Guild Wars 2

Two things from yesterday ….

The WvW forum now has a post asking people to tier (in their opinion) the professions after the new patch. People list every profession but the ranger. They don’t even list it last … they simply don’t list it … like it’s not even a profession in the game. Frustrating and saddening ….

Conversely … last night I’m in WvW (TC). There are people complaining in open chat that the new patch is horrible because they nerfed some professions so bad that they are being beaten by rangers. It’s like if they buff ranger the other professions will just say their profession was nerfed … because ranger has such a stigma attached to it.

I know more work is needed to the ranger but the latest patch was at least moving forward. As a BM/Bunker, I was doing ok in WvW before but I can tell a difference after the patch. I hope the next patches keep moving forward.

Last thing … and most important

Last night in WvW, a party of 5 rangers from either FA or DB had formed a chokehold on a point. They were dominating about 10 – 15 other people. They were fighting from a distance with LB, alternating well timed traps and entangle, and using fern hounds, wolves, and spiders. The people they were fighting against weren’t noobs. I was really impressed. They timed their LB#5 really well. They made it hard for other AOE classes to get close to them. One would fire, then people would try to move around while another one triggered their barrage and so forth. Another would run in and drop muddy terrain. If a player got into near their group, they would fear him away with a wolf. It was really a tight group of rangers. They had everyone locked down and were killing people … without arrow carts. I was sad I couldn’t join them and was jealous.

If any of you were in that group, you should record stuff like that next time for everyone to watch.

I know … I know that some will say what should have been done to counter them. Regardless, I thought it was impressive and fun to see a group of rangers dominating for a bit.

Traps were not buffed. LB was not buffed. The only thing in that scenario that got buffed was the pets vitality which i dont even think would be a factor since they kept everyone at range.

Welcome to Ranger 101

I never said traps or LB were buffed. I was just making an observation that a group of rangers were doing great last night. Also, pets were a factor because they sent their wolves in to fear other players that got too close to them.

Also, I’ve been playing ranger since launch so stop with the 101 stuff.

Reading comprehension is a valuable tool, KensaiZen … give it a shot.

While I’m glad to hear this story, I think it really is more a testament to the value of skill and great team play than the Ranger class itself.

I agree with you. I just haven’t seen five rangers working in tandem like that.

I’m not sure where anybody gets the idea that rangers are weak, other than they don’t bring much to the table that an entire team can benefit from.

It’s just that rangers aren’t a complex class to use skill wise. Most of, if not all of the skills are fire and forget. When compared to a class like elementalists or engineers who benefit more from constantly swapping kits/attunements and setting up skill rotations.

That being said, ranger is one of the classes that is very management dependent, needing the ability to micromanage the pet, as well as perform constant positioning maneuvers to maintain the most ideal situation.

The thing that needs the most improvement is build diversity. Rangers have no plausible reason to use more than half of our grandmaster traits, so it really limits what you build around. On top of that, spirits are still subpar and the only other group support we can bring is traps for the combo fields (and maybe Search and Rescue).

This is why rangers are considered top tier for pvp currently, but bottom tier pve. The opposite is true for warriors, they are considered top tier PvE, and bottom tier pvp.

I’m not saying the class is perfect, but for people in WvW chat to say “OMG, I got beat by a ranger” as some off handed insult is more of a testament to that person’s ignorance than the actual performance of the Ranger profession. There are quite a few rangers out there that aren’t that good and it tends to get the profession painted in a broad stroke as being bad. But when they face off against a good ranger, they’re going to be in for a big surprise. Consider yourself having a slight advantage as they aren’t taking you as seriously as they probably should. Make them regret that error.

It is nice to hear that story about the five rangers, I have always wanted to see that on a larger scale, i.e. fifteen rangers all dropping traps as a zerg tries to rush into lords room on hills keep.
I also agree with the negative stigma about rangers, it is sad to see people always assuming we are the worst class. At the same time that makes it that much sweeter when an enemy whispers you to tell you he is impressed by your skills

Anyone who plays “fire and forget” ranger struggles with the profession.

BrimstoneAshe.5043:

I’m not saying the class is perfect, but for people in WvW chat to say “OMG, I got beat by a ranger” as some off handed insult is more of a testament to that person’s ignorance than the actual performance of the Ranger profession. There are quite a few rangers out there that aren’t that good and it tends to get the profession painted in a broad stroke as being bad. But when they face off against a good ranger, they’re going to be in for a big surprise. Consider yourself having a slight advantage as they aren’t taking you as seriously as they probably should. Make them regret that error.

