Ranger Pet DPS -- more quick Mists tests
To add to this, drakes are currently bugged so god knows where they’ll stand when their other 2 skills are used, and you should really list the hyenas time when their F2 is used because they’re balanced around having that second Hyena up 24/7, other canines are NOT balanced around that.
PS: you should put how long it takes -you- to kill a golem with your auto attack to put it in better perspective on their dmg vs ours.
They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family.
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
Better test:
Let a pet kill a heavy golem, time it from the time its first attack lands. Specc for pet damage.
Then you go and kill the same golem, time that. Specc for max damage.
Compare the difference in time between the two of you.
Win10 pro | Xeon 5650 @ 4 GHz | R9 280x toxic | 24 Gig Ram | Process Lasso user
The first line: “passive pet” means the pet isn’t doing anything (ie. all ranger). Also, I didn’t use the F2 skill in any test. I did try a couple of them, but nothing worthy of putting in the timing results.
The Hyena is particularly bad DPS. It’s even worse when you use the F2 skill. The howl animation and resulting summon took so long that I don’t think the second one had a chance to do anything. It despawns before F2 comes ready again, too, which is another strike against that pet. It’s basically so bad that you’d need a crowd of about 4 hyenas up permanently to equal one bear.
Truly, hyena should be renamed chihuahua.
—
As for the other nice test suggestions, go for it. The mists are ready, waiting, and eager for you to go time some golem kills. The question I wanted to answer was “does pet dps matter?” The secondary was “are all pets equal or are some more equal?”
Keep in mind these tests are against enemies that are standing perfectly still, where as in actual PvE/PvP this does not happen at all and pets are easily shut down by moving targets.
Dragonbrand
Elementalist
The Dragonfly Effect [Phi]
Elementalist
The Dragonfly Effect [Phi]
Keep in mind these tests are against enemies that are standing perfectly still, where as in actual PvE/PvP this does not happen at all and pets are easily shut down by moving targets.
Pretty much what I was going to say. Instead of using a stationary golem, use a moving one.
Then prepare to measure your results in minutes instead of seconds.
The first line: “passive pet” means the pet isn’t doing anything (ie. all ranger). Also, I didn’t use the F2 skill in any test. I did try a couple of them, but nothing worthy of putting in the timing results.
The Hyena is particularly bad DPS. It’s even worse when you use the F2 skill. The howl animation and resulting summon took so long that I don’t think the second one had a chance to do anything. It despawns before F2 comes ready again, too, which is another strike against that pet. It’s basically so bad that you’d need a crowd of about 4 hyenas up permanently to equal one bear.
Truly, hyena should be renamed chihuahua.
—
As for the other nice test suggestions, go for it. The mists are ready, waiting, and eager for you to go time some golem kills. The question I wanted to answer was “does pet dps matter?” The secondary was “are all pets equal or are some more equal?”
Um… Hyenas are quite strong, you are not taking the cast animation out of the time for the test which is pretty much just adding 2-3 seconds onto their time… and the Hyena despawns because there’s no “enemies” nearby after the target dies, infact, if you stay in combat, or at least follow the Hyena Ally around on his rampage and keep him alive via healing spring you can summon an infinite amount of hyenas.
I know while fighting my friend while i was teaching him how to fight a ranger he ignored my hyena and ended up having to fight me, my rock dog, and 4 Hyenas, quite a powerful pet…
They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family.
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
follow the Hyena Ally around on his rampage and keep him alive via healing spring you can summon an infinite amount of hyenas.
LOL, that’s just hilarious. I was wondering if it would permit chain summoning. I’m picturing a guy walking about 20 chihuahuas on leashes with a T-shirt reading “Careful, they bite.” Almost worth rolling another ranger just to name it Don Chihuahua and summon herds of hyenas.
The hyena thing doesn’t work for me. The pet suddenly dissapears after a while.
Pretty much what I was going to say. Instead of using a stationary golem, use a moving one.
Then prepare to measure your results in minutes instead of seconds.
Use the 30% mov speed trait = problem solved
Use a ranged pet = problem solved
Use both = amazing.
It’s like saying i can’t hit from 1.200+ range because i refuse to use anything but an axe.
There is a reason why you can change pets anytime (outside combat), anywhere.
