idea for boon punishment.

What if there was a grandmaster trait (lets call it fungal spores or something) that would, when the Ranger is equipped with shortbow, dagger, or torch, create field of effect around the Ranger where each boon on an enemy pulses a corrisponding condition every few seconds? The boons wouldn’t be removed, but it would still be a unique way for Rangers to pressure boons.

Just to add examples, Might would pulse Bleed, Fury would pulse Burn, Regen would pulse Poison, Swiftness would pulse Cripple, Protection would pulse Vulnerability, Aegis would pulse Blind, Retaliation would pulse Confusion, Stability would pulse Fear, Vigor would pulse Weakness, and Quickness would pulse Slow.

Razor.9872:

I don’t know about Boon removal, but I have an idea for boon punishment.

What if there was a grandmaster trait (lets call it fungal spores or something) that would, when the Ranger is equipped with shortbow, dagger, or torch, create field of effect around the Ranger where each boon on an enemy pulses a corrisponding condition every few seconds? The boons wouldn’t be removed, but it would still be a unique way for Rangers to pressure boons.

I like this idea. This would replace poison master. I can see this compete against WK and EB.

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

runeblade.7514:

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

How so? That seems more of a opinion base statement there. It could be just as easy to say that warrior or engineer having condition removal is just dumb, but those exists and have /are getting improvements.

Bran.7425:

runeblade.7514:

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

How so? That seems more of a opinion base statement there. It could be just as easy to say that warrior or engineer having condition removal is just dumb, but those exists and have /are getting improvements.

To the one who is saying boon removal is dumb. Okay then, rangers will forever be out of the high tier pvp.

StickerHappy.8052:

Bran.7425:

runeblade.7514:

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

How so? That seems more of a opinion base statement there. It could be just as easy to say that warrior or engineer having condition removal is just dumb, but those exists and have /are getting improvements.

To the one who is saying boon removal is dumb. Okay then, rangers will forever be out of the high tier pvp.

You don’t need boon removal to be high tier.

Last time I checked: Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and the Boon removal masters: Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

runeblade.7514:

StickerHappy.8052:

Bran.7425:

runeblade.7514:

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

How so? That seems more of a opinion base statement there. It could be just as easy to say that warrior or engineer having condition removal is just dumb, but those exists and have /are getting improvements.

To the one who is saying boon removal is dumb. Okay then, rangers will forever be out of the high tier pvp.

You don’t need boon removal to be high tier.

Last time I checked: Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and the Boon removal masters: Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

Thieves say hello?

runeblade.7514:

StickerHappy.8052:

Bran.7425:

runeblade.7514:

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

How so? That seems more of a opinion base statement there. It could be just as easy to say that warrior or engineer having condition removal is just dumb, but those exists and have /are getting improvements.

To the one who is saying boon removal is dumb. Okay then, rangers will forever be out of the high tier pvp.

You don’t need boon removal to be high tier.

Last time I checked: Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and the Boon removal masters: Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

Boon hate itself is completely weaker than boon generation,the classes are not on same level either, maybe with upcoming changes it will put equal to it. Don’t forget revenant.

StickerHappy.8052:

runeblade.7514:

StickerHappy.8052:

Bran.7425:

runeblade.7514:

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

How so? That seems more of a opinion base statement there. It could be just as easy to say that warrior or engineer having condition removal is just dumb, but those exists and have /are getting improvements.

To the one who is saying boon removal is dumb. Okay then, rangers will forever be out of the high tier pvp.

You don’t need boon removal to be high tier.

Last time I checked: Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and the Boon removal masters: Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

Thieves say hello?

Only for SB #5 and scare off other zerkers but guard.

StickerHappy.8052:

runeblade.7514:

StickerHappy.8052:

Bran.7425:

runeblade.7514:

Ranger boon removal is just dumb.

How so? That seems more of a opinion base statement there. It could be just as easy to say that warrior or engineer having condition removal is just dumb, but those exists and have /are getting improvements.

To the one who is saying boon removal is dumb. Okay then, rangers will forever be out of the high tier pvp.

You don’t need boon removal to be high tier.