I tend to run in small groups or solo in wvw. When people see a ranger they stop whatever they’re doing to get a “free badge.” I love when they run in to kill me and end up running away or dying. I don’t always win but I don’t always lose either. I think part of it is because they’re surprised that a ranger isn’t as easy to kill as expected ….. for the most part.

I know the ranger still needs some work … I was a warden in lotro …. I guess I gravitate to the underdog.

I too have been playing a ranger since early release as well as for every BWE. I love my ranger but I do rotate to other toons/profs depending on what I’m doing. I am almost always in WvW. Zerg surfing is all about leveling up my lower chars unless we’re sucking it. I only do JP’s in WvW with my non-80’s too, especially since they made the siege blueprints account bound.

That is a nice story to hear, especially since I’m on TC too but I didn’t see that while online but I wish I could have been part of that.

Pendleton.6385:

I never said traps or LB were buffed. I was just making an observation that a group of rangers were doing great last night. Also, pets were a factor because they sent their wolves in to fear other players that got too close to them.

Also, I’ve been playing ranger since launch so stop with the 101 stuff.

KensaiZen, welcome to Ranger 102: Reading Comprehension

Corrected the quote for you Pendleton.

Nice story. I’ve actually been curious if I could somehow create a Ranger Longbow Beastmaster build with 1,500 range. Keep my opponent chasing me and not let them burst me whenever I’m in range and spend the rest of the time plinking them from out of their range while my pet eats them too. Biggest problem so far is handling the large number of closers other classes have while also wielding a longbow. Point Blank Shot and then you’re S.O.L. … though Muddy Terrain is lovely.

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Pendleton.6385:

I never said traps or LB were buffed. I was just making an observation that a group of rangers were doing great last night. Also, pets were a factor because they sent their wolves in to fear other players that got too close to them.

Also, I’ve been playing ranger since launch so stop with the 101 stuff.

KensaiZen, welcome to Ranger 102: Reading Comprehension

Corrected the quote for you Pendleton.

Thank you : )

What I meant is that rangers don’t any complex skill functions. They are all straightforward, easy to perform, and don’t require much forethought, as compared to a class who has to be mozart with a keyboard switching in and out of different things to setup a proper rotation.

Instead of that factor, rangers are much more of a micromanagement class, needing to control and position the pet well, as well as position themselves well, while other classes are more forgiving about that sort of thing, or lack a mechanic that requires any sort of managing (thieves).

That being said, it’s nice to see our resident troll pouncing on every thread and every person they can.

Quick question to op. Were you at the fight night yesterday? I jumped in real quick with some guildies and won ever duel I was in (even against this Mesmer that won every duel until he fought me from what I could tell). I’m from DB btw.

Rant inc. The perception behind rangers being the worst profession isn’t because it is, it is because the players who play the profession use builds that bring terrible results to the table in any form of pvp. Very, VERY few rangers use a viable build. Why is that? For starters, this forum is full of crap builds that new players look at and decide to pick up. Second, ranger has terrible build diversity due to several worthless skills and traits. Using one of them can literally kill your build. Third, ranger requires a tab bit of micro to manage your pet well in combat. Micro takes practice, so in order to do well as ranger, you need to practice more than most other professions. Last, rangers can’t support. Sure you can tell me we have spirits that grant … swiftness on hit … wow … because that is when I want swiftness right? When I hit somebody? Yet the little spirit can’t give me swiftness if I’m attempting to flee (ties into bad skills)? Our only real support skill is signet of renewal as a team condition cleanse. The issue with that is your pet instantly blows up requiring a swap since pets have no condi removal. Pets are in a good state right now! The issue isn’t the pets, it is the players using them. I know the game has some quirks (auto cancelling your pet F2 or your pets inability to use it for no reason), but the big issue here is that a seemingly simple profession is actual fairly complex requiring quite a steep learning curve in order to understand how exactly to play with it against every other profession because ranger has no auto win buttons, it requires you to analyze every situation to determine what you should do next and if you aren’t up to the challenge, expect to perform poorly. /rant

Indoles.1467:

Quick question to op. Were you at the fight night yesterday? I jumped in real quick with some guildies and won ever duel I was in (even against this Mesmer that won every duel until he fought me from what I could tell). I’m from DB btw.