(edited by Sleepy.2647)
Pretty much what I was going to say. Instead of using a stationary golem, use a moving one.
Then prepare to measure your results in minutes instead of seconds.
Use the 30% mov speed trait = problem solved
Use a ranged pet = problem solved
Use both = amazing.It’s like saying i can’t hit from 1.200+ range because i refuse to use anything but an axe.
There is a reason why you can change pets anytime (outside combat), anywhere.
Wrong. Pets get rooted in place when they attack, while your target moves out of range. Birds have 300 range on most of their attacks and they STILL whiff 50% of the time. Ranged pets have generally pretty crappy dps from what I can tell, so problem is still there.
Wrong. Pets get rooted in place when they attack, while your target moves out of range. Birds have 300 range on most of their attacks and they STILL whiff 50% of the time. Ranged pets have generally pretty crappy dps from what I can tell, so problem is still there.
Wrong,The only time bird misses is when he uses the skill casted by the pet itself, and that happens once every…10-15 attacks? Not a big deal
Same goes for all other pets, autoattacks RARELY miss. Don’t base your facts on a BS video, try it yourself. Arguing that pets miss 50% of their attacks is BS, they hardly miss 1/10 with or without trait, but trait helps catching up your target faster so it boost the DPS against moving targets.
And devourers don’t make bad DPS, they are actually the best DPS against moving targets or mobs/bosses that hurt melee pets. Canines are also great because they cripple a lot.
Conclusion…want to get the most out of your pets? Learn to use them. Just like you can’t be in melee in many situations pets can’t do it either…you can’t expect a pet to go melee and survive to something that you wouldn’t survive.
(edited by Sleepy.2647)
yesterday,my Jaguar did on a warrior 9,8k dmg with one hit..(Ofc i was BM,ofc he had the haste debuff on him,ofc there was some might buffs).I love my pets but i feel that there should be a little less timing in their animation.Sometimes they used to not attack even when i was pressing F1 like hell,and sometimes they take a long patch to reach my target.
But i love them..Im a Ranger i suppose to have pet,thats my difference from warriors and thiefs.And some pets have nice skills that can make a lot of combos with the Ranger…Just not yet,they need some improvements..Some are allready done but theres still more
Yes, their skills cast time animations are quite bad for the most part
Wrong. Pets get rooted in place when they attack, while your target moves out of range. Birds have 300 range on most of their attacks and they STILL whiff 50% of the time. Ranged pets have generally pretty crappy dps from what I can tell, so problem is still there.
Wrong,The only time bird misses is when he uses the skill casted by the pet itself, and that happens once every…10-15 attacks? Not a big deal
Same goes for all other pets, autoattacks RARELY miss. Don’t base your facts on a BS video, try it yourself. Arguing that pets miss 50% of their attacks is BS, they hardly miss 1/10 with or without trait, but trait helps catching up your target faster so it boost the DPS against moving targets.
And devourers don’t make bad DPS, they are actually the best DPS against moving targets or mobs/bosses that hurt melee pets. Canines are also great because they cripple a lot.
Conclusion…want to get the most out of your pets? Learn to use them. Just like you can’t be in melee in many situations pets can’t do it either…you can’t expect a pet to go melee and survive to something that you wouldn’t survive.
I have been using my pet since BWE1 and he’s not wrong. I have also been on the opposite of the pet with my Mesmer, where I largely just ignore the pet as they aren’t a threat.
I have been using my pet since BWE1 and he’s not wrong. I have also been on the opposite of the pet with my Mesmer, where I largely just ignore the pet as they aren’t a threat.
Just try the pet on the mist golem and tell me if they miss 50% of their attacks. You will notice that it’s the skill the pet cast what makes them miss most of the time, autoattack is fine for the most part…you can use pets that have no autocast skills and pretty much be fine vs moving targets, they obviously can’t hit so often but that’s not because they miss.
Mesmer is not really the best example to prove that statement since probably most of the rangers will use their pets (their attacks even) on your clones.
(edited by Sleepy.2647)
I have been using my pet since BWE1 and he’s not wrong. I have also been on the opposite of the pet with my Mesmer, where I largely just ignore the pet as they aren’t a threat.
Just try the pet on the mist golem and tell me if they miss 50% of their attacks. You will notice that it’s the skill the pet cast what makes them miss most of the time, autoattack is fine for the most part…you can use pets that have no autocast skills and pretty much be fine vs moving targets, they obviously can’t hit so often but that’s not because they miss.