Last time I checked: Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and the Boon removal masters: Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

Thieves say hello?

Doesn’t change the fact that you don’t need boon removal to be high tier.

Doesn’t change the fact that Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and that Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

Instead of repeating yourself how about you state what would bring ranger into high tier play otherwise you two are only going to get this thread closed with your ‘is not/are to’ skritt.

Longbow #4.

Every time you knock back a target, it removes a boon. You hit the enemy so hard that a boon falls off! The closer they are, the further they are knocked back, and therefore the greater the number of boons removed.

serow.6524:

Longbow #4.

Every time you knock back a target, it removes a boon. You hit the enemy so hard that a boon falls off! The closer they are, the further they are knocked back, and therefore the greater the number of boons removed.

Path of scars would be funnier as sometime is will drag a target across the ground. Road rash and boon stripe, take that might and face.

But in all seriousness the knock-backs are not a good mechanic to attach boon stripe to as stability and aegis would just protect the other boons completely.

imo, it should be done by the pet and only the pet because it is common to all ranger builds. It would have to be on any attack though, with an ICD, triggering on crits kills the choice of pets to birds or cats to make it effective. Plus, with +30% run speed as default in BM line now, they will connect a lot more often too.

If they decide to address the pet performance with something other than band aid fixes then that could be an option. The rangers have a choice to make (choosing to bring a pet with boon stripe) or not.

Bran.7425:

Instead of repeating yourself how about you state what would bring ranger into high tier play otherwise you two are only going to get this thread closed with your ‘is not/are to’ skritt.

This thread is titled “Proposed Ways To Introduce Boon Removal”

It is about adding Boon removal for rangers, It isn’t about “bring ranger into high tier play.”

runeblade.7514:

It is about adding Boon removal for rangers, It isn’t about “bring ranger into high tier play.”

Translation: You don’t have an argument beyond repetition. Shame, it might have been entertaining.

Bran.7425:

If they decide to address the pet performance with something other than band aid fixes then that could be an option. The rangers have a choice to make (choosing to bring a pet with boon stripe) or not.

they are addressing pet performance. their F2 is being virtually overhauled. casting the F2 will result in a variety of pbaoe effects like weakness and taunt. pbaoe’s don’t miss and they hit multiple targets.

rangers not being competitive currently doesn’t have much to do with rangers being weak, but with the versatility of a handful celestial specs.

Bran.7425:

runeblade.7514:

It is about adding Boon removal for rangers, It isn’t about “bring ranger into high tier play.”

Translation: You don’t have an argument beyond repetition. Shame, it might have been entertaining.

Argument against what? That Rangers can’t be high tier without boon removal? That is false and wrong.

Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and that Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

Thieves having boon removal doesn’t change the fact that you don’t need boon removal to be high tier and doesn’t change the fact that Shoutbow, D/D Ele, Medi Guard Hammer, Cele Engineer didn’t have any kind of boon removal and that Mesmer and Necros aren’t meta tier.

I don’t need to make new arguments if he can’t prove that my evidence is false or until he make new arguments/give evidence that Boon removal is necessary for high tier play.

mistsim.2748:

they are addressing pet performance. their F2 is being virtually overhauled. casting the F2 will result in a variety of pbaoe effects like weakness and taunt. pbaoe’s don’t miss and they hit multiple targets.

Until it ships, they can say anything about it, but general stance on it as been:

“Pets that delay F2 use isn’t some wait script we put into their skills it has to do with core AI behavior shared by all pets and creatures and how they decide tasks. Rewriting that has the risks of breaking millions of unknown things so we have up until now band aided the solution. It is something that needs addressing but won’t be addressed until we can kitten how and when we will test it.”

So we will have to see. As much as I would like to be optimistic on this experience tells me to set my expectations low and wonder if they can surprise me in either direction.

Bran.7425:

…“Pets that delay F2 use isn’t some wait script we put into their skills it has to do with core AI behavior shared by all pets and creatures and how they decide tasks. Rewriting that has the risks of breaking millions of unknown things so we have up until now band aided the solution. It is something that needs addressing but won’t be addressed until we can kitten how and when we will test it.”…

Is that an actual quote or are you using quotation marks to give validity to your opinion?