I wasn’t at fight night. I was taking part in some battles at the gates of Greenwater Lowlands between Greenlake and Askalion Hills. There were two really good battles there last night. I’m pretty sure it was FA … could be wrong though.

I did duel another ranger on the coastline of the Askalion Hills. We dueled for a bit and stopped and discussed our builds and servers. I think we were both bunkers so the fight drug on and on … but was fun.

Pendleton.6385:

I never said traps or LB were buffed. I was just making an observation that a group of rangers were doing great last night. Also, pets were a factor because they sent their wolves in to fear other players that got too close to them.

Also, I’ve been playing ranger since launch so stop with the 101 stuff.

Reading comprehension is a valuable tool, KensaiZen … give it a shot.

Wasn’t aimed at you chappy. Pointing more towards the people that have dragged the community down. IE Rangers are rubbish in WvW because etc

The mechanics of the rangers in question had not been touched by the recent patch yet they can still do it. Just goes to show. Dont believe everything you see on paper.

Notice i never used the reply button to the OP. Comprehension indeed.

Rangers are not under powered any more, it seems everyone on here isn’t going to be happy until they can win every fight with their ranger. Like all classes, certain builds will be countered by other builds. If you want to roll full zerker LB build don’t complain when you lose 1v1’s.

Rangers haven’t been underpowered. The current issues with them are:

• Pet AI could still use some tweaking to better handle moving targets
• Less viable utilities than most classes (hi spirits)
• Some trait tweaks (many classes need this)

Sebrent.3625:

Rangers haven’t been underpowered. The current issues with them are:

• Pet AI could still use some tweaking to better handle moving targets
• Less viable utilities than most classes (hi spirits)
• Some trait tweaks (many classes need this)

You forgot the biggest issue – being dependent upon the pet for a large chunk of your DPS. The pet should be optional, not required.

what the eff you are talking about, rangers are op not kill-able with insane healing and annoying attacks

Lighter.5631:

what the eff you are talking about, rangers are op not kill-able with insane healing and annoying attacks

Troll or T/Spvp player. (I say this as though there’s a difference.)

What night is fight night? I play on TC. I’d love to drop in and duel a bit.

Come to pvp. Where rangers are gods.

BrimstoneAshe.5043:

I’m not saying the class is perfect, but for people in WvW chat to say “OMG, I got beat by a ranger” as some off handed insult is more of a testament to that person’s ignorance than the actual performance of the Ranger profession. There are quite a few rangers out there that aren’t that good and it tends to get the profession painted in a broad stroke as being bad. But when they face off against a good ranger, they’re going to be in for a big surprise. Consider yourself having a slight advantage as they aren’t taking you as seriously as they probably should. Make them regret that error.

Oh this a thousand times over. There are plenty of great rangers. You don’t hear from them usually because the time they put into truing explain advanced concepts to people who try to classify the professions into tiers but ignore the fact that the people behind each keyboard are usually not of the same skill level.

No matter how much in love these profession forum goers are with prominent members in any particular forum and think unless those people made a build every other build will suck. Lots of great rangers who will not share a build so others have to work harder to beat it. So when someone does start attacking thinking that since they are targeting a ranger they will win you can surprise them and not share the build, that way they become a little more scared to attack rangers.

tldr; make your own builds and ignore anyone saying any class sucks, the one that sucks is almost always the person behind the keyboard for their loser attitude.

I’d say let the stigma remain (for WvWvW at least).

It’s priceless seeing other players always run after the ranger thinking that they’re free bags of loot, only to go running with their tails behind their backs when we start “needling away” at their hp.

stale.9785:

Lighter.5631:

what the eff you are talking about, rangers are op not kill-able with insane healing and annoying attacks

Troll or T/Spvp player. (I say this as though there’s a difference.)

obviously tpvp, in pve anything goes

WvW Ranger is the unbeatable profession the thing is people don’t know how to gear and spec or refuse to do so….We have seen players post that build with clips several times on these forums with SB/LB/Sword/ I mean come on whatever you want melee or ranged YOU CAN BE A GOD!

Its so OP I actually stopped playing it, you can not be killed by 1 and most times 2 players of equal gear and skill….Just cant happen.