Mesmer is not really the best example to prove that statement since probably most of the rangers will use their pets (their attacks even) on your clones.
The pets stop, attack, stop, and attack. The long range pets end up whiffing because the same problem as the longbow, the attack moves too slow and if you just stay on the move, it will miss.
Mesmer is a good example as any. If a pet is on me, I don’t bother wasting one of my skills to get away from it.
The pets stop, attack, stop, and attack. The long range pets end up whiffing because the same problem as the longbow, the attack moves too slow and if you just stay on the move, it will miss.
Mesmer is a good example as any. If a pet is on me, I don’t bother wasting one of my skills to get away from it.
Pet stops, attack AND HIT. That’s what you don’t realize, you think that because they stop to attack they won’t hit. That would be the case if you could get far away during that time which it’s not likely to happen if you are in combat. Obviously the ranger is the biggest threat, so it’s quite pointless to waste a skill on the pet…which doesn’t defeat the purpose that they hit 500-3k easily on you (that’s far from being useless). Or the double knock-down you can get with two canines which RARELY misses…but you are right…pet’s are so useless.
Pet skills = miss most of the time against moving targets with a few exceptions, pets autoattack = rarely miss, it’s not that hard to understand.
(edited by Sleepy.2647)
The pets stop, attack, stop, and attack. The long range pets end up whiffing because the same problem as the longbow, the attack moves too slow and if you just stay on the move, it will miss.
Mesmer is a good example as any. If a pet is on me, I don’t bother wasting one of my skills to get away from it.
Pet stops, attack AND HIT. That’s what you don’t realize, you think that because they stop to attack they won’t hit. That would be the case if you could get far away during that time which it’s not likely to happen if you are in combat. Obviously the ranger is the biggest threat, so it’s quite pointless to waste a skill on the pet…which doesn’t defeat the purpose that they hit 500-3k easily on you (that’s far from being useless). Or the double knock-down you can get with two canines which RARELY misses…but you are right…pet’s are so useless.
Pet skills = miss most of the time against moving targets with a few exceptions, pets autoattack = rarely miss, it’s not that hard to understand.
The Ranger is barely more of a threat. Largely the Ranger isn’t a threat as a whole. Generally most of the ones running around now are quite bad as they are the only ones still actually playing the profession and they love Signet of the Hunt.
You’re still wrong though, they stop, attack, and whiff quite a lot. As for the knockdowns, they usually aren’t a problem as the Ranger is seeing the respawn screen before he gets a chance to summon the second Hyena. Getting knocked down by a Ranger isn’t really a threat because the Ranger itself isn’t really a threat.
(edited by arcaneclarity.5283)
Mesmer is hard to kill for several classes and several builds, your argument is very poor. I’ve yet to see any competent ranger complain about our 1v1 PvP. Most of the complains go for the tPvP aspect, which focuses mainly on a meta team build being stronger than the rest.
Your argument is mainly the following: “I own rangers with my mesmer so their pet makes nothing”. Guess what, any decent ranger that still plays their class has probably has no issues in 1v1 for the most part…i don’t even know what kind of ranger uses SoH or hyenas in PvP.
(edited by Sleepy.2647)
Mesmer is hard to kill for several classes and several builds, your argument is very poor. I’ve yet to see any competent ranger complain about our 1v1 PvP. Most of the complains go for the tPvP aspect, which focuses mainly on a meta team build being stronger than the rest.
I haven’t seen a competent ranger for a long while now. It seems to be favored by really new players who don’t quite understand the game yet or really bad players who don’t understand just how bad the profession is.
(edited by arcaneclarity.5283)
follow the Hyena Ally around on his rampage and keep him alive via healing spring you can summon an infinite amount of hyenas.
LOL, that’s just hilarious. I was wondering if it would permit chain summoning. I’m picturing a guy walking about 20 chihuahuas on leashes with a T-shirt reading “Careful, they bite.” Almost worth rolling another ranger just to name it Don Chihuahua and summon herds of hyenas.
The most I’ve had up at one time was 8, but everything changed when the Charr Fire Shaman attacked….