It is an old one. I put is at the head of a document I working through ideas for the Ranger CDI (to remind myself to be careful about suggestions on entirely pet based improvements) before it got to the point of being a PR sham at best.

Fair enough. That was a valid question too, I wasn’t being a kitten.

If I recall they necromancer inadvertently got that information from him while complaining about minion (or summon AI as the developer from the quote stated as being a different can of worms) behavior.

It is along the lines of the stance of ‘sword is fine and working as intended’ to the realization that it was interacting poorly with some of the games basic functions and that the designer who both thought it was fine and then found out it really wasn’t had to pass it along to the team as something to someday look into.

So I slept over it and came up with this:

Rending Attacks
Each attack of your pet causes bleeding. If the target has three or more stacks of bleeding, the attack will remove a boon on hit (5 seconds cooldown).
Bleeding (6 seconds)
Bleed threshold: 3

naphack.9346:

So I slept over it and came up with this:

Rending Attacks
Each attack of your pet causes bleeding. If the target has three or more stacks of bleeding, the attack will remove a boon on hit (5 seconds cooldown).
Bleeding (6 seconds)
Bleed threshold: 3

Very bad idea.

Boon removal need to be an active skill, can you imagine saying to your mates on TS : Ok, am gonna remove his boons, well, wait for the pet to attacks guys, wel, hum, wait i need 3 stacks of bleed on the target ! You promote horrible passive play.

And if you really want boon removal, first go take a sigil or ( boon duration will be nerfed) it need to be in Nature Magic, cuz this line is pretty bad with the changes, something more like “steal” boons rather than “remove” boon since NM is the boon duration line.

borya.2964:

naphack.9346:

So I slept over it and came up with this:

Rending Attacks
Each attack of your pet causes bleeding. If the target has three or more stacks of bleeding, the attack will remove a boon on hit (5 seconds cooldown).
Bleeding (6 seconds)
Bleed threshold: 3

Very bad idea.

Boon removal need to be an active skill, can you imagine saying to your mates on TS : Ok, am gonna remove his boons, well, wait for the pet to attacks guys, wel, hum, wait i need 3 stacks of bleed on the target ! You promote horrible passive play.

And if you really want boon removal, first go take a sigil or ( boon duration will be nerfed) it need to be in Nature Magic, cuz this line is pretty bad with the changes, something more like “steal” boons rather than “remove” boon since NM is the boon duration line.

Stilling boons is more of the thief’s “thing.” I still like my idea.

borya.2964:

naphack.9346:

So I slept over it and came up with this:

Rending Attacks
Each attack of your pet causes bleeding. If the target has three or more stacks of bleeding, the attack will remove a boon on hit (5 seconds cooldown).
Bleeding (6 seconds)
Bleed threshold: 3

Very bad idea.

Boon removal need to be an active skill, can you imagine saying to your mates on TS : Ok, am gonna remove his boons, well, wait for the pet to attacks guys, wel, hum, wait i need 3 stacks of bleed on the target ! You promote horrible passive play.

And if you really want boon removal, first go take a sigil or ( boon duration will be nerfed) it need to be in Nature Magic, cuz this line is pretty bad with the changes, something more like “steal” boons rather than “remove” boon since NM is the boon duration line.

I still don’t get why boon removal NEEDS to be active.
Not every boon removal skill needs to strip stability in clutch situations. Just think of it as the pet having even more pressure by constantly ripping regeneration and protection to wear down a bunker. I just don’t see, how that would be a bad thing for a beastmaster.

Concussion Shot – Daze your foe with an arrow. Stun them and strip 1 boon if you hit from behind or from the side.

or

Concussion Shot – Daze your foe with an arrow. Stun them if you hit from behind or from the side. Remove 1 boon if you interrupt them.

25s untraited CD is fair for 1 boon strip I’d say, and it’s conditional

And you can only use it if you have a SB on you… Making it the pet that strips means you can use it with any weapon set.