One last time: Regeneration Power Toughness build, I like to play it as ranged with SB/LB, other play it with Sword its all good….The Regeneration is greater than any DPS of any single build in the game today while hitting you with over 2k Power for consistent DPS and the pet chewing chunks away…It even has a burst chain using QZ and pet swoop knocking 5k – 6k off at least every x sec.

In a way its good so many players refuse to wear Cleric gear, this away Anet will not nurf the build.

Cempa.5619:

WvW Ranger is the unbeatable profession the thing is people don’t know how to gear and spec or refuse to do so….We have seen players post that build with clips several times on these forums with SB/LB/Sword/ I mean come on whatever you want melee or ranged YOU CAN BE A GOD!

Its so OP I actually stopped playing it, you can not be killed by 1 and most times 2 players of equal gear and skill….Just cant happen.

One last time: Regeneration Power Toughness build, I like to play it as ranged with SB/LB, other play it with Sword its all good….The Regeneration is greater than any DPS of any single build in the game today while hitting you with over 2k Power for consistent DPS and the pet chewing chunks away…It even has a burst chain using QZ and pet swoop knocking 5k – 6k off at least every x sec.

In a way its good so many players refuse to wear Cleric gear, this away Anet will not nurf the build.

I agree, I don’t know why so many people think rangers are terrible while regen ranger builds exist. I’ve played against regen rangers and the only build I’ve found that can do well against them is a heavy boon stripping/cc necro and even that requires very well timed play. Playing a regen ranger in sPvP, I can survive multiple mesmer/thief bursts while playing half asleep as I just dodge around all while stacking 40+ seconds of ridiculously high regeneration with 3500+ armor. I would gear my ranger for a regen build in WvW, but this build is so good that I am almost certain it will be nerfed in the next 1-2 months so I don’t want to waste money on the gear.

Ummmm, can someone PM me the build the last 2 posters are talking about?

Sebrent.3625:

Rangers haven’t been underpowered. The current issues with them are:

• Pet AI could still use some tweaking to better handle moving targets
• Less viable utilities than most classes (hi spirits)
• Some trait tweaks (many classes need this)

QFT,

Rangers are so much fun to play and bring more to the table than I see on these forums. What is so awesome about the Ranger is that if can be melee, range or both. I play only bunker specs in WvW (and not the BM regen) The Ranger has many build options through their traits, weapon skills and 4 out of 5 of their utility skills (PLEASE fix Spirits in WvW) The only thing that holds them back from being a team player is there spirit builds are lackluster because of there poor design. Once Anet fixes spirits, Rangers with be a welcoming addition to any group.

I dont know. Yesterday I met a 5 rangers premade in sPvP and we were absolutely demolished. One of the most one sided matches I played (not counting hotjoin random nonsense). Perhaps it was pure skill, I dont know. But it is worth noting that I never seen a 5 rangers premade yet alone so many rangers in sPvP as I see recently.

A group of rangers can be quite devastating due to the area denial they can exhibit via pets and traps.

When I’m solo roaming, I prefer to be tankier as you can’t evade all the attacks when there are 2-3 enemies on you (squeaked out a 3vMe last night!). When it comes to more coordinated fighting, I’ll go much more offensive with my traits, stats, weapons, and utilities.

For those wondering about the tanky build being referenced by many on here, check out the Roaming Regen Ranger build already posted in its own thread in the Ranger subforum. The classic version is 0/0/30/10/30 but some people move 10 or so points around in it due to their own preferences. The classic trap build is 0/30/30/5/5 with some moving usually 5 points around to suit their tastes.

Just to clarify … my original post wasn’t to criticize the ranger. I love playing ranger. It is my main and my alt is a 40 ranger as well.

I was just relaying how other forums don’t even rate us in their wvw profession breakdown … yet they complain in map chat about being downed by a ranger. It can be quite frustrating … and funny at times.

Sebrent.3625:

A group of rangers can be quite devastating due to the area denial they can exhibit via pets and traps.

The group of rangers I mention in my original post were doing this. They completely denied a larger group access and slowly walked them back via timed LB#5 and fear from wolves. It was really impressive.

stale.9785:

You forgot the biggest issue – being dependent upon the pet for a large chunk of your DPS. The pet should be optional, not required.

So the ranger’s class mechanic should be like other classes? I can agree with this. After all, the thief doesn’t have to use the initative system, let alone the stealth system, warriors don’t have to use their burst skill to dramatically improve their performance, elementalists don’t have to change elemental…

…ohwait.