That being said I have never had issues with my pet hitting a moving target, hell my friend who runs from fights hates me because he can’t shake my pet with anythin short of jumping off a cliff!! Oh Sick’Em movement buff how I love you….
They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family.
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
I haven’t seen a competent ranger for a long while now. It seems to be favored by really new players who don’t quite understand the game yet or really bad players who don’t understand just how bad the profession is.
In which category do you fit? Where do you find these rangers that get killed before they touch you? Anyone can go to random sPvP or WvW and probably faceroll any class that doesn’t mean that class is bad.
Yep, everyone that plays ranger must be either a new player who knows crap or a bad player who knows crap…you are right. Or maybe they didn’t play Beta with a ranger that was OP as hell and find themselfs doing just fine.
I haven’t seen a competent ranger for a long while now. It seems to be favored by really new players who don’t quite understand the game yet or really bad players who don’t understand just how bad the profession is.
In which category do you fit? Where do you find these rangers that get killed before they touch you? Anyone can go to random sPvP or WvW and probably faceroll any class that doesn’t mean that class is bad.
Yep, everyone that plays ranger must be either a new player who knows crap or a bad player who knows crap…you are right. Or maybe they didn’t play Beta with a ranger that was OP as hell and find themselfs doing just fine.
What do you mean ranger was OP in beta?! It wasn’t like we were capable of soloing 5 people all the while dishing out hundred blade damage from 1500 range with pigs that crit for 8k eyes dash back and forth nervously as he tries to cover up the truth
I personally do significantly worse in sPvP due to my “Don’t be in the Zerg” mentality which usually gets me violently kitten by a pack of roaming thieves… Idc WHAT you are you don’t survive 4 glass canon thieves…
They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family.
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
What do you mean ranger was OP in beta?! It wasn’t like we were capable of soloing 5 people all the while dishing out hundred blade damage from 1500 range with pigs that crit for 8k eyes dash back and forth nervously as he tries to cover up the truth
Being OP doesn’t mean you will do these things, that’s not OP…that should be unacceptable.
(edited by Sleepy.2647)
What do you mean ranger was OP in beta?! It wasn’t like we were capable of soloing 5 people all the while dishing out hundred blade damage from 1500 range with pigs that crit for 8k eyes dash back and forth nervously as he tries to cover up the truth
Being OP doesn’t mean you will do these things, that’s not OP…that would be unacceptable.
I will say that I miss when Sir Oinks A Lot had 2k power with 30 points in BM… That was nice… But alas, a tanky pet with that much damage is kinda OP… But god was it awesome…
Ah if only we were still in Beta… Then everyone would be a ranger again ad they’d be yelling to nerf us instead of our forum constantly crying about how we’re “underpowered”
They sing dark, delicious notes about power and family.
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
As their mother, I have to grant them their wish. – Forever Fyonna
Spider f2’s are really utility boosys not DPS. You can stack poison to 25+ seconds, stun + immobilize etc… Your results with them doesn’t surprise me.
Devourers are handy pets because the damage is relatively stable and they make good ranged shields due to high toughness (AKA you can hide behind them while shooting and be immune to non pierce ranged weapon DPS). They also when engaged at melee have a chance of having their burrow retreat skill up which will move them out of melee aoe without you controlling them.
I yearn for when we actually get pet damage in the combat log so we can figure these things out in real gameplay scenarios vs on static targets.
Arrys Shaikin
OoS
A whittling ranger becomes viable by forcing his opponent to whittle
OoS
A whittling ranger becomes viable by forcing his opponent to whittle
Don’t cause your Pet to miss 30% more.
The thing you’re all looking for is Fr-en-zy.
The pets stop, attack, stop, and attack. The long range pets end up whiffing because the same problem as the longbow, the attack moves too slow and if you just stay on the move, it will miss.
Mesmer is a good example as any. If a pet is on me, I don’t bother wasting one of my skills to get away from it.
Pet stops, attack AND HIT. That’s what you don’t realize, you think that because they stop to attack they won’t hit. That would be the case if you could get far away during that time which it’s not likely to happen if you are in combat. Obviously the ranger is the biggest threat, so it’s quite pointless to waste a skill on the pet…which doesn’t defeat the purpose that they hit 500-3k easily on you (that’s far from being useless). Or the double knock-down you can get with two canines which RARELY misses…but you are right…pet’s are so useless.
If the target is moving, the pet will miss.
I sit on “keep watch” all the time in WvW. To pass the time I’ll use the “guard area” ability with my pet, and set him out on the road to harass enemies if they run by. While I’m waiting, I’ll send him out to attack creatures that are nearby. Once he smacks them, I call him back to start reeling the creature toward me so I can shoot it. But to keep the creature coming, I have to tell my pet to re-attack a couple times along the way. This is where it is easy to see the problem.
Both NPC creatures and pets suffer from the same moving target problem. When my pet turns to attack the NPC creature, they run through each other, “rubber banding” back and forth 2 or 3 times before they settle in to a stop… Only then do any attacks land.
It’s also why it is so easy to just run thru NPC content if they are melee only NPC’s… They can’t hit you very well while your moving, because they have to stop for their animation. By the time the animation ends, your out of the hit box.
Salvo – Ranger – SoS
Shiver Me Timbers – Elementalist – SoS
Shiver Me Timbers – Elementalist – SoS
If the target is moving, the pet will miss.
I sit on “keep watch” all the time in WvW. To pass the time I’ll use the “guard area” ability with my pet, and set him out on the road to harass enemies if they run by. While I’m waiting, I’ll send him out to attack creatures that are nearby. Once he smacks them, I call him back to start reeling the creature toward me so I can shoot it. But to keep the creature coming, I have to tell my pet to re-attack a couple times along the way. This is where it is easy to see the problem.
Both NPC creatures and pets suffer from the same moving target problem. When my pet turns to attack the NPC creature, they run through each other, “rubber banding” back and forth 2 or 3 times before they settle in to a stop… Only then do any attacks land.
It’s also why it is so easy to just run thru NPC content if they are melee only NPC’s… They can’t hit you very well while your moving, because they have to stop for their animation. By the time the animation ends, your out of the hit box.
Really? Because i tested this and my pet hits the mobs just fine with no misses. You can send your pet and shoot once the mob to gain aggro, your pet will chase the mob and hit with no problem so i don’t know what’s the issue.
The only time where autoattacks can miss is when your target is out of combat…but in combat that’s quite rare to see unless they have something like thief signet + celerity buff.
@Sleepy.2647
Agility training is bugged, its only about 15% speed instead of 30%.
Yeah, dps is great on target golems. Super. Now, when your fighting a mesmer/thief and need to constantly press TAB and F1 to get your pet to attack them after they leave stealth or use clones. Plus, you need to use all your other spells and utility. Your pet also attracts aggro from Necro pets and Thieves guild. Yup, you’re almost guaranteed to pull all aggro from every npc in spvp because you have a pet. A pet that lowers your own dps and dies quickly.
" I like to let people talk who like to talk. It makes it
@Sleepy.2647
Agility training is bugged, its only about 15% speed instead of 30%.
It still makes an huge difference
Wrong. Pets get rooted in place when they attack, while your target moves out of range. Birds have 300 range on most of their attacks and they STILL whiff 50% of the time. Ranged pets have generally pretty crappy dps from what I can tell, so problem is still there.
Wrong,The only time bird misses is when he uses the skill casted by the pet itself, and that happens once every…10-15 attacks? Not a big deal
Same goes for all other pets, autoattacks RARELY miss. Don’t base your facts on a BS video, try it yourself. Arguing that pets miss 50% of their attacks is BS, they hardly miss 1/10 with or without trait, but trait helps catching up your target faster so it boost the DPS against moving targets.
And devourers don’t make bad DPS, they are actually the best DPS against moving targets or mobs/bosses that hurt melee pets. Canines are also great because they cripple a lot.
Conclusion…want to get the most out of your pets? Learn to use them. Just like you can’t be in melee in many situations pets can’t do it either…you can’t expect a pet to go melee and survive to something that you wouldn’t survive.
I have been using my pet since BWE1 and he’s not wrong. I have also been on the opposite of the pet with my Mesmer, where I largely just ignore the pet as they aren’t a threat.
False. My eagle or reef drake can solo many classes, All I have to do is sit back and press a few buttons. Specced into BM you lose a bit of dps, but the dps you gain with your pet is phenomenal. The eagle can use his F2 every six seconds. This adds bleeds on top of the bleeds you can add with a shortbow. Going LB/SB with a pet can do wonders. Don’t underestimate